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Scooters/mopeds

Old 06-28-2011, 11:07 AM
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Default Scooters/mopeds

With the price of gas going up and up and up and the "joy" of public transport, I've been seriously considering a scooter or moped for the past couple years. At first I was just going to get a beat up old scooter to last the summer and go from there, maybe get it fixed to keep going with it or get another one each summer. The problem with this is unless your a mechanic there is no such thing as a deal in my area, they dont depreciate until they are just good for parts. So I started considering a new one or good second hand.

While looking I quickly came to the conclusion that the only scooter I found remotely nice to look at and would ride was the Honda ruckus:



It has a raw/rough look to it and well its a Honda. The only problem is they are expensive.

The main thing I dont like about scooters is the way you sit on it. Thats when I started looking at mopeds. Once again I was thinking of an old one, probably from the 70's or something. I started looking at the classifieds and local listings when I found out about a company called Tomos that makes some pretty nice looking mopeds:













Tomos has been around for a long time and probably most of the gearheads know about them but its a new discovery for me. Needless to say I started to get a little more excited about the whole thing. Lets face it, if your planing on getting a fuel efficient mode of transportation why not do it with some style. The best thing was a decent used one was way more reasonable than any scooter, win win in my case. Just looking for one of those deals you just cant pass up.

And just recently I found, what I find to be the best looking of them all, the Sachs Madass:



Engineered in Germany and available in stock form at either 50cc or 125cc in a variety of colors. The main difference is it has a 4 cycle engine rather than the 2 cycle of most scooters/mopeds. One of the things I like about the Sachs is its more of a streetbike and can easily be brought up to a 170cc or more later on. I dont know if others can though. And if you like the raw machine look as I do then this is it, or is it?

At the moment I have no idea which way im going on this and could use some advice. I would like to get your views on certain things.

4cycle vs 2 cycle? I've heard that a 4 cycle under 250cc is not very good. Why would this be?

Old or new? I do plan on using this thing for a long time to come.

What do you ride? What would you ride? and why?

FYI: Unless i pay a huge amount of money for a course (about 700-800$) and wait the 11 month period with a learners permit I'm pretty much stuck with a limit of max 50cc and 70Kph. I will eventually get the license so a bike I can upgrade later on is preferable.
Old 06-28-2011, 11:12 AM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds

WOW. Its 800 bucks for the Motorcycle course? In NH its like 200 bucks and you can get your license in like 2 days.
Old 06-28-2011, 11:18 AM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds

Yeah I know its insane! 950$ for a regular drivers license course, plus exams, driving tests, license is around 250$ a year and insurance is also high because we are a port city, lots of theft in Montreal. The course used to be optional but they passed a new law about 2 years ago. Thats why the moped route is best at the moment. 10$ for the test, no course needed and 32$ for the license per year.
Old 06-28-2011, 11:20 AM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds

Yeah it seems like you are going to have to go with the 50cc route to make it the cheapest. Maybe go used with the scooter as well.
Old 06-28-2011, 11:36 AM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds

Like any motor vehicle, rc or full size, used is always risky. You dont know what the previous owner did to it or if it was maintained properly. That said if I go that route then I will most likely have to pay someone to get it running or at least inspect it to put my mind at ease. I will eventually work on it myself. Like my first nitro, one screw at a time till you know it inside and out.
Old 06-28-2011, 03:45 PM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds

Remember, anything over 50cc requires a motorcycle license and endorsement.

I would advise getting one of the older ones with pedals. The only current company that makes one is Tomos. The Targa LX is a great bike.

Here is the run down on mopeds.

Tomos - Power can be had cheap, and easily upgradeable.
Puch - Endless aftermarket kits, pipes, and parts. Stick with the E50 motor.
Sachs - Powerful, high compression engines. Not easy to mod, and the clutches are weak, but there are very powerful kits out there.
Motobecane - Expensive to mod, but worth it in the long run, as they have a high resale value to the right buyer.
Piaggio/Vespa - Only two models. The older Grande, and the newer Kinetic. Engines are hard and expensive to mod, but seem to last. Kinetic has a weak subframe.

