New A/C weight limts = Good News
02-11-2011, 12:29 PM
#1
New A/C weight limts = Good News
As a perinneal experimental aircraft permit holder, I found this interesting. The AMA sent me the following information on weight increases to model A/C. I found it interesting, given all the FAA talk lately. I especially like the increase to 77.2 pounds (?...why the .2), as most 10 foot airplanes, which I liken to, can be kept within this weight range, even if you tend to build heavy as I do:
Dear Permit to Fly Holder,
On January 25, 2011, AMA’s Executive Council (EC) approved an update to the Large Model Aircraft program. This program includes some significant changes that you need to be aware of and should familiarize yourself with prior to the next annual inspection. To review the document go to http://www.modelaircraft.org/files/520-a.pdf.
One of the most prominent changes is the weight increase to 125 pounds for prop-driven models (LMA) and 100 pounds for turbine-powered models (LTMA). There are four classifications referenced within the program: LMA-1, LMA-2, LTMA-1 and LTMA-2.
Classifications LMA-1 and LTMA-1 (55 pounds to 77.2 pounds) will allow for a self-inspection by the owner of the LMA or a Large Model Aircraft Inspector (LMAI). It will require two demonstration flights in front of two observers. The owner can serve as one of the observers, as long as he/she is not the pilot of the model. The other observer has to be an AMA Contest Director (CD), Leader Member (LM) or Large Model Aircraft Inspector (LMAI).
Classifications LMA-2 and LTMA-2 will require inspection by an LMAI, followed by demonstration flights observed by the inspector.
Please note that all required documentation (as outlined in the program) has to be received by AMA HQ no later than 30 days after being issued for the permit to be valid! AMA HQ will send a receipt notification to the owner listed on the Permit to Fly. To allow an immediate notification, we will need your current and valid e-mail address on file or listed on the submitted documentation. We will update the Web site permit listing (Document 520-C, located in the Members Only section) accordingly; however, this update does not take place on a daily basis.
Jeff
Dear Permit to Fly Holder,
On January 25, 2011, AMA’s Executive Council (EC) approved an update to the Large Model Aircraft program. This program includes some significant changes that you need to be aware of and should familiarize yourself with prior to the next annual inspection. To review the document go to http://www.modelaircraft.org/files/520-a.pdf.
One of the most prominent changes is the weight increase to 125 pounds for prop-driven models (LMA) and 100 pounds for turbine-powered models (LTMA). There are four classifications referenced within the program: LMA-1, LMA-2, LTMA-1 and LTMA-2.
Classifications LMA-1 and LTMA-1 (55 pounds to 77.2 pounds) will allow for a self-inspection by the owner of the LMA or a Large Model Aircraft Inspector (LMAI). It will require two demonstration flights in front of two observers. The owner can serve as one of the observers, as long as he/she is not the pilot of the model. The other observer has to be an AMA Contest Director (CD), Leader Member (LM) or Large Model Aircraft Inspector (LMAI).
Classifications LMA-2 and LTMA-2 will require inspection by an LMAI, followed by demonstration flights observed by the inspector.
Please note that all required documentation (as outlined in the program) has to be received by AMA HQ no later than 30 days after being issued for the permit to be valid! AMA HQ will send a receipt notification to the owner listed on the Permit to Fly. To allow an immediate notification, we will need your current and valid e-mail address on file or listed on the submitted documentation. We will update the Web site permit listing (Document 520-C, located in the Members Only section) accordingly; however, this update does not take place on a daily basis.
Jeff
02-11-2011, 04:20 PM
#4
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RE: New A/C weight limts = Good News
ORIGINAL: F4u5
... I especially like the increase to 77.2 pounds (?...why the .2), as most 10 foot airplanes, which I liken to, can be kept within this weight range, even if you tend to build heavy as I do:
... I especially like the increase to 77.2 pounds (?...why the .2), as most 10 foot airplanes, which I liken to, can be kept within this weight range, even if you tend to build heavy as I do:
02-12-2011, 10:19 AM
#6
RE: New A/C weight limts = Good News
ORIGINAL: G-Pete
...I don't know about ''good'' news - there were no restrictions before and only AMA appointed inspections for the waiver.
...I don't know about ''good'' news - there were no restrictions before and only AMA appointed inspections for the waiver.
02-14-2011, 08:17 AM
#7
My Feedback: (43)
RE: New A/C weight limts = Good News
Yeah it is great news. Much easier to get a CD and another pilot to watch the test flights vs. coordinating an inspector and all of that Jazz. I am referring to the less than 77.2 class. I might actually start on my Tigercat now.
02-14-2011, 08:49 AM
#8
RE: New A/C weight limts = Good News
Yes, the old limit was 55 pounds and no waiver. Waiver required 55-100 pounds, with an AMA inspector overseeing the build and test flights. No A/C over 100 pounds. Now, 55-77.2 only required 2 observers (note no A/C inspections by anyone but builder). In the end, it makes it a little easier to certify up to 77.2 pounds, expecially from the builder's perspective. I can now have a 150 pound model as well. So, this is good news.
02-14-2011, 10:06 AM
#9
RE: New A/C weight limts = Good News
ORIGINAL: F4u5
Yes, the old limit was 55 pounds and no waiver. Waiver required 55-100 pounds, with an AMA inspector overseeing the build and test flights. No A/C over 100 pounds. Now, 55-77.2 only required 2 observers (note no A/C inspections by anyone but builder). In the end, it makes it a little easier to certify up to 77.2 pounds, expecially from the builder's perspective. I can now have a 150 pound model as well. So, this is good news.
