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Sig Tri Star Build

Old 01-20-2007, 08:32 PM
  #1  
Rocketman612
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Default Sig Tri Star Build

Well here we go on a Soup to Nuts build of the Sig Tri Star. I saw this plane a few years ago at the Perry Swap Meet and was able to score a kit on Ebay. Have been reading some on Canard planes and researching this kit. Planning to use the following.

Engine: OS CV.15A
Prop: Zinger 7x4 pusher (will also test a Zinger 8x4 and Graupner 7x4)
Mount: Dave Brown
Tank: Sullivan 4oz flextank
Wheels: Dave Brown Lite
Servos HS 81 mounted next to the elevator servo. HS 225MG for elevator and a Futaba 3004 on ailerons.
Battery:800mah NiMH
Rx: Futaba FP-R148DF
Switch: MPI
Covering: UltraCote plan on the USAF version.


I know there are some Tri Stars out there so if you have a tip or "should have done " jump in and post.

I'm not the fastest builder so bear with me. Sit back have your favorite beverage




Pete
Old 01-20-2007, 09:29 PM
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slevin1
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build

Hi Pete,
I have had a tri star ever since they came out. 1st, DO NOT GO GLOW!! I have a .15 on mine & I am going to change it to the E-flite 15 size brushless out runner w/ a 4s lipo. The problem w/ the glo is that you need A LOT of nose weight to off-set the engine & fuel which makes the plane heavy. With the E-version you simply move the battery forward. 2nd, get larger wheels than what's included. MPI sells large very light wheels which will allow you to fly off of grass. 3rd, straighten out the front nose gear & twirl it 2x so the nose gear looks like what you'd see on the front of a trainer aircraft. It looks cool when it's bent back but each time you land, it will bend & each time you straighten, it will weaken the wire. 4th call Sig & see it they still have the replacement main landing gear in stock. The original gear was made of a wire that was too small of a diameter & would easily bend so they were replacing them @ no charge. If they do not have them just get the replace landing gear for the Hangar 9 e-flite Edge 540 @ www.horizonhobby.com. They are the same height as the main gear used w/ the Tristar. 4th The plans call for 1 servo to operate both ailerons. Use 2, one for each aileron. Go to www.zagi.com & follow their technique for installing the servos in their wings for your tri star. Write me if you have any more questions.
Saul
Old 01-20-2007, 10:59 PM
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build

Saul,

Thanks for the the info. It looks like the "Power 25 BL Outrunner Motor, 870Kv" http://www.e-fliterc.com/Products/De...odID=EFLM4025A is the motor your suggesting. I thought about it a good bit still leaning glow the OS CV.15A is proven in the TriStar. http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_26...tm.htm#2633736

post 15. Can always do the conversion to electric. Which 15 engine did you use?

This plane will fly off pavement. I have one of the later kits with the upgraded gear. I may swap out the nose gear for one with the "spring" bend .

Looks like the HS-85BB would work for wing mounted ailerons. Is the single servo setup that bad? Bind?

I understand we can get heavy in the tail going glow and using the 4oz tank. I thought we could get around that with the throttle servo forward next to the elevator servo.

Pete
Old 01-20-2007, 11:15 PM
  #4  
dennis
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build

That plane was designed around the Cox TD 09 and if equipped with that motor will balance perfectly. I used it and didn't use a throttle but could have used a Medallion 09 if I had wanted to. It was a blast and of course I saved the wt of a servo, which today really doesn't mean too much.
Oh and why a TD 09 simply put is that it puts out the power of most sport 15's ,bar none the best motor that Cox ever made and almost completely ignored by everyone.
Dennis
Old 01-21-2007, 09:13 PM
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slevin1
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build

