After Run Oil And Omega Fuel ( Morgan )
 

Noticed on newer label that it says, " Do not use after run oils! " Any comments on this? New formulation? The old labels didn`t say this.

RE: After Run Oil And Omega Fuel ( Morgan )
 

Good catch. I just went and looked at the bottle and you're right. I think they say that cause the fuel is supposed to have the stuff already in it, just like the antifoaming agent. Hopefully it doesn't mean that the after run oil mixed with the new Omega fuel harms the engine.

Joe

RE: After Run Oil And Omega Fuel ( Morgan )
 

That`s my main question as well, Joe. I`ve been using after run oil with my " old " Omega fuel. I`ve sent an e-mail to Morgan asking questions. If I don`t get a response in a couple of days I think it warrants a phone call.

RE: After Run Oil And Omega Fuel ( Morgan )
 

I recently discovered something very interesting. I purchasd an OS 90 four stroke brand new in the mid 80's. I bench ran it to break it in a few times. Then a few more for kicks. I was a kid, so I wasn't really into caring for the engines very much. The engine sat around after that in the garage, in the house, various places as it was moved through the years. It was in very humid areas, consequently, the outside had some corrosion, the bolts on the outside also had rust. I recently took the engine apart after all these years, and was blown away to find absolutely no rust on the inside! The bearings had varnish on them from the gumming of the fuel and oil left in it, but the cylinder wall, the ring, the piston, the valves, literally looked like new!! I was quite surprised. Leaves me to believe that whatever these fuel manufacturers put in their fuel for rust prevention works very good. I did never put any type of oil in the engine after I ran it whatsoever.

RE: After Run Oil And Omega Fuel ( Morgan )
 

I would like to see a show of hands of those who actually believe that Morgan (Omega) has
added "ARO" to their fuel, or that it posseses some mystical quality which eliminates the
need for good post-use engine care.

Omega is GREAT fuel. I use lot's of it. I also make a habit of running out the motor at
the end of the day to remove moisture attracting alcohol and then nail the engine with a real
healthy dose of ARO.

Nary a problem. Why should there be?

It's called "MARKETING" and the "DO NOT USE AFTER RUN" is a roundabout way of
promoting their oil package.

Further...fuel manufacturers are reluctant to add anything to the fuel that really doesn't
need to be there. Any additional components mean added cost, added processes and less
burnable mixture....the end result is a product that costs more, and modelers (ARF consumers?) are
notoriously price conscious.

If it ain't nitro (that they can charge a lot for)...they don't want it in there.

Like it or not...That's my take on it.

'Race

RE: After Run Oil And Omega Fuel ( Morgan )
 

I wonder if it's because their Omega fuels all have castor blended with the synthetics which would make an ARO redundant? I'm still waiting for them to get their "FAI" fuel right though :)

RE: After Run Oil And Omega Fuel ( Morgan )
 

I certainly don't believe they add ARO to their fuel. I'm guessing that they don't think it is needed and might believe it is detrimental in some way....and they don't want to have it blamed on their fuel. I have never heard that ARO was a problem though....but it seems to me that ARO is kinda like a "black art".....people think it does something....but no-one really knows....everyone just has their personal experience.

RE: After Run Oil And Omega Fuel ( Morgan )
 

I certainly don't believe ARO is added to anyone's fuel either. Let me pour a cup of coffee...
I'd love to curl up and listen to the stories of why oiling a motor would be detrimental.

Product Marketing is one thing...mechanics are entirely another.

Folks can believe what they want...do what they want to do.

I'll oil my motors thank you all....

<G>

'Race

RE: After Run Oil And Omega Fuel ( Morgan )
 

Oiling a motor CAN be detrimental if enough moisture is present when the oil is added. Oil floats on top of water. Mineral oil will not mix with water and the water is traped between the oil and the metal parts. If you store nose down the water will flow toward the bearings. If you add oil right after flying there will be some moisture in the engine. Best to run the engine dry and add castor or even synthetic oil as an afterrun oil. Or at least let it sit with the pistion at BDC for a while before adding the afterrun oil.

