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Banning of 72 mhz

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Banning of 72 mhz

Old 01-17-2012, 02:22 AM
  #26  
Oberst
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Default RE: Banning of 72 mhz

ORIGINAL: landeck


ORIGINAL: Oberst


The AMA does not endorse any club or event that is bias towards 72mHz usage and forces 2.4GHz only rule. If you don't believe me ask someone high up in Muncie. I belong to a very large AMA Club and we hold many events. We are well known and some of the AMA office holders in Muncie have come from our club. 2 were entered in the Hall of Fame in 2011.



Pete
Pete, the AMA leaves it up to the event CD to set the restrictions that he feels are appropriate for his contest, e.g., whether or not it is to be a 2.4 GHz only event. Also, an AMA chartered club has the right to ban 72 MHz radios at their flying field if they so choose. I even know of clubs that ban all radios - control line clubs. OBTW, one of my flying buddies with whom I fly every week is in the AMA Hall of Fame so obviously I must be knowledgeable on the subject.



Bruce


OK. What I was told by Dave Mathewson that the AMA does not agree that any event small or large should ban usage of any type of radio for the sole purpose of using 2.4GHz only.

Ask Dave Mathewson and tell them Peter James Dowling District II of S.T.A.R.S. sent you to ask them what they told me in the parking lot at the last summers S.T.A.R.S. Event. Also ask Walt from Walt's Hobby of Syracuse, (no plug intended) he was there when I had this conversation with Dave.

Right at my face they all agreed with me about my concerns about the forced limitations that theses events have for mHz radio usage. True the event CD makes the rules. Personally I was told by Dave that the AMA does not endorse these decisions to ban. And they are doing everything they can to preserve the right for anyone wanting to use what ever radio he or she has, and at the same time he has listened to others with my same concerns.

Please name drop me to them if you don't believe me. I talk to Dave just about every few weeks. And if you look at last months MA, in the back I mentioned 2 who were inducted in the AMA hall of fame. Write or call them and quote what I just wrote and I ask that you do it word for word. Heck, link my post to them if you don't believe me. I also know Walt quite well, even though I don't buy from him. (Distance too far away and I support a smaller LHS near me)

Not all big events ban radios of any kind, and there's always enough volunteers willing to use the impound booth if clubs asked around a tad bit more. Because of the mass usage of the 2.4 GHz radio, only a handful of 72mHz radios are in the impound at any given time. So I don't see what the issue is and I know I'm not alone.

It will be interresting what the new rules will be when places like Joe Nall starts impounding 2.4GHz radios. It is a misnomer that 72 or 24mHz radios cause interferance with the 2.4 GHz radios. GHz and mHz is like comparing apples to oranges. One works on the light spectrum and the other radio wave lengths.

The problem is that Joe Nall and other big events like his is close to urban areas, and many people are turning on and off 2.4GHz radios constantly at these events. The problem with all 2.4GHz radios is if more than one is using the same light spectrum channel, the TX and RX will try and find another channel while at the same time keep the bind. When it can't find a open channel quickly that's when a "Brown out" occurs. When it can't find a open channel at all then a "Black out" occurs.

Futaba tried to solve this problem to have their radios scan more channels and to do it quickly ie FAST. Unfortunately I and a few others have seen this problem coming. I know of one who has wrote a very insightful article on it in some of the RC Aircraft magazines. I believe he had to do a dissertation on it for his BA Electronic Engineer Degree.

What I gather from him is that so many people are using 2.4GHz radios now, that all the channels are starting to get used up. Wireless phones and most all telecomunications including Wi-Fi all use 2.4GHz channels. So eventually all big events will eventually have to bring back the impound. There is or was a discussion about Joe Nall bringing back the impound because of what happened last year. And the problems this time was with Futaba, not JR or Spectrum!

Now if that happens and they bring back the impound, and they still won't allow mHz radios then I think they are guilty of bias rather than just freeing up man power or man hours.

2.4GHz is fine for suburban events, and if there's restricted usage keeping people from doing mass radio checks while others are flying.

The AMA is well aware of all the concerns and issues with all 2.4GHz radios including the usage of mHz radios at large events. Let me reiterate- AMA as a whole does not endorse any event rulings restricting the usage of any radio that is approved by the FCC and the AMA.

