elven wizard

I've always been intrigued of WW2 technology especially of what the Germans had. More so after watching Hitler's Stealth Fighter on the National Geographic channel. So I took the day off and my trusty camera to go to the San Diego Aerospace museum and to look at this marvel in person. I spent hours looking at all the planes, but the German Stealth Fighter I looked at the longest. I was in total awe ! It's hard to believe they had this kind of technology back then in 1945 ! Just amazing. Can you imagine what our American troops thought when they opened up the doors to that hanger in Germany to see this !

Besides the German Messerschmitt 262 jet fighter everyone else had prop planes. Other high tech machines the Germans had - Ships, Tanks, Guns, Planes even said to have flying saucers.

elven wizard

more pics

elven wizard

Could alot of the technology we have today be from German technology ....

DaveG55

I honestly doubt that there would be much of a space program today - or at least not nearly as advanced as it is - w/o the Germans.
But don't discount what the allies had/did either. Look at radar and the nuclear weapons. There were some stunningly intelligent men involved with the Manhatten Project.

elven wizard

The Manhatten Project ahhhh now that's another story

elven wizard

and more stunning pics

slimjimzrule

if the war ended only like a year later, who knows what the germans could have invented...makes ya think a little about how advanced they were and you can't forget about hitlers "secret lab's" where is rumored that they tested super weapons.

elven wizard

I had talked recently to a few American WW2 veterans and they had said if the war had lasted a year longer the war might of ended differently

elven wizard

Talking to to WW2 history buffs I get different answers on how far ahead were the Germans than the U.S. when it came to technology. One told me they were just a few years ahead of the U.S. another said they were many, many years ahead of us in technology.

HJJFFFAA

Could use some overnight parts from Japan.

quietnas1

I must say that I have also researched the technology of WW2 and the Natzis. From the strange planes to the so called flying saucers which I believe were real. They were supposed to be powered by either BMW or Rolls Royce Jet engines and also use electro magnetism. Crazy to think about what could have happened if they had escalated their research.

Also look into Nicola Tesla. He did a lot of experimemnts with free energy, electro magnetism, and was even on the verge of creating a flying machine that required no fuel. He also invented the first remote control anyrthing. It was a small boat and he was trying to sell remote control technology to the military. Also the Germans had small remote control tank looking things that were about the size of a 1/4 scale RC car and it was packed with explosives. They used them to blow up allied tanks but they were not to reliable.

Then you think about what we did with the A bomb. To think that we could unleash such a great force just by splitting an atom. Incredible if you ask me and mind blowing till this day.

elven wizard

Here's an interesting read -


In 1945 German made UFO's could travel to moon in 1 hour!

A German scientist, Victor Schamber, was the designer of many crafts and were involved in some alien type crafts. Victor Schamber was of the same class as Nicola Tesla.

People in Germany and North America photographed many of these but they were not thought of as being a craft, since all people could see would be something like a meteorite or 'ball of fire' moving at high speed across the sky (there are many of these photos on the video). Much of this research and development was suppressed from the public and even their own German Government. The video explains why they never used these Foo Fighters in World War II - there was a different agenda that the Germans had and it involved ET's.

The Germans had bases on the moon as early as 1930. They used UFO's to get supplies from around the world to these moon bases.



The Belmonto Saucer with rocket engines. ( pic below )
Many people think that the Germans lost the war as a result of defeat from the Americans and Russians. This is not entirely the case. The Germans had technology during the war that was far advanced that anyone had thought.



A stealth type bomber with a flywheel that ran D1 engines. There were no windows on this craft since the pilot inside could not see anyway. The craft would fly so fast visuals would mean nothing.


The German enemies could not figure out where military equipment was being made, since analysis showed that the Germans had more fighting power than known factories to produce them. The Germans had Underground "Grap" tunnels. They were about 15-25 km long. Equipment was manufactured in a production line underground, lifted up in an elevator to the surface.

