SKYLINE350GT

I think this is more of what everyone is looking for. One thread where one particular buggy can be discussed to everyones hearts content. Please post all comment, questions and anything else pertaining to this buggy in this thread.

slicks

Skyline -- good job!

Well - I have my 777 on order should be in no later than Friday. I saw where Tower was/is getting rid of their kyosho line for much less than they used to sell them at.

I am impressed with this buggy - the suspension and the long travel shocks really absorb all shocks and it flies nice and level. I am looking forward to building it and getting it out on the track.

SManMTB

[sm=greedy.gif][sm=greedy.gif][sm=eek.gif][sm=thumbup.gif][sm=thumbup.gif]

$280 from Tower is a SMOKING deal! The SP1 for $570 is VERY hot too!!!

spokman

My Feedback: (2)

Had the guy at the LHS tell me how much better the SP2 is over the SP1, that I have. LOL! I'm starting to despise the LHS guys.. Me team driver, 5 years experience, you need longer SP2 chassis. Lick my what? I said to him.. Just kidding but the stores are really starting to annoy me.. It's all about money..

slicks

Hey Christian ---

yep I got a good deal. Scott bought another one and Kevin ordered one too .

If I could have afforded it I would have gone for the SP1 -- but my car (the real one - the buick) blew the head gasket [:@][:@]

Mrfranchize02

I am absolutely stoked about my SP1. It will be a year old in September and I have never been pulled off the track for a broken part, and I have had some really nasty crashes. If you are getting ready to build one, I suggest that you get better bearings unless you have time to strip it and completely maintenance it twice a month. I just ruined my Werks clutch so I'm going back to three shoe. I've been thinking about going to a complete Mugen setup, flywheel, nut, springs,shoes etc. My LHS carries Mugen stuff. Will someone please let me if this will be Okay. I don't see why it wouldn't.

dockman2

Yeah Joel they shipped mine today. Honestly I really didnt want a 777 but for $254.99 shipped I just couldnt pass it up. I know I will put it together, servos, motor etc and set it up, but Im not sure if I will run it or just sell it. I may just do the same with the TQ kit. Get everything setup and ready to run and then sell it. I really just want another XB8 but couldnt pass up those deals that I may be able to pass on to someone else thats looking for a buggy.

Hpi_mt2

I got my standard mp777 for 249.99 total free of shipping from ultimatehobbies I dunno but they dont really update there site much because last time i checked it was still around 300 dollars... Anyways i have a quick question im goin to put this servo in for my throttle http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LX0929&P=V and i was wondering what double sided arm would fit on the head of the servo... it doesn't matter if its aluminum or plastic thanks...

slicks

HPI -- when ever I bought a servo there was always an arm with it. You may not need to go out an get another - unless you really want a metal servo arm for your throttle - I use that heavy duty yellow one on my throttle servo and it works just fine.

Mrfranchize.... sounds like you have some bad experience with the Kyosho bearings -- are they really not up to the task? What bearings did you replace yours with? A couple of guys where I run have the Kyosho's and I don't think that they have encountered a problem with their bearings. Thanks for the heads-up on this!

Christian --- have you had to replace your bearings? I know that you have the MP7.5 K (I think that is what you run) - maybe the bearings are different from what comes in the current kits?

Hpi_mt2

Thanks slicks... but that servo is coming with a radio im getting and i just need a double sided horn that will fit it...

nolimit208

I'm replacing my bearing with www.avidrc.com revolution bearings.

Here is a Some stuff that is going around my LHS area on set up's and stuff for the 777.

I'll just copy past it here. I'm not sure what forum its from but it goes through some setups people have tried and tells you alittle about the car and its reactions to the diff Set UPs


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


It's simple Dibbs, just fatten up the low end till it's about to die, won't idle fer nothin' but will still run if you can clear it out. Then take it out to the track and run it, lean out the top little at a time till it's where you wannit. You'll have to play with the idle a bit as you go and sometimes I have to tweak the bottom in a tad after setting the top end. Worked great on the WS7, that motor sings and stays cool enough not to boil water. I haven't tried it on an OS or on my new Nova yet but Regan says it will work , I have no reason to doubt him, other than his haircut
This is how Regan LeBlanc tunes engines…..

Depends on the track IMO Ken. On a smooth track with fairly normal jumps
I run my dog bones level front and rear. On a rough track with larger
jumps I like to run my front dog bones a little above level.

I am using the 22 degree blocks up front, I took the LSD diff out and used a regular diff, I am running 5,000 in front, 7,000 in the middle and 2,000 in the rear, try 40 or 35 weight oil all the way around in the shocks, a little less than 1 degree toe out in the front the 2.5 degree block on the rear and depending on the track I use white springs if its high traction and if not I use the kyosho blue springs. You might have to dial in a little bit of negative expo if its still a little twitchy, or try a little less toe out.
It works well for me after a lot of trial and error, but if it doesn't wrok for you, it should at least have you close to the right set up for you. I hope it works well for you just like that. Let me know how it works for you, and if you change anything from that set up. Good luck !

