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P180RX = Flame Thrower

Old 06-21-2014, 04:16 PM
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essyou35
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Default P180RX = Flame Thrower

Got my p180RX back from being upgraded, before I sent it in it ran very well.
I finally after several months ran it up. So it starts up and idles great.
When I try to go to half it just puffs, sputters, a little smoke here and there, RPM and temps jump all over. RPM doesnt get much past idle.
Full throttle same thing.

The turbine spits out a flame during this process. I confirmed no air is going into the turbine. It does not flameout.

I'll call monday but would love to fly tomorrow if someone can help.

Thanks.
Old 06-21-2014, 05:46 PM
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essyou35
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I tried some new fuel as well, no change.
Here are some numbers, I only went half throttle this time but there is not change at full throttle:
MaxPump: 1.35
Max Temp: 743
Max RPM: 49400
Avg RPM: 17900

At above idle there is just a blue flame that forms and stays pretty constant except when the turbine stutters and loses some RPM for some reason. I observed no air going into the turbine.
I did a purge fuel system into a bottle and got the pump going up over 2 without any issues or air.
Old 06-21-2014, 07:16 PM
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Mine has done the same thing. It is currently in California. They are waiting to hear from Germany on a solution.
Old 06-21-2014, 07:24 PM
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essyou35
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Did you try using the barom auto tune? I may try a runup with it on.
Did this happen to yours right after being upgraded
Old 06-22-2014, 02:08 PM
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cyphur01
 
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Yes just after upgrade. It did do it before but I thought it was humidity. I tried every setting imaginable. Try ramp very slow and then run it up to full. This worked for a little while but it just got worse eventually. I just sent it in. I was scared of a flameout in the air.
Old 06-23-2014, 08:04 AM
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essyou35
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I talked to Jetcat today and they confirmed what you are saying. In humid environments the engine does not work. So its down for the count until they figure it out. I am certain they will make it right, and we'll come out on top.
Old 06-26-2014, 11:51 AM
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Jeffpro
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I have a P100-RX that behaves the same way at times, especially in humid air. I just sent it back to JetCat USA, where John and the boys rotated the injector needles 180 degrees. John told me that this should solve my P100-RX problems by ensuring that the fuel enters the hot part of the combustion chamber. Maybe the same treatment would work for a 180. (The turbine arrived home a couple of days ago, but I'm overseas right now and haven't had a chance to reinstall the turbine and test it.)
Old 06-26-2014, 12:51 PM
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essyou35
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My problems are not during startup, but after it is running and at idle, which sounds fine. Its when I then give some throttle.
I would assume, after it is running, the cumbustion chamber is the same temp all around, is your problem during startup or after it has already started?
Old 07-10-2014, 07:45 AM
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essyou35
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No update Jetcat went quiet.

Jeffpro: In terms of rotating injector needles. Very strange. I would assume once the engine is running the entire combustion chamber would be the same temp for the most part.
Also what happens if you fly inverted or mount the turbine "upside down"? (relative to however they rotated them)
Old 07-10-2014, 04:20 PM
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I have two 180RX's both will not spool up past about 60k rpm, they just spit and sputter. They have both been back to JetCat for the updates, very frustrated... JetCat has no answer for the problems.
Old 07-11-2014, 03:27 PM
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essyou35
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How long have they been doing that, did they do it before the update?
Old 07-11-2014, 06:18 PM
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I bought two around October, I installed one and had three flame-outs in flight, lucky I didn't crash. The second one I never installed before the update came out. I sent both in for the update, one had about an hour run time, the other was new in the box so I can't say how it would have ran. When I got them back it was already getting hot here in Texas, I installed both in planes and the both are doing the same thing. I just got word from John over at JetCat to send them back but to say the least it's been very frustrating!!!
Old 07-11-2014, 06:56 PM
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essyou35
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When did john contact you? I haven't heard anything from him for a while now.
Old 07-12-2014, 11:46 AM
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I have been speaking with him since January on these issues, mostly by email.
Old 07-13-2014, 07:17 PM
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wow I saw a friend of mine have issues with his 180rx, it was a Zombie start the turbine kept coming back from the dead and then fading. Out of the 3 starts 1 finally worked and the acceleration was pretty bad also lots of sputters. Finally once it was int he air it seemed ok. Compared to this the King tech 180 was FLAWLESS, despite being over a grand cheaper.