The speed of German 'planes' were 3.5 times faster than the fastest plane in that time. This is an estimated speed of 2,000 km per hour. According to Billy Meier - in 1942, UFO's also had a general speed of 2,000 km per hour, which was bout 3 1/2 times faster than planes of that time. A strange coincidence!

larryf333

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Not to be a buzzkill, but how can German UFO's fly to the moon in less than an hour in 1945, if they were only going 2000kmh in 1942? I would like to see the reference for that piece of information.

As far as the war, I'm pretty sure we'd all be speaking German right now if it hadn't ended when it did. I can only imagine the number of things that Hitler and his crew were coming up with to wreak havoc on the rest of the world. He was a smart man and knew how to find the smartest/most creative/craziest men in the world to work on German technology. Just imagine, if humans weren't so competitive/greedy/recognition hungry (whatever you want to call it), and actually shared all information and worked cooperatively on creating new things/solving problems, how far we'd have advanced by now. But, it's not in our nature to want to share "the greatest discovery/invention of our time". I imagine Hitler's way of advancing so quickly was to have a dedicated group of scientists, working on one project at a time and making sure they didn't repeat the same mistakes/failures over and over. They weren't competing with each other (like most scientists/companies are today) they were working together and didn't care whether they got the recognition or not. Probably because they were afraid for their lives.

PS- The UFO with the swastika on the side made me LMAO! That is an incredibly disturbing image.

elven wizard

Here's the reference to flying to the moon in less than an hour - http://www.germanufochatter.com/Germ...ers/index.html

On the radio ( coasttocoastam.com) this subject of German technolgy came up said Area 51 and all that ufo activity over there is all derived from WW2 German technology

warheadforever

You do know that the B-2 stealth bomber was based on this airplane.
[img]
http://image2-9.rcuniverse.com/e1/forum/upfiles/283924/Ay75029.jpg[/img]

warheadforever

You know, I just want to say, I find it very nice, that I am not the only one whoo loves to look at all this old German stuff, they had a lot of thins back then, that if they had built them, could have very well changed who won that war.......including, the world first nuclear generator.[X(]

The Hedgehog

I have a 262 jet r/c model that is fun to fly. I also have the Heinkel 162 model to fly as well. I am big into the German jets of WW2. A model of the Komet (sp?) is on the way.

elven wizard

It would be cool if today they can get up and going a working Horten Wing German Stealth Fighter. That would be a sight to see.

larryf333

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Okay, I see where you're coming from with that. However, that site annoys the hell out of me because of all the misspellings and errors. I was ready to kick myself in the nutz after reading that. It makes it much less believable when you have that many errors, it's like a 10 year old wrote it. Not saying my writing is much better, though.

Anyhow, Area 51 is the government's goof-up. They should just go ahead, admit it's there and allow access to some of the base. It can be seen from satellites, the surrounding hills and there are signs and fences everywhere. Yet, according to them, it's not there. What a load of crap. The activity over there may or may not be derived from German technology, there's no way we can know for sure. Either way, we are not alone in this universe. Whether the beings are out in space, or in the parts of our oceans we haven't been to yet, remains to be seen, but we are not the only beings with advanced technology and tools. To say we are would be ignorant and close-minded.

elven wizard

Interesting you bring this up.
Talking to a very smart person I know a while back on this Ufo's, Area 51 etc. He said and now I want you to think of this. Out of the thousands and thousands of years advances towards lets say technology mankind was very slow until we came upon the last century especially during and after WW2. Technology then shot up. He said that Roswell was not a UFO from outer space, but our very own UFO from German technology.


True or not it sure makes ya think. In a way alot of it makes sense.

J.D.T

I also suspect we would be having this conversation in German if Half that stuff was true, they did make some crazy things that is for sure, the problem is they could have produced what 100 real fighter planes with the money they waisted on each of these gimmicks which rarely if ever worked, as far as the 2000 kmph spaceship gotta think that scientist found the mushroom growing Glap tunnel lol.

elven wizard

You said J.D.T I also suspect we would be having this conversation in German if Half that stuff was true, but if.........perhaps another year Germany would of lasted this stuff might of come to frutation. I'm reading and have been on WW2. Right after the war Americans started to take German secret technology back to the U.S. They had said some of the stuff they were inventing was way out there and Scary !







