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~~Sig Kadet Brotherhood~~.

Old 01-23-2015, 04:41 AM
  #2426  
nealmontgomery
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Box Car
post some pics of your slat construction methods. I think I am going to mod my seniorita build to include movable Handley-Page slats using NACA Technical Note 459. That should be quite a project!
Old 01-23-2015, 06:24 AM
  #2427  
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yeah, americon idol puts me to sleep too, LOL I need a new project to start on. I dont want to finish my daughters Kadet, thats up to her. I have a NIB Citabria, but not really interested in that one yet, I might go full scale on it with the full cockpit. I was thinking maybe get a wing kit from SIG for the LT-40 and make it flat. Or scratch build one with semi symmetrical ribs.
Old 01-23-2015, 06:46 AM
  #2428  
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Originally Posted by FlyerInOKC
Thanks Dave! Can I get a picture of the tail or are the pictures of a modified tail posted look the same?

Mike
Hi Mike, here you are:


Sincerely, Richard
Old 01-23-2015, 08:52 AM
  #2429  
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Cool flaps Neal! I looked up that YouTube you mentioned after I saw your post. They guy did a nice job on the hinges.

Dave, thanks for the information and the picture of the plans. I think I may modify the tail to match on my next Kadet.
Old 01-23-2015, 07:47 PM
  #2430  
nealmontgomery
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How do you get a .docx pasted into here?

pretty sure it's simple, but I'm new to this whole thing. I have most of the mod procedures saved in .docx files and don't want to re-type as time goes on.

thanks for the help

I could copy-paste just the text here, but i have some text boxes and shapes thrown in there to clarify the TR 664 and those features mess up the paste provision

Last edited by nealmontgomery; 01-23-2015 at 08:04 PM. Reason: seeking guidance
Old 01-24-2015, 05:10 AM
  #2431  
nealmontgomery
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SLOTTED FLAP MOD - Installment 1

http://naca.central.cranfield.ac.uk/...report-664.pdf


Before beginning the mod, we need to take some measurements for our particular wing and do some calculations. No complex formula is involved, just simple arithmetic and geometry. The basis for all these measurements is the chord. Using data presented in TR 664, we can determine values for our new flap chord, our slot lip length, the slot entry radius, flap cove radius, and later on when installing the flap mount, figure dimensions to double-check the correct placement of our flap relative to the aft edge of the slot lip as the flap deploys.



I will be using the ARF from Nitroplanes as the basis for my modification. The primary difference between a SIG kit and the ARF is: 1) the chord for the ARF is 15.0 inches vs. 15.125 for the SIG kit Even so, the calculations should vary only a little.

The main structural differences in the ARF vs. SIG version is that the aft spar further aft, which makes for a narrwower (chordwise) slot lip extension. If you have the original SIG kit , you can either make your slot lip extension longer (chordwise) to capture the SIG aft spar, or you can fab and install your own sub-spar from which to attach your slot extension.

Fortunately, in any case,

The SIG Kadet Senior has a straight wing, therefore a constant chord, and this simplifies everything. The flap will have a constant chord from inboard to outboard.

Our numbers from Figure 5 of TR 664 (Slotted Flap Configuration 2-h):

Reference Values

Chord (C) = 15.0 inches
therefore: C = 15.0 inches

Flap Chord (C[SUB]f[/SUB]) = C X 0.2566
therefore: C[SUB]f[/SUB]= 15.0 X .2566 = 3.849 inches


Slot Lip (E) = C X 0.827
therefore: E =15.0 X 0.827 = 12.40 inches


Slot Entry Radius (R[SUB]e[/SUB]) = C X 0.0789
therefore: R[SUB]e[/SUB] = 15.0 X .0789 = 1.18 inches


Cove Radius (R[SUB]c[/SUB]) = C X .0475 =0.712 inches
therefore: R[SUB]c[/SUB] = 0.712 inches

The graphic from NACA TR 664 Figure 5, gives all the dimensions for configuration 2-h, EXCEPT the flap chord dimension. It is depicted in configuration 2-i, immediately below 2-h.



