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RE: mods???
The guy asked if it is worth it. I have a stock v-spec and 2 modded. The jp mod is a full on rocket (use's lots of fuel). The RB is Smoother than the stock and a little better on the top. The stock will run with most other $300.00 engine's.
My stock engine has been through 3P/S's, 2 rod's, and a set of bearing's. in 15 gallons. The RB has been through 4 gallons, and is on its second P/S/R. The Jp Is on its third gallon and has good compression. I use the stock one to practice with, and some racing. The RB is good for technical tracks. The Jp is for, got to go real fast racing. When compression gets below 50PSI, I replace P/S and maybe a rod. So are they worth it. Hell yea. I'm pretty sure the increase in performance is directly proportional to decreased life span. Thats why the RG last forever. |
RE: mods???
ORIGINAL: JJJEEEFFFFFF the difference between an rg and a v-spec is time and money and r&d. Its the same difference between the current top of the line engine and the ones from 10 years ago. proof is when one of these guys can make a $100 engine run as good as a topline engine. but i have yet to see one. anyway why you need a mod for? its not like there is only 1 engine available to buy. cheap bashing/beginner engine $100 OS RG Good club racing/intermediate engine Novarossi N21B $150 Top of line Race Engine OS Vspec $220 USD; Or Novarossi P5 $260 or RB C6 $330 JP Mod engine $400 instead of modding, pay the extra $70 and get yourself a better engine |
RE: mods???
so if you where running in an rg only class and modding was allowed you wouldn't consider it?
or you where running club racing only on a technical track and didn't want to spend the money on a v-spec you wouldn't think of running a modded rg? you wouldn't put after market "o" ring in your mugen diffs to stop them leaking, or lighten parts, or run after market parts or un screw your front shock ends a couple of turns for some more droop? is it worth it? depends what your after? i don't think its worth modding a v-spec but some would, it comes down to what your after. is every ferrari on the road stock standard? can you make an rg run like a v-spec, only if you turn it in to a v-spec. Is the v-spec going to be the fastest engine ever created?, no. could o.s. get more out af a v-spec if they new exactly what fuel, temp, air pressure, track, pipe car, each individual one was going to be used on? yes. would it be worth the $2000 an engine it would cost? no. so back on track, you can get more out of an engine by modding it, but its only worth it, if you think it is. |
RE: mods???
ORIGINAL: JJJEEEFFFFFF so if you where running in an rg only class and modding was allowed you wouldn't consider it? if i wanted something faster than an RG and was willing to pay an extra $65 then i would get the Nova N21b If i wanted something faster then the N21B and i could pay an extra $65 i would get a vspec. ORIGINAL: JJJEEEFFFFFF or you where running club racing only on a technical track and didn't want to spend the money on a v-spec you wouldn't think of running a modded rg? ORIGINAL: JJJEEEFFFFFF you wouldn't put after market "o" ring in your mugen diffs to stop them leaking, or lighten parts, or run after market parts or un screw your front shock ends a couple of turns for some more droop? |
RE: mods???
why moddify a mugen prospec, it would be just like modifying an engine.
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RE: mods???
why not? what part of a mugen do you need to mod??
of course there are different setups on a mugen that you can change, shock oils, springs etc. your talking about the o-ring diffs? a $2 "mod" hahaha yeah that you can compare to hacking up an engine. well in that case I mod ALL my engines. I put silicon seal around the carby and also a throttle return elastic band on all my engine. thus that is called modding it?? hahaha and say even if for some unknown reason you still think a P5 or Vspec can go "better". there are alot of things you should try before you go hacking away at it. Like clutch settings, clutch shoes, pipe, manifold, waller lengths, plugs, fuels, not to mention actually getting an optimal level with the needles. :eek: |
RE: mods???
ORIGINAL: JJJEEEFFFFFF so if you where running in an rg only class and modding was allowed you wouldn't consider it? or you where running club racing only on a technical track and didn't want to spend the money on a v-spec you wouldn't think of running a modded rg? you wouldn't put after market "o" ring in your mugen diffs to stop them leaking, or lighten parts, or run after market parts or un screw your front shock ends a couple of turns for some more droop? is it worth it? depends what your after? i don't think its worth modding a v-spec but some would, it comes down to what your after. is every ferrari on the road stock standard? can you make an rg run like a v-spec, only if you turn it in to a v-spec. Is the v-spec going to be the fastest engine ever created?, no. could o.s. get more out af a v-spec if they new exactly what fuel, temp, air pressure, track, pipe car, each individual one was going to be used on? yes. would it be worth the $2000 an engine it would cost? no. so back on track, you can get more out of an engine by modding it, but its only worth it, if you think it is. |
RE: mods???
wow you guys are on it.. kinda see were this is going but keep going i like it
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RE: mods???