Mike, I would say you really need to give the all Kyosho clutch with carbon shoes and 1.0 springs a try. Trim about 2mm off the tips of the shoes and then just scuff them every couple of race weekends. It's my second favorite clutch performance wise to the Mugen, but it's way easier to maintain than the Mugen clutch.

Most people are setting their cars with as much droop as possible.
That's pretty much how I run mine. There's a great setup by Degani
posted here somewhere.
I ran both the 2 and 3 degree anti squat plates, they both work, but
I'm saving my 3 degree one for Blue Groove! 2 degrees is better for
rougher looser conditions.
King Heads sells the 2 degree one alone! ALL the others sell the
1,2,and 3 degree blocks as a $100 set! Maybe someone else sells them
separate?

Here are Greg Degani and Mark Pavidis's setups they
posted here:

Response 5574:
Date: Mon, Oct 4, 2004 (23:46)
From: greg degani (gregdeg)

Got Back from Hemet car worked really well on Saterday, did lots of
testing with different set-ups. Finished third and almost won it but
crashed at the end..I had gotted lapped 7 minutes into the 15 minute
main by chad but i managed to put in fast laps in the last 7 minutes
and un-lapped myself and almost one but i blew it with 45 seconds
left..anyway Found a decent set-up for bumpy tracks. Diff
5000,7000,1000 Front oil 60wt 1.4 rear oil 35 wt 1.4 Front upper link
long, "High block""A" Middle steering hole on steering link. Shocks
inside on arm,inside on tower 14 mm ride hight clips front.
Rear end.. Shocks inside hole arm Second hole from inside on tower,
Use
the upper shock holes on the tower. 3 degree toe in,2 degree
antisquat.
Rear hubs back, use bottom hole hinge pin on hubs. 17 mm ride-hight
clips. Full travel front and rear(in the front yur travel is limited
by
the arms hitting the chassie...and in the rear your travel is limited
by the shocks in the top holes in the tower) So no need to mess with
your droop screws..Hope that covers it..

Response 5575:
Date: Mon, Oct 4, 2004 (23:48)
From: greg degani (gregdeg)

Oh and i forgot That set-up is for like 80 degree weather, if you race
where it is really cold like 65 and below reduce your shock oil to
like
50wt front and 25-30 rear...



Mark Pavidis - 777 settup

front 60w oil (70w if hot out)
1.4 piston
blue spring
inside hole in front tower
inside hole for shock on arm
22 caster block
Low A block
std sway bar
ride height front bones just above level
5000 diff oil
steering in middle hole in rack
droop depends on track slightly limited

Center
48 tooth spur
13 clutch bell
3 shoe clutch 1.0 springs
7000

Rear
35 w oil
std rear sway bar
2 deg anti squat
3 deg toe
hubs back
camber link long and in lower hole in tower
2nd to inside hole in tower
inside hole in arm for the shock
blue springs
bones level if bumpy just above level
1000

Brandon - Longer link = Less camber uptake = more steering = "twitchy" Shorter link = More camber uptake = less steering = more predictable Even with the shortest link using the inside hole, the 777 had more than enough steering. Your best bet is to try it at the track and see what works for you.




Mike, Run 3000,7000,3000 in rear for Kz. My car was really good there at the last races..Ive done a ton of testing with diffs the last month, Ive come to realize that you dont ever need to run an lsd in the front, all it does is make your car hard to drive through bumps and just in general. You can run a 3000 up front and turn-in like an lsd but still have the stability and ease to drive of a diff. If 3000 up front gives you too much steering run 5000 instead. Running 3000 in the rear is really the key to the 777. It calms the car down and give it super stability and traction out of the corners. If your on a super hooked up track like Hemet that also has a lot of bumps, 1000 in the rear will probably be better, but everywhere else run 3000.

Daniel, we went from 40 to 35 in the back, and it made a huge difference. Arms level in back, down in front.

Last year Degani posted a way to build volume compensating foam into the Kyosho shock cap. There is no bladder to blow then and the shocks are incredibly smooth. I believe the procedure is listed on rcpics.com. The downside is it is a little tricky to fill them and it makes a mess.

#216 of 412 by Matt Windell (windellm) on Tue Jan 11 21:20:53 2005:
Last year Degani posted a way to build volume compensating foam into
the Kyosho shock cap. There is no bladder to blow then and the shocks
are incredibly smooth. I believe the procedure is listed on
rcpics.com. The downside is it is a little tricky to fill them and it
makes a mess.

I have been using Degani's setup which was easier (slower) to drive
into the corner than what I had been using and faster coming out of
the corner. It can be driven more consistently. My old setup makes the
car look hooked up on some tracks (RC Barn, JCP) but not so good on
others, (Xdome) and it has a lot of steering going into the corner.