.2566 c gives us a flap 25.66% of the original wing chord. Generous indeed.
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Last edited by nealmontgomery; 01-24-2015 at 05:15 AM.
Old 01-24-2015, 07:15 AM
  #2432  
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The summary and conclusion paragraphs from the TR 664 are depicted below. We will get to the mod, but to understand the rationale and conclusions are important, I think.






I know the TR is a long read and full of "engineering-speak," but I did want to cover some of the major points.

Furthermore,

There has been considerable debate as to the best flap span/aileron span proportions.

Andy Lennon, my hero, published several articles in Model Airplane News back in the early 90's regarding high lift devices and R/C aircraft.
He favored a larger percentage flap span, upwards of 60%.

http://www.mosquitobiteplanes.com/robin.html

When you look at Andy's Robin design, you can see that he favored bigger (spanwise) flaps and shorter spanwise, but longer chord, ailerons.

This mod's flap span comes out to around 47%. Purely a design consideration, it comes to that according to rib bay spacing.


On to the mod.....

Now that the covering and the aileron has been removed (which will be the basis for our new flap), I removed and saved the trailing edge and the ancillary rib segments for re-construction of the areas outboard of the flap.

I also removed material inboard to the first center wing box rib bay. This will be our flap cove area.

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Last edited by nealmontgomery; 01-24-2015 at 07:38 AM.
Old 01-24-2015, 07:35 AM
  #2433  
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Interested in seeing how you hing this thing to get the desired effect.
Nice job so far as I know the rest will be.
Old 01-24-2015, 07:41 AM
  #2434  
nealmontgomery
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Thanks, flyingagin

The hinge line will be an imaginary line from one or more hinge pivots making an axis of rotation parallel to, and under the flap just aft of the flap LE so that it moves through an arc as it deploys.

It is important to note that in the TR 664, there is mention made of the ability to move the hinge point of the flap as it is deployed so that the position of the greatest coeficient of lift can be measured and recorded. So, they move the flap to a point to achieve the greatest lift numbers, but that point may not coincide precisely with the flap deployment arc. No worries, though, if memory serves, the "ADJUSTED" value differed only very slightly (1%) from the values derived from the "non-adjusted" hinge point, so the slotted flap travel arc should produce results very similar to the reported results.

The hinge point location is best done with templates and a mounting area large enough to experiment with the best hinge point, using the dimensioning in the 664 as a baseline. That would be 0.8081 X C from the leading edge and 0.0475 X C below the chord line.

The problem arises that we are using a flat bottom airfoil, where as they used a NACA 23012 semi-symmetrial airfoil, so the dimension from the chord line is different from that of the big SIG airfoil, so adjusting the pivot line is important to get the gap dimensions called for in the TR.

This will be discussed later when we check the flap rig for the final install.

I used this method: adjusted the hinge point with a T-pin and measured the gap values as the flap went through its arc. Some were too close, some were too far.....and some were juuuust right.



I found that I could approximate the hinge location initially, and then fine tune the arc, and therefore the Flap LE-to-Slot Lip relation according to the dimensions according to the TR. My templates got pretty worn out, though. You can see the multitude of holes where I experimented with the changes in the flap travel at various pivot locations. The discernible "T" was the optimum location and I marked it for later reference.

Andy Lennon's method of flap hinges was sound, but with the advent of the Robart Hinge Pins, it makes things simpler, and cleaner.

I used Andy's hinge build method on my Icon A-5. Although, it is a solidly-designed hinge, it tends to be a bit bulky, so I went with the Robart hinges inside a faired block of hard balsa. Not for the weight advantage, as might be implied, but for ease of fabrication.

Still learning how to use this posting and editing system. I did not want to include that hand made drawing that I took a pic of. Can't figure out how to get rid of it.

Oh well, it is poor quality, but still usable. It is just a profile view of how the mod contours should look. Been a looong time since drafting class.

