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DSM2 - The brown-out bug strikes again (AR6200)

Old 02-19-2015, 07:10 PM
  #1  
downunderjo
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Default DSM2 - The brown-out bug strikes again (AR6200)

Hello out there.
What a great day it was out here last Wednesday in the centre of New Zealand!
So I loaded up my Big Stik 60 that had been carefully rebuilt after a fellow member crashed it years ago.

I had the wing set up with ailerons and flaps (4 small digital servos, Corona 4kgcm), two Hitec 475 on elevator and rudder and a small 5g servo for throttle.
The 2s LiPo was measured at 7.4V going into a Turnigy BEC 4A/5A peak and then into an AR6200 (incl satellite), Binding it was no problem and everything worked fine!
After 5 minutes into the flight I had a glitch and put it down to my flying style or thermals or whatever.
Two more small circuits and the system locked up. No chance of recovery.....
BTW, I am using a brand new DX9 which I find fantastic but this receiver issues on the AR6200 units is wearing me thin. It's the third plane I;ve lost with the same setup. Some will ask 'when will he learn'...

As a technically minded person I would like to understand what's causing the brown-outs and how can I test my other receivers, ie how to check if the receivers are all 100%?
And why are the diodes now flashing (main unit and satellite) and not solid lights although the servos are moving when I wiggle the sticks? I don't want to blame the gear but why do I get different responses from the receiver at different times although all I do is switch TX and RX on and off???????????????????????????
Old 02-19-2015, 08:22 PM
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Aerocal
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Sounds like the classic case of the BEC simply not able to keep up with the current demand of inflight loads.It gets warm or hot and voltage drops.It sounds like you had a quick reboot first and then it got hot enough to just shut off. BECs and regulators are notorious for this kind of failure if they arent capable for whatever reason.I would seriously consider Telemetry to monitor what your voltage is doing on the Rx bus.Your little glitch was a warning you didnt hear.Rx voltage and telemetry with a warning set properly would likely have saved your grief. Once you start doing some checking your probably going to find how marginal some setups really are and be able to set them up right.Plug and Pray doesnt get it when you mix/match stuff together.
You didnt say whether your 60 size Stik was electric or I/C. I kind of dont see a 60 on a 2S LiPo Flightpack so Im thinking its I/C with the 2S LiPo/reg for Rx power. In these cases most ppl I know have mostly gone to a 2S LiFe and ditch the electronic voltage conversion of a BEC/reg. If its bigger than a 40 size electric your going to need a beefier BEC/reg.Even then I dont screw with it.A LiFe pack with a hard plugtogether connector for a switch if practical is my choice.
The slowblink led on the Rx(s) is telling you that it rebooted since the Tx was last powercycled.This reboot indication only works in DSM2 mode.
Old 02-19-2015, 09:35 PM
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downunderjo
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Thanks for the info Aerocal.
Yes, it is (was) a nitro setup with a beautiful OS .61 2-stroke. My LiPo was a 1700MAh 2S unit...

The things is that although I had 4 servos in the wing I didn't use the flaps at the moment of the brown-out. Throttle was also set and the only sticks used for that turn were elevator and ailerons.
What voltage do LiFes put out? What size would you recommend for a 60 size plane??
What BEC would I need for a LiPo setup as described in my first post? How many Amps? What brand????
Old 02-20-2015, 07:50 AM
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SkidMan
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If the receiver lights are blinking it means that there was a significant malfunction, such as a brown out. In the event of a brown out the receiver will Quick Connect and flash the LED's to let the pilot know that the problem occurred, even though they might not have even noticed it in the air.

Brown outs are not bugs. They are due to problems with the power being supplied to the receiver. Your BEC "should" be able to handle the current levels I would expect, but it seems like it might be dropping out.

Since you are technically minded I would HIGHLY recommend getting a Spektrum Flight Log (SPM9540). It will provide you with voltage and radio signal information. Since you do not need to mount it in the plane (you just plug it into the data port before powering down the plane and transmitter) you can use it on all your planes that have data ports on their receivers. IMHO it is invaluable for positioning antennas and being confident about your RF link performance. Another benefit is that you can share it with other fliers. Or, maybe one of your friends already has one that they will share with you.