(x) "Rearward impulse propulsion for vehs and aircraft". Given the nature of Dr. Erb's other work, it is a safe bet that this "impulse propulsion" was not of the jet or rocket nature. In fact there remains little doubt that this propulsion was, in fact, field propulsion. Dr.Erb was experimenting on means to apply forward motion using rearward impulse propulsion to aircraft and "vehs" (vehicles). If this is not the smoking gun for German experiments in field propulsion saucers, it is at least a hint that there is a gun.

larryf333

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http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com...iscs_plans.htm

elven wizard

nice read Larry here's another


http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=...ed=0CCIQ9QEwCA

elven wizard

Disc Aircraft of The Third Reich



Introduction by Rob Arndt



Probably the most misunderstood and problematic of all terrestrial-based disc technology lies at the heart of the German disc programs that started with the birth of the NSDAP (Nazi Party) in 1920- a full 13 years before Adolf Hitler came to power as the leader of the Third Reich.


To fully comprehend the depth of these programs requires the knowledge that above all else the NSDAP was founded from the onset by the occult Thule (1917) and Vril (1919) Gesellschafts (Societies), and other occult groups like the DHvSS (Men of the Black Stone) that stretched back to the turn of the 20th century with the old German Order (a.k.a. Order of Teutons).


As such the very first disc project in Germany built in 1922 was not even an aircraft but an inter-dimensional flight machine in disc form- the JFM built by Thule-Vril.


When Adolf Hitler (a Thule member along with Goering, Himmler, and various other top Nazi officials) became chancellor in Germany in 1933 the 11 year occult metaphysical science of Thule-Vril became strengthened by official state backing for the continued disc development programs starting with an RFZ (RundFlugZeug), or "Round Aircraft" series of discs that utilized levitators developed by W.O. Schumann of the Technical University of Munich who worked on the JFM.


1934 saw the first RFZ discs built which led in five short years to two vast programs of highly advanced disc aircraft overseen by Himmler’s SS- specifically, the SS technical branch Unit E-IV (Entwicklungsstelle 4) which was created to explore various alternative energies. This unit was tasked with developing both the Haunebu and Vril disc designs that utilized the world’s first electro-magnetic-gravitic drive systems: the Vril and Thule Triebwerks. These drives relied on Hans Coler’s free energy Konverter coupled to a Van De Graaf band generator and Marconi vortex dynamo (a huge spherical tank of mercury) to create powerful rotating electromagnetic fields that affected gravity.

Meanwhile, BMW started work on a design very similar to Schriever’s Flugkreisel but utilizing the company’s own BMW 003 jet engines. These machines, called ‘Flugelrads" (Winged Wheels) were not really true disc aircraft but jet autogyros that used a standard BMW 003 with a Strahlrohr (Jet pipe) deflector to power a multi-blade disc rotor. These craft were built on a much smaller scale than Schriever’s Flugkreisel so work proceeded from 1941-45 with construction of prototypes beginning in 1943. Instability, however, was never really solved in the earlier designs. One disc, however, a BMW Fluglerad II V-2 possibly achieved flight in April 1945.


Schriever’s own disc began to take shape in 1943 as well and flew under jet power provided by three attached special kerosene-burning jet engines driving the disc rotor as well as two kerosene jets on the body for forward thrust and horizontal stability.


Flight characteristics were good but then the SS decided to abruptly drop Schriever’s jet-fan design in favor of Miethe’s version that eliminated the large disc rotor blades driven by jet engines for Schauberger’s liquid vortex engine, but on a larger scale. With Schauberger released back to Austria in 1944 by the SS, the Miethe disc took to the air that same year over the Baltic.


At the same time a private venture with official backing from Air Ministry General Udet was taking shape in Leipzig. Arthur Sack who caught the attention of Udet way back in 1939 with his A.S.1 circular wing flying aero model was given permission and some funding to build a manned large-scale version of his model. Sack took up the challenge and built 4 more models of increasing size. When the A.S.5 demonstrated that the basic concept was sound construction began on the manned version in early 1944- the A.S.6. Within a month the strange largely wooden aircraft utilizing salvaged parts from a ME BF 108 was taxiing and making attempts to fly. But this project was doomed from the start with an underpowered engine and plagued by structural problems which meant the aircraft could hop- but never fly.