Current setup:
Front
5k diff
60 wt. Assoc. oil with foam in shock caps
blue springs
H block and A block (going to try L block again soon)
Camber link set to outside on 22 degree hub carrier
Shocks outside on arm and lower holes, 2nd from inside on tower. The
downtravel is limited a little with the droop screws. Limit for more
on-power steering.
Rear hole in steering plate.
0-2 degrees toe-out and 1 degree negative camber
I think the ride height is around bones level to slightly above level.

Center
7k oil
Kyosho black clutch with 1.0 or .95 springs. A little cut off the end
of the clutch. Tune for your engine
Collari B3 with Top hardcoated 086 one-piece pipe. No waller
46t (stock spur), 13t Kyosho clutch bell
Fioroni Ferrodo brakes. Remove brake guides from center diff mount

Rear
1k diff oil
40 wt. Assoc. oil with foam caps
Blue springs
Shocks in lower row on tower and 2nd from inside hole. Inside hole in
arm.
Rear camber link on inside lower hole in tower and outside hole in hub
carrier. Carriers in lower hinge pin hole and set to longest wheelbase.
3 degree toe-in and 2 degree anti-squat.
I had been running full droop in rear, (arms hit chassis) but I just
switched to some droop. Adjust for the track.
Ride height bones level to slightly below level.

Stock swaybars and chassis braces. King servo saver part (not sure if
this is necessary with the newer stock part). King steering knuckles
for durability.

Old setup for reference (if you want your car to turn in very hard)
Front
20 degree caster with B and L block

Rear
Short wheelbase

The bad thing about my old setup is the car will turn before you even
think about it off power. This is also good though. The worse thing is
it will not turn if the track slicks up because you give up a lot of
on-power steering. You have to really respect the car and drive smooth
with this setup. The nice thing is if you overshoot a corner you can
just slow down enough, and the car will turn no matter how bad you
blow it. It was dialed at JCP and RC Barn this way, (high traction
tracks) but I am not sure the new setup would not have worked the same
or better.

What does running the front shocks, or the rears for that matter in
the outer holes on the arms do?

it limits down travel and stiffens the wheel (effect of the spring on
the wheel) rate signicantly 11%, where as each top hole in the shock
tower changes the wheel rate ~ 1% out on the tower change the body roll
rate also.

#347 of 428 by Greg Luna on Tue Jan 18 16:05:32 2005:
I made a diff oil change from 5/7/1 to 4/7/2 this weekend & was VERY
pleased. Something I recommend to try out.

I took apart my car since it's been raining & noticed I have been
running a setup close to Pavidis & not Degani's which I thought I had.

Dylan - The 777 has an insane amount of suspension travel. You need to play with downtravel to get the car where you want it. Too much could be the cause of the bucking or you may just need to go through that section differently. My car seems to handle rough tracks pretty well and that was even with full downtravel in the rear. Try accelerating through the bad section. What diff oil are you running other than 3k in the rear? Are you running the LSD?

no lsd here...LOL it is the Degani set up he posted on here a while ago with the 3k rear diff. and shock oil change. 5-7-3 currently I thought about limiting travel...the TTR took the rough stuff no problem with full travel. Is it that much better in the rough stuff. I know my K3 handled the rough stuff better for sure. I am going to the same track again Sunday, I'll try limiting the suspension, do you think limit both front and rear? I see alot of chassis slap comin my way if I limit it very much...



Kenny,
Not a problem it was a great time. I might be back out there in May, & if I
am I would bring my 1/8 again. Here are some setups that Degani & Pavidis
posted.I run Pavidis setup with 60/35(I would also try 30 rear if it is cold
out) Associated shock oil. I run -2 camber Frt & rear with 1degree toe out.
Frt sway bars flush on the end & rear sway bar showing 2mm. I have my frt
camber link on the outside hole on the hub.My diff oil is 4/7/2.(Pavidis
runs 4/6/2 now). 46t spur everything else is Pavidis setup. Oh yeah I ran
Panther KII in med-soft(I recommend soft for there though). If you get
Panther tires make sure to practice with them before you qualify as the foam
is too hard at first. The tires I ran had 5 club races on them & cut the
outer edge off. Crimefighters work awesome also, but they are one runs.One
race weekend then they're done, because of the foam.