Blustery day here in Georgia, so perfect weather day to compose build logs

nm
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Last edited by nealmontgomery; 01-24-2015 at 09:26 AM.
Old 01-24-2015, 07:52 AM
  #2435  
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I had forgotten about this flap set pic I had stored on my computer.
Woops wrong button

Ken
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Last edited by flyingagin; 01-24-2015 at 07:57 AM.
Old 01-24-2015, 08:18 AM
  #2436  
nealmontgomery
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Perfect Ken, that is what we are trying to replicate here.

The kicker for me, and more for the fun of looking at an old NACA technical report, was that the contours were smoothed and the dimensions were given precisely, and the results of each iteration were measured an evaluated to give the best result, or compromise, across all performance regimes.

The comparison between contours with more abrupt changes to the cross-sectional area and the smoother flows as they researched is what interested me, and prompted me to follow this path.

So, this is more a matter of making something for fun following the research of guys who were, back in the day, having a ball at Langley and being paid (well) for what they loved to do.

If it works, I have triumphed. If it works not as well as hoped, that is okay, too. I have had a ball making something from historical research.

But it will work....magnificently.

The Icon A-5 I have was not pretty to fly. With the addition of slotted flaps and a drooped outer leading edge, (which I also have a build log on) it is a big ol' baby to fly now. Flies great......still wiggles, but slow flight is ROCK solid.

But I digress.......

Last edited by nealmontgomery; 01-24-2015 at 08:21 AM.
Old 01-24-2015, 09:16 AM
  #2437  
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Originally Posted by nealmontgomery
Thanks, flyingagin

The hinge construction is best done with templates and a mounting area large enough to experiment with the best hinge point, even in light of the dimensioning in the 664.

I used this method, adjusted the hinge point with a T-pin and measured as the flap went through its arc. Some were too close, some were too far.....and some were juuuust right.




nm
Back in this thread about 4-6 months ago I went thru the same process designing new rip templates for the new wing for my SR. But you know life interruptus. Had to move cross country.

I did get the templates made. I am back building some. Maybe in a couple of months or so. But then again I am going to have to move again pretty soon.
So there are other priorities first.

But I really do look forward to the time when I can build my stretch low wing modification.

I will hunt later for my drawings and templates. I did not take any pictures of the process of arrive at hing points, I used cardbstock cut outs and a t pin also. It may be far from optimal, but should be good enough.

Ken
Old 01-27-2015, 01:50 AM
  #2438  
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I finally finished sheeting the Foam Wing I made for my Kadet. I decided to document the steps I used to cut out the Ailerons. I decided on
15" X 2.5" ailerons. I think I'm going to use them as Flaperons and I will mix in some down eleavator. Enjoy the pictures.
Thanks,
Larry
Conyers, Georgia

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Old 01-27-2015, 08:48 AM
  #2439  
nealmontgomery
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SLOTTED FLAP MOD –cont’d

Having cut new rib sections and new rib notches for attachment to the rear spar and trailing edge, the TE was reconstructed. Flap bay is ready for the flap cove mod, while will come soon.





First, the flap.



Carl Wenzinger and team surmised (as I’m sure that we all do,intuitively) that a flap of “good airfoil shape” would provide the greatest effect since the flap is a lifting component as well.

They used a NACA 6318 nose profile.



Since I don’t know what that is, and would rather avoid the tedium of plotting airfoil coordinates, as fun as that may sound, I went by what was depicted in TR 664 and tried my best to replicate that profile. I would imagine that most any flap profile representing a nice fat airfoil with a flat bottom would be effective. Interestingly, the P-3 and C-130 flap profiles are versions a bit squished from this, but seeing as they are Fowler flaps, they need the flatter upper profile, to extend before translating down.

BUILDING THE FLAP PROFILE for the BIG SIG flaps:

The salvaged aileron is the base structure for this flap mod. I created a rib profile template from heavy cardstock. It allowed me to draw/trim the profile to match what I wanted. As you can see from the construction picture, the flap template affixed to the end of the aileron, showed that it was short chord-wise, and a little high “airfoil-wise.” If you do this mod from existing airplanes, you will find that most flap and aileron profiles do not offer the very generous 26% flap chord required for this mod. You have to build them up, and sand ‘em down.




