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RC Electric Off-Road Trucks, Buggies, Truggies and more Discuss electric RC off-road, buggies & trucks here. Also discuss brushless motors, speed controllers aka ESC's, brushed motors, etc

best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.

Old 08-30-2011, 01:51 PM
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NjBasher
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Default best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.

this thread is for the bashers who have a cheap budget. i havent upgraded to brushless and dont plan to until i have more money. im looking for a great motor for my pede. what in your opinion is the best and cheapest brushed motor? there are no limits on the turn of the motor and the manufacturer. usually i have stock motors in my truck but im tired of the slow 20mph speeds. i want my truck to haul some ass =p. the only other motor ive had was the venom fireball. and we all know that its a hit and a miss. so what are some other good options
Old 08-30-2011, 01:56 PM
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.

What is brushed? Oh yea, that's those fossil's you see lying around.



Lol man, seriously once you get a brushless kit you will never look back. Back in the the day, I used to like a 19T Reedy or Chameleon motor in my pede. 7-cells made it even more fun until I finally got a Novak SS5800 to put in it. Man, that was years ago
Old 08-30-2011, 02:02 PM
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.

its true- not knocking a guy on a budget, im one myself. but if youre looking for performance, get away from brushed. the mags have no holding power and the wire cant flow many amps, so even running a "hot" brushed motor you'll still be paces behind the BL. case in point, i had a 15T mod motor that i ran 12t pinion on and it would come off the track @140, tossed in the VXL and i was able to gear up to 19T and only run 115.

hobbyking is your friend. 39.99 for 100A speed control, $29 for a 2200kv 550. (grab em before the new neo mag pices drive them up)

save till you have the cash.
Old 08-30-2011, 02:06 PM
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.

Kinda agree for a offroad vehicle you are limited in choices seeing the larger tires put a quite a bit of extra stress on the motor.
any decent brushed motor will probably cost close to the price of a budget brushless setup that will blow it away in performance, and life.
Brushed IMO only still reigns supreme in crawlers due to BL generally being too damn fast, and loswer KV motors are more susceptible to cogging(when ran on 2S they seem fine on 3 but kills the point to a low KV motor) from what I've seen
Old 08-30-2011, 02:38 PM
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.

do they sell brushless in water tight setups? if they do someone show me a decent set up?
Old 08-30-2011, 02:45 PM
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.

why mess with a $30 brushed motor when you can get an ezrun 35amp brushless system for $50-$60.
Not high amperage, but better power than any brushed setup and fine for 2wd RC's
Old 08-30-2011, 03:12 PM
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.

It's hilarious that some of you guys are so anti-brushed because of power.

ThunderbirdJunkie's 14x2 in his B4.1 FT hung just fine with the big dog 7.5s down the straights on a 2S lipo and an ancient Novak Cyclone speedo. A racing buddy still runs 13t brushed motors with NiMhs and runs up front.
Old 08-30-2011, 05:04 PM
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.


ORIGINAL: ThunderbirdJunkie

It's hilarious that some of you guys are so anti-brushed because of power.

ThunderbirdJunkie's 14x2 in his B4.1 FT hung just fine with the big dog 7.5s down the straights on a 2S lipo and an ancient Novak Cyclone speedo. A racing buddy still runs 13t brushed motors with NiMhs and runs up front.
nah just in a pede that he wants to go fast, and isn't happy with the stock motors speeds.
For a brushed motor that can take the punishment it would cost about the same as a BL setup seeing to go lower in turns I believe he would also need a new ESC to handle the lower turned motor(isn't a XL-5 15t 540, 12t 550 limit).
If it was a buggy or something then yea he could get a lower turned brushed motor, and it would be fine.
Old 08-30-2011, 05:06 PM
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indy34096
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.

How about a S600? It's a 550 can 19t. Should have plenty of torque to run cool.
Old 08-30-2011, 05:08 PM
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.


ORIGINAL: SyCo_VeNoM


ORIGINAL: ThunderbirdJunkie

It's hilarious that some of you guys are so anti-brushed because of power.

ThunderbirdJunkie's 14x2 in his B4.1 FT hung just fine with the big dog 7.5s down the straights on a 2S lipo and an ancient Novak Cyclone speedo. A racing buddy still runs 13t brushed motors with NiMhs and runs up front.
nah just in a pede that he wants to go fast, and isn't happy with the stock motors speeds.
For a brushed motor that can take the punishment it would cost about the same as a BL setup seeing to go lower in turns I believe he would also need a new ESC to handle the lower turned motor(isn't a XL-5 15t 540, 12t 550 limit).
If it was a buggy or something then yea he could get a lower turned brushed motor, and it would be fine.
You're 100% right about a good brushed motor being expensive.

But the reasoning cited by some people is just out there.