Thanks again & have fun there

Greg


Mark Pavidis - 777 settup (he just changed diff oil to 4/6/2)

front 60w oil (70w if hot out)
1.4 piston
blue spring
inside hole in front tower
inside hole for shock on arm
22 caster block
Low A block
std sway bar
ride height front bones just above level
5000 diff oil
steering in middle hole in rack
droop depends on track slightly limited

Center
48 tooth spur
13 clutch bell
3 shoe clutch 1.0 springs
7000

Rear
35 w oil
std rear sway bar
2 deg anti squat
3 deg toe
hubs back
camber link long and in lower hole in tower
2nd to inside hole in tower
inside hole in arm for the shock
blue springs
bones level if bumpy just above level
1000

Degani's
Got Back from Hemet car worked really well on Saterday, did lots of
testing with different set-ups. Finished third and almost won it but
crashed at the end..I had gotted lapped 7 minutes into the 15 minute
main by chad but i managed to put in fast laps in the last 7 minutes
and un-lapped myself and almost one but i blew it with 45 seconds
left..anyway Found a decent set-up for bumpy tracks. Diff
5000,7000,1000 Front oil 60wt 1.4 rear oil 35 wt 1.4 Front upper link
long, "High block""A" Middle steering hole on steering link. Shocks
inside on arm,inside on tower 14 mm ride hight clips front.
Rear end.. Shocks inside hole arm Second hole from inside on tower,
Use
the upper shock holes on the tower. 3 degree toe in,2 degree
antisquat.
Rear hubs back, use bottom hole hinge pin on hubs. 17 mm ride-hight
clips. Full travel front and rear(in the front yur travel is limited
by
the arms hitting the chassie...and in the rear your travel is limited
by the shocks in the top holes in the tower) So no need to mess with
your droop screws..Hope that covers it..

Response 5575:
Date: Mon, Oct 4, 2004 (23:48)
From: greg degani (gregdeg)

Oh and i forgot That set-up is for like 80 degree weather, if you race
where it is really cold like 65 and below reduce your shock oil to
like
50wt front and 25-30 rear

Mike - try and work on your barking and brake set-up a bit more....as previously mentioned it made a massive dif in my driving. This weekend I took hold of another guy's transmitter and immid felt that his brakes were to "hard" - as you approach the corner and pull brakes the rear locks immid and the car looses traction in the rear. What also happens is that his car would come to a standstill before entering the corner and he needs to "throttle" through the turn VS gliding.Sooo, due to his rear being unstable (i.e. los of traction creating the rear to "skid") and having to tap on throttle again just before the turm it made the car very difficult to drive..... I changed his brake bias to 60 f and 40 r - which solved the rear "locking-up" and dialed down his end-point to solve the car stopping way to early - car felt 20 times better.

I switched to the shorter upper arms to run the inside camber link holes on the front and also replaced the 3 degree anti-squat plate with the 2 degree unit. Corner entry was smoothed out and the car is very predictable now with the inside location. Rear traction was also the best that I've experienced with the car too. I think the 2 degree plate attributed to this. I'm starting to really like this car.

yes, or use green springs, greens on the 77 act like blues on the k2
due to the geometry change stiffening the sping 11%

I was chasing my setup for quite a while on my 777. The steering was too much, and it was hard to pick a solid line because the car was too affected by ruts and bumps under power, plus the back end swang around under power like a 2 wheel drive stadium truck. My KII/III would push slightly, and was much easier to drive. I have finally found a comfortable setup that really works for me, and it sounds as if I'm not the only one with the same complaints. Two things: Setup change, and driving style change. On the setup, I'm running 5-7-1.5 in the diffs front to back. Shocks are 50wt front, and 35wt rear. Inner holes on tower and arms front and rear. Wheelbase SHORT. 22 degree hubs, Front B block LOW switch from 48spur to stock 46.

From Mark Pavidas: 777 Starting Settup for Hemet Nitro Challenge Front: 60w -1.4 pistons -Blue Springs -Front shock location in the upper middle hole in tower / inside hole in arm -22deg caster blocks -A block -Lower upper arm position -Short upper arm (Inside hole in 3 hole caster block) -Std front sway bar -4000 front diff oil -Steering ackerman in the back hole in steering rack (Increases ackerman making the car turn a little smoother) -Front ride height is with universals "slightly" above level Center -48 tooth spur gear -6000 center diff oil (for bumpy track which hemet usually is) Rear -30w (or 35w if temp is warm) -1.4 pistons -Blue springs -Shocks are mounted in very outside upper hole in tower / inside hole in arm -Rear camber link is outside in hub and upper hole in tower (to increase rear traction. For the car to pivot more on the rear move rear camber link down one hole at a time) -3deg rear toe -2deg anti squat -rear hubs spaced one spacer in the front with two spacers in the back ( this will shorten the wheelbase slightly but this will give the car the correct amount of dogbone sweep the car needs. To free the rear of the car up move hubs back. For hemet hubs back might be ok. -Rear ride height is universals level -std rear sway bar Clutch -3 shoe Kyosho carbon shoes(with tips of shoes slightly cut) -1.0 springs -13 tooth clucth bell

IF-329 for the 777 short upper arms. GP/Tower has them in stock.

there was no way you could get -2 camber with the long arms if you had it in the Middle hole let a long the inside hole. once i got short i was able to do that. if anyone said they got -2 camber with the long arms is wrong period.

