Why 2 strokes?
 

Here in Japan 2-strokes are rare at my field, especially on fun-fly/3d type planes. The consensus here seems to be that 4-strokes provide more torque, and hence better torque-rolling, and better transition, hence smoother hovering. What do you all think? Why use a 2-stroke over a 4-stroke?

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

For me on profiles - 2 Strokes all the way:
1.Cheaper
2.Less moving parts
3.Did I say cheaper already

Fav engines Thunder Tiger pro 46 and Webra 32 and Webra 1.20

Also to me I get better control of an airlane with a 2 stroke. Although a 4 strokes torque is good for some things I find the excessive torque sometimes annoying depending on what I'm doing.

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

Wagas, You did say cheaper.....right?? LOL:D
Wish I could get the $$'s together and try a 4 stroke, Just not in the cards right now.
Just broke in my first TT last night ( pro .46 ) WOW! I LOVE THIS ENGINE!

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

Yeah I did didn't I heh Heh..

Problem with saving for 4 strokes for me is by the time I have enough for a saito 72 I've done bought 2 more TT pro .46's


I guess I also like the throttle transition of a 2 stroke, especially in a hover. With the fourstrokes I've had they were more like light switches. Idle to full power----that is a HUGE plus for most (hence torque) fourstrokes but again I guess I just like the spooling up and down of a TT Pro .46 swinging an APC 11 x 3 or 11 x 4 prop.

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

I don't care about price. I'll fly what is best for any particular application. With that being said, I'll never fly a 4-Stroke on a .40 sized profile for a couple of reasons.

The first and biggest reason is one that's already been brought up, throttle response. I've seen a lot of 4-stroke profiles fly and every time the pilot is having to constantly work the throttle up and down to try and maintain a steady hover/torque roll, usually to no avail. It wears me out just WATCHING!

There's just no way that an engine firing on every other revolution can ever have the throttle response of an engine that fires on every revolution. Add the extra weight and drag of the larger 4-stroke propeller and the spool up/down response time is much greater. What has better throttle response, your 2-stroke weedeater or your 4-stroke lawnmower?

The other reason is weight. I've talked to many a 4-stroke enthusiast about this and the first thing they tell you is the Saito only weighs a couple ounces more. What they don't take into consideration is the weight of the whole power package and including the prop the package weighs several ounces more. Weight is critical......

Most people are used to 4 lb plus airplanes and have never flown a 3.5 lb airplane. Fly a 3.5 lb airplane with a 2-stroke engine for a few flights, then try and go back to that 4.5 lb 4-stroke lead balloon you've been flying. You'll put it up for sale so fast, your head'll spin.[&o]

........yeah, yeah.........your's flys great........I'm serious, fly a 3.5 lb plane and your opinion will change dramatically!

Rob

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

Im with Airjunky!

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

I have an OS 25 on my FF Taco, a Webra 50 on my EF Edge and a YS63 on my Burrito. I much prefer the power and throttle response of my YS over the two 2 strokers. As far as all or nothing on a 4 stroker, my YS is very responsive to one click of throttle in hover or harrier. Actually I no longer have any clicks on my radio but you get what I mean. The YS is only my second 4 stroker with drawers full of various 2 strokers and on planes.
They all work great when you get them going so it really doesn't matter. It's not much different the the never ending Ford-Chevy debate.
My $0.02
Matt

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

Why 2 stokes??

Why 4 strokes??

Why ANY strokes is the question. ;)

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

Chuck your not right [8D]

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

I thought in japan everybody was doing E-power??
2 cycle or 4 its like Outrunner vs Inrunner;)

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

The more strokes she gives the more I like it........

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

Actually strangely enough e-power is not as big here as it is in America. Weird, huh? Japan seems ideal for it. In fact I was the first person at our field to get a high performance electric plane, the first person to get a LiPo pack, and the first person to get a brushless motor. That being said, I think e-power is set for an explosion here.

I like e-power, and fly my Tantrum a lot, but there is a different impact level with a fuel powered plane. Seems there is a time for noise and mess. Honestly I would hate to be without either my electric or fuel planes.:)

Back to the subject at hand though. Interesting comments. I've got an OS 32SX in my Taco. I've heard that is not a very good 2-stroke for fun-fly though. I'd like to try one of those Webras I hear people raving about. The most popular engines for fun-fly planes here are the YS 63 and the Saito FA-56F (A special fun fly version fo the Saito 56) Both seem good, but pricey.