There are others, but these are the main ones. Do not buy a scooter... you might as well wear a pink dress if you do.
Old 06-28-2011, 03:58 PM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds

ORIGINAL: proanti1

Remember, anything over 50cc requires a motorcycle license and endorsement.

I would advise getting one of the older ones with pedals. The only current company that makes one is Tomos. The Targa LX is a great bike.

Here is the run down on mopeds.

Tomos - Power can be had cheap, and easily upgradeable.
Puch - Endless aftermarket kits, pipes, and parts. Stick with the E50 motor.
Sachs - Powerful, high compression engines. Not easy to mod, and the clutches are weak, but there are very powerful kits out there.
Motobecane - Expensive to mod, but worth it in the long run, as they have a high resale value to the right buyer.
Piaggio/Vespa - Only two models. The older Grande, and the newer Kinetic. Engines are hard and expensive to mod, but seem to last. Kinetic has a weak subframe.

There are others, but these are the main ones. Do not buy a scooter... you might as well wear a pink dress if you do.
Exactly how I feel about scooters lol. The targa lx is the one I was looking at until I saw the Sachs. As much as I like the look of the streetmate R I cant justify the price difference. The only problem with Tomos is I have to order parts online, there is no way of getting any in my area. Scooters are crazy popular here, so not many moped parts around.

Great info thanks.
Old 06-28-2011, 04:22 PM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds

No, I was talking about the older mopes with the true two stroke Sachs motor. That one you have up there is a Chinese frame that says "Sachs", with a crappy Chinese 4 stroke motor. Go with the Tomos, you will be a lot happier. Don't buy anything 4 stroke.

Here is a company that sells a ton of moped parts... from kits, to stock parts, to just about everything you would need. http://treatland.tv/

Seriously, go with the Tomos.
Old 06-28-2011, 08:03 PM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds

Hmm... Damn shame, the madass is a looker but if its junk then its junk. Ok back to shopping for a targa lx.

Someone suggested this site for parts, do you know it? If so is it any good?

http://www.1977mopeds.com/
Old 06-28-2011, 08:37 PM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds

the problem with scooters is that you sit on them like a toilet

unless you really want to spend a thousand bucks on a moped you should just buy a used one. I do not like 1977mopeds because of their shipping, I like treatland.tv better.
Old 06-28-2011, 09:30 PM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds


ORIGINAL: -SomeGuy-

Yeah I know its insane! 950$ for a regular drivers license course, plus exams, driving tests, license is around 250$ a year and insurance is also high because we are a port city, lots of theft in Montreal. The course used to be optional but they passed a new law about 2 years ago. Thats why the moped route is best at the moment. 10$ for the test, no course needed and 32$ for the license per year.
Wow it took a lot of restraint to not post a couple choice words.


Now im confused here... In Canada you have to pay 250 dollars a year for a license..? Then they want you to pay 950 for a license course? Say what?
Old 06-28-2011, 09:36 PM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds

I dont think its all of Canada. Probably just my province, it varies from one to the other.
Old 06-28-2011, 09:42 PM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds

If you dont mind me asking.. Are you under age? Cause they definitely dont require a permit where I live if your over 18.
Old 06-28-2011, 09:59 PM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds

in California you need an M2 permit or better no matter what your age is if you want to ride a moped. If you are under 21, you need to take a MSF safety course before you can get a permit.
Old 06-28-2011, 10:09 PM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds

lol. my bud took msf seemed like he had his license in no time. Maybe I just dont recall a permit but it definitely didnt take 11 months.. Seemed like a week..? Dont know. All I know is 11 months of a learners permit and 800 dollars for the license is pretty insane..
Old 06-28-2011, 11:39 PM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds

if you have a drivers license, you never get a motorcycle permit because the safety course passes as the test to get a motorcycle license. So if you complete it you get a provisional license if under 21.
Old 06-28-2011, 11:42 PM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds

Just looking up the exact info and its worse than I thought.

http://www.saaq.gouv.qc.ca/en/driver...ycle/index.php

Looks like the yearly fee is pretty steep as well, even for 50cc.

http://www.saaq.gouv.qc.ca/en/vehicl..._cost/moto.php

Couldnt find the actual cost for the course anywhere.
Old 06-29-2011, 04:22 AM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds


ORIGINAL: -SomeGuy-

I dont think its all of Canada. Probably just my province, it varies from one to the other.

