Go Back  RCU Forums > RC Cars, Buggies, Trucks, Tanks and more > RC Car Engines
Reload this Page >

Brand new engine broke in 2 days

Notices
RC Car Engines Talk about rc car nitro engines and gas engines

Brand new engine broke in 2 days

Old 04-13-2020, 05:46 AM
  #1  
VicenteChimenes
Junior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Posts: 8
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Question Brand new engine broke in 2 days

I got a new FTX Torro .18 engine 2 days ago and only used 7 tanks of fuel and the engine has already broken.
Today the exhaust manifold dropped loose from the engine. It's attached to the engine by 2 screws and they popped out entirely but didn't brake.
I followed all the instructions on the manual and I spent around 2 tanks of fuel breaking in the engine(the first on with the engine idling).
Do you think I did something wrong or is it some factory problem and I should return it and ask for my money back?

Old 04-13-2020, 05:52 AM
  #2  
J330
My Feedback: (2)
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Grant - Valkaria FL
Posts: 431
Received 8 Likes on 8 Posts
Default

This is the cheapest branded Nitro fuel powered trophy truck you could find on the market. One tank at idle is all these really need for break in. It's ABC. Loose bolts can be attached again, happens from vibration, even in my airplane aspect of this glow engine hobby, it's something you check on periodically and tighten. What exactly has broken internally on this engine besides loose bolts on the exhaust? Simply put those exhaust bolts back in, tighten them and you're back in business. That's not breaking. If the engine internally isn't turning over anymore, then you have problems. You should see a smoke vapor running out of this engine from the exhaust. RC trucks require maintenance. The entire truck including the exhaust bolts, are to be checked over after a run. Suspension components also can come loose. Some would suggest attaching those exhaust bolts again using thread locker, one way of making maintenance less of a problem, but servicing that engine one day, harder to do.


Last edited by J330; 04-13-2020 at 05:56 AM. Reason: grammar
Old 04-13-2020, 06:27 AM
  #3  
VicenteChimenes
Junior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Posts: 8
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by J330 View Post
This is the cheapest branded Nitro fuel powered trophy truck you could find on the market. One tank at idle is all these really need for break in. It's ABC. Loose bolts can be attached again, happens from vibration, even in my airplane aspect of this glow engine hobby, it's something you check on periodically and tighten. What exactly has broken internally on this engine besides loose bolts on the exhaust? Simply put those exhaust bolts back in, tighten them and you're back in business. That's not breaking. If the engine internally isn't turning over anymore, then you have problems. You should see a smoke vapor running out of this engine from the exhaust. RC trucks require maintenance. The entire truck including the exhaust bolts, are to be checked over after a run. Suspension components also can come loose. Some would suggest attaching those exhaust bolts again using thread locker, one way of making maintenance less of a problem, but servicing that engine one day, harder to do.
​​​
Thanks for the reply. Just like you said, some suspension parts have also come loose and the exhaust tip seems to have melted a little bit because it's made out of plastic. I've been able to find one of the bolts from the exhaust but I couldn't find the other one, I will have to buy another set of bolts. Nothing else seems to be broken, it's just the loose bolts on the exhaust. I tried to upload a picture but apparently I need to have a certain amount of posts before I can upload a picture here. I'm just impressed with the fragility of this RC car, I only used it for 2 days and I already have to fix some parts of it. Could the untightened bolts on the exhaust/suspension be a manufacturing problem and I should return it or should I just buy spare parts and fix this car? Being honest, I would really prefer my money back, do you think it's possible?

Last edited by VicenteChimenes; 04-13-2020 at 06:39 AM.
Old 04-13-2020, 09:27 AM
  #4  
D3MON
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: Western MT
Posts: 162
Received 14 Likes on 13 Posts
Default

it is recommended by every manufacturer to inspect screws and bolts and confirm they are tight before operation of the vehicle, especially metal to metal ones. once you get familiar with the truck you will figure out the ones that tend to loosen.
t is not a manufacturing problem, just maintenance of the hobby. you may be able to email them and they may send you new screws. (if not M3 x 30mm screws are what you need, can get a hardware store).
i do not recommend one tank break in, heat cycle method? sure, but not just one and done, you engine will not last long. as long as they are taken care of they will last awhile.
Old 04-13-2020, 07:49 PM
  #5  
J330
My Feedback: (2)
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Grant - Valkaria FL
Posts: 431
Received 8 Likes on 8 Posts
Default

It sounds like you're not happy with the nature of nitro and perhaps would be happier with a brushless electric truck instead, then you deal with a trade off of other issues and a different learning curve. It's a hobby, so you deal with tinkering a bit. Not sure the vendor/hobby shop takes back used nitro trucks, especially when you describe this "normal" hobby issue to them? You may get the same response you got here.
As far as nitro truck/car engines, if 3-4-5 small tank break in steps are needed, so be it. Break in is longer. I just went with the video suggestion. My guess, the engine will outlast the rest of the truck regardless of how you break it in. From what I read searching google for answers on your nitro truck engine lifespan, it's 8-10 gallons average. That is a sad lifespan. I'm a glow airplane user for 44 years. Results for this segment is different.