Due to round-the-clock bombing the SS was forced to try even more drastic measures, launching unmanned interceptor discs from the Schwarzwald. These discs were known as the "Feuerball" weapon, sometimes erroneously referred to as the mystery "V-7" weapon (of which there never was an official designation). The WNF Feuerball relied on a rocket motor for launch, a plume sensor for aerial detection, and an electrostatic filed weapon invented at Messerschmitt’s Oberammergau facility. Production of these craft was initially performed by WNF. Because the discs burned chemicals around its ring to create the electrostatic field necessary to disable Allied bomber engines and radar the object was soon nicknamed the "Foo Fighter" by the Allies who sighted this fiery halo weapon approaching them by day or night. FOO was a take on the French word Feu (Fire) and from the Smokey Stover comic of a bumbling fireman that actually started fires!


Naturally, WNF observed the burning effect too and soon nicknamed their weapon the WNF Feuerball (Fireball). The Feuerballs plagued the 415th NFS from November 1944 to April 1945. By that time production had been shifted to the Zeppelin Werk that nicknamed the larger improved weapon as "Kugelblitz" (Ball Lightning). The Allies seemed confused by these weapons which ranged in size from small to large and attacked in singles or multiples. The Germans further confused the Allies by launching "Seifenblasen" along with the Feuerballs. Seifenblasen (Soap Bubbles) were large weather balloons trailing metal strips that confused Allied radar. Their large round shape reflecting in daylight gave them the appearance of a shining globe similar to the Feuerball. The Germans further complicated the identification of the "Foo Fighters" with a range of smaller purely spherical aerial probes that were used as psychological weapons. These "KugelWaffen" (Ball weapons) played aerial games with the Allied bomber gunners that would have in time distracted them from the real threat of larger approaching Kugelblitz discs.


But by the spring of 1945 the war was lost regardless and most of the remaining disc programs were halted. Henri Coanda had been arrested in Paris in 1940 and forced to work on a disc under SS supervision. His design for a lenticular disc that benefited from his own "Coanda effect" was a masterpiece of jet disc design. But because it required 12 JUMO 004 jets to power the huge machine the project never got past the wind tunnel testing phase. Likewise, Andreas Epps independent Omega Diskus which utilized two Pabst ramjets and 8 Argus lift fans was also confined to 1/10th scale model testing.


Dr. Alexander Lippisch had also studied disc aerodynes back in 1941 but was too involved in the ME-163 Komet and DM-1 delta glider programs to produce anything more than brief design concepts based on the Gottingen K 1253 disc wing profile. The Horten brothers, experts with flying wings, also studied circular wing designs but did not actually work on any in Nazi Germany. They did so for the US Govt. postwar in late 1945-46 producing what is now believed to be the craft that crashed at Roswell in 1947- a spy craft parabolic lifting body carried by a large meteorological balloon.


In the face of imminent defeat BMW destroyed all their Flugelrads. Schriever’s Flugkreisel was also destroyed. Miethe’s disc may have been captured as Miethe went to Canada postwar to work on AVRO’s designs.


Habermohl was captured by the Russians while Dr. Belluzzo returned to Italy. Schauberger’s Repulsins were also captured by the Allies while most of the SS scientific branch records still intact were captured by the British who postwar attempted to create a working design through AVRO Canada with eventual US assistance.


One very little known Peenemunde disc project under Heinrich Fleissner was the last disc to take off from Berlin in late April 1945 on an official mission. But details of the "Dusenscheibe" (Devils Disc) remain clouded in mystery.
Meanwhile, the Feuerball attacks that stopped in April 1945 in Germany resumed in August 1945 in Japan- an obvious technology transfer from Germany to Japan via U-Boat. The Japanese, however, lacked all the documentation for this weapon and only launched a few. It is said that the Japanese were frightened by this "demonic thing" and destroyed the remaining Feuerballs by dynamiting them in a pit. Photographic evidence also seems to identify "Kugelwaffen" sent to Japan as well as several are seen trailing Sally bombers, probably for flight testing.