An EZrun 60a/3200kv Tacon with 26/83 gearing should make that pede a rocketship though.
Old 08-30-2011, 05:25 PM
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.


ORIGINAL: ThunderbirdJunkie
But the reasoning cited by some people is just out there.
explain?
Old 08-30-2011, 05:41 PM
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.

No turn limit on the ESC? The lowest you really want to go in a Pede offroad is 14t, and even then you are short on gearing and high on maintenance. I'd go for a nice 17t Reedy Radon or Quad Mag. A Speedgems Pro Titanite 15tx2 if you can get your hands on one. LRP GT3's are nice too, I run 2 of their 17t's in my old school 4x4 Pede and it hauls. Ceramic capacitors are your friend if you are experiencing interference.

Brushed can put out power newbies. Some serious power if you want it to. There used to be a day when everyone did more than just drive their RTRs around and people actually spent time working on and tuning their rigs. Back in those days we got technical questions that required thought to even come up with. Now we get questions like "which of these parts are broken?" I dont see anyone making custom modifications anymore. Back in the day we'd go nuts with the dremel on a regular basis and we called it "janging" or "jangification." Google it. Upgrade parts are non-existant or too expensive? We made them ourselves. Not too often you see a post about someone making a skidplate for their RC out of a random piece of aluminum plate is it?

You guys are missing out on a lot of knowledge and experience. I spent 4 hours tuning my 55t crawler motor. I'm talking cutting and truing the comm, aligning the brush hoods, swapping brushes and springs, centering the armature in the magnetic field, breaking it in submerged in water, etc. How many of you know what half those things are?
Old 08-30-2011, 06:16 PM
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.


ORIGINAL: hands without shadows

No turn limit on the ESC? The lowest you really want to go in a Pede offroad is 14t, and even then you are short on gearing and high on maintenance. I'd go for a nice 17t Reedy Radon or Quad Mag. A Speedgems Pro Titanite 15tx2 if you can get your hands on one. LRP GT3's are nice too, I run 2 of their 17t's in my old school 4x4 Pede and it hauls. Ceramic capacitors are your friend if you are experiencing interference.

Brushed can put out power newbies. Some serious power if you want it to. There used to be a day when everyone did more than just drive their RTRs around and people actually spent time working on and tuning their rigs. Back in those days we got technical questions that required thought to even come up with. Now we get questions like ''which of these parts are broken?'' I dont see anyone making custom modifications anymore. Back in the day we'd go nuts with the dremel on a regular basis and we called it ''janging'' or ''jangification.'' Google it. Upgrade parts are non-existant or too expensive? We made them ourselves. Not too often you see a post about someone making a skidplate for their RC out of a random piece of aluminum plate is it?

You guys are missing out on a lot of knowledge and experience. I spent 4 hours tuning my 55t crawler motor. I'm talking cutting and truing the comm, aligning the brush hoods, swapping brushes and springs, centering the armature in the magnetic field, breaking it in submerged in water, etc. How many of you know what half those things are?
It probably wasn't your intent, but you certainly came off as an "I am from the old school therefore you know nothing" elitist. ThunderbirdJunkie no longer has any desire to align brush hoods, cut comms, or experiment with brush spring tensions. That's the whole reason he went whole-hog nitro back in the day. Is it fun to find power? Sure. It's not fun, however, NEEDING to do that stuff. TBH, ThunderbirdJunkie got to the point where instead of running a Trinity D2 10t that cost $90 and maintain it, he'd just buy a Trinity Speed Gems motor and run it until it quit, buy another one, and repeat. $25 motors? Hell yeah. They still ran with the big dogs, and he didn't feel bad about throwing it in the parts box in case he needed to pillage it later to get something else running, or a buddy needed an armature to rewind that had a good comm on it that just needed a cut. Sometimes he'd just rotate his motors and give them to a buddy and have him play with it and $15 later he'd have a new motor.

However...this is 2011, not 1997. We have brushless, and if we can afford it, we might as well use it, and there is absolutely nothing wrong with being a little lazy. After all, it's a TOY CAR. Something to do in your spare time. Back in the day, racing stock 2wd buggy could be a nearly full time job. F that. ThunderbirdJunkie is more than OK with throwing his trucks in the closet dirty, pulling them out on Thursday to give em a once over, and throw them on the track on Friday with last week's dirt still on them. If you want to make your hobby a full time job, that's fine. ThunderbirdJunkie already has one; he doesn't need another.

And you're not from the old school if "janging" is a verb in your vocabulary, so stop pretending. Sorry, dude. It's called modifying stuff. Nothing more.
Old 08-30-2011, 06:34 PM
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.

I'm not an elitest or think I am from the old school. I haven't been in the hobby that long. I was merely pointing out that brushed can do the job.