One of the biggest Harley dealer here in our area, Brian, offers courses free. Do not have a bike? They lend you one. They meet on a deserted (old) place where they used to test drivers for the driver's license... I know a couple of people that used their services and no, you do not have to buy to get the free course. I guess they figure that eventually (if you are a biker) they can sell you one....

Gerry
Old 06-29-2011, 05:07 AM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds

several differnt companies make a Rukus clone, ScooterDepot is at $659 on the 50 cc and $1899 on the 150 cc version. I have seen the 150 version for under $1200 in the past however.
We got one of them Sachs dealers here in town but I think they only sell the 50 versions.
Old 06-29-2011, 05:23 AM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds


ORIGINAL: -SomeGuy-

Like any motor vehicle, rc or full size, used is always risky. You dont know what the previous owner did to it or if it was maintained properly. That said if I go that route then I will most likely have to pay someone to get it running or at least inspect it to put my mind at ease. I will eventually work on it myself. Like my first nitro, one screw at a time till you know it inside and out.
In 2008 I purchased a 2001 Honda Reflex 2100.00, 250cc, 65 MPG, 83 MPH top speed, comfort, super reliability. The same time my next door neighbor purchased a 2008 chinese something or other 150cc, today it's not running and nobody will work on it, go figure
Old 06-29-2011, 06:01 AM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds


ORIGINAL: -SomeGuy-

Just looking up the exact info and its worse than I thought.

http://www.saaq.gouv.qc.ca/en/driver...ycle/index.php

Looks like the yearly fee is pretty steep as well, even for 50cc.

http://www.saaq.gouv.qc.ca/en/vehicl..._cost/moto.php

Couldnt find the actual cost for the course anywhere.
Well... its still a pretty good deal. The only expensive part is the insurance, which you would want anyways. You should probably call your DMV and ask them, or ask other Canadian moped owners.

Here in South Carolina, you dont need anything if the moped is below 50cc. You dont even need a tag on it. If registration is a requirement up there in Canada, make sure that whatever you buy has a title, and if it only comes with a bill of sale/ticket, make sure you can still use that to get a title.

As for 1977mopeds, I have had some trouble with them in the past, mostly shipping related.
Old 06-29-2011, 06:59 AM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds

Wow, got it good here. 150 bucks to get it going. I think vehicle registration is something like 75 bucks now here, so each year. Then every 5 yrs, last update was 20 bucks for written test, then 56 for road test license.

I live in a small town, and I truly have to go up hill home and to work..... 14 percent grades, poor bike!!
Old 06-29-2011, 01:18 PM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds

This is whats available in my area at the moment. I should probably wait for the fall and hope someone wants to get rid of one cheap. The 2005 one is not bad but a little to yellow, unless I paint over the winter.

http://montreal.kijiji.ca/f-tomos-ta...earchFormZtrue
Old 06-29-2011, 02:17 PM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds

That's not a bad price... $700CAD is like $730US, I would buy it. That one has an A55 engine, which is a bit better and more powerful than the A35. Maybe you can talk him down to $650 or something. It also hasn't been modded or anything like that, which is something to look for.
Old 06-29-2011, 05:57 PM
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Default RE: Scooters/mopeds

A friend was on a scooter last week end when he hit some gravel, lost control, went off the road and over the handle bars, landing on his chin. Broken jaw and 15 stitches in his chin. He had surgery today to repair his broken jaw. You can always reason that "I'm a good rider and it won't happen to me". Personally, I have no use for the things.

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