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Q-500 Racing Discuss AMA 428, AMA 424, and any other variants of Quickie 500 racing

Q500 engine

Old 03-01-2007, 02:47 PM
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wkevinm
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Default Q500 engine

I see Nelson Q500 engines on e-bay lately. Does this suggest there is some betting a new engine is on the horizon?

Old 03-01-2007, 02:52 PM
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daven
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Default RE: Q500 engine

Yes it does.

As far as I know, the Nelson Q500 LS is being tested now. It took close to a year to get the Q40 version ready for market, but I doubt it will take the Quickie version as long. Shadel mentioned it on a thread on the NMPRA site.
Old 03-02-2007, 04:18 AM
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Default RE: Q500 engine

Oh good lord lets all drop what we are doing and run out and get one.
Old 03-02-2007, 06:14 AM
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Default RE: Q500 engine

Some of us "rich" guys ordered 2.

LTF
Old 03-02-2007, 08:37 AM
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Default RE: Q500 engine

your funny too.
Old 03-06-2007, 09:53 AM
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DMyer
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Default RE: Q500 engine

The new Nelson Q500 will finish off those pilots that have been on the bubble due to the composites price... I guess it is finally time for me to pack it in for 428 and join the many others who departed over the last 10 years. There simply are not enough 428 flyers left in my part of the country to justify the expense of new engines to compete with 4 or 5 other pilots for a $10 trophy. It's a real shame... I really used to enjoy 428 but every year we rehash the same old "what can we do to attract more racers or retain the ones we have" and the response by our genius leaders is always the same... go faster more expensively! I predict that within 1 year, there will never be another 428 east coast race north of florida. Prove me wrong.
Old 03-06-2007, 10:06 AM
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daven
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Default RE: Q500 engine

Didn't they race 428 in Georgia, or was it South Carolina last year? Sounds like Bill J, has a resurgance of 424 and a nice group of 428 racers to help grow that area. It is unfortunate what you have seen in your area, there are competitive Build Your Own Q500 kits available in the Hurrikane, Seeker, Vortex, and even the Bird of Prey is competitive with the new weight rules and not as expensive.

I've never felt it was a composite plane issue, it is a "lack of people that want to build issue".
Old 03-06-2007, 10:30 AM
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DMyer
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Default RE: Q500 engine

I hear they lost their field... so it is back to just Florida.
Old 03-06-2007, 12:14 PM
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Ed Smith
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Default RE: Q500 engine

We cannot halt progress but is it realy progress?

For the recent past most racers fitted into a slot in the pecking order. Sure one could have a decent contest and place above his usual spot, but this was rare. The same racers at the top, in the middle and at the bottom end.

If we all buy the latest equipment nothing will change. It will be the same racers at the top, in the middle and at the bottom end. Except now we will be going a little faster and spending a lot more money! Seems kind of pointless.

Ed S

Old 03-06-2007, 12:41 PM
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Default RE: Q500 engine

Ed is write
Old 03-06-2007, 02:59 PM
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DMyer
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Default RE: Q500 engine


ORIGINAL: Ed Smith

We cannot halt progress but is it realy progress?

For the recent past most racers fitted into a slot in the pecking order. Sure one could have a decent contest and place above his usual spot, but this was rare. The same racers at the top, in the middle and at the bottom end.

If we all buy the latest equipment nothing will change. It will be the same racers at the top, in the middle and at the bottom end. Except now we will be going a little faster and spending a lot more money! Seems kind of pointless.

Ed S


Seems kind of pointless... and that is the whole point!

Except there are so very few left to even make the point with... that is if they would even be willing to listen.

I remember a few years back, before composites ruled the world, I think it was Duane Gall or some other person with future vision that put a proposal out there to drastically slow 428 by eliminating the minipipe as a method to make them safer and more enticing to newcomers... I, like most others, was totally against slowing down. Well, were I live we don't have anyone to play with anymore unless we travel over 500 miles at least. Some progress. Even if I were to talk the wife into buying a new Nelson, I would have to put it in a stand in our china cabinet next to all those other expensive "DISPLAY" pieces. Just my 2 cents.

Old 03-06-2007, 04:35 PM
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DHG
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Default RE: Q500 engine

Thanks for the credit, but I take no pleasure in being proven right after the fact.

"If we could all sell our experience for what it cost us, none of us would have to work." -- Anon.
Old 03-06-2007, 04:38 PM
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garys
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Default RE: Q500 engine

Just remember one thing. If the inner-pipes were removed from the engines, we probably already would've bought new engines as they would have been re-engineered to run better without the inner pipes. Would they be as fast as the current engines? I don't know, but they definately would've been faster than the current engines with the inner pipes removed.
Old 03-06-2007, 04:57 PM
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DHG
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Default RE: Q500 engine

True. And I thought they would be no faster than Thunder Tigers if you took out the minipipe, which turned out to be 'way wrong. So we probably would've needed event 424 anyway.