Beergator

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

Yeah, seems like Europe is the big E place...with all the consumer electronics produced in Japan, maybe E flight is blase.

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

Yeah. Part of it could be that the law actually prohibits flying in parks. That sort of makes park-flyer a misnomer here. Luckily Japan also has farming fields interspersed throughout the city. I have a feral rice field just across the street. That allows for some quick flying any time I can sneak away.

Beergator

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

Price is the biggest consideration for many people in deciding on 2 or 4 strokes.

[/quote]

The first and biggest reason is one that's already been brought up, throttle response. I've seen a lot of 4-stroke profiles fly and every time the pilot is having to constantly work the throttle up and down to try and maintain a steady hover/torque roll, usually to no avail. It wears me out just WATCHING![/quote]


4 strokes have MUCH better throttle response. My YS's rock with a few clicks on the stick. Also the 4 stroke is muuuuuuuuuuch less annoying when your hovering right in your face, 2 strokes have a horrible whine when close in, and when flying many 2 strokes make the entire airframe rattle like a rattlesnake trapped in a snare drum.

[/quote]

There's just no way that an engine firing on every other revolution can ever have the throttle response of an engine that fires on every revolution. Add the extra weight and drag of the larger 4-stroke propeller and the spool up/down response time is much greater. What has better throttle response, your 2-stroke weedeater or your 4-stroke lawnmower?[/quote]

If you compare weights of the same displacement, 4 strokes are ALWAYS lighter. Dont ask me why they can make a 4 stroke lighter than a 2 stroke but they do. Now to get one with the same power as a 2 stroke you may have to buy an engine that weighs 1-2 oz more than a 2 stroke and it almost all cases when you size up like that you get MORE power than a 2 stroke.........sweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet!:D

[/quote]

The other reason is weight. I've talked to many a 4-stroke enthusiast about this and the first thing they tell you is the Saito only weighs a couple ounces more. What they don't take into consideration is the weight of the whole power package and including the prop the package weighs several ounces more. Weight is critical......[/quote]

Weight can be very important, 4 strokes aren't for every application thats for sure.

[/quote]

Most people are used to 4 lb plus airplanes and have never flown a 3.5 lb airplane. Fly a 3.5 lb airplane with a 2-stroke engine for a few flights, then try and go back to that 4.5 lb 4-stroke lead balloon you've been flying. You'll put it up for sale so fast, your head'll spin.[&o][/quote]

Light is good, no arguement!

My airoplane toolbox has an increasing pile of good used 2 strokes in it. I am converting to all 4 strokes:D:D:D
Nothing against 2 strokes, they work well but the 4 strokes are just the shizzle:D

........yeah, yeah.........your's flys great........I'm serious, fly a 3.5 lb plane and your opinion will change dramatically!

Rob
[/quote]

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

Yeah what randy said

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

What do you know! You misspelled "Benjamin Franklin"! :D

You coming to Gordos Bash in Tulsa??

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

Sure thing. I've only missed one Pro Bro in North Carolina!
[/quote]
[/quote]

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

What do they say? "Different strokes for different folks", kind of applies unusually well here :)

Yeah, I guess I'm weird. I prefer the 2 stroke sound on a aerobatic bird. To me, the 4-stroke is annoying with all the constant throttle adjustments. Makes me uneasy as it seems the pilot is having trouble with control.

The first and biggest reason is one that's already been brought up, throttle response. I've seen a lot of 4-stroke profiles fly and every time the pilot is having to constantly work the throttle up and down to try and maintain a steady hover/torque roll, usually to no avail. It wears me out just WATCHING![/quote]


4 strokes have MUCH better throttle response. My YS's rock with a few clicks on the stick. Also the 4 stroke is muuuuuuuuuuch less annoying when your hovering right in your face, 2 strokes have a horrible whine when close in, and when flying many 2 strokes make the entire airframe rattle like a rattlesnake trapped in a snare drum.