And ranting about the lack of people working on their car and doing something in the hobby other than driving. You have to admit the quality of threads goes gradually downhill as time goes on and knowledge of how to do things is forgotten and not replaced. I have just as much fun working on my cars as I do driving. I wish more people shared my interests like they used to.
Old 08-30-2011, 07:10 PM
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.

hands is from the crawling scene, and they usually come off as elitist. well.... maybe a bit more than usually. i'm all for brushed, (and yes, i used to break mine in underwater too, there hasnt been that much of a gap) but id really like to see these awesome brushed motors perform against BL.

better yet- find me a brushed that will produce 700 watts and be roar legal.
Old 08-30-2011, 07:12 PM
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.

You're right, in general, to those of us more advanced it does seem that way.

However, what may be a stupid question to us, replacing a caster block on a Bandit with a bent hinge pin can be a daunting task to some people. Not everybody has the ability, or even want, to devote 20-30 hours a week to RC stuff. It's simply not practical, and to expect such is simply ridiculous.
Old 08-31-2011, 02:03 AM
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.

High polished brass bushings(with super lube) or metal shielded bearings ..... J/k lol
Old 08-31-2011, 08:38 AM
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.

each to their own.there are guys that love old cars and think the world of them so if someone is still using a brushed motor dont knock it.I didnt know brushed motors were still being made.
Old 08-31-2011, 09:18 AM
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.


ORIGINAL: cloudancer03

each to their own.there are guys that love old cars and think the world of them so if someone is still using a brushed motor dont knock it.I didnt know brushed motors were still being made.
most of the high end ones aren't
note how hands said "if you can get your hands on one."
Old 08-31-2011, 05:55 PM
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.

Dont mean to offend anyone, but brushed motors are horrible, ive smoked 5 of them in the early days, why would u want to go brushedd??? whats the resoning behind it?
Ive never seen any brushed r/c car that could keep up with a brushless or a nitro car.

Here a few points that make brusless better
brushless RC motor the windings are mounted stationary, meaning less rotating mass
Commutation is done electronically rather than mechanically
Less radio noise generated to interfere with the remote control
No loss of commutation due to brushes flying over the commutator
No loss of effectiveness due to resistance of the brushes
Lowering resistance because more wire and thicker wire can be fit in the "can"

Because of these advantages the brushless RC motor have the capability to spin faster. To operate at higher currents, to produce more power, with no loss in performance.

What does this all mean, For the power produced a brushless motor is more efficent.

hands without shadows why u spent 4 hours stuffing around with ur motor & what gained maby a extra 10% in preformnce
while u were doing that i fitted a 2200kv motor with a HPI GRU into my crawler all under 7min. I would even go as far as i bet my motor has way more torque down low, more useable power, higher rpm, & would last longer on the same battery than ur brushed motor. on ur brushed motor can u adjust the innital brake force & brake drag. or running mode (just forward & backward with auto brakes for down hill runs)

$10 says ur new motor cant do a 15deg down hill run, make a dead stop 1/2 way then reverse back to the top without it slipping forwad even the slightest
this is my car testing out the down hill brakes, keep in mind this is a tamiya buggy with MT wheels
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jI6veCm8Qhg[/youtube]
Old 09-01-2011, 02:14 PM
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.

An ez run 60a and tacon 3200kv will destroy most brushed setups like TBJ said. Everyone thinks that they will never go BL but like me, they are wrong. The reason why im selling my evader is because i made the mistake of going with brushed and i dont want to spend anymore.
Old 09-01-2011, 04:11 PM
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.

Less radio noise generated to interfere with the remote control
While I am completely in favor of brushless, the statement above is not true all the time. After going brushless I was plagued by interference with my am radios. once I switched to 2.4 it was fine, but that adds to the cost. but not everyone gets the interference.
Old 09-01-2011, 04:45 PM
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.

ORIGINAL: hands without shadows

I'm not an elitest or think I am from the old school. I wish more people shared my interests like they used to.
Amen! I'm not an old geyser yet, but everyday I'm a little closer. Brushed motors can generate good power. In 1998-99 I had an Associated Team TC3 running a no turn limit ESC, and various ultra hot wind motors, 3-5 turn type setups, mainly for "bashing" and top speed fun, not much racing (hate the politics). Running Ni-Mh "matched" packs (remember that term?) LOL, the car was in the mid 70's pretty easy with a pretty hack setup otherwise as far as suspension, weight distro, and aerodynamics. The thing that was the absolute WORST about these setups, was running 2,3 maybe 4 packs through if you really pushed it, and then full motor tear down time. Those super soft silver brushes (not cheap)- toast after 15 mins. I had my own Hudy lathe and did my own motors but it was a REAL downer!!! I don't miss that one bit. OK , that was quite a worthless rant.