Just for the record, I voted against Rick Moreland's proposal to require 8-3/4" props in Q40 based on the same reasoning. He said we'd be able to use Q500 engines, but I was afraid we'd all have to buy new pistons and liners -- somewhere between the timing of the Q500 version and the small-prop Q40 version -- because the existing Q500 ones weren't optimized for the lower drag of a Q40 airframe. So I'm not really evil, just mischievous.
Old 03-06-2007, 05:51 PM
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Default RE: Q500 engine

Why not run Thunder Tigers on a course short enough to turn about the same times turned with Nelson engines. Should be just as fun and much cheaper. Jim
Old 03-06-2007, 06:03 PM
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daven
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Default RE: Q500 engine

Jim,

That is exactly what they do in Minnesota, except they use the O.S. .46AX with any prop, on the 475 foot course.

Average times around 1:15 and not so fast the average guy can't fly.
Old 03-06-2007, 06:52 PM
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DHG
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Default RE: Q500 engine


ORIGINAL: jeide

Why not run Thunder Tigers on a course short enough to turn about the same times turned with Nelson engines. Should be just as fun and much cheaper. Jim
Jim,

Stop making sense!

We lost a lot of fields when Yeager put 428 Quickie on the long course for safety (reaction time) at the Nats -- I want to say 1991. It would be nice to get back to the days of small fields, short courses, and fake speed. But right now both of the Nats events are too fast to allow that.

You could do it with 424 or F1 Sport. Build yourself one of those and let's rumble!

Duane
Old 03-06-2007, 07:15 PM
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garys
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Default RE: Q500 engine

428 was changed to the long course at the Nats in 1994. Where is the rule that says you must run 428 to hold a contest? Wayne didn't force anybody to the long course and 428, they easily could've changed their events to be able to keep the short courses if the desire was there at the time. The answer isn't to change 428, the answer is to run whatever event will get you the most entries and suit your flying field.

Part of the problem with the speeds increasing over the years is the national events become national markets for manufactures. I'd be willing to bet, no matter what the racing event is, there would be a substantial increase in speeds if it were to become a popular national event. If the market is there, the manufacturers will do what they can do to get an advantage to sell their products. The only way to attempt to prevent this it is to limit to one manufacturer so that there can't be any competition from other manufactures.
Old 03-06-2007, 07:24 PM
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Clark L
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Default RE: Q500 engine

Let's see... How can we improve 428?

We could run sport engines.
We could run big sport props.
We could outlaw molded composite wings.
We could run on either the short or long course, two or three pylon.

That would slow it down and make it less expensive too!

Wait a minute, uh...uh...

Isn't that 424?


Old 03-07-2007, 12:30 AM
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Default RE: Q500 engine

I don't think you need to outlaw composite wings. Just do away with the weight limit. I can build a wood airplane lighter that a composite airplane that will handle the Thunder Tiger type motor just fine. I bet the difference of the perfect composite and the wood airplanes a bit lighter will cancel each other out. Jim
Old 03-07-2007, 02:13 AM
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Arch Adamisin
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Default RE: Q500 engine

Anyone know anything about this new quickie motor yet? If recent history repeats itself, we're going to need some time for development of it and possibly the props also. So, how long before there is any accurate data about this motor? We're on the fence right now. We have 9 motors that were going to have to be rebuilt, now it appears we'll have to replace them instead and that bill is significant. It's kind of hard to justify those costs when you consider we'll only be able to travel to 4 or 5 contests plus the Nat's. When we had 17 or 18 wekends a year to race, the choice was easy, that's not the case anymore.

Arch
Old 03-07-2007, 06:23 AM
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Default RE: Q500 engine

Is this RCU, or the complaint department?

NOBODY is forcing anyone to buy anything, especially the new motor. If it costs too much, don't buy it. Run your old stuff. I ran the old Q40 motor in Phx a few weeks ago and placed 8th. We are actually really lucky that our sport has not evolved any in the last 8-10 years. Sure people developed new planes, and the composite stuff started showing up.... but aircraft development has been a part of this hobby for ever. The rules clearly state that you can still build your $35 quickee from foam and wood. But the perception leads you all to believe that you need all this new craze stuff...motors, and planes.

This form of racing is SO cheap it isn't funny (compared to other forms of racing). F3D, F5D, F5B, R/C cars, Real Cars, Karts, Bikes....

Lets fly foamies around pylons.

RB
Old 03-07-2007, 07:51 AM
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Default RE: Q500 engine

I better not say anything I will get in truble
Old 03-07-2007, 08:39 AM
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Default RE: Q500 engine

Speak... it's an open forum. I'm not jabbing at anyone, just putting in my 2 cents. Maybe my views are as warped as the views of all the other guys "that show up to races"....

LTF
Old 03-07-2007, 09:17 AM
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Default RE: Q500 engine


ORIGINAL: luv to race


This form of racing is SO cheap it isn't funny (compared to other forms of racing). F3D, F5D, F5B, R/C cars, Real Cars, Karts, Bikes....

Lets fly foamies around pylons.

RB

424 is cheap... 428 is not by any measure inexpensive....


I have actually considered flying foamies arround pylons in my backyard park with my son.... I figure the same electronics as our 40" 3-D's and set the max throttle to about 85% so the batteries will last... maybe something with a lot of side area like a geebee will work! Final proof to my neighboors that I am friggin nuts!

While this may not be the complaint department... what we need is a help department as 428 is virtually dead in the east making all the discussions about engines and planes a frankly irrelevant point for many. The point is... it is already too late for many of our traditional racing areas, those of you still left with local competion... you better hold on tight and start thinking about how to make it grow... or you will be next... no exceptions!

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