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1987 Expert Radio

Old 08-08-2005, 12:11 AM
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trouling
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Default 1987 Expert Radio

If possible, I wish to match an 18 year old 7 channel Radio made by Expert with a new FM receiver. Expert is no longer in business and I no longer have the users manual. So I'm wondering is someone else is familur enough with this radio to know if 1) It's FM, 2) what type of reciever it can be matched up with (positive or negative poll). Picture uploaded.
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Old 08-08-2005, 12:22 AM
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trouling
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio

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Old 08-08-2005, 04:11 AM
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keepiru1
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio

No offense, friend.....but I don't want you flying at my field with that noisy thing. In 1991 they passed a narrow band set of specifications and, unless you're going to go get it tuned to those specs, I don't think anyones going to help you with it because it's a hazard.

Rich
Old 08-08-2005, 10:59 AM
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RCKen
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio

keepiru1 was right on the money. It's more than likely that this radio is illegal to even use. The law in 1991 was passed to make sure that all radios are "narrow band" radios. The narrow band gives us more channels to use in our assigned frequency range. An old radio like this is going to transmit on 3-5 adjacent channels, if not more. You're not going to want to use this radio to fly with, and more than likely most clubs won't let you use it at their field. You would be better off getting a new radio and keep the old one as a "museum exhibit".

Ken
Old 08-08-2005, 12:54 PM
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Scar
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio


ORIGINAL: trouling

If possible, I wish to match an 18 year old 7 channel Radio made by Expert with a new FM receiver. Expert is no longer in business and I no longer have the users manual. So I'm wondering is someone else is familur enough with this radio to know if 1) It's FM, 2) what type of reciever it can be matched up with (positive or negative poll). Picture uploaded.
It is entirely possible, if you want to spend enough money, to get the radio upgraded to the "Narrow Band" specs. Radio South could probably do it. Then you could operate some standard receiver. It would be expensive, but possible.

Why would you want to do that? Inexpensive standard radios are available, and programmable radios are available for under $250, to pick a number. (I have a Tracker III coming from Polk's Hobbies, 8 Channel, 99 model memory storage, frequency & shift selectable, with a receiver for the $200 intro price.)

There is really no need to refurbish the nonprogrammable radio you have, considering the prices. It would be a good conversation piece, even without a battery.

Good luck,
Dave Olson
Old 08-08-2005, 05:40 PM
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sbd-5
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio

the expert radios were fm and were in compliance with 1991 regs.it was a korean copy of the futaba at about half the price.you can try to match it to either a jr fm reciver or futaba,i do not know what the shift is on this,i do know kraft fm tx are compatable with airtronics and jr recievers..email radio south and they can tell you which brand is compatable.i had three of these when they came out and never had a problem did niot care for the minimolex connecter that was used on servos.good luck
Old 08-08-2005, 07:20 PM
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio

If it's a futaba clone current to the 1991 specs then a negative shift receiver should work (Futaba or Hitec negative shift).

Regardless; it's old and before I started using it around other aircraft I'd be inclined to have it checked out to make sure none of that sitting inte garage got into the components.

A radio really isn't the place to try to save money; especially at the expense of other modeler's aircraft.
Old 08-08-2005, 08:54 PM
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Swager
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio

I actually had the same system. People in my club said it was OK to use for it was compliant. I still have and use the receiver and servos it came with.

I accidently blew it when I hook up a charge to it wrong!
Old 08-09-2005, 11:14 AM
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sbd-5
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio

almost all tx regardless of age can comply with the 1991 regs,whether am or fm the signal is very clean and usually no modifications need to be made,the problem is the old rx's they are wideband and can not be tuned to reject adjacent channel signals.thoe in doubt should contact pete waters at kraft midwest.
Old 08-10-2005, 01:41 PM
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio

Hey dude

Dont mean to pick on ya but its 2005 time to get a new radio buddy its not that much money they got 9 channels now. What kind of plane u flyin a 1950 glider ?
I dont want you flyin at my feild wit 18 yr old radio
Old 08-12-2005, 11:54 PM
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trouling
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio

Thanks for all the info. At this point It seems most prudent to get a good quality new radio. Any advice on a good quality radio for $200 or less is appreciated?

Re acquainting my self with flying again, I've been practicing on Great Planes G3 Real Flight Software. I plan on purchasing a park flyer category airplane for starters. I'm considering a foam biplane from Great Planes named: "Reflection" model flatout. I also noticed that park flyers exist are flexible and crash resilient. Any advice on a good plane in this category is appreciated?