I added balsa to the LE and drew the profile from the template onto the end, giving me my desired profile. Easy enough.

The beveled leading edge of the aileron made it difficult to glue balsa so that there were no complex angles to trim to and deal with. Solution: fill the remaining gap with a sandable material after the profile sanding is completed and final sand to complete the job. Seal with a sandable sealer. I used latex paint. Sands very nicely and leaves a good finish for monokote to adhere to. Probably not a good foundation for oil-based paint.........or is it?

Could someone tell me?


Of note, however is the consideration that the flaps are “faired into the contour of the main airfoil over the rest of [the flap’s] length.” Makes sense.

That is important in this situation because:

The flap should be rigged so that it seals the aft slot lip/flap interface. This is not a tight fit, mind you (which would lead to servo binding) but should be as close as possible.

Where is that on the flap then?

Wing Chord (C) = 15 inches
Slot Lip Extension (E) = 12.40 inches
(C) minus (E) should give me the dimension from the TE where the Slot Lip Extension is located.

15.0 – 12.4 = 2.6 inches from the trailing edge

Therefore, the faired section of the flap begins 2.6 inches from the flap trailing edge. This arithmetic should help alleviate fiddling with the flap contour later, also, the aileron rib profile gives me a strong basis for the flap rib profile , so I will sand the top where needed. The flap can then move out from under the slot lip extension without interfering.

Remember, our flap chord is 3.85 inches so we should have no trouble profiling to the FCS 1.25 (Flap Chord Station 1.25). We’ll see.

I could have built the flap cove first, but from past experience, there are complications associated with this, too numerous to delineate here, so please take my word for it.

The flap will nest in the flap cutout, of course. On my first mod on another plane, instant panic when I placed the flap into the cutout and the trailing edges did not line up.

Huh? I thought.



Ah! When we profile the slot entry transition, the nose of the flap will move forward into the cove and line up with the rest of the trailing edge.

Here is an installation drawing of the arrangement, minus the hinge mounts.





NEXT UP: Flap Cove, Slot Entry Transition, and Slot Lip Extension
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Last edited by nealmontgomery; 01-27-2015 at 09:00 AM.
Old 01-27-2015, 10:00 AM
  #2440  
flyingagin
 
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Good tutorial thanks

Ken
Old 01-30-2015, 11:16 PM
  #2441  
soarrich
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Default Sr. build.

Originally Posted by skylark-flier
Rich, I like that "retro" stab - kinda brings the whole design back to its origins. Probably should have done something like that with my Mk-II when I built it, might do that yet. You going to change the horizontal stab too?
I got the vertical fin/rudder done, then I built the stab elevator. I changed the shape a little, then the structure some. If you look at the back sticks of the stab you can see I used a couple of pieces of balsa rather than the small piece of spruce, and added some hinge mounting points.

I've started the wing. I found that by using the scraps left after taking the ribs out I was able to build half ribs, I just like the look of half ribs, they are aren't needed though. Mine's going to be a RET plane.
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Old 01-31-2015, 04:33 AM
  #2442  
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Looking good, Rich !

I like the idea of using half ribs. I wish that I wouldhave thought of it when I built my Kadet.
Old 01-31-2015, 06:05 AM
  #2443  
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Rich, love the half ribs!

new tail feather profiles pretty sharp too!
Old 01-31-2015, 06:23 AM
  #2444  
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Can I still join the Brotherhood or is it too late? This is my Kadet LT 40 from when I was 12 and I begged my dad for RC. I am now 29! It has been wrecked several times with 2 engine replacements. It has also been re-monokoted several times. This was a Superman design but the fuel deteriorated the stickers I had placed on the monokote and now it is the silhouette of Superman. It has an O.S. 40LA on it and flies beautiful. Honestly, I am still learning to fly...lol.