Of course a TM1000 telemetry is far better and I have them in most of my planes.

Here is what I would do (My 2-cents)
  1. Perform a thorough range test
  2. Make sure that you have the correct failsafe set on the receiver (It amazes me how man people are not familiar with this). You can program the receiver to either hold the last commanded position or to return all of the surfaces to a specific position.
  3. After the range test, with the transmitter in full power mode, swirl both sticks continuously for 5-10 minutes and see if you get any flashing LEDs. Keep in mind that you want to stress your power system beyond what you would expect in a flight. If you get a glitch or flashing LED's then you have diagnosed a power problem.

Paul
Old 02-20-2015, 08:24 AM
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Is this a receiver that has been crashed? If so, I'd see if Model Flight would check it out for you. When I crash a plane, the receiver goes to Service before it goes back into a plane. Better safe than sorry!

Where did you get the AR6200? There are a number of counterfeiters out there, selling lookalikes made with (very old) stolen code and substandard parts. Just something to consider. If you're buying them "new" - they're fakes.

As for the root cause, it sounds like the other guys have it nailed.

Andy
Old 02-20-2015, 01:22 PM
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downunderjo
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Default How to detect fakes AR6200??

Originally Posted by AndyKunz View Post
Is this a receiver that has been crashed? If so, I'd see if Model Flight would check it out for you. When I crash a plane, the receiver goes to Service before it goes back into a plane. Better safe than sorry!

Where did you get the AR6200? There are a number of counterfeiters out there, selling lookalikes made with (very old) stolen code and substandard parts. Just something to consider. If you're buying them "new" - they're fakes.

As for the root cause, it sounds like the other guys have it nailed.

Andy
Thanks for your reply Andy!
So how can one detect a counterfeit receiver? If the 'old code' is so bad why didn't I have any losses in the early in my Spektrum days? Should I have kept my Multiplex (pizza box) MC3030 transmitter?????

What are the channels for us Australasian customers? Can we still send the units to Spektrum US to have them checked?? What are the costs of 'checking out' a receiver??
I have more than one and I am not going to use them again........

Cheers
Jo
Old 02-20-2015, 01:41 PM
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If you've had the receiver for a while, you're probably OK. It was intended as cautionary for people buying "new" AR6200's in the past two years. You can't tell one; only the service centers can.

If you're in AU contact Model Flight http://modelflight.com.au/. If you're in NZ contact HOT RC http://www.hotrc.co.nz

DON'T send them here. We have these regional distributors for a reason! Use them!

Andy
Old 02-20-2015, 02:32 PM
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downunderjo
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I have contacted HOT RC here in NZ and will wait for an answer. I hope there is somebody at that address because their webshop looks really depleted and negleted
Old 02-20-2015, 05:35 PM
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junkjet
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Just wandering what is the output voltage set at on this bec. If not 6.v you are below the voltage needed to run your flight gear. I run li fi. 6.6 and a123 6.6 flight packs straight to the receivers. Never had a brown out on 6.6v.
Old 02-23-2015, 03:16 PM
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Jetdesign
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You said "The 2s LiPo was measured at 7.4V going into a Turnigy BEC 4A/5A peak and then into an AR6200". A 2S lipo should read 8.4v fully charged, and at 7.4v should not be going up for another flight.
Old 02-23-2015, 04:08 PM
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I use to fly large scale petrol and experienced the same issues, out of pure frustration I ended up ditching all my Spectrum gear and started using FrSky with telemetry and reading nothing but good reviews on it. Have never looked back, guess at the time I took the easy way out instead of trying to resolve my issues. But got sick of riding off expensive models. Yet a lot of my fellow flyers have had no issues with Spectrum apart from the standard over priced receivers!!
These days I fly large scale vintage, both glow and electric but still use FrSky gear and with a lot more confidence.

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