Jet cat has really slipped.
Old 07-14-2014, 08:03 AM
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I had the same issues with my 180 rx in an F4 ...hot starts, other starts ok but then spluttering during throttle up, flameout, fading rpm and flames during running, resulting in a destroyed tail pipe, 1 scorched horizontal stab and a deadstick from which I was lucky to escape with minor damage.....a thousand bucks and hours of repairs later....not happy. I have quite a few jet cat engines (everything except a 200 and a 90) and have never seen anything like this. Sent mine in for update but have not run it since getting it back. Hopefully it will be ok but I am certainly a bit nervous about it now. Experiences like this are certainly good for Kingtech's business.......if you are going to be a grand more to buy, you had better deliver the goods!
Old 07-14-2014, 08:10 AM
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essyou35
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Ouch. Run it up on a test stand! I ran mine up on a test stand at first but didnt go over idle, I usually just worry about a hot start. For some reason I dont trust my setup to hold up to 40+ lbs of thrust.
Put it in my mig and torched it a bit. I am not sure if I need a new pipe or not. But the Y got red hot from the small flame coming out the back.

Interestingly in the fall, before the update the turbine ran perfect.
I am hearing in my other thread on the RX turbines jetcat may have a solution now.

Originally Posted by Craig B. View Post
I had the same issues with my 180 rx in an F4 ...hot starts, other starts ok but then spluttering during throttle up, flameout, fading rpm and flames during running, resulting in a destroyed tail pipe, 1 scorched horizontal stab and a deadstick from which I was lucky to escape with minor damage.....a thousand bucks and hours of repairs later....not happy. I have quite a few jet cat engines (everything except a 200 and a 90) and have never seen anything like this. Sent mine in for update but have not run it since getting it back. Hopefully it will be ok but I am certainly a bit nervous about it now. Experiences like this are certainly good for Kingtech's business.......if you are going to be a grand more to buy, you had better deliver the goods!
Old 07-15-2014, 05:42 PM
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essyou35
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Per John Redman:

The newly worked onP180RX worked awesome in Indiana and then at Kentucky Jets. We are working on fixing three more and I am traveling to Houston and then to Florida to fly them and verify our fix is sound. ... Should have great news next week.
Old 07-20-2014, 09:27 AM
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Originally Posted by essyou35 View Post
Per John Redman:

The newly worked onP180RX worked awesome in Indiana and then at Kentucky Jets. We are working on fixing three more and I am traveling to Houston and then to Florida to fly them and verify our fix is sound. ... Should have great news next week.
I was lucky to be with John R. during his Houston testing. he wanted to test the engines in a hot and very humid environment..... which we have plenty of here all went great! he showed the issue to me and also the fix. it all makes perfect sense. for those waiting for the fix it should not be too much longer. the 3 test engines were flown on Ray Blair's Kingcat and made it go like stink! Alan Hoes and myself watched with amazement as John put them through every flight attitude, throttle setting, slow speed, blistering fast, etc. it was a good day! now off to Florida for John to test in another hot, humid area.
Old 07-22-2014, 11:47 AM
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essyou35
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Waiting patiently for an update!
Old 07-28-2014, 06:24 PM
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essyou35
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Still no update
Old 09-17-2014, 07:05 AM
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No word about this issue from anybody?
Old 09-18-2014, 07:22 AM
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essyou35
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Sent it back in, they did some stuff, now it works. I sold it, between this engine and my skymaster mig I gave up.

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