Old 09-10-2005, 02:06 PM
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pt19 flyer
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio

hi

do not use the "87 radio to fly. they are the old wide band version and not legal since around 1992. current equipment is all narrow band and you would probably be shot down or someone else may be shot down due to wide band interference. the price of current equipment make conversion to narrow band too expensive. tx would have to be narrow banded and you would have to buy a narrow band receiver.

good luck and happy flying

pt19 flyer
Old 01-19-2006, 05:30 AM
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iflidou
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio


ORIGINAL: RCKen

keepiru1 was right on the money. It's more than likely that this radio is illegal to even use. The law in 1991 was passed to make sure that all radios are "narrow band" radios. The narrow band gives us more channels to use in our assigned frequency range. An old radio like this is going to transmit on 3-5 adjacent channels, if not more. You're not going to want to use this radio to fly with, and more than likely most clubs won't let you use it at their field. You would be better off getting a new radio and keep the old one as a "museum exhibit".

Ken
Moderators, like other forum contributors, are human beings and are capable of being WRONG. People who have knowledge of these radios know that World Engines is the Korean manufacturer that attempted to comply with the FCC regulations THAT WERE MADE PUBLIC IN 1986. (Most people are aware of the fact that before an FCC law goes into effect, it must be published.) In fact WE started producing "narrow band" equipment even before Futaba and JR. They produced excellent equipment. I know for a fact because I flew WE Expert systems between 1988 and 1995. Anyone that states "It's more than likely that this radio is illegal to even use." is WRONG. These radio systems, at least the 7 channel ones, were and STILL ARE perfectly legal. The seven channel transmitters are all narrow band and the receivers that were sold with them (model # HP-7RM72F) are dual conversion receivers of good quality.

Because a radio is manufactured before the narrow band law went into effect does not mean that it is not legal. And those "narrow-minded" individuals who make comments telling beginners not to fly this radio are also exhibiting their lack of knowledge on the subject.

Now that the record is straight about these radios, I would make the same recommendation about this radio as with any radio that is approximately the same age - whether it be manufactured by WE, Futaba or JR: If the transmitter does not have one of the gold stickers that were attached by such greats as Pete Waters and the like indicating that they were in fact tuned correctly, send the equipment to a radio person of your choice and have it checked out. Not only to confirm that it is transmitting within the narrow band but also to make sure that the radio, after sitting idle for such a long time, is operating properly. The cost of doing so is much less than the cost of replacing the crashed plane and damaged equipment.

IMHO these radios were good then and are good now. Don't let anyone tell you that you can't fly them.

IFLIdou
Old 01-19-2006, 05:48 AM
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iflidou
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio


ORIGINAL: trouling

If possible, I wish to match an 18 year old 7 channel Radio made by Expert with a new FM receiver. Expert is no longer in business and I no longer have the users manual. So I'm wondering is someone else is familur enough with this radio to know if 1) It's FM, 2) what type of reciever it can be matched up with (positive or negative poll). Picture uploaded.
In answer to your specific question about this radio, if the Tx does not wear a gold sticker, send it in to one of the radio guys to (1) have it tested to make sure the RF deck is narrow banded (which it probably is) and (2) check out the operation since it has been sitting so long. Moisture has a way of damaging electronic components. It is an FM radio. Any Futaba or Hitec (negative shift) receiver would work with this transmitter provided that you purchase either the Futaba or Hitec Rx Xtals that match your Tx. The choice of components is yours. Either will work with that transmitter. If you have the old style receiver that goes with this system (either the Expert HP-7RM72F or the sister receiver imported by Polk Hobbies as the Aristo-Craft Challenger 720 #HP-7RM72), it will probably have the old style Molex connectors. These were proprietary and required that the servos have Molex connectors or have pigtails that connect to Molex connectors.

The Futaba FP-R127DF FM receiver works fine with this Tx as does the Hitec Supreme SuperSlim 7 channel receiver. The advantage of using one of these over either the Expert/Challenger 720 receivers is that with either the Hitec or Futaba you can use almost any brand of servo that plugs into them including Futaba, JR, GWS, etc. (not Airtronics).

If your radio checks out as functioning properly I am sure you will get many more good years of enjoyment from it.

IFLIdou
Old 01-19-2006, 06:23 AM
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Mr_Scale
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio

The Expert radios were always terrible. I would not use that in any plane even if it were legal.
Old 01-19-2006, 06:28 AM
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iflidou
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio


ORIGINAL: Mr_Scale

The Expert radios were always terrible. I would not use that in any plane even if it were legal.
...and that opinion is based on what.......?
Old 01-20-2006, 06:26 AM
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Mr_Scale
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio

That opinion is based on personal experience with that piece of $***. [:'(]
Old 01-20-2006, 11:03 AM
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iflidou
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio

Well, that is YOUR opinion. Fortunately many, many other people do not share yours. Hope you have a better day.
Old 01-20-2006, 03:18 PM
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Mr_Scale
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio

Oh you are right.... that why they are out of business
JR and Futaba are still in business.....
Seriously, I lost a very nice scale plane that I spent 2 years building because of the Expert tx. Expert's service dept. even told me that it was tx that failed.
Old 01-20-2006, 04:04 PM
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Jim Messer
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio

Sorry iflidou, I can't agree with what you are saying about Expert radios being good. Back in the 80's, I sold radios from World Engines (Expert), Pro-Line, and Ace: it was no secret that the Expert radios were very unreliable. On the other hand, the Ace and Pro-Line radios were very reliable. I had so many complaints about the Expert radios that I had to quit selling them - couldn't take the chance of losing customers because of them. I even tried one myself, and it crapped out on the first flight of a brand new airplane. I threw that brand new radio in the junk pile and I have never been sorry for doing so. Sometime you win - sometime you lose. I tried the Expert radio myself, and I lost. I have to agree with Mr. Scale - in my opinion - they never made a good reliable Expert radio.

Better to get an up-to-date computerized radio than to spend good money on that thing.
Old 01-20-2006, 04:14 PM
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio

Weather or not Expert radios are good or bad really doesn't answer the question asked here. I think it is fair to say, that the Expert radio, or any very old radio, that hasn't been used in years, is questionable at best. Certainly we can agree, that there have been numerous enhancements and advances in R/C gear over the last 10 to 15 years. I think the idea of retiring this old equipment makes sense; Not only from a safety stand point, but, from a features and benefits stand point (when comparing to the latest technology).
Old 01-20-2006, 04:22 PM
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iflidou
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio


ORIGINAL: Jim Messer

Sorry iflidou, I can't agree with what you are saying about Expert radios being good. Back in the 80's, I sold radios from World Engines (Expert), Pro-Line, and Ace: it was no secret that the Expert radios were very unreliable. On the other hand, the Ace and Pro-Line radios were very reliable. I had so many complaints about the Expert radios that I had to quit selling them - couldn't take the chance of losing customers because of them. I even tried one myself, and it crapped out on the first flight of a brand new airplane. I threw that brand new radio in the junk pile and I have never been sorry for doing so. Sometime you win - sometime you lose. I tried the Expert radio myself, and I lost. I have to agree with Mr. Scale - in my opinion - they never made a good reliable Expert radio.

Better to get an up-to-date computerized radio than to spend good money on that thing.
I have to disagree with both of you. I have had at least a dozen of the radios and the only problems that I had with them were the gimbal supports. They cracked easily and had to be replaced. As far as reliability, I flew these radios (7 channel only) for almost 8 years and NEVER had even so much as a glitch or a hiccup.

To reply to Mr_Scale, i am sorry that the plane was lost and that it was due to (as you say) the transmitter. However, regular maintenance of radios is the responsibility of the flyer - not necessarily the manufacturer. I have known numerous individuals who have lost planes due to Futaba/JR/Hitec tx problems but those are the chances that we all take. It is my understanding that the company did not go out of business but was purchased by Hitec and Hitec decided not to continue the line of this product.

Anyway, have a good winter building!!!
IFLIdou
Old 01-20-2006, 04:25 PM
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iflidou
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio


ORIGINAL: iaclmac

Weather or not Expert radios are good or bad really doesn't answer the question asked here. I think it is fair to say, that the Expert radio, or any very old radio, that hasn't been used in years, is questionable at best. Certainly we can agree, that there have been numerous enhancements and advances in R/C gear over the last 10 to 15 years. I think the idea of retiring this old equipment makes sense; Not only from a safety stand point, but, from a features and benefits stand point (when comparing to the latest technology).
I know people that are still flying their 15yr+ JR and Futaba stuff and it works just fine. Maintenance of a system is the responsibility of the flyer and as I said in a prior post I also recommend that the radio be checked out. This applies to ALL manufacturers.

IFLIdou
Old 01-21-2006, 08:13 AM
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Mr_Scale
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio

I lost my scale plane on the fifth flight with the Expert radio. I don't believe it should have needed any thing at that point aside from proper charging.
Old 01-21-2006, 11:19 AM
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iflidou
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Default RE: 1987 Expert Radio


ORIGINAL: Mr_Scale

I lost my scale plane on the fifth flight with the Expert radio. I don't believe it should have needed any thing at that point aside from proper charging.
I am sorry to hear that. Unfortunately, planes are lost due to manufacturing problems by all manufacturers. However, I have not heard or read anywhere that WE had more than its share of problems. In the '80s Fred Marks published a book entitled "Getting the Most from Radio Control Systems" wherein he shows a "Fault Tree of System Failures". That is the only published article on the subject that I know of and to my recollection it does not delineate by manufacturer. That does not bring back the scale plane that you lost but, as stated in the article, it is difficult to assess blame to a particlular failure.

Be well.
IFLIdou

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