E-flite makes a 15 size outrunner brushless. The biggest problem w/ the glo config is that you 1st have to balance the plane w/ fuel in the tank. This creates a problem in that as the plane is flying & the fuel is burned it becomes quite nose heavy. The electric config eliminates this problem. As far as putting the throttle servo next to the elevator servo, that is a very very tight fit. Plus you have to keep in mind that the wing takes up most of the space in the fuselage. Trust me when I say that the glow set up is a PAIN IN THE A**! The biggest problem is when you try to bolt the wing on. You can't get the belly tray out of the way because the throttle cable will only allow it to open just so far there-by limiting access to the wing bolt. I also have the same engine in it. As far as the .09, I have never seen one fly w/ an .09. What I can tell you about it is that the September 1995 issue of Model Airplane News, page 62, has a review of the tristar (I am actually looking at it right now) & it states, and I quote, "There wasn't enough power. So we returned to the pits to increase the nitro content. Removing the head gasket & the muffler helped. Gradually increasing the nitro from 15% to 45% got the plane airborne." As far as the aileron servo, there was some binding but the real pain was having to hook & unhook the clevises each time you remove & attach the wing. HS 65 will work fine for this plane. I use them all the time in my larger 3-D park flyers & I have never has a problem. Plus they are lighter that the 85's & the biggest advice I can give you w/ this plane is THINK LITE! Make sure you place the servos in the wing as close to the fuselage as possible. If you place them too far out you will be increasing the tail weight. As far as the nose gear, trust me when I say get one w/ the spring bend. One more thing, that throttle cable that is included w/ it is a piece of garbage. Look at the Sulivan golden rod flexible.
Saul
Old 01-21-2007, 11:15 PM
  #6  
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build

ORIGINAL: slevin1

E-flite makes a 15 size outrunner brushless. The biggest problem w/ the glo config is that you 1st have to balance the plane w/ fuel in the tank. This creates a problem in that as the plane is flying & the fuel is burned it becomes quite nose heavy. The electric config eliminates this problem. As far as putting the throttle servo next to the elevator servo, that is a very very tight fit. Plus you have to keep in mind that the wing takes up most of the space in the fuselage. Trust me when I say that the glow set up is a PAIN IN THE A**! The biggest problem is when you try to bolt the wing on. You can't get the belly tray out of the way because the throttle cable will only allow it to open just so far there-by limiting access to the wing bolt. I also have the same engine in it. As far as the .09, I have never seen one fly w/ an .09. What I can tell you about it is that the September 1995 issue of Model Airplane News, page 62, has a review of the tristar (I am actually looking at it right now) & it states, and I quote, "There wasn't enough power. So we returned to the pits to increase the nitro content. Removing the head gasket & the muffler helped. Gradually increasing the nitro from 15% to 45% got the plane airborne." As far as the aileron servo, there was some binding but the real pain was having to hook & unhook the clevises each time you remove & attach the wing. HS 65 will work fine for this plane. I use them all the time in my larger 3-D park flyers & I have never has a problem. Plus they are lighter that the 85's & the biggest advice I can give you w/ this plane is THINK LITE! Make sure you place the servos in the wing as close to the fuselage as possible. If you place them too far out you will be increasing the tail weight. As far as the nose gear, trust me when I say get one w/ the spring bend. One more thing, that throttle cable that is included w/ it is a piece of garbage. Look at the Sulivan golden rod flexible.
Saul
Saul,

Valid points for sure. The thing that really strikes a chord it the balance issue. The trim is changing the whole flight would be a pain! Is this the motor your talking about? http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products...odID=EFLM4015A

Looks like it needs a 10x6 prop but the specs look good for this weight plane. What prop are you planning to use? Battery?

Had not considered the HS-65 with 25oz torque per aileron should be fine.

Pete




Old 01-23-2007, 08:25 PM
  #7  
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build

Pete,

Saul makes some great points. I have been reluctant to fly my glow X-wing because of the points he has made. I may go electric with my Tri Star and convert the X-Wing and share the set up. Money is what's holding me back. 4s bateries are a big investment , and only having one sucks.

Thanks for the heads up about the thread.

John
Old 02-11-2007, 06:40 AM
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build

Well some posting.

