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Newbie help .... Enya 35 model 5224

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Newbie help .... Enya 35 model 5224

Old 01-26-2014, 11:51 AM
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Nathan134
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Default Newbie help .... Enya 35 model 5224

Hi there.




iv just acquired an enya engine. I don't know much about these but would really like to get it running.


Could anyone advise me on how ... I guess I'd need some kind of ignition but I'm unsure how.. The spark plug is present and new ... Can this be a DIY ignition job ?
And the fuel mix ?
Basically I want to see it running and have a play ...
iv bought live steam powered cars in the past and have them around the house.
This is just something I'd like to get running and modify, and get to know before I buy a plane ..and when time allows.
Any help would be much appreciated !
Old 01-26-2014, 01:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Nathan134 View Post
iv just acquired an enya engine. I don't know much about these but would really like to get it running.


Could anyone advise me on how ... I guess I'd need some kind of ignition but I'm unsure how.. The spark plug is present and new ... Can this be a DIY ignition job ?
And the fuel mix ?
Basically I want to see it running and have a play ...
iv bought live steam powered cars in the past and have them around the house.
This is just something I'd like to get running and modify, and get to know before I buy a plane ..and when time allows.
Any help would be much appreciated !
A pic might help here. I'm not aware of any Enya 5224 model being converted to ignition - would definitely like to see this one.
Old 01-26-2014, 01:43 PM
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Nathan134
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I think it's enya 35


The only like I can find with a picture is one for sale on eBay ...

http://r.ebay.com/FeBtvj

Last edited by Nathan134; 01-26-2014 at 01:49 PM.
Old 01-26-2014, 05:55 PM
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JohnBuckner
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I Nathan welcome to the forum. I am no Enya expert but have owned and operated a few various ones in the past both controlline and RC versions.

Now I would be willing if it is a .35 ci displacement engine to wager a Stale Glazed Donut aginst three buned out Glow Plugs that the spark plug you are talking about is actually a glow plug. A picture would be of immense help Your link to some E Bay sale above does not work.

if it is a .35 Cubic inch engine then that seems a very likely possibility as I believe there have been Enya's in that size both for controline and RC. You can tell the difference easily the carburetor just forward of the cylinder is just a big hole with a needle adjustment running through the side of it. The RC version would have an articulated lever out the side of that hole (venturi) that rotated a barrel in the ventrui.

John
Old 01-27-2014, 01:14 AM
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Nathan134
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http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/attac...mentid=4360174

it's on the first picture here..

i keep trying to upload my own pictures but it just freezes on the upload page with no option.

Last edited by Nathan134; 01-27-2014 at 01:24 AM.
Old 01-27-2014, 05:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Nathan134 View Post
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/attac...mentid=4360174

it's on the first picture here..

i keep trying to upload my own pictures but it just freezes on the upload page with no option.
YUP! What this pic shows is a very stock Enya .29 RC GLOW engine - yours would just be a bit larger. Runs on normal 10-15% nitro fuel, starts with a 1.5v battery hooked to the glow plug (not spark plug). The movable arm is your throttle (just in case you didn't know).

Nice engine. IF it's stiff/froze, a little bit of Marvel Mystery oil (a couple drops) will help free it up. Just unscrew the glow plug, drop it down the hole and turn gently in each direction. Takes a bit, but it works.

Enyas in this size class (your .35) run best on 10x4 - 10x7 props, CAN run decently on 11x4 or 11x5 but you won't get top rpm. That .29 would take a 9x6 - 9x8 best.

Last edited by skylark-flier; 01-27-2014 at 05:24 AM. Reason: to correct numbers
Old 01-27-2014, 08:21 AM
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Hey cool Nathan glad you found its and it is an Rc engine. I just love winning the Stale Glased Donut, of course it is what we call a glow engine although in more recent years the fellows are changing the language (a never ending process) and calling them nitro engines because of the fuel used, alcohol with oil and sometimes a small pinch of nitro methane.