ORIGINAL: Hincappe and say even if for some unknown reason you still think a P5 or Vspec can go "better". there are alot of things you should try before you go hacking away at it. Like clutch settings, clutch shoes, pipe, manifold, waller lengths, plugs, fuels, not to mention actually getting an optimal level with the needles. :eek: i would rank most of those steps in order of value for money, so after that if your still wanting more whats next. i'll talk just about straight line acelleration as the list could be endless. get the power down better: this could be as simple as $2 o rings, so your diffs don't leak, or tires, diff oils, suspension settings. (most of these comprimise something else, like steering. lighten the buggy: mill out the part, use exotic metals, use lighter rims and tires. some improvements can be made here you run the risk of weakening parts too much and some parts can be expensive, a buckle rim won't help at all either. reduce friction: get all your meshing perfect, run expensive bearing everywhere. whats a full set of cermic bearings worth? get more out of the engine: differnt engines, fresh engines, lean it out some more, put a bigger cooling head on it and keep leaning, get it modified. the downsides to the first four are obvious, with modifying you run the risk of going to one of the backyard hacks the hincappe has been to, not getting what you wanted, it cost money, engine might not last as long, it could use more fuel. or you could get what your after, the little bit extra or in my case an engine that runs like a v-spec that may or may not cost less in the long run? I'ld rank $60 for an engine mod above alot of the weight reduction and friction reducing options. |
RE: mods???
ORIGINAL: babagnush wow you guys are on it.. kinda see were this is going but keep going i like it |
RE: mods???
what ive noticed about modded engines is fuel economy .....jeffffffff is right in the aspect that it is all about efficiancy.....modding doesent really give you more power it gives you usable power and efficiency.......as far as the best engine modder around that would have to be either jp or jim hottinger of hot mods
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RE: mods???
the ONLY modded engine I would get is one from JP. Which is more than just sleeve and crank works. Usually comes with hardened Crank, Crankcase, better bearings. Thats making the engine more reliable and longer lasting.
ANY race spec engine from OS, novarossi, rb, JP, picco, cmb, ops etc etc etc can win you races without ANY mods. what type of engine you have is usually the last factor in whether you win or not. so long as it is tune properly and is fresh and doesnt flame out. having said that the best engine that feels fast yet is also easy to drive has to be the Vspec. Its a perfect engine as it is. |
RE: mods???
ORIGINAL: Hincappe ANY race spec engine from OS, novarossi, rb, JP, picco, cmb, ops etc etc etc can win you races without ANY mods. what type of engine you have is usually the last factor in whether you win or not. so long as it is tune properly and is fresh and doesnt flame out. having said that the best engine that feels fast yet is also easy to drive has to be the Vspec. Its a perfect engine as it is. |
RE: mods???
thanx folks, i love the discussion, that's what we need to see more on this sight, good bad , idea's are the best reading... peace..
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RE: mods???
ORIGINAL: JJJEEEFFFFFF ORIGINAL: Hincappe ANY race spec engine from OS, novarossi, rb, JP, picco, cmb, ops etc etc etc can win you races without ANY mods. what type of engine you have is usually the last factor in whether you win or not. so long as it is tune properly and is fresh and doesnt flame out. having said that the best engine that feels fast yet is also easy to drive has to be the Vspec. Its a perfect engine as it is. better still, he should apply for a job at OS, or even still why dont he start his own engine manufacturing company haha. |
RE: mods???
I just don't understand you sometimes, there is no such thing as a perfect motor, otherwise everyone would run it an OS would fire its entire r&d department 'cause there would be nothing left to do.
Go buy your self a ferrari and be happy that they will never release another model. |
RE: mods???
you can play on words all you like, you know what i mean by "perfect"
comparitively to any other top of line engine the OS vspec rates Powerband: 10/10 Fuel Economy 10/10 Price 10/10 Durability 9/10 for me there is no better engine for the price (even if i had more to spend) so for me its a perfect engine. |
RE: mods???
it can be improved and i hope it is, that goes for all of them. And it is still my choice of engine, but i wouldn't be trying a something else if I thought it was perfect. [8D]
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RE: mods???