I went with Saul's suggestion and got some new parts. The Power 15 weighs 5.6oz with mount and prop adaptor while the OS 15CVA is 7.58oz with mount and muffler. Big savings on the tail. 5/32 Dubro front gear,DB 2 3/4 in rear and 2 in front Lite Flite wheels should keep the prop off the ground.
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Old 02-11-2007, 06:46 AM
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build

I want to thank ML #39 who either inspected or packed the kit. Everything in great shape. The fins were straightforward. To do the taper I placed the 3m masking tape on the line. Using 1/16 stock as a guide I mark the TE to get the depth then sand.

Pete
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Old 02-11-2007, 06:50 PM
  #10  
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build

Pete,

What battery are you going to use?
Old 02-11-2007, 10:04 PM
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build

ORIGINAL: Tequesta

Pete,

What battery are you going to use?
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products...dID=THP20704SX

This is the one Saul suggested. Not 100% sure yet. Tried playing with Motocalc but the Power 15 isn't in their list of motors yet to run a few different combos.

Got the elevators done and started the wing. Working on the aileron servos in the wing. Photo's to follow.

Pete
Old 02-13-2007, 10:45 PM
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build

Progress!!

Got the elevators shaped and mounted to the elevator control rod. Used 1/16 ply to mark the TE one side at a time leaving a nice target to sand to.
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Old 02-13-2007, 11:04 PM
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build

Next task was to layout the aileron servos. These HS-65's are just the right thickness thanks Saul. The control horns are in a good location. All I did was rotate the line and go perpendicular to the TE. The servo pole is 3 inches from the TE. Marked out the servo then cut through the wing to recess the servo. Used a 3/8 sharpened brass tube to run the servo wire. It enters the root of the wing 6cm from the tip aimed at the TE corner of the cavity. Trimmed the foam flush and glued it in place.

Hatch parts made from a 5cm by 5cm piece of 1/16 ply, eight 3/8 dia by 1cm dowels and hardwood blocks. Measured the depth of the plugs and cut then glued in place with Tightbond III glue. sanded flush. positioned the servo in the cavity put twosided tape on it and placed the hatch on mounted the blocks to the hatch, cut the slot for the control arm. Marked the hatch corners with then drilled for the socket head screws. With one done I transposed the measurements to the other wing half and it want much faster. All together it turrned out easier than expected. I plan on making a template of each wing underside to locate and transpose the hatch location on the sheeted wing. Will fully sheet the wing for strength.

All for now,
Pete
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Old 02-13-2007, 11:07 PM
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build

More photo's
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Old 02-14-2007, 12:13 AM
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Tequesta
 
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build

Looking good Pete
Old 02-14-2007, 03:21 PM
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build

Always wanted to build this kit, will follow your post and pics with great interest. THANKS!!!

Anybody from SIG out there?????? Please reintroduce this kit, there are still kit builders out there.
Old 02-17-2007, 07:27 PM
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build

Fully sheeting the wing eliminates a host of steps and adds strength. I made templates for the top and each bottom. One for each bottom to help locate the hatches later. Placed tape where the hatch goes so no adhesive there. I made the skins using the balsa included but had to buy more. Tru the edges then tape together. lap over the table edge to open the seam and glue. close the gap and wipe off excess. I used wax paper between skins and then pressed them with weight till dry. Using the Pica glue drying time was fast. Then sand the skins and do the rough trim !/4 in larger than the surface covered.

Used the 3m 77 spray adhesive on the cores and skins let it set 20 min then removed the tape on the cores so the balsa would lay flat. Carfully applied them and making a stack like the instructions called for . Aligned the foam so the contour was spot on and added weight. Let it sit for 3hrs.
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Old 02-17-2007, 09:40 PM
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build

More, More, More!!!!!!!
Old 02-18-2007, 10:58 PM
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build

Full day in the shop.