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Old 01-31-2015, 03:42 PM
  #2445  
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Originally Posted by bisszerk
Can I still join the Brotherhood or is it too late? This is my Kadet LT 40 from when I was 12 and I begged my dad for RC. I am now 29! It has been wrecked several times with 2 engine replacements. It has also been re-monokoted several times. This was a Superman design but the fuel deteriorated the stickers I had placed on the monokote and now it is the silhouette of Superman. It has an O.S. 40LA on it and flies beautiful. Honestly, I am still learning to fly...lol.

Absolutely, you can join the Brotherhood!!!! Always happy to meet another brother around here. Gotta tell ya, your history with the Kadet isn't all that far from mine - an original 1973-era Kadet that lasted 39 years in the air before I finally retired it and started flying my new Mk-II (also with a .40LA) this past March. They're great airplanes!!

We've got #181 all set for you - Welcome to the SIG Kadet Brotherhood!!

RICH!! I'm going to join everybody else - those half-ribs are GREAT!! They add a whole lot of class to what's already a great wing. I also like what you did to the tail feathers. Great lines!

So, here's our SIG Kadet Brotherhood, as I've got it today (3-columns, new divisions):[TABLE="width: 508"]
[TR]
[TD]1[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]Gary Harris[/TD]
[TD]66[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]mike109[/TD]
[TD]131[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]UPF-7[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]soarrich[/TD]
[TD]67[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]beevo[/TD]
[TD]132[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]neons[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]3[/TD]
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[TD]skylark-flier[/TD]
[TD]134[/TD]
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[TR]
[TD]5[/TD]
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[TD]wildbills21[/TD]
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[TD]6[/TD]
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[TD]zippome[/TD]
[TD]71[/TD]
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[TD]Cloud Cruiser[/TD]
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[TD]shepard62[/TD]
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[TD]SIGPlanes[/TD]
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[TD]8[/TD]
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[TD]DeferredDefect[/TD]
[TD]73[/TD]
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[TD]10[/TD]
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[TD]tomgreen[/TD]
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[TR]
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[TD]Steve Westphal[/TD]
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[TD]Unclebuck21228[/TD]
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[TD]82[/TD]
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[TD]malitape[/TD]
[TD]147[/TD]
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[TD]rc56[/TD]
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[TR]
[TD]18[/TD]
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[TD]ovationdave[/TD]
[TD]83[/TD]
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[TD]Dave Holmes[/TD]
[TD]148[/TD]
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[TD]redjack[/TD]
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[TR]
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[TD]joebahl[/TD]
[TD]84[/TD]
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[TD]Carlos G[/TD]
[TD]149[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]rdgettler[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]20[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]WI53072[/TD]
[TD]85[/TD]
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[TD]kingranch[/TD]
[TD]150[/TD]
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[TR]
[TD]21[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]huck1199[/TD]
[TD]86[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]Red Kadet[/TD]
[TD]151[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]MartyPetriSr[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]22[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]Top_Gunn[/TD]
[TD]87[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]dirtrod[/TD]
[TD]152[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]tomclark[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]23[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]Nergall[/TD]
[TD]88[/TD]
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[TD]t4[/TD]
[TD]153[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]c-crunch[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]24[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]acdii[/TD]
[TD]89[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]FlyerInOKC[/TD]
[TD]154[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]BigTeeEldorado[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]25[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]hutchis[/TD]
[TD]90[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]DELTAFLY[/TD]
[TD]155[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]TomCrump[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]26[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]ddewey[/TD]
[TD]91[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]sharpe917[/TD]
[TD]156[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]hiflyer15[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]27[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]dhal22[/TD]
[TD]92[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]jollyroger[/TD]
[TD]157[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]Fly North[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]28[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]Thomas Pham[/TD]
[TD]93[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]Cliffc[/TD]
[TD]158[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]dwaynenancy[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]29[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]cubkadet[/TD]
[TD]94[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]1320fastback[/TD]
[TD]159[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]oinoyou[/TD]
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[TR]
[TD]30[/TD]
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[TD]Greg Davis[/TD]
[TD]95[/TD]
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[TD]Captinjohn[/TD]
[TD]160[/TD]
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[TD]Jersy Hank[/TD]
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[TR]
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[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]CanDo[/TD]
[TD]96[/TD]
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[TD]161[/TD]
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[TR]
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[TD]Major Tomski[/TD]
[TD]163[/TD]
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[TD]TheComputerGeek[/TD]
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[TD]164[/TD]
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[TR]
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[TD]-[/TD]
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[TD]125[/TD]
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[TR]
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[TD]128[/TD]
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[TD]129[/TD]
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[TD]TunnelBill[/TD]
[TD]130[/TD]
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[TD][/TD]
[TD][/TD]
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[/TR]
[/TABLE]
Old 01-31-2015, 08:09 PM
  #2446  
bisszerk
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Originally Posted by skylark-flier
Absolutely, you can join the Brotherhood!!!! Always happy to meet another brother around here. Gotta tell ya, your history with the Kadet isn't all that far from mine - an original 1973-era Kadet that lasted 39 years in the air before I finally retired it and started flying my new Mk-II (also with a .40LA) this past March. They're great airplanes!!

