RE: NIT PICKING ABOUT WEIGHT? READ THIS
 

I hope your not implying that heavy planes are not fun[:-] Some maneuvers look really great when the plane has a bit of mass pushing it along. Don't get me wrong the ultra light stuff looks like tons of fun but flying back-wards in a 5kt wind is nothing compared to doing it @ 35kts...:D

RE: NIT PICKING ABOUT WEIGHT? READ THIS
 

Man that Gonzo is good looking. I am not a afraid of the wind, I did however while flying that Headmaster trainer down wind learn about ground speed and air speed and no air flow over the control surfaces, I thought my radio was dead .

I guess I just let all the '' build lite'' get to me, sorry. I read a post the other day where a guy said he hated to se a mustang flying like a kite. I guess the key is to just have fun while we can.

Thanks Glenn.

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Broken - Who said anything about 5 knots? I fly Gonzo when nobody else will fly - and it doesn't even have ailerons. Please don't get me wrong though... it's not my place to say what anyone else *should* enjoy flying. But I do think people are far too afraid of wind. Learn to use the wind to make your plane do what you want it to instead of fighting it. I don't see myself ever building a plane heavier on purpose just because of wind.

RE: NIT PICKING ABOUT WEIGHT? READ THIS
 

whatwheel - I agree with the Mustang comment. A buddy of mine has a Nosen Mustang that is way too light. It just floats along and looks really silly if you ask me. But scale is a whole different subject. I'm talking about flight for the sake of flight - not trying to replicate anything.

PS. What's a knot in MPH? I've flown Gonzo in about 20 MPH winds with no problem except landing is a bit of a challenge. But if I screw up and dump her in there's never any damage. No mass. :D

RE: NIT PICKING ABOUT WEIGHT? READ THIS
 

A long time ago (late 70s) my Dad help me build a P-63 King Cobra C/L. This was not a big kit and was rated for a .09 - .25 engine. We growing up with a lot of brothers and sisters (my parents were foster parents -- way cool, but not for me) we recyled everthing. So my beautiful Profile P-63 flying on 50' wires was powered by an old steel sleaved K&B .19 Green head. This plane took about 8 16 Penny nails in the tail to balance it. It flew rock solid and would even wing-over (C/L guys know what I'm talking about) but don't pull to many Gs on anything. She would actually nearly stall and wobble through at the bottom of a loop. After getting a job delivering papers, I bought a brand new Fox 0.15 with the offset glow. More power and at least a pound lighter (maybe stretching it a bit) but what a difference.

My earlier post on my 9 lbs Supersportster on how great she fly's is true "Heavy plane can fly very good."

But to the point:
--Build light (but you don't have to go crazy like cuting a hundred lightening holes in a kit that doesn't call for them)
--Build strong (this means re-enforce where appropriate and the the correct materials don't skimp on structure)
--Finishing can add as much as 25% to your model!
--Its better to come close to the rated weight with an engine in the specified range than to over power and add lead (most of the time, but a lot of exception to this one -- mostly applies to sport and trainer types -- with warbirds we generally are about 1/2 ton heavier than rated -- I mean sometimes flying at nearly 50oz of wing loading. So what's another 20 oz if you can get another horse under the cowl)
--If its 10%-20% over weight with a strong engine it will probably fly great, so great you'll never even think about weight again with this plane.
--If its more than that -- well anything goes. It could be a great flyer, a good flyer, or a brick (warbird = 2x4, lighter than a brick with better aerodynamics).

So just build, build, build, build. Don't spend to much time wondering if you should cut 5 or 10 lightening holes in that 1/8th horizontal stabalizer. Use your head when re-enforcing (1 oz fiber glass and paint should be skipped on .20 size models). Fly the heck out of what you build even if it flys like a warbird (mine looks soooo cool on a high speed with her gears up). If it is to heavy to fly safely than pull your radio gear and your engine. Add a bunch of scale details and dummy stuff. Then hang it from the ceiling so you can admire your work on those raining days. Beside, hanging a beautiful non-flying model in your family room lets the rest of the family members share in the craftmenship of your art and passion.

RE: NIT PICKING ABOUT WEIGHT? READ THIS
 

CafeenMan- JOKE ON MY PART--- I assume that a light plane can fly very slow. If light enough less than 5kt (1 knot = 1.15077945 mile). My heavy plane on the other hand would need considerably more wind to pull off the same feat.

I have only done one back-wards landing due to high wind and that was many years ago in VA....

RE: NIT PICKING ABOUT WEIGHT? READ THIS
 

Broken - I've tried zero airspeed landings on many occassions, but only successful once. Normally what happens is the wind gives out at about one foot of altitude and the plane dumps in.

mcarleno - Good points. If I felt a plane needed to be heavier to handle the wind then I would probably still build light but then add removeable ballast as conditions dictate. At least you still have the option of flying a light plane when there's less wind.

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cafeen man when are you going to finish the Wermacht's Scorpion i had been checking its progress weekly. get to it man i dont have all day :)

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Cafeen man,

Thanks for the comments -- from you that is a very big compliment. I have learn so much from your site from glassing, making cowls, and forms, to strengthening and lightening.

I suggested nearly the same approach for learning to handle and fly warbirds where typically with all of the scaling that we idiots do, many of us go from 4*s to Thunderbolts with no way to learn. Warbirds fly a lot different. A great method to learn warbirds on sport planes like a Super Sportster is to add weight. Adding removable balast you can slowly add wing loading to learn how that 12 lb 700 sq. inch warbird will handle in the air and on the ground.

RE: NIT PICKING ABOUT WEIGHT? READ THIS
 

Cafeen man- You have a great website, good job. Thanks for joining in here. I've heard of people seizing up on their project trying to decide if a nyrod vs old time balsa control rod would make a difference in weight/performance. 4-40 vs 2-56 linkages and on and on. There is nothing wrong in doing it light, just do it right. A lot of new guys and gals will benefit from useful discussion as found in this thread.

RE: NIT PICKING ABOUT WEIGHT? READ THIS
 

have to agree about light planes in crashes - less mass = less kinetic energy = less damage. If built well, a light structure will be every bit as strong as a "reinforced" one where aerodynamic forces are concerned, but will just as likely sustain less damage upon impact due to its lower mass.

I've moved exclusively to electric, with one residual glo plane ... cant yet afford the e conversion for it ... if it's windy i just use a heavier battery pack and thereby up my wing loading

i.f.

RE: NIT PICKING ABOUT WEIGHT? READ THIS
 

I have heard many times a Seniorita won't fly in the wind because it is too light. BULL! It is one of my favorite planes to fly in excessive wind. There is a balance between weight and performance, you must first decide what you want from your plane and go accordingly. Keep it in the target range and it will be a good all-around flier in wind or calm conditions.