All the best with your decision.
Old 04-14-2020, 12:02 AM
  #6  
VicenteChimenes
Junior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Posts: 8
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by J330 View Post
It sounds like you're not happy with the nature of nitro and perhaps would be happier with a brushless electric truck instead, then you deal with a trade off of other issues and a different learning curve. It's a hobby, so you deal with tinkering a bit. Not sure the vendor/hobby shop takes back used nitro trucks, especially when you describe this "normal" hobby issue to them? You may get the same response you got here.
As far as nitro truck/car engines, if 3-4-5 small tank break in steps are needed, so be it. Break in is longer. I just went with the video suggestion. My guess, the engine will outlast the rest of the truck regardless of how you break it in. From what I read searching google for answers on your nitro truck engine lifespan, it's 8-10 gallons average. That is a sad lifespan. I'm a glow airplane user for 44 years. Results for this segment is different.

All the best with your decision.
Thanks for all the help. I've decided I'll keep it and just fix the exhaust problem.
The following users liked this post:
D3MON (04-14-2020)
Old 04-14-2020, 07:29 AM
  #7  
D3MON
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: Western MT
Posts: 162
Received 14 Likes on 13 Posts
Default

if you have more questions/concerns definitely post and ask we are all here to help, while that is one of the "lower end" models, it is also a cheaper one if something goes wrong and cheap to repair comparatively.
also being it isnt a "race quality" engine, if you burn it out, the engines can be had for quite cheap, i do recommend getting a true SH .18 if you ever do need to get a new one.
ive honestly been quite curious about that model, it definitely looks to have some weak areas, but at 200-230$ for an RTR 4wd nitro, there is going to be something.
for your next vehicle though i am going to highly recommend getting a more "name brand" kit, like the Losi 8ight (T), Kyosho nitro tracker, or even buy used and rebuild.(helps to learn the vehicle before you ever break it lol.)
you will still want to regularly go over the trucks and inspect screws and components, but that is more or less maintenance across the board, Nitro and electric.
Old 04-16-2020, 06:51 AM
  #8  
1QwkSport2.5r
 
1QwkSport2.5r's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Cottage Grove, MN
Posts: 9,942
Received 15 Likes on 15 Posts
Default

Never idle for break-in. Regardless of what the manual says - which is rarely if ever written by the designers or engineers of the engine, they often instruct to do stupid things like run stupid rich, never adjust the needles, drive slow or idle for a tank or more... These regimens are NOT good for an ABC engine. Run it warm with adequate lubrication, and run it at the rpm it will see in service. This means don’t baby it. Cheap engine or expensive engine.

Always re-tighten screws when the engine is warmed up. DO NOT use exhaust manifold gaskets if it had one to start with (on side exhaust engines). Rear exhaust engines usually use a silicone o-ring or silicone manifold seal.
Old 04-24-2020, 08:55 AM
  #9  
D3MON
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: Western MT
Posts: 162
Received 14 Likes on 13 Posts
Default

personally i think the Adam Drake method is the best. main thing is to make sure to keep the engine above 230F while running for break in.
you are saying to NOT use exhaust gasket between block and manifold? i am curious the reason you recommend this.
Old 04-25-2020, 09:19 PM
  #10  
1QwkSport2.5r
 
1QwkSport2.5r's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Cottage Grove, MN
Posts: 9,942
Received 15 Likes on 15 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by D3MON View Post
personally i think the Adam Drake method is the best. main thing is to make sure to keep the engine above 230F while running for break in.
you are saying to NOT use exhaust gasket between block and manifold? i am curious the reason you recommend this.
Adam Drake is all about EBIS now which is far and away the biggest batch of snake oil that has taken the racing scene by storm. It’s a bunch of hullabaloo. The proper way to break in an engine is to start it rich, lean it in to build some heat, and run it. Period. This is what the metallurgy dictates. This is most notably true for ringed engines and ferrous iron/steel constructions. Those engines WILL NEVER break-in if they aren’t actually being run.