We've got #181 all set for you - Welcome to the SIG Kadet Brotherhood!!
Great! I hope to see more stuff about the Kadets in the thread.
Old 02-01-2015, 02:46 PM
  #2447  
tomclark
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Originally Posted by spaceworm
Hi Mike, here you are:


Sincerely, Richard
Guys, those plans are what was marked up by me for my 90" Kadet. The original plan came from Outerzone plan number 2950. It is available as a pdf and shows the wing plan also.

Tom

The big Kadet is a dream to fly touch-and-goes all day long. When reading the notes on Outerzone, I did build the wing and stab at zero degree incidence, and added 3˚ down thrust to the motor mount. All flat bottom wing planes do a bit better with the down thrust.
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Old 02-02-2015, 08:46 AM
  #2448  
FlyerInOKC
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Originally Posted by bisszerk
Can I still join the Brotherhood or is it too late? This is my Kadet LT 40 from when I was 12 and I begged my dad for RC. I am now 29! It has been wrecked several times with 2 engine replacements. It has also been re-monokoted several times. This was a Superman design but the fuel deteriorated the stickers I had placed on the monokote and now it is the silhouette of Superman. It has an O.S. 40LA on it and flies beautiful. Honestly, I am still learning to fly...lol.

So what you are saying is it's a well flown airplane.

Don't feel bad I'm 56 building and flying RC since 1973 and I'm still learning how to fly!
Old 02-02-2015, 09:40 AM
  #2449  
bisszerk
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Originally Posted by FlyerInOKC
So what you are saying is it's a well flown airplane.

Don't feel bad I'm 56 building and flying RC since 1973 and I'm still learning how to fly!
I'm getting much better but I'm always nervous and expecting the worst. I really haven't seen this plane go up and just fly too many times. Since the beginning it was crashed and I've been fighting it ever since. After several fixes, it doesn't fly straight and the landing gear will never stay on (hard landings). Luckily, my last few flights needed minor trim settings. My next flight is going to be my first true success story... haha
Old 02-02-2015, 11:59 AM
  #2450  
spaceworm
 
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Originally Posted by bisszerk
I'm getting much better but I'm always nervous and expecting the worst. I really haven't seen this plane go up and just fly too many times. Since the beginning it was crashed and I've been fighting it ever since. After several fixes, it doesn't fly straight and the landing gear will never stay on (hard landings). Luckily, my last few flights needed minor trim settings. My next flight is going to be my first true success story... haha
I have not flown for about 2 years and have just joined the local RC club. I have asked for and hope to get help getting it back up again. even though I expect that the planes I will fly are still in trim. May I suggest a buddy box approach or someone to get the plane up and trim it out before you take it over? Planes severely out of trim are difficult if not impossible to fly, even for accomplished pilots. Good luck

Sincerely, Richard

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