Yes, the old limit was 55 pounds and no waiver. Waiver required 55-100 pounds, with an AMA inspector overseeing the build and test flights. No A/C over 100 pounds. Now, 55-77.2 only required 2 observers (note no A/C inspections by anyone but builder). In the end, it makes it a little easier to certify up to 77.2 pounds, expecially from the builder's perspective. I can now have a 150 pound model as well. So, this is good news.
03-10-2011, 06:11 AM
#12
RE: New A/C weight limts = Good News
Well, apparently even with an improvement that AMA can still screw the pooch. I got this e-mail from my former inspector who resigned as a result of the new rules. I guess I never thought about the changes from the inspector's sided of the fence. Can't say I blame him:
Jeff,
Recent changes in the LMA certification procedure expose Inspectors to litigation risks that didn’t exist before. There are several problems with the new rules. I will describe just two of them.
1. Inspectors are required to calculate servo torque using an algebraic formula provided by the AMA. This formula contains constants that appear to be arbitrary. When I asked the AMA how these constants were derived, I was told that they are based on someone’s personal experience. When I asked how to calculate servo torque for other control schemes, I was told the formula is only an example. It is the inspector’s responsibility, not the AMA’s, to defend this procedure, even in a court of law. I am unable to do that.
2. For kit-built models, it is the inspector’s responsibility to verify that the plane was built per the kit’s instructions. How to do that? The AMA offers no help.
In the event that an LMAI-certified model causes injury to persons or property, the inspector can be sued for negligence or incompetence. The AMA offers no immunity from this. The only protection that an inspector has is the AMA secondary insurance that all AMA members carry. That may pay lawsuit awards, but it does not protect the inspector from being sued. It’s not worth it.
Jeff,
Recent changes in the LMA certification procedure expose Inspectors to litigation risks that didn’t exist before. There are several problems with the new rules. I will describe just two of them.
1. Inspectors are required to calculate servo torque using an algebraic formula provided by the AMA. This formula contains constants that appear to be arbitrary. When I asked the AMA how these constants were derived, I was told that they are based on someone’s personal experience. When I asked how to calculate servo torque for other control schemes, I was told the formula is only an example. It is the inspector’s responsibility, not the AMA’s, to defend this procedure, even in a court of law. I am unable to do that.
2. For kit-built models, it is the inspector’s responsibility to verify that the plane was built per the kit’s instructions. How to do that? The AMA offers no help.
In the event that an LMAI-certified model causes injury to persons or property, the inspector can be sued for negligence or incompetence. The AMA offers no immunity from this. The only protection that an inspector has is the AMA secondary insurance that all AMA members carry. That may pay lawsuit awards, but it does not protect the inspector from being sued. It’s not worth it.
03-10-2011, 08:46 AM
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RE: New A/C weight limts = Good News
ORIGINAL: F4u5
Yes, the old limit was 55 pounds and no waiver. Waiver required 55-100 pounds, with an AMA inspector overseeing the build and test flights. No A/C over 100 pounds. Now, 55-77.2 only required 2 observers (note no A/C inspections by anyone but builder). In the end, it makes it a little easier to certify up to 77.2 pounds, expecially from the builder's perspective. I can now have a 150 pound model as well. So, this is good news.
Yes, the old limit was 55 pounds and no waiver. Waiver required 55-100 pounds, with an AMA inspector overseeing the build and test flights. No A/C over 100 pounds. Now, 55-77.2 only required 2 observers (note no A/C inspections by anyone but builder). In the end, it makes it a little easier to certify up to 77.2 pounds, expecially from the builder's perspective. I can now have a 150 pound model as well. So, this is good news.
03-10-2011, 09:04 AM
#16
My Feedback: (43)
RE: New A/C weight limts = Good News
I have a question after reading this:
Classifications LMA-1 and LTMA-1 (55 pounds to 77.2 pounds) will allow for a self-inspection by the owner of the LMA or a Large Model Aircraft Inspector (LMAI). It will require two demonstration flights in front of two observers. The owner can serve as one of the observers, as long as he/she is not the pilot of the model. The other observer has to be an AMA Contest Director (CD), Leader Member (LM) or Large Model Aircraft Inspector (LMAI).
If the owner is also the pilot, I read it to say that he can perform his own inpections but not be an observer. Therefore, do both observers now have to be LMAI, CD, or Leader Member?
Classifications LMA-1 and LTMA-1 (55 pounds to 77.2 pounds) will allow for a self-inspection by the owner of the LMA or a Large Model Aircraft Inspector (LMAI). It will require two demonstration flights in front of two observers. The owner can serve as one of the observers, as long as he/she is not the pilot of the model. The other observer has to be an AMA Contest Director (CD), Leader Member (LM) or Large Model Aircraft Inspector (LMAI).
If the owner is also the pilot, I read it to say that he can perform his own inpections but not be an observer. Therefore, do both observers now have to be LMAI, CD, or Leader Member?
03-10-2011, 10:20 AM
#17
RE: New A/C weight limts = Good News
You are correct Jeff. So basically it is a little easier, as CD's are easier to find and more readily available...at least in our area. And you typically had to cover LMAI's costs if they had to travel to you...at least they could request expense reimbursement.
Jeff
Jeff
03-11-2011, 06:38 AM
#19
RE: New A/C weight limts = Good News
Hey Mitch, yes, there are forms. They are on the AMA site under membership data. I can forward them if you want to e-mail me at [email protected] or see if this link works for you: http://www.modelaircraft.org/files/520-a.pdf
Jeff
Jeff