The 19T Chameleon was a favorite motor of mine as well back in the day, I actually had 3 cans and mayby 4 armatures for them. Great balance of torque/power and not picky about gearing. Good overall motor "life" too. The P2K was also a great stock motor, they last and last and last. I remember I had a "cheater" P2K that I popped the bushings out of and put bearings into, LOL I had every turn motor from stock spec 27's, down to 3T. Realistically, anything below 12T brushed would not be worth it, unless you have your own lathe (or a buddy with one), and a cheap source/endless supply of brushes. Motors like that simply require ALOT of maintainance, no matter who they are made by/ or where they are from. On hobby king you can buy a 40 amp car brushless ESC ($25), and a 2700kv motor that matches it for about ($30). Running it on 2S 7.4 packs in a light 4wd buggy I get 40mph and 15+ minutes run time easy, maybe 135 degree motor temp when done. Our ambient temp is unusually high, mid 90's so I imagine that setup has more in it once it cools down some. But this assumes you have li-po batteries and a charger for them.

Nothing at all wrong with running a cheap brushed can setup. I'm fortunate enough to have a dozen planes, 4 helis, and 6 or so 1/4 gas boats all with full mod or Quickdraw engines. I'm just getting back into cars again after a LONG break. Competitive racing just burned me out and ruined all the fun for me. I forgot how much fun cars are. All the brushed equipment people are getting rid of you can get some nice stuff on ebay/Craig's list, ect for next to nothing. If you are just bashing around with a couple buddies over a beer or two, who friggin cares what kind of setup you got? The elite"est" really tick me off (and most everyone else) and ultimately they drive others away from the hobby [] Sad, but true.

Another place to check for cheap 540/550 can motors is Scientific supply shops. I've seen plain jane 540/550 can motors for $2-3 at times. Another thing you can do to pickup some speed in run on 7 cells. Even the most cheapest brushed ESC will usually handle 7 ni-cd, nimh cells under load. Also, gear it up and watch the motor temps. If you smoke a $3 motor you can laugh, open another beer and throw it in the trash


Just getting back into cars I got myself a HPI Vorza, I know how far things have come electronics wise from my E planes, helis, and a few boats I recently converted epower, so was VERY interested to see where cars were at. Stock outta the box on 6 cells the thing is actually frightening!! The sounds of those metal gears intimidating. I only made a few full speed passes on some empty road but would have to say it was dang near 70 outta the box, completely stock. Weighing in at what it does (I dunno 12-13 lbs?) with 22.2 V worth of battery strapped in that is simply amazing!!! Seem like it would definetly amputate both feet with little problem if you hit yourself or someone with it at full tilt.

So, I got 60 tons of clay delivered, and a Bobcat rented for the entire weekend!!!! Backyard track here we come. This morning, the neighborhood association rent-a-cop was doing some "paperwork" parked right out in front of my house while staring at the pile of clay taller than my house, LOL!! But back on track, I really don't have ANY car racing buddies at all. So my wife agreed and thought it be cool if we got a couple bone stock Duratrax Evaders (with stock can motors) and race each other in our own "spec" class. I'm not going to modify anything on these, leave 'em 100 completely stock. So there is plenty of fun to be had with cheap R/C gear. Not everyone gives a rats azzz if they have the latest and greatest Losi race kit, or the next jigawatt 1000 amp brushless controller 30S capable or a motor that sips up 20,000 watts and dosen't even get warm. Sometimes its fun just to drive R/C "toys" (and yes, all of these are just toys I don't care how much $$$$-$$$$$ you got in 'em).
Old 09-02-2011, 01:31 PM
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.

Brushed motors are still fast, if you can find a Novak ESC that can run 8-12turn motor limits i think the Novak GTS runs up to a 12turn motor.

Along with the novak esc  buy used on ebay that and  a Orion v2 Brushed motor there fast for a brushed motor I have my old rustler runing that setup and we droped a 2s in and did two speed runs and almost clocked 50mph.

I just went brushless with a new RTR truck and I'll never go back.

Brushless is just better all around, cheaper in the long run. They spin 3x the Rpms of a Brushed motor and you can gear some motors to the moon.

Deff checkout Hobbyking.com I've seen a buddys hobby wing esc and motor yeah there nothing speical but their cheap and faster and less maitence then any brushes setup.


- I have a Castle 1415, 2400kv Motor NINB with New Castle fan, asking $100.00
Old 09-02-2011, 10:24 PM
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Default RE: best bang for you buck brushed motor on the market.

Im so over brushed motors, no kidding ive got a r/c line no limit ESC with 2mm Gold Bulled connectors for a novark 11.1v lipo cutoff that im trying to sell.

Compare this its my BAJA KING

BRUSHED TAMIYA DIRT BLACK CAN, brushes only lasted 4 charges
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pKsg1ovzJJI[/youtube]

BRUSHLESS
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xNlVuntoDg[/youtube]

How can brushed motors even compare??? its like comparing mechanical fuel injection to electronic

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