ORIGINAL: JJJEEEFFFFFF it can be improved and i hope it is, that goes for all of them. And it is still my choice of engine, but i wouldn't be trying a something else if I thought it was perfect. [8D] so now since you got a "GO massive this is better than the OS vspec in every aspect Engine" I will be expecting to see your name winning the Outback National CHamps soon then LOL :D:D:D:D p.s i still dont see them pics of the internals yet... too scared? ;):D[8D]:) |
RE: mods???
no i wont be there probably for the same reason you won't be there, i also never said i was any good.
forgot all about photos of the internals, i can't think of any reason i'ld be too scared, can you? I'm actually currently in the process of moving houses, and most of my stuff is packed, including my computers, and digital camera, the buggy is in my car though. what are you going to do with the photos get your dremel out and see if you can copy it? [8D] Just a question for you, not bating you or anything, just for my benifit, how many v-spec have you had, and do you replace the rear bearings? if so from new or after how many gallons approx (liters if you do that?). This is really a serious question, nothing intended by it. |
RE: mods???
ORIGINAL: JJJEEEFFFFFF no i wont be there probably for the same reason you won't be there, i also never said i was any good. forgot all about photos of the internals, i can't think of any reason i'ld be too scared, can you? I'm actually currently in the process of moving houses, and most of my stuff is packed, including my computers, and digital camera, the buggy is in my car though. what are you going to do with the photos get your dremel out and see if you can copy it? [8D] Just a question for you, not bating you or anything, just for my benifit, how many v-spec have you had, and do you replace the rear bearings? if so from new or after how many gallons approx (liters if you do that?). This is really a serious question, nothing intended by it. i have had 2 vspecs. and never changed bearings. one 1 have only 2 major race meets. this one i keep for major meets only. so i can have a fresh as possible engine for major meets. the other 1 i have over years clube racing. still runs great. dont know how many gallons i dont count. but say 2litres x 10 races = prob around 20litres (conservative figure) i have other engines that i used aswell. (sts, rb, novarossi,picco,jp) i just love engines. and like i said whatever engine i used my lap times are no better or worse. engine choice relates to about 1% of what your lap times say. the rest is setup, driving, tuning, tire choice. |
RE: mods???
i like other people have had rear bearing failures early on do you have the batch numbers out of curioustity, just to see how old mine are in comparison to see if mine are the earlier ones. I would think my second one would be the new batch if there really was two batches (with the first having the 'bad bearings') as it was bought in january this year. but the rear bearing went after only 8-10 litres. This is honestley the only reason i sort something else. That and the price of replacing the bearings, the last one cost me $85 australian 25% of the price of a new engine plus $65 (20%) for the conrod, yes it would have been cheaper to get it from the US but i couldn't wait for it.
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RE: mods???
where is the batch number located? box says 13890. which is that? i never read too much into the bad bearing stories. I look after my engines REAALLLY well.
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RE: mods???
I also didn't read anything into it until the second one went, i did every thing right with it, it was never more then an hour from being tuned right, and the internal were spotless. I put the first bearing in the first motor down to running lean a couple of time due to a fuel lid that didn't close properly, but there was nothing for the second one.
i'll post the photos of the go-tech when i can if you haven't seen them in the next week or two remind me, if the engine fails early or has another fault worth mentioning i'll mention it. if it last for ever and keeps going strong and stay at a good price, ill stick with it for a bit. With the v-specs for me it still works out cheaper to buy one and put in an after market bearing then to buy an rb or a novarossi, but i don't like that there is a question about the stock one and the inconveniance of replacing it. v-specs are still the best (in my opinion and through my experience) motor out there in most situations. i still stick by my comments on my go-tech, I did also revise the beats it in every aspect comment. |
RE: mods???
ORIGINAL: Hincappe you can play on words all you like, you know what i mean by "perfect" comparitively to any other top of line engine the OS vspec rates Powerband: 10/10 Fuel Economy 10/10 Price 10/10 Durability 9/10 i dis agree........although i do run v specs on certain race tracks it is not a longevity motor.....fuel economy is good power is awsome but the life is short.....the v spec doesent last long because of the power and fuel economy it has....basicaly v specs run lean even at low temps which in turn shortens the life dramatically ......ive never seen a standard v spec go more than about 5 gallons.......ive owned about 6 of them and i dont mind the short life span because im happy with the performance and i have no problem financialy replaceing the motor when needed.....on the other hand i have had modded novarossi motors with as much as 15 gallons of fuel through them without ever replacing a piston and sleeve or bearings or con rods.....simply put novarossi's are constructed of better materials to begin with and design allows for proper lubrication while running.....dontget me wrong i love the v spec i more often than not choose one for a big race over the nova's due to its smooth power band and tunning ease......i also have been running a jp modded v spec this year and have about 7 gallons on it now and it is ready for a piston and sleave....this is the only motor ive ever had that actually is faster than the stock version ....about 5000 more rpm on top than the standard v spec...... dont let your v spec feelings be hurt..... for me there is no better engine for the price (even if i had more to spend) so for me its a perfect engine. |
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