But the Third Reich story ends as strangely as it had begun. What about the mysterious Thule-Vril discs which were actually built in small numbers? By 1945 there were quite a few Haunebu II and Vril 7 discs flying. Vril had even tested the Vril 8 Odin and possibly the even more streamlined Vril-9 Abjager. These craft were not destroyed but evacuated from March 1945 to an area safe from Allied bombing or capture.


In the year preceding the start of WW2 Germany sent an expedition to Antarctica to scout out a location for a military base there. The Germans found such a location in the former Queen Maud Land which Germany renamed Neu Schwabenland. There, in secret during 1942-43, a base was built in the Muhlig-Hoffman mountains. Base 211 (or Station 211). The base was supplied with slave laborers shipped by sea and U-boats to construct an elaborate cave complex deep within the mountains- an impregnable fortress. Hot internal springs were found there, iron ore deposits, vegetation and access was achieved primarily through an underwater trench that ran through the area.

During the war, especially the latter part, German U-boats made frequent trips to the South Atlantic, South America, and Antarctica. Germany also set up floating meteorological buoys in Antarctic waters and weather stations on islands located between Antarctica and the tip of South America. The SS RuSHA, (Rasse und SeidlungsHauptAmt- Race and Settlement Bureau) began in 1942 to take women of Aryan decent (Volksdeutsch) from the Ukraine solely for the purpose of transporting them to Base 211. Ten thousand women between the ages of 17-24, blonde and well proportioned, were recruited for the project along with 2,500 Waffen SS soldiers serving in Russia. The goal of this massive undertaking was to create a colony at Base 211 suitable for habitation and continued development of the Thule-Vril technology. It is believed that both the Thule and Vril Gesellschafts evacuated that technology to Base 211 at the close of the war under SS General Kammler, who was in charge of Germany’s most secret weapons programs. Two U-boats that surrendered after the war in Argentina are also believed to have carried cargo and high-ranking SS to Base 211. Both boats were empty upon surrender with the crews refusing to disclose their cargos and destinations.

It became apparent in 1946 that 54 U-boats and over 6,000 technicians and scientists were ‘"missing" from Germany- especially from the SS Technical Branch. There were also 40, 000 slave laborers and between 142,000-250,000 German citizens unaccounted for. Despite simply writing these off as probable losses and deaths of the war, Washington suspected that a large number of these missing actually escaped to South America and Base 211 (if such a base existed). The US then went on a hunt using the "war criminal" propaganda to cover up the search for technology akin to a South American version of "Operation Paperclip".


The United States was so concerned about the secret base that in 1947 with the first Antarctic summer "Operation Highjump" was launched with a full military task force headed by Admiral Byrd. The task forth was to head straight for Neu Schwabenland and recon the area for a base. If one was found 4,700 armed troops would have been sent to capture it or destroy it. The task force performed the aerial recon, trailing magnetometers to detect any magnetic anomalies under the ice… but several of Byrd’s planes were lost. The aircraft had run into enemy opposition. "Operation Highjump" ended in failure as Byrd headed back after several weeks, far short of the 8 months that was intended. In his unofficial comments to the South American press Byrd stated that he was attacked by "enemy aircraft" that "could fly from pole to pole at incredible speed". Subsequently, the modern UFO phenomenon sprang up in 1947 and concentrated disc development programs were initiated in the ‘50s that have continued on to present-day "black project" aircraft operated by the CIA, NSA, and NRO.


So the story of the Third Reich disc programs does not end with the collapse of the Third Reich itself. It continues unresolved…

Each occult group had its own distinct beliefs and origins. The DHvSS (1912) worshipped the German mountain goddess Isias and the Schwarz Stein (black stone). The Thule Gesellschaft (1917) believed in the hollow earth theory and derived its name from Ultima Thule the ancient capital of Hyperborea at the top of the world. Vril worshipped the Black Sun (the invisible inner light of the Godhead) which supposedly gave or generated incredible power and communicated with Aryan aliens through psychic channeling.