[/quote]

There's just no way that an engine firing on every other revolution can ever have the throttle response of an engine that fires on every revolution. Add the extra weight and drag of the larger 4-stroke propeller and the spool up/down response time is much greater. What has better throttle response, your 2-stroke weedeater or your 4-stroke lawnmower?[/quote]

If you compare weights of the same displacement, 4 strokes are ALWAYS lighter. Dont ask me why they can make a 4 stroke lighter than a 2 stroke but they do. Now to get one with the same power as a 2 stroke you may have to buy an engine that weighs 1-2 oz more than a 2 stroke and it almost all cases when you size up like that you get MORE power than a 2 stroke.........sweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet!:D

[/quote]

The other reason is weight. I've talked to many a 4-stroke enthusiast about this and the first thing they tell you is the Saito only weighs a couple ounces more. What they don't take into consideration is the weight of the whole power package and including the prop the package weighs several ounces more. Weight is critical......[/quote]

Weight can be very important, 4 strokes aren't for every application thats for sure.

[/quote]

Most people are used to 4 lb plus airplanes and have never flown a 3.5 lb airplane. Fly a 3.5 lb airplane with a 2-stroke engine for a few flights, then try and go back to that 4.5 lb 4-stroke lead balloon you've been flying. You'll put it up for sale so fast, your head'll spin.[&o][/quote]

Light is good, no arguement!

My airoplane toolbox has an increasing pile of good used 2 strokes in it. I am converting to all 4 strokes:D:D:D
Nothing against 2 strokes, they work well but the 4 strokes are just the shizzle:D

........yeah, yeah.........your's flys great........I'm serious, fly a 3.5 lb plane and your opinion will change dramatically!

Rob
[/quote]
[/quote]

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

I can't agree with your Ford-Chevy analogy here dweller. That is purely a "Brand" discussion of products of the same basic design. This discussion is a debate about the fundemental design differences between 2-strokes and 4-strokes.

Now if I told you that my Webra .50 makes more power than your OS .50, then we'd have a Ford-Chevy thang goin' on........

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

As far as shaking goes.

OMP GS540P Edge Profile
At first I had a OS 1.60 FX 18 x 8 Mej prop on it.
Was Bored so I stuck my Saito 1.80 on it with 25% fuel thinking it might be better suited for it...
Ran it and flew it one weekend, not only did it beat the profile fuse to death (yes prop an spinner is balanced) but it wasn't an improvement at all over the 1.60, about the same infact. I love my Saito 1.80 for it's smoothness on other airplanes why it shook the profile so bad I have no idea.

There was also Less airflow over the control surfaces using a 16 x 8 APC verses using a 20 x 6 and 18 x 8 on the OS 1.60.

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

I like 4 strokes because of their better throttle response. I do not have to bleep the throttle up and down on any of my 4 strokes but the very fact that you can zip them up and down so fast is an indicator of their superior throttle response capabilities.

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

4 strokes with with left, 2 strokes with the right and then a big grin. :)

To each his own. I like them both. Just depends what kind of mood I am in.

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

Show me any pilot hovering/TR down on the ground who is NOT working the throttle constantly. Heck man, that's one of the big things you have to learn. Just with a 4-stroke the response is quicker through the midrage (higher engine torque) and more audible.

Allright, Gator and I had a vertical drag raced at Cookeville. May OMP Edge/Saito 72 vs his EF Edge/Irvine53. Know what happened? I killed him out of the hole and jumped out in front, after the Irvine got wound up he caught me and pulled ahead at a higher speed. He has more HP, I have more mid/low torque, and a bigger heavier prop.

From the Horizon site, Saito 72 with muffler, 16.6 ounces, From tower, OS 46FX with muffler 16.7 ounces.

Ask Kenny and Mike B what they think of my 4lb+ OMP Edge 540/ 4-stroke after they flew it Sunday morning.:D Both told me they were ready to order one on the spot.

Nothing wrong with 2-strokes, I've got several. They are cheaper, simpler and can power these planes perfectly well. But superior to 4-strokes? That's just an opinion and relative to flying style.

Hey, ask Swany. He was pretty put out with 4-strokes till he flew my birds. The Katana got good to him, torquin that Saito down low.

RE: Why 2 strokes?
 

2 Stroke versus 4 stroke is personal preference. I prefer 4 strokes but ive had virtually no problems with 2 strokes either. But what airjunky said against 4 strokes is flat out wrong. sorry dude:D