Anyway learning to operate one is a learning curve and its best always to get with an experianced operator or flyer to help mentor you. Here is a link to the best way in your case to provide the 'ignition' to the glow plug.

Just a note on that engine is note on something it is provided with something that not even a lot of the current operators/flyers know about. Point in question is that pivoting door out there on the side of the muffler?

That engine is from an era when transition to common use of mufflers was taking place. Formally no mufflers were often used and in order to prime the engine for starting the fellows would squirt a bit of of fuel directly into the combustion chamber for starting. Well when mufflers came along you could not do that anymore so what a few manufacturers did was provide a 'Primer Port' out there on the side of the muffler so the fellows could still squirt a bit of fuel directly into the combustion chamber. While not real common there were others that did this which also includes some Fuji engines.

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...&I=LXME72&P=ML

John

Last edited by JohnBuckner; 01-27-2014 at 08:26 AM.
Old 01-27-2014, 10:06 AM
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NB that engine can require a LOT of running in.
Old 01-27-2014, 12:18 PM
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Capt. Sluggo
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I have an Enya 5224 and it is a .29. It came with an extra high compression head and a couple of different size venturis for U/C use.
It runs great with the carb too.
Use plenty of oil >20%, preferably with some castor, it may run for decades.
I usually put a 10/6 prop on it.
Captsluggo
Old 01-27-2014, 01:46 PM
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Nathan134
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Really really appreciate the help. I'm going to get my laptop out in a second and try upload a picture as I can't do it via iPhone or iPad.
My intention is to get this running on my bench so I get to know how they work etc before I go into any models.
I want to know the basics first... Starting ..... Set up.. Fuel mix .. As mentioned above it is In fact a glow plug not spark ( thank you for pointing me in the right direction) Iv just bought a glow plug starter and some methanol and castor oil mix . I'll upload a picture within the hour.
Old 01-27-2014, 02:29 PM
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AMA 74894
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nice find! WAAAAY back when I used to run an Enya .61 with a tuned pipe in old ballistic pattern airplanes.
I DO hope you're in a warm climate... glow engines are not cause for myrth when the temps are below 30F
you've got some of the finest minds on the planet helping here... have fun with that little gem.

you mentioned 'methanol and castor oil mix' ... did you buy proper glow fuel or are you mixing it yourself?
Old 01-28-2014, 01:53 AM
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Nathan134
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Old 01-28-2014, 01:55 AM
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Nathan134
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The fuel im going to try an mix myself...
The only reason for this is; if im going to take up an activity id like to know as much as i can...

Last edited by Nathan134; 01-28-2014 at 02:02 AM.
Old 01-28-2014, 06:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Nathan134 View Post
Really really appreciate the help. I'm going to get my laptop out in a second and try upload a picture as I can't do it via iPhone or iPad.
My intention is to get this running on my bench so I get to know how they work etc before I go into any models.
I want to know the basics first... Starting ..... Set up.. Fuel mix .. As mentioned above it is In fact a glow plug not spark ( thank you for pointing me in the right direction) Iv just bought a glow plug starter and some methanol and castor oil mix . I'll upload a picture within the hour.
If you've never run a glow engine before, let me run you through the BASIC basics;

your engine is best with a 10x6 prop, especially on a test bench
1.5v battery - one lead goes to glow plug and the other to any other part of the engine
needle valve (the long screw on the carb, left side) - close it off completely (clockwise) and re-open 3.5 turns
throttle arm - all the way forward, you want to see down the carb
finger over carb to block it (choke) for 2 revs of prop
flip the prop to start - she SHOULD start right up within just a couple flips
close off the needle valve (slowly) until engine reaches top rpm, then open it back up just a bit to come off the top rpm rate
that's best power/fuel/rpm rate