As for exhaust gaskets - side exhaust engines that get supplied with a paper gasket should omit the paper gasket and instead use RTV sealant (if anything at all!!) because of a few reasons. One, paper compresses. During the heating and cooling cycles, the paper gets compressed and uncompressed a bunch. What happens is after enough cycles, the screws will loosen. Engines (and mufflers) that have a lot of time on them typically don’t have as much of this happening, but it’s common knowledge/practice to throw the paper gasket away and use either a brass gasket or RTV. The latter being the easiest. Two, even under normal circumstances, you will find yourself needing to tighten the exhaust screws often. It’s best to torque the screws with the engine warm. Three - RTV is so much easier and quicker than cutting new gaskets.

Last edited by 1QwkSport2.5r; 04-25-2020 at 09:21 PM.
Old 04-28-2020, 01:52 PM
  #11  
D3MON
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: Western MT
Posts: 162
Received 14 Likes on 13 Posts
Default

Adam drake method does run the engine very rich, for 4 full tanks, just with an engine pre-heated, and then running 1/4, 1/2, and 3/4 throttle tanks afterwards all the while being quite rich.
i still take it easy after that until i can tell its fully broken in. and typically i do an extra tank at 1/4 throttle after i lean the engine 1/8 turn, then the same for 1/2 and 3/4. kind of a mix of the Associated method, and Adam drake method.

engines with rings will not have that same kind of mechanical wear, as the rings themselves will compress or expand as needed to keep a seal, and doesnt compress the piston while doing so.

i understand what you mean about the break in, but also thinking about wearing it in. as the piston and sleeve is cold(er) the pinch is tighter, so running for 3 tanks of fuel with the sleeve at its tightest compression gives the most mechanical wear. then as it warms up after those tanks of running really rich and you start leaning it in some. you have already had all that mechanical premature wear on the inside of the sleeve, that if warmed up first wouldnt be wearing. which being warmed up also reduces the stress on the connecting rod as it doesnt have to force itself through as tight of a pinch because everything is expanded.

ive been in the hobby for a decent while, and have never known it to be common practice to not use a gasket for the exhaust. i know the first time they heat up and expand it typically loosens the screws, so i always prepare to tighten them up, during first few tanks and have not had an issue since.

guess we each have our own ways of doing stuff. the most important things are to let cool between tanks, and to set your piston at BDC.

Old 05-06-2020, 06:32 PM
  #12  
J330
My Feedback: (2)
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Grant - Valkaria FL
Posts: 431
Received 8 Likes on 8 Posts
Default

It's interesting to read the contrast in break in of a ABC engine simply because it's in a car and not an airplane. To put it in concise terms, this site describes it perfectly - http://www.mecoa.com/faq/breakin/breakin_abc.htm
I've had literally hundreds of engines that I've broke in over 44 years of being in the airplane hobby and I never considered running any of them "very rich" for break in when they're ABC engines or I'd have ruined them if I did. I don't know anything about your nitro car hobby, but I'd think the engine works similarly, where heat expands the liner/cylinder at operating temperature, and that only happens when it's running at a mixture that you would normally set it at for every day use. Getting a temp gage on the engine and seeing what temperature it's at during break in to me is crucial since we have that handheld technology at affordable prices. I've experimented many ways over the decades with ABC engines and avoiding a very rich break in always gave me the best results.

I wonder if you'd discover a longer lasting more powerful result, or catastrophe, or absolutely no measurable difference. I'm curious what the results would be without conjecture. ABC is ABC in my mind. Marine engines, automobile engines, ship engines, even lawn mowers all break in at operating temperature and at normal mixture. It's interesting to find the one exception to the rule, and I wonder what happens when you ignore the rule and break it in, but avoid overheating the engine?
Old 05-07-2020, 08:01 AM
  #13  
D3MON
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: Western MT
Posts: 162
Received 14 Likes on 13 Posts
Default

though airplane engines are similar do have to keep in mind they are designed with a different oil/fuel ratio, as well as the castrol to synthetic ratio as well, as they run a very different RPM range then land vehicles. (primarily WOT or close to, where land engines run lower, and not long periods of WOT comparatively.
many have had good luck with the older way of just running it rich and cold letting it idle through the tanks, but seems that even better results nowadays being able to pre-heat the engine to operating temperatures while still running rich, so the piston and liner is still expanding to where it needs to be, but still rich so there is enough oil to lubricate everything as much as possible.
would really like to see a true test of side by side either way, but there are too many variables to really be able to do so i think, between breakages of the car itself, inconsistency in tunes compared to each other, fuel inconsistency batch to batch, etc. and overall duration to get to the end result.

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.