Paul - the settup sheet that was posted by James is correct as far as the rear camber is located. If I mover to the outside row of camber holes it will increase the camber during the travel of the supension. This would allow the car to rotate very fast thru corners which the 777 allready does. Trace - sorry the rear diff oil is 2000 James - the clutch springs are 1.0 not 1.1 I have a smaller eyelet than the stock one that allows me to run the short upper arm with about 2 deg neg. camber. You can dremel you stock one down by about 2mm. This will give you the right amount of room to get 2 deg neg camber. The chassis is also 4mm thick (Fioroni

Matt - Fioroni chassi braces James - toe out 1 deg camber 1 to 2 neg I am not sure on the rebound or shock length for droop I will have to check Sway bars are set at the end of the ball Rear hub is in the lower hole(furthest from bearings) I have "A" block with "L" bushing

A more kickup angle= less stering, soaks up bumps better B less kickup angle= more steering L&H bushings change the roll center of the suspension L raises the roll center of the chasis reducing chasis roll force in a corner, ie less chassis roll H lowers the roll center causing the chasis roll force to be higher, ie more chassis roll for a given corner

From Mark P: Arthur - with the short upper arm it will make the car easier to drive
when the track gets bumpy. If you need more steering with the settup
just make the upper arm longer till you get the steering you need.

James - 2 deg anti squat
GOOD-more sidebite
- more forward bite
- works well on slightly bumpy tracks
- jumps and lands better
BAD-car bounces a little more under acceleration on
- bumpy tracks

1 deg anti squat
GOOD - smooths the car out under acceleration on bumpy tracks
- the rear of the car is a little more free in
the corners
BAD - Car will not have the forward bite or side bite needed
for loose track conditions
- does not jump and land as good


Mark P or anyone. When Would you run the 3 anti? on a smooth track with no bumps? also mark when would be a good time to run the 48Spur gear? is Hemet a small track? and why would you run a 48 spur with the v-spec if i could ask? thanx dibs

3 degrees anti squat is best used on high bite, smoother tracks. It
kind of locks out the rear suspension under power, but also causes the
rear to squat MORE under braking. 2 and 1 degrees allows the rear to
squat and "dig in" and also frees up the rear suspension under power,
and is better for rough or loose tracks.
I use the 48 on small tracks only with my top end motors like the C5.
I just dropped to a 46 with my Max MT5 and it really improved the
power deliver. The 48 hits harder.
The Vspec has a lot of low end grunt, and I wouldn't think you'd need
to run a 48 ever with that motor.,

Pavidis 777 Starting Setup for Hemet Nitro Challenge Front: -60w -1.4 pistons -Blue Springs -Front shock location in the upper middle hole in tower / inside hole in arm -22deg caster blocks -A block -Lower upper arm position -Short upper arm (Inside hole in 3 hole caster block) -Std front sway bar -4000 front diff oil -Steering ackerman in the back hole in steering rack (Increases ackerman making the car turn smoother) -Front ride height is with universals "slightly" above level Center: -48 tooth spur gear -6000 center diff oil (for bumpy track which Hemet usually is) Rear: -30w (or 35w if temp is warm) -1.4 pistons -Blue springs -Shocks are mounted in very outside upper hole in tower / inside hole in arm -Rear camber link is outside in hub and upper hole in tower (to increase rear traction. For the car to pivot more on the rear move rear camber link down one hole at a time) -3deg rear toe -2deg anti squat -rear hubs spaced one spacer in the front with two spacers in the back ( this will shorten the wheelbase slightly but this will give the car the correct amount of dogbone sweep the car needs. To free the rear of the car up move hubs back. For Hemet hubs back might be ok). -Rear ride height is universals level -std rear sway bar -2000 rear diff oil Clutch -3 shoe Kyosho carbon shoes(with tips of shoes slightly cut) -1.0 springs -13 tooth clutch bell This is the only one I have. Cody ran this set-up but a few slight changes. 5-7-2 55 front oil/32.5 rear middle hole on the c hub 2 carbon/1 aluminum shoe/1.0 springs

From Cody King’s dad: James - not slick, but VERY bumpy. Our normal diff lube set up is 5-7-1,
but went to 2000 rear to try it out and it was great. We tried the
lighter shock oil to handle the bumps, and it was still jumping fine
(not bottoming out) so we left it that way. Middle hole just gives him
more steering.

Gene - the single aluminum shoe just makes it a little more snappy, with
out the crazy snap of pure aluminum, or the wear and tear either. The
aluminum shoe cleans the bell, and conditions the carbon shoes too. They
compliment each other very well. I like the way it engages and it's easy
to maintain. That is our standard clutch set-up from now on. oh yea, and another important adjustment. Droop screws turned in to raise the arms to where they would be if they didn't have cut outs for the chassis.

The carbons engage first so there is not much sliding when the
aluminum shoe hits the bell so very little (maybe none) aluminum is
laid down on the bell surface.

dgrobe - The setup will depend on what kind of traction and how bumpy
the surface is. Kit setup is A block and H block in front. If you need
more entry steering try the L block in front. If you need low speed
steering try the B block.