RE: After Run Oil And Omega Fuel ( Morgan )
 

I don't know their product --- for all I know some by-product is left over from their fuel which they intend to be useful but under the conditions of some ARO form some reactive product with properties similar to bubble gum.

I sincerely doubt it...but who knows exactly what is in Omega Fuel.

RE: After Run Oil And Omega Fuel ( Morgan )
 

Oh, and I'm in marketing and if this is marketing....they need to fire their marketing person.

Morgan:

instead of "Do not use after run oils! "

Try:

"After run oils not needed because of the excellent lubricating qualities of this fuel"

No charge...this time.

RE: After Run Oil And Omega Fuel ( Morgan )
 

Well...in light of the fact that I run out as much of the fuel as I can at the end of the day
and then hand prop it 'til it just won't even try to emit a "pop"....I feel pretty safe that I'm not
storing my engines in an Oil/Water pickling solution.

Others can take whatever approach they want. Mine has proven itself to me to be quite
effective at preventing problems. Period.

I simply don't buy into the "DO NOT USE ARO" thingie on the bottle. Simple.

Why not? How do they know what my ARO consists of? If the fuel has some weird ingredient
that could be corrosive in the presence of some lubes....it's that FUEL that needs to be fixed...

'Race

RE: After Run Oil And Omega Fuel ( Morgan )
 

They don't...thats the only reason I can deduce they put it on....to protect them from some frivilious lawsuit....the marketing is too bad to suspect thats the reason.

Most of the warnings on the bottle are for lawsuits. I was reading an old bottle yesterday that I was cleaning out so that I could reuse it to store my homebrew in there that said:

Do Not Resuse this Bottle?

I giggled because I know someone somewhere along the line, cleaned out the bottle and is storing their child's cherry kool-aid in there in their refrigerator.

RE: After Run Oil And Omega Fuel ( Morgan )
 

Properly taken care of and run dry at the end of a flying session, any engine using a fuel with a considerable castor content will have less of a need for after run oils than an engine running total synthetic lubes or one with wet fuel left in the engine.
Are you going to hurt anything by adding your favorite after run oil (assuming it's appropriate for that type engine)? NO, you will not, just don't hydro lock the engine the next time you go to start it up.

Several fuel companies, including mine, use lubricants that have some anti-corrosion properties in the synthetic. Castor has always been the best corrosion inhibitor for model fuels.

Hope this helps shed some light on the subject.


Fuelman
Cooper Fuels

RE: After Run Oil And Omega Fuel ( Morgan )
 

A big thank you to everyone who`s responded to this post. My main concern was not to unknowingly damage my engine by adding some ARO ( happen to be using Hobbico, which I`ve heard is identical to Marvel Mystery Oil, only more expensive ). South Louisiana, needless to say, has high humidity. I`ll continue to use some, along with Omega fuel, unless and until someone can tell me that I`m damaging my engine by using the ARO.

RE: After Run Oil And Omega Fuel ( Morgan )
 

I usually say something about Corrosion X in these discussions, I haven't lost a bearing since using it for 13 years now. I especially like it for fourstrokes because when it is injected into the vent tube it foams up big time for a few seconds and goes everywhere inside the engine, it even comes out around the camshaft cover on a Saito. I bought two used engines recently, a MDS 1.48 and a SuperTigre 3000 both had really rusty rear bearings. Also the inside of the crankcase on both was bone dry, the counterweight on the ST was super rusty and dry. The only sign of lube on either was in the rod bushings. The total dryness in each tells me they were run on synthetic. I did an experiment with my brand new MDS 148, after running it using 5% nitro fuel with 20 lube which was 80% syn and 20% castor, I ran it out of fuel and immediately pulled the backplate, guess what, every surface in it was bone dry except the rod bushings, even the rear bearing was dry. So, it's back to Fox 5% nitro with 20% 50/50 lube.

RE: After Run Oil And Omega Fuel ( Morgan )
 

Good old castor saves the day again!

They don't call it "Palma Christi" (Hand of God) for nothing you know.

<GGG>

'race

RE: After Run Oil And Omega Fuel ( Morgan )
 

Man just run a little marvel mystery oil after a day at the field, pull the plug put about 10 -15 drops down the carb and spin her over, nitro will attack the chrome