Removed the cores from the chocks and they were great. Trimmed the edges and checked the tips for squareness. Using the templates I cut holes into the sheeting to find the holes for the hatch. Opened the skin so the mounting blocks would pass through. I tried to use a router bit on the Dremmel and it skipped, changed to the drum sander and sanded through worked way better. Marked the outline with the hatch in place and cut out the sheeting and it lifted off nicely. Leading and trailing edges placed then sanding and more sanding then sanded some more to get the profile per plans. Also sanded the sheeting well before gluing the halves together.
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Old 02-18-2007, 11:07 PM
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build

Before gluing the wing together I marked the tunnel location on the sheeting. Then made plugs out of paper towel wrapped with wax paper placed to keep epoxy out of the tunnel. Placed some Petrolium jelly in the antenna tube to keep epoxy out there too. Sanded the root to give the 1/2 in dihedral. Used 30 min epoxy to join.


Pete
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Old 02-19-2007, 07:54 AM
  #21  
Craig-RCU
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build

Hey all,
I think that the glow power option was just an after-thought by Sig when they designed this plane. Saul makes some good observations about problems with glow-powering the Tri-star as per plans. However, those problems are very solvable by shortening the aft fuse to mount the engine as close to the rear of the wing as possible, then making a cut out in the wing for the fuel tank. The engine gets closer to the C.G. and the tank ends up pretty much right on the C.G. I have an OS 25fp on mine with no nose weight needed. Here is another Tri-Star thread with some pictures of my shortened aft fuse and a link to a video of my Tri-Star http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_85...tm.htm#5172532

Here are some pics of how I mounted the throttle, elevator and nose-wheel servo up front. It is tight but works flawlessly. As I look at my servo setup I wonder if I couldn't have put the elevator servo up front and the throttle servo aft of it. I think that, at the time, I was concerned about having to use nose weight so I put the heavier standard servo up front. No nose weight was needed and the receiver battery is mounted in the belly-pan on the C.G.
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Old 02-19-2007, 09:24 AM
  #22  
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build

Craig,

Thanks for posting. Your TriStar looks great, Hope my covering will look as good. Your mods were motivating me to go ahead with the glow version but Saul's arguments convinced me to do it as a electric.

Did you add anything to strengthen the wing with the tank mounted in it?? Carbon fiber? or just the fiberglass cloth per plans?

I don't think I will need to shorten the tail. If anything I may mount the motor inside the fuse to bring that mass closer to the CG. That will also eliminate the tail cone (but it looks sooo good with it on). Using the 5/32 front nose gear will add weight there and am planning to place the elevator and gear servos up front.

Pete
Old 02-19-2007, 10:59 AM
  #23  
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build

Pete,
Thanks for the complement. Yes, I added spars fore and aft of the fuel tank. It would have been easier to add them before sheeting and gluing the wings together, but that would have been too easy and I'm not one to take the easy way out of anything I cut the tank hole after the wing halves were glued together, then I finagled in the spars.

I don't think that there is a need for you to shorten the aft fuse if you are going electric. The heavier nose wire is a good idea too. I have to straighten my nose gear wire a lot, but I'm not going to do the surgery to replace it until it breaks or it's time to repair and/or recover my Tri-Star.
Old 02-20-2007, 02:46 PM
  #24  
Lamoilleriver
 
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build

Rocketman612 - I am enjoying your progress, didn't realize that the wings foam core. Very interesting post. I like the Tri-star looks and size, have a .15 in the basement that was earmarked for that kit, then SIG discontinues the kit[:@][:@][:@]. I'm afraid us kit builders are a dying breed.

Craig-RCU - Pics and video is great, yes I'm jealous.

Anybody at SIG reading this, please reintroduce this kit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Old 02-20-2007, 04:57 PM
  #25  
Rocketman612
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Default RE: Sig Tri Star Build


ORIGINAL: Lamoilleriver

Rocketman612 - I am enjoying your progress, didn't realize that the wings foam core. Very interesting post. I like the Tri-star looks and size, have a .15 in the basement that was earmarked for that kit, then SIG discontinues the kit[:@][:@][:@]. I'm afraid us kit builders are a dying breed.

Craig-RCU - Pics and video is great, yes I'm jealous.

Anybody at SIG reading this, please reintroduce this kit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks,

The quality of a Sig kit is great. LITE Balsa, Laser cutting, etc. I built a Somethin Extra a few years ago and it also was a fun build.

Hope to start the fuse soon.

Pete

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