So again, the only reason in my opinion that any event coordinator has the mHz ban is because no one in the club wants to work the impound. In other words- LAZY! Reminds me of the frase, " Technology will eventually make a person lazy."

Please new mHz system come quickly! Because I still love my old 72.

Take care, I wrote enough and I stand by every word.

Pete
Old 01-17-2012, 05:32 AM
  #27  
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Default RE: Banning of 72 mhz

I know Dave too and he's a great guy, but he's also a politician. Note his statement, "the AMA does not agree that any event small or large should ban usage of any type of radio for the sole purpose of using 2.4GHz only."

What that says (if you read between the lines) is that they are not saying you can only use 2.4 because we want everyone to buy a 2.4 radio. But there are times when avoiding the hassle of frequency control only makes sense.
Old 01-17-2012, 06:40 AM
  #28  
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Default RE: Banning of 72 mhz

Now concerning the matter of competitive events. There are two forms of competition that have event round mattrix difficultys far far more complex than most other forms of organized events such as simple fly-ins or events that are individual performances.

These two are most all classes of pylon and the other is combat. These require a mattrix where all the entrants end up flying aginst as many of the others as possible. This has been the most difficult part of pylon since the start of pylon when competitors could only race aginst the clock one at a time due to frequency constraints of the day.

Pylon has been on a rise ever since the advent of 2.4 for this reason and I beleve most events has gone, 2.4 if not they are making a mistake. The simplification of the event is in fact enormous over previous methods and this is actually vital to the continuation of the sport. Thats a fact and I am referring to the sport of pylon racing specifically.



Now moving along to the matter of just an ordinary club banning 72. First and formost Let me get this straight Our local club has not banned any frequency band.

-Let me repeat that Our local club has not banned any frequency band-

I will refrain from screaming that disclaimer with arrogant, giant colorful fonts like one of the posters here is fond of.


Our field is no longer safe to fly 72 at simply because a group of parkies have moved into a bald open section of the desert exactly seven tenths of a mile away and have compete disregard for anyone or any frequency control and they use a hodge podge of any kind of old or new systems or what ever they can get at a swapmeet.

I have had two of my students airplanes shot out from under us while I was mentoring them. Which later was verified with monitor and binoculars proved they were there at the time and a drive by showed at least one or two on long antennas.

Now rather than starting world war 111 which was a distinct possiblity all of our members have gone 2.4 its a matter of that or loose our wonderfull field we have worked hard on since about 1984. Ironically since that collective move away from 72 about two years ago the occurance of mystery crashs has definately and dramatically decreased, thats a fact.

Now while we have not banned 72, its use is strictly at the users risk as any sort of frequency control is impossible period. All visitors are informed of this also.

So I dare say to the gentleman and arrogant namedropper, sky is falling type that has yelled and screamed (giant font) at me every time I have posted the very real situation at our field, just wait till it happens to you. Please, please come to our field and fly all the 72 you want.

John


Old 01-17-2012, 09:37 AM
  #29  
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Default RE: Banning of 72 mhz


ORIGINAL: JohnBuckner

Now concerning the matter of competitive events. There are two forms of competition that have event round mattrix difficultys far far more complex than most other forms of organized events such as simple fly-ins or events that are individual performances.

These two are most all classes of pylon and the other is combat. These require a mattrix where all the entrants end up flying aginst as many of the others as possible. This has been the most difficult part of pylon since the start of pylon when competitors could only race aginst the clock one at a time due to frequency constraints of the day.

Pylon has been on a rise ever since the advent of 2.4 for this reason and I beleve most events has gone, 2.4 if not they are making a mistake. The simplification of the event is in fact enormous over previous methods and this is actually vital to the continuation of the sport. Thats a fact and I am referring to the sport of pylon racing specifically.



Now moving along to the matter of just an ordinary club banning 72. First and formost Let me get this straight Our local club has not banned any frequency band.

-Let me repeat that Our local club has not banned any frequency band-

I will refrain from screaming that disclaimer with arrogant, giant colorful fonts like one of the posters here is fond of.