But unlike the other two groups the Vril Gesellschaft were an inner circle of women who were also fighting against their times and culture. They were psychic mediums that wore a horse-tail hairstyle. They believed that their long hair acted as cosmic antennae to receive alien communication from beyond. So this is where the Vril disc story begins.

Despite their distrust of men, the women of Vril joined with the Thule Gesellschaft and DHvSS in order to construct an inter-dimensional channeled flight disc known as the JenseitsFlugMaschine (JFM). By 1922 the odd disc shaped machine was constructed in Munich and tested for two years. It is not known if any success with channeled flight was ever achieved but a certain W.O. Schumann of the Technical University of Munich invented a levitator from the channeled JFM information provided by the mediums Maria Orsic and Sigrun. By 1924 the JFM project was scrapped but work continued on perfecting the levitator unit known by then as the Schumann SM-Levitator.

With the Nazi Party in power in 1933 (which itself originated from the Thule Gesellschaft) the occultists now received official backing for their continued development of the flight discs. Thule and Vril started with the RFZ (RundFlugZeug, or Round Aircraft) series from 1934-41.


As war had started in 1939 the RFZ-5 became the Haunebu I and by 1941 the RFZ-7 had become the Vril 1 Jager (Hunter). The reason for the changes were due to Thule’s revolutionary Triebwerk (Thrustwork) engine that used rotating electro-magnetic-gravitic fields to affect gravity. Vril had by 1941 perfected the SM-Levitator as well and thus two new series entered limited construction, but with slightly different goals.


Thule wanted to develop both a production combat craft and a functional Raumschiff (Spaceship). Vril, by comparison, only wanted to develop Raumschiffen to reach Aldebaran in the Taurus Constellation 68 light years from earth.

As Hitler had forbid secret societies in Germany from 1941 forward, both Thule and Vril were documented under the SS Technical Branch Unit E-IV (Entwicklungsstelle 4) tasked with developing alternative energies. This unit had already helped with the RFZ series but now “officially” Thule and Vril did not exist. Vril became known secretly as “the chain”. Vril members wore a Doppelsignet disc that represented the two mediums Maria Orsic and Sigrun.

The first purely Vril disc - the Vril 1 Jager (Hunter) was constructed in 1941 and first flew in 1942. It was 11.5 meters in diameter, had a single pilot, and could achieve 2,900 km/h - 12,000 km/h! It flew with a metal dome at first but subsequent test versions had a heavily reinforced glass dome and could seat two crew. Flight endurance was 5.5 hrs. It was planned to arm this craft with two MK-108 cannon plus 2 MG-17 machineguns. Seventeen of these craft were constructed and tested between 1942-44 with 84 test flights


The Vril 2 Zerstorer (Destroyer) was a highly advanced oval shaped disc that was much too complex for the time period; thus it was projected for 1945/46, so no construction was started. The Vril 3 and 4 have been photographed but no surviving information is found on them. Vrils 5 and 6 likewise do not show up and may have only been projects. The Vril 7 and 8, however, were constructed.


The Vril 7 Geist (Ghost) was 45 meters in diameter and crewed by fourteen men. It was built in 1944 and tested at Arado-Brandenburg using Vril‘s own Triebwerk.

Vril’s medium Sigrun made frequent trips to the facility to oversee construction and testing. In 1944, Arado engineers approached her with a request. They wanted to know if the Vril Triebwerk could be adapted to one of their projects- the Arado E.555 strategic bomber. They were abruptly told , “No” and returned to their designs which resulted in eleven different versions of the bomber.


Sigrun was actually insulted because the entire purpose of the Vril discs was aimed at space flight. No conventional bomber could withstand the heat of the velocity achieved by these machines which were constructed of hulls specially made of an advanced metal called Viktalen (in some sources Victalen or Viktalon). The Vril 1 had a single hull of this type, the Vril 7 two. The large Haunbeu III had three!