Mark Pavidas:Phil - glad I was able to help. Next time get a O.S. 2050 pipe and you wont have to worry about your stinger ever again. Those pipes are tough and make good power. If there is anything I can do in the future let me know. Glad to see you made it back home. Here is the settup I ended up with at Hemet Front: Blue Springs 1.4 pistons 60w associated oil Shocks mounted in inside upper hole in shock tower Shocks mounted in inside hole in arm 22 caster blocks A block with low inserts Short upper arm mounted in inside hole in hub carrier Std sway bar Back hole in steering rack 1.5 deg toe out 4000 diff oil lightned Fioroni diff gear front droop allmost full ( hard to measure ) ront ride height universals slightly above level Center: 6000 diff oil 48 spur gear 13 clutch bell 3 1.0 springs Cradock brakes Front and rear Rear: Blue Springs 1.4 pistons 35w associated oil mounted in second hole from upper outside hole in tower mounted in inside hole in arm std rear sway bar with kit 3 deg toe 1 deg anti squat rear hubs space on med in front with med and thin in rear rear camber outside hole in hub and inside lower hole in tower wing flat droop slightly more than fron when looking at the car when the wheels just come off the ground 2000 diff oil lightned Fioroni diff gear Motor - O.S. Vspec Pipe - 2050 red restrictor P3 plug Sidewinder 30% temp 220

You think I'm kidding? That's the way they are designed to work, and
that is what we do. I put on the cap, unscrew it a half turn, hold the
shock at 45 degrees with the bleed hole up, and burp it once. Then I
tighten it. Done.

All the way down. I can post my entire shock assembly if you want. The only thing I really do when they are new is make sure to sand around the top of the shock bodies so they don't cut the diaphragms. And make sure the cartridges work smoothly. Fill up the shock with the shaft pulled out, then pump it in and out a couple times and rotate it to get any air out from under the piston. Let it sit for about 5 minutes or so to let all the air come up. Top it off a little to make sure it's full, then do what I said. Cap it.

I measure the lenth of the shocks when setting my droop.Take the shocks out and measure the total lenth - I measure from the centre of the top "eye" to the center of the "bottom eye".They'll vary pending on the car, i.e. K2/K3/777 - especially the rear shocks.The front ones are all the same.Then, put the shocks back in the car.You never want to run your car with the shocks fully extended, as this will place allot of pressure on then.Your front shock should be around 102mm (fully extended) from the centre of the top lock-nut to the centre of the bottom pin.When installed, the max I would run them are about 100mm to 101mm - this is my max droop in the front and I'll start dialing-out from there... pending track etc. In the rear, I use to run my shocks (K2) at about 116mm - but this will depend on your track/ driving style/shock positions etc.

I adjust my droop screws and then check for equal droop on each side by checking on a flat surface with the suspension extended. Slightly higher than level in fromnt, and level in the rear is how I run mine. The 777 is super sensitive to ride height, so experiment.

Tommy - When you run a long upper link, you reduce camber uptake, which is how much camber changes during travel. Less camber uptake means more traction, increasing steering but also making the handling less predictable, particularly on rough surfaces. If you run the shorter upper link, you get more camber uptake, which reduces traction when the suspension compresses, making for more predictable handling, but at a loss of steering.

OK on the rear camber links, if you were to move them to the short side
what will happen? Outside hole in c-hub and upper most on outer set on
sp-1 shock tower. How will this effect from outer hole c-hub and lower
inner most on shock tower.

David.. moving the upper arm in the rear.. when you move the arm up..
it lowers the roll center..

moving it to the outside hole in the tower will shorten the arm
length.. which in turn, allows for more camber gain under compression
(meaning, the you get more camber change, under shock compression, if
you push the rear of the car down.. you will get more negative camber
change, than if you were on the inside set of holes.., using the outer
holes in the tower will allow for more traction..

If you use a longer link, the car is more forgiving, and handles the
rough stuff better..

Phil - it sounds more like a diff oil issue. More "turn in" or off power steering is indicative of lighter front diff oil. Heavier oil provides less turn in and more on power steering. The level of the oil can cause this too. If your diff leaks, or the level is low in the front diff, the car will do what you are saying. Also, check to make sure your steering ball ends are in the rear hole on the ackerman plate. Cody found this to be quite allot smoother than the middle hole. Wangyl - the heavy front shock oil is just to keep the car from doing a front flip when the car hits a crater full wood. lol

The 777 really works a lot better with 2000 or 3000 in the rear.
It makes the rear center shaft harder to turn to the center diff,
which then transfers more of the power to the front. this improves
stability because the rear isn't getting hit so hard with power, the
front's getting MORE power, and the rear wheels aren't as easily
redirected when the car is slightly off balance. The 777 is teeter
tottery weight distribution wise, and this is why it's kind of a
handful with 1000 in the rear. The rear inside rear wheel reverses
direction too easily because of this, and this is ALSO why going up to
3000 in the rear helps.
This is my hypotheseis.