Our field is no longer safe to fly 72 at simply because a group of parkies have moved into a bald open section of the desert exactly seven tenths of a mile away and have compete disregard for anyone or any frequency control and they use a hodge podge of any kind of old or new systems or what ever they can get at a swapmeet.

I have had two of my students airplanes shot out from under us while I was mentoring them. Which later was verified with monitor and binoculars proved they were there at the time and a drive by showed at least one or two on long antennas.

Now rather than starting world war 111 which was a distinct possiblity all of our members have gone 2.4 its a matter of that or loose our wonderfull field we have worked hard on since about 1984. Ironically since that collective move away from 72 about two years ago the occurance of mystery crashs has definately and dramatically decreased, thats a fact.

Now while we have not banned 72, its use is strictly at the users risk as any sort of frequency control is impossible period. All visitors are informed of this also.

So I dare say to the gentleman and arrogant namedropper, sky is falling type that has yelled and screamed (giant font) at me every time I have posted the very real situation at our field, just wait till it happens to you. Please, please come to our field and fly all the 72 you want.

John


+1
Old 01-17-2012, 10:13 AM
  #30  
Steve Percifield
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Default RE: Banning of 72 mhz


ORIGINAL: JohnBuckner

Now concerning the matter of competitive events. There are two forms of competition that have event round mattrix difficultys far far more complex than most other forms of organized events such as simple fly-ins or events that are individual performances.

These two are most all classes of pylon and the other is combat. These require a mattrix where all the entrants end up flying aginst as many of the others as possible. This has been the most difficult part of pylon since the start of pylon when competitors could only race aginst the clock one at a time due to frequency constraints of the day.

Pylon has been on a rise ever since the advent of 2.4 for this reason and I beleve most events has gone, 2.4 if not they are making a mistake. The simplification of the event is in fact enormous over previous methods and this is actually vital to the continuation of the sport. Thats a fact and I am referring to the sport of pylon racing specifically.



Now moving along to the matter of just an ordinary club banning 72. First and formost Let me get this straight Our local club has not banned any frequency band.

-Let me repeat that Our local club has not banned any frequency band-

I will refrain from screaming that disclaimer with arrogant, giant colorful fonts like one of the posters here is fond of.


Our field is no longer safe to fly 72 at simply because a group of parkies have moved into a bald open section of the desert exactly seven tenths of a mile away and have compete disregard for anyone or any frequency control and they use a hodge podge of any kind of old or new systems or what ever they can get at a swapmeet.

I have had two of my students airplanes shot out from under us while I was mentoring them. Which later was verified with monitor and binoculars proved they were there at the time and a drive by showed at least one or two on long antennas.

Now rather than starting world war 111 which was a distinct possiblity all of our members have gone 2.4 its a matter of that or loose our wonderfull field we have worked hard on since about 1984. Ironically since that collective move away from 72 about two years ago the occurance of mystery crashs has definately and dramatically decreased, thats a fact.

Now while we have not banned 72, its use is strictly at the users risk as any sort of frequency control is impossible period. All visitors are informed of this also.

So I dare say to the gentleman and arrogant namedropper, sky is falling type that has yelled and screamed (giant font) at me every time I have posted the very real situation at our field, just wait till it happens to you. Please, please come to our field and fly all the 72 you want.

John


Very well said

steve
Old 01-17-2012, 10:46 AM
  #31  
landeck
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Default RE: Banning of 72 mhz

JohnBuckner, you are right on target.

Bruce
Old 01-17-2012, 12:59 PM
  #32  
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Default RE: Banning of 72 mhz

We still have a handful of folks that fly 72mhz. Another reason we'll keep it around a bit longer is because of buddy boxes. Some of the 2.4 stuff with differing brands doesnt seem to play well together. Don't have specifics but some of the instructors have ran into compatibility issues with newer radios.
Old 01-17-2012, 03:24 PM
  #33  
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Default RE: Banning of 72 mhz

At my club, 72 is welcome but 2.4 is the main type of system used. we still have a pegboard, but I am pretty sure nobody uses conflicting fequencies. If everybody on 72 got together and agreed on who uses what frequencies, the pegboard would not be needed. The main conflict at our feild is futaba vs spectrum/jr. The only people who use 72 are the new guys and the "old fart" 72 diehards. Most new guys quickly move up to 2.4. 

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