With the SS supervising all aspects of the disc programs every model had to have at least theoretical provision for armament. In the Vril 7 Geist it would have been four MK-108 cannon.


The Vril 8 Odin was the last official Vril disc that was flight tested in the spring of 1945 during the collapse. This disc had an automatic Oberon upward-firing gun installation on top of the control center.

The Vril Gesellschaft had started evacuating to Base 211 in Neu Schwabenland Antarctica in March 1945 so it would seem like the Vril 8 Odin was the last Vril disc actually tested. However, some weeks after Germany surrendered both Haunebu and Vril craft were spotted in the skies over occupied Germany. Although the Vril 9 Abjager (Universal Hunter) was show as a design on paper, a craft identical to it was photographed postwar.


Vril’s final plan was the construction of a large 139 meter long cylindrical Raumschiff known by the SS E-IV Unit as the Andromeda-Gerat. Work on this “flying cigar” was to commence in 1945 at a huge, sheltered above-ground Zeppelin-like hangar. Once completed it could internally accommodate one large Haunebu IV and two Vril 2 craft, making the journey to Aldebaran, the ultimate dream of the Vril Gesellschaft.

Although these mysterious craft seem to come from the realm of science fiction it is interesting to note that once Germany was occupied and the military Intel teams swept through the defeated nation all documentation and evidence of the Vril Gesellschaft was destroyed by the Allies. If the occult Society and craft never existed and did not represent any threat to the Allies then why has all trace of their existence been forcefully carried out by the victors?

“Not all good comes from above”. For Vril it came “from beyond… 68 light years from earth” and it was this obsession that lead to ALL of the occult German disc programs. One can only wonder if any of them truly made it to their ultimate destination?

Some say that some of them had been sunk into the Austrian Mondsee, others maintain that they were flown to South America or brought there in parts. It is certain though that if the crafts didn't get to South America, the plans that did allowed for new ones to be built and flown there, for an important part had been used in 1983 in the "Phoenix Project", the follow-on project of the 1943 "Philadelphia Experiment". This was a teleportation, materialization and time travel experiment of the U.S. Navy that was more successful than you could imagine in your wildest dreams. There is enough material for another book, but it does not fit too well into our subject here. See the literature list.

In 1938 a German expedition to the ANTARCTIC was made with the aircraft carrier Schwabenland (Swabia). 600,000 km2 of an ice-free area with lakes and mountains were declared German territory, the "NEUSCHWABENLAND" (New Swabia). Whole fleets of submarines of the 21 and 23 series were later headed towards Neuschwabenland.

Today about one hundred German submarines are still unaccounted for, some equipped with the Walter snorkel, a device that allowed them to stay submerged for several weeks, and it can be assumed that they fled to Neuschwabenland with the dismantled flying disks or at least the construction plans. Again it must be assumed that since the test flights had been very successful some so-called flying saucers have flown directly there at the end of the war.

Perhaps some may think these assumptions to be a bit on the daring side, but there are strong indications that this may well have happened that way. (For example the video-production UFO-SECRETS OF THE THIRD REICH - which so clear shows the story here - why is this production never shown in our traditional tv-stations?? Because it shows the whole secret - and why the americans after ww2 had to secure this information for their own increasing of power and PREVENT THIS INFORMATION TO REACH OUT - THIS WOULD SABOTAGE THEIR CONTROL OF THE WORLD THROUGH MONEY AND ENERGY CONTROL).

There is the question why in 1947 ADMIRAL E. BYRD led an invasion of the ANTARCTIC, why he had 4,000 soldiers, a man-of-war, a fully equipped aircraft carrier and a functioning supply system at his command if it was a mere expedition? He had been given eight months for the exercise, but they had to stop after eight weeks and high losses of planes undisclosed even today. What had happened?

Later Admiral Byrd spoke to the press:

"It is the bitter reality that in the case of a new war one had to expect attacks by planes that could fly from Pole to Pole." Further he added that there was an advanced civilization down there that used their excellent technologies together with the SS.