Daniel,
It took me a long time to figure my 777 out, and I agree running the
short wheelbase also helped a lot.
The 777 is more easily knocked off center, moreso than the K cars,
and this is why it doesn't transfer as much power to the front,
because the rear is always shifting back and forth, allowing the rear
center shaft to spin easily, and of course the center diff is going to
take the path of least resistance and throw the power that way.
This is why i think the rear of the 777 is a handfull, and why 3000
wt oil in the rear helps. Normally going up in the rear would make the
back end looser under power.
Greg Degani told me about going to 3000 in the rear, I cannot take
credit for it, but obviously i've put too much thought into it.

paul.. i ran 3/7/1 forever.. and went to 5/7/2, huge difference.. i
think Cody will like it.. also.. i been using the short wheel base..
with 3deg toe in the rear.. the car is alot better..

Long is better. I think many dont realize the benefits of a good stable rear end as far as shock fluid is concerned. If your rear is stable and the downtravel is set right the longer wheelbase is better . makes turning smoother and more predictable and helps through the bumps.I personally think 30 or 35 is too light and makes the car tend to hook more . I run 40,42.5, or 45 about all of the time and my car is way dialed. If the rear shock fluid allows too rapid of movement (groundward) when power is applied then the car is thrown way out of balance and thois i believe causes all of the twitchyness. And robs on power steering and right on down the line.

NEW Hard & Light Weight Pinion Gear for MP777 and MP7.5 (4 grams lighter). they are $32 each NEW Hard & Light Weight Conical Gear for MP777 and MP7.5 (8 grams $52 each

Phil, 99% of the drivers I know use the 48t spur everywhere except the
really big tracks. It helps with low-end punch and gives you more
response. The standard set up is 13/48, again the vast majority of
races use that gearing.


For KingheadzRoy - Both. It's the insert that you match to the A or B lower block.
Put the insert in with the hole closer to the bottom, A block - Put the
insert in with the hole closer to the top, B block.

Joe, when you build your 777, don't use the LSD in the front. Do yourself a favor and start with 5 front, 7 center, and 3 in the rear. The LSD makes the already super quick turning car uncontrollable on power. The standard diff in front is MUCH better. Use THAT as your baseline. Also try running the wheelbase short, it helps the back end stick better. When I used a 48 on this car it hit too hard off the line and made the back end looser. Sticking with the stock 46 really helped smooth the power delivery. Run the 22 degree front C hubs. My shock setup is 60fr, 37.5 to 40 rear, one from the inside lower row on the towers, inner holes on arms. My car seems to only work with Chameleons cut up differently for different track conditions. As soon as I try Crime fighters or Kimodos, it's like starting from scratch again. I would HIGHLY recomend exploring the chameleon tire first on the 777. For me at least, it's the ONLY tire. I think the car likes more paddle type tires so I'd bet that ProLine Mug Shots or Dirty Harry's would also work well, I'd also try them. A tire switch totally transforms the 777 into a different car. See you at the new track Mang! I'll probably miss the first raceday as I 'm going to be at the pro series.

Jared was running a 777, and the only thing I know of that MAY have been different is a slightly longer chassis. Not sure why tho, it seems more bouncy to me, and the stock 777 chassis seems to work better IMO. They used the softer green springs, softer front oil, and inside upper shock positions that all the Kyosho folks were having success with

From the X-Ray Manual setup pages...

REAR ANTI-SQUAT
Adjust rear anti-squat of the rear lower arms by changing the
eccentric bushings in the plate at the front of the rear bulkhead.

Less anti-squat = flatter arm
· increases rear traction off-power
· decreases rear traction on-power
· better on a bumpy track
More anti-squat = leaning more backwards
· increases rear traction during acceleration
· decreases rear traction off-power
· better on smooth and/or slippery tracks

They will still tear. The only bulletproof way to outrun the prob is to do the Degani mod thing. And by the way your car will handle better with them withthe mod.

aaron is correct running the short wheelbase will give you more rear
traction but it will also take away some steering. I run 2mm of spacers
in front of the rear hub and 3mm of spacers behind the hub and still
has plenty or steering with good rear traction. Try messing with the
wheelbase and see what works for your driving style.

Jim Becker, you can use which ever blocks you want, however.. depending
on the blocks is what you use on the bushing.. if you have a L block,
then the bushing marked with L/H, the L is in the up position, if you
use the H block, then you flip over the bushing, so the H is up..

Also, depending on which block you use on the lower, A or B, also
affects the A/B bushings in the same way..