Good luck with this critter. If it doesn't come together for you just send it to me (LOL). I'll put it in a plane and have FUN! (LOLOLOL)
Old 01-28-2014, 08:10 AM
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Hi!
It's a plain bearing engine (No ball bearings) and as such you don't have to worrie about changing any bad (worn out) ball bearings.
10x6-11x5 prop (APC ,Graupner G-Sonic or RAM), Enya 3 or OS 8 glow plug (lot´s of others that work too).
20-25% castor oil fuel and 5-15% nitro! This is a mechanite engine ,which means it has a mechanite steel piston running in a hardened steel cylinder liner.
Engines built like that needs lots of castor oil in the fuel and needs to be run in at a slow rpm, at full throttle opening, adjusting rpm with the high speed needle. Why you always should run in an engine with the throttle intake fully open and adjust the rpm with the fuel needle is to secure that the engine gets adequat fuel (and not getting too hot). This is not certain with the throttle drum partly open.
Old 01-28-2014, 10:36 AM
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Nathan134
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Hi guys sorry but still no joy!
iv got the prop on and have tried hand cranking it a couple turns anti clockwise ( facing front end and prop (drive end) A little smoke but not running
Just went and got a 1.2v glow starter.. Still no joy ;(
Old 01-28-2014, 11:20 AM
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does it 'pop' ? feel a slight 'kickback' when hand cranking? (if so the glowplug at least is likely working properly as is the glow driver <1.2 v battery>)
you can remove the glow plug and attach the glow driver to the glow plug (briefly... it may get hot) and see that the plug actually lights.
IF the glow plug doesn't light up RED (or at all) you might want a 1.5 V starting battery.
there should also be a small copper gasket that came along with the glow plug... it's not likely causing the engine not to start, but do make sure that gasket is present.

one thing I did JUST think of... IMHO, since we're trying to get an old engine running, you MAY want to purchase some ready blended fuel...
there are a LOT of variables that can come into play when mixing your own fuel... either buy a quart of fuel, OR try your home mixed fuel on an engine that's already known to run well.

hope that helps.
Old 01-28-2014, 11:33 AM
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Nathan134
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Sounds plausible to me.. I'll order some fuel now and try that. Yes it pops and I got a very small (almost dentist like) mirror to check the condition of the internals prior to starting. I also used this to check the plug which glows bright red...

ill await the fuel and try again
Thank you
Old 01-28-2014, 11:12 PM
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Hi!
A small 1,2V glowdriver is no that good!
A much better way is to get a large 12V motor cycle battery of at least 7Amp, preferably 9-10A and a glowdriver to reduce the voltage to 1,5V-
Also...those old plain bearing engines could be difficult for a newbie to start, so get a 12V elektric starter (which is also driven from the 12V motor cycle battery).
Old 01-29-2014, 05:21 AM
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JohnBuckner
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I agree With what Jaka suggested about electric starters is quite accurate an most new folks especially working on their own really struggle with chicken sticks, I do hope you have been using one of those instead of your fingers. Bottom line is you will need a starter sooner or later.

However your 1.2 glow driver (ignitor) is quite satisfactory and heck in my part of the world universal. I have not see someone use an old fashioned power panel and big 12 volt battery in some years now. Another trouble with power panels is most of the fellows when they are having a hard time starting cannot resist the temptation of cranking up the voltage and they seen burn out the glow plug. The 1.2 volt glow starter is perfect.

Gllad to see you have listened to AMA 74894 and obtained commercial fuel as mixing on your own can often turn into a real 'Keystone Cops' affair. You want to do that great then just wait till you are experienced operating your engine(s).

John

Last edited by JohnBuckner; 01-29-2014 at 05:27 AM.
Old 01-31-2014, 05:40 PM
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Hi Nathan,

I read through this thread and seen what has been recommend thus far. Some good tips, some not so good.

This is really an engine from a bygone era, and uses engine building technology not seen to much in today's engines. So it must be operated in a manner consistent with what worked best back in the day, and not like engine with ABC technology.