Norbert-Jurgen Ratthofer writes about the whereabouts of the Haunebu developments in his book "Zeitmaschinen" . Time Machines:

"The Haunebu I, II and III space gyros and the VRIL I space flying disk had disappeared after May 1945... It is very interesting to note in this context that after its nineteenth test flight, the German Haunebu III is said to have taken off on April 21, 1945, from Neuschwabenland, a vast, officially German territory in the Eastern Antarctic, for an expedition to Mars, about which there is nothing further known...

One year later, in 1946, the many sightings that suddenly occurred in Scandinavia of shining objects of unknown and definitely artificial origin caused a great stir among the Allies in East and West. Again one year later, in 1947, and well into the Fifties, a rising number of shining unknown flying objects, doubtlessly steered by intelligent beings, mostly round, disk- or bell-shaped, sometimes cigar-shaped, so-called UFOs appeared over North America."

The text goes on to say that as a rule these objects were unlike the German developments. I beg to differ. Good photographic material proves that the Haunebu II version especially had been sighted very often since 1945. If you have wrestled with what is available in the UFO world for ten years as I have, that in a significantly high percentage of the cases where personal contacts with the people from the so-called UFOs was made, these were with especially beautiful Aryan types, blond and blue-eyed and that they either spoke fluent German or another language with a German accent (for insiders I would refer to the Adamski case of 1952, the Cedric Allingham case of 1954 and the Howard Menger case of 1956).

It is further said that colour photographs taken by a night guard in West Germany in the Seventies exist of a landed and restarted flying disk that had both a knight's cross and a swastika on its hull.

The flying machines just mentioned are well documented on photographs and films. There is the 60 minutes documentary "UFO - Secrets of the Third Reich". The American Vladimir Terziski gave a three-hour speech at the September 1991 UFO conference in Phoenix, Arizona, where he showed slides of German saucers, construction plans and subterranean German bases. Also of interest are the book by the Italian air force commander Renato Vesco and the book by Rudolf Lusar "Die deutschen Waffen und Geheimwaffen des Zweiten Weltkrieges und ihre Weiterentwicklung" (The German Arms and Secret Weapons of the Second World War and Their Development), J. F. Lehmanns Verlag, Munich 1971.

Do you see now why the subject of UFOs is treated as nonsense by the media, especially in Germany? Upon this German background it becomes evident that the news and media world controlled by the Illuminati through the Anglo-American Zionist lobby shirks no costs to keep the German citizens from research in this area.

The Question arises from where the Thule and Vril secret societies got their knowledge about the construction of these flying machines? Also their knowledge of gene technology in which area the Germans were also way ahead of other countries?

According to Herbert G. Dorsey and other researchers they had, besides the construction plans the Vril-Gesellschaft had received through telepathic contact with extra-terrestrials, a non-terrestrial saucer that had crashed in the Black Forest in 1936 and whose undamaged drive had proved a great help to the Germans. But there is practically no proof of that, and no living eye witnesses are known.

But these exist in America, and in large numbers. For around the same time the Americans recorded quite a number of crashes that could not be kept entirely secret. More of that later.

Back to the political arena. Apart from the fact that I. G. Farben supported Hitler, their cartel partner "Standard Oil" (Rockefeller) fanned the flames against the Nazis. The "Ford Motor Company" for instance helped to build up the American army while at the same time producing in Germany military vehicles for the Nazis. Ford and Opel (subsidiary of General Motors that is controlled by J. P. Morgan) were the two largest producers of tanks in Hitler's Germany.

Whatever the outcome of the war, these multinational companies had already made their cuts. Many enterprises followed this principle during the Second World War.

Why is there nothing about all this in schoolbooks or encyclopaedias? Especially in Germany where the freedom of the press is apparently honoured and the truth is taught?

One of the reasons is that the Rockefeller Foundation spent US$ 139,000 in 1946 to present an official history of the Second World War which covered up the whole story of the U.S. bankers building up the Nazi regime as well as the occult and mystical background of the Nazis. One of the main sponsors was Rockefeller's own "Standard Oil Corp."