H block (lower roll center) increases on power steering, car is less responsive, better on high bite, smooth tracks with high speed corners L block (higher roll center) decreases on power steering, car is more responsive, use to avoid traction rolling, use on track with quick direction changes, and chicanes
thinner in the front, increases steering into the corners off power, too thin becomes inconsistant, and lose forward bite during accelleration thicker in the front, increases stability into the corner under braking, and give more on power steering at corner exit thinner in the rear, increass cornering traction, and increases steering into the corner thicker, decreases rear traction while cornering, and reduces wheelspin I have found, that 5/7/2 is pretty good all around, but went to 4/7/2, and like it better since this weekend.. if you run the 777, i think 2k is the ticket in the rear

George s. i've been running front cva's in the rear of my 777 for a
while now with no problems.(they are a couple of mm's longer.)

James,
Make sure you're using the LONG wheelbase (rear hub setting) for more
steering. Don't let the "long wheelbase" thing fool you. By setting
the hubs to the back, you are unloading the rear wheels, which takes
away traction from the back of the car, allowing the back end to
slide/break traction easier.

IMO, 1/8 scales are very sensitive to this setting. If your car is
having trouble with steering authority, take a look at your ENTIRE
setup, because you shouldn't be having this problem with a properly
setup car.

I notice alot of guys running the -3 rear toe , what does that give
you compared to the -2 ?? and nitrofactory is a great place to get
parts thanks..


donnie.. going to 2 degree toe in the rear will give the car more on
power steering.. coming out of the corner.

slicks

NOLIMIT --- wow - thanks for all of the data -- this is great stuff and will help me when I start to build mine (this weekend I hope). I see where you are replacing your bearings -- is this because you find the Kyosho bearings unacceptable - or is it just time to do so?

again - thanks

slicks

HPI -- OK - well - give Tower Hobbies or NitroHouse a try. I have also purchased servo horns from Horizon hobby. Just make sure that they will fit your brand of servo - which you probably already know anyways.

SManMTB

Woah! Lot's of good info here. [sm=thumbup.gif] I will be getting my SP1 soon (hopefully).

Joel (slicks), in my Kanai 3 i've been using the stock Kyosho bearing and they hold up but the metal shield is not enough to keep the dirt out. I actually took all the bearings out and cleaned them out with WD-40 (taking the seal off) and regreased them. They were still OK but I won't do that again. I had to change one of them since it was completely busted and put a few new ones in the front if I remember correctly. The replacement bearings I use now are the Team Associated with plastic seal. They are not as smooth when they are new but after a run or two they loosen up and the seal is much better. No dirt in those bearings yet.

edit:
The aluminium servo arms from OFNA are good (part no ???), they come with inserts for different brand servos.

rc car CRAZY

What about boca green bearings, dere in my kanai 2

ill get it drivin by d end of dis week so ill tellu how gd dey r

http://www.bocabearings.com

Ben

djray77

My Feedback: (6)

What kind of language is this?

rc car CRAZY

Oh blast, sorry. This is the first time I have ever spoken slang in the forum. I was on msn messenger so I got confused[sm=spinnyeyes.gif]

As I was saying, My kyosho kanai 2 has boca green bearings. This weekend I should get the car running, so I can tell you how good they are.

Sorry bout d wierd slang.

Ben

djray77

My Feedback: (6)

lol np.

breakin2

My Feedback: (1)

If you use coupon code 010PA, you get $50 off a purchase over $500. I don't know if you have to be a Super Saver or not, but I just used it.

Mrfranchize02

I replaced my Kyosho bearings with some regular Ofna rubber shields($15 a set of 18). I ran about a gallon though my engine Saturday and there is no gritty grinding sounds coming from my drivetrain when I turn the wheels. Metal shields have no place in offroad racing, they are a little free'er but doesn't seal like the rubber or teflon shields.

nolimit208

My 777 has only 6 races on it and has bearly seen a gallon of gas, and well the metal shielded bearings allow dirt to easily find its way into the bearings, and from using a Aircompressor and nitro cleaning solution it has found its way into most of my drive train bearings, so I'm replacing them with the half shielded bearings besides my center diff bearings I might Keep the regular metal sheilded ones there since they seem to be staying pritty smooth, but will mostlikly replace with the double shielded rubber bearings there.

I'll gain alittle more resistence with the sheilded bearings but Not enough to really show any side effects.

gs-stormracer

nolimit208

Not be be a ass about it but how long did that take u to type?

nolimit208

It took me 2 seconds, I have a word document with all that info on it, its been going around my local area since the race in hemet, My track is very simular to there's. that whole thing is from a different forum some where not sure witch one though I had a guy send me it in a word document.

SKYLINE350GT

It's from the grid.

Mrfranchize02

Guys please help me. I'm going back to the 3 shoe from the Werks and to tell you the truth, I'm excited to go back to the basics. I'm having such a hard time finding the 1.0 clutch springs. Does anyone know if the part number is IFW053 or IFW53? One more question. Will the K-factory hinge pin set for the 7.5 work on the 777? Thanks.