First, the fuel needs to be very oily, partly because of the bushing bearing, and partly because of the iron piston/sleeve technology used 40 years ago. Since most of the fuels made today are for different types of engines, you should add caster oil to your fuel. Not having it run thus far is in your favor at this point. Most commercial fuels today are in the 16-18% oil, and you need at least 22%. So if you buy a gallon of fuel, add at least 5 or 6 oz. of caster oil to it, and 9 oz. would not be too much.

Next thing, take a piece of fuel line and attach it to the engine's fuel inlet and blow through it with the throttle wide open. You should be able to hear the air entering into the carb. Turn the needle valve CW until you stop hearing the air go into the carb. Do not turn it in any more than just to the point where it stops. Now open the needle valve 3 1/2 or 4 turns by turning it CCW. This is the point where you want to first start the engine. BTW, if you don't hear any air at all going into the carb, then remove the needle valve completely and clean the spray bar inside the carb by shooting fuel or methanol through it until you can blow into the carb with the fuel line. An engine that has sat that long could have congealed oil blocking the fuel flow. Once this is done, go back to finding the point where is just quits and open it the 3 1/2 to 4 turns.

Now you are ready to start the engine. Without the glow plug hooked to the battery, with the throttle wide open, put your finger over the carb inlet and turn over the engine two or three times. You should see the fuel being pulled through the fuel line (bubbles move). Then flip it a couple times. Now hook up the battery to the glow plug and pull it trough compression. You should feel a big bump as you pull it through. If it bumps every time, you have too much fuel in the engine, do not flip it yet. Instead, keep pulling it over feeling for bumps. When it starts bumping on every other pull through compression, it is ready to start. Pull it trough a bump, then pull it through no bump, then flip it and it will start with just one flip.

If you have too much fuel in the engine, it won't give you a bump, and if you have not enough fuel in the engine, it won't give you a bump. Goldie Locks is looking for just right in between.

Now if you get it to start, it should be running pretty slow because the needle valve is open too much, and for this type of engine too much is just right. If it dies when you remove the battery, but runs with it, then you are just right for the first couple of minutes of running. Then you turn in (CW) the main needle valve a couple of clicks and see if it stays running. Couple more minutes. wear some hearing protection, because you are going to need to run this engine for at least a half hour to an hour over the course of 8 or 10 runs of two or three minutes each. Eventually you will get to the 4 cycle to 2 cycle break which means the engine has enough time to hold a good needle setting That is about were we want to stop and put it into an airplane.

Now because this is an Enya, it will last forever, if given a slow break-in with the oily fuel and not run lean (assuming you keep it out of the dirt).

Oh, one last thing. Hand flipping an engine is a lost art, and not really the way to go if you are using a plastic prop, especially the sharp one's like APC. Wood prop, then I'll take a chance with just a finger. The feeling for the bump, no bump, bump, then flip will give you a fighting chance. However, use a chicken stick (or an old chuck of heavy garden hose to do the flipping. Set the prop to be level when the engine is coming into compression and flip up with your right hand. Lefties kind of push down into the ground. But if you use starter, the bump, no bump, bump is also when you want to put the starter to the engine. The engine will start instantly, and more important, will not throw the prop or prop and spinner.

Last edited by HighPlains; 01-31-2014 at 05:44 PM.
Old 06-14-2021, 02:50 AM
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First you'll want to put a new glow plug in the top of the engine. Then you'll need a glow plug and just standard model glow fuel. You will need an extremely strong mount preferable outside. Wear a glove so u dont chop your finger of and attach a piece of wire to the carb for throttle control. when starting it fill the tank with fuel. Prime the engine by turning it over e few times without the glow startrer. Then put the glow starter on and spin the propeller anti-clockwise as hard as you can. Adjust the carb to minimuim throttle and slowly open if it wont start do a few times till it starts. Then have fun!
Old 06-23-2021, 09:11 AM
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Steve Collins
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Archie, Archie, Archie! I don't think they are still looking for answers after 7 1/2 Years. I suspect that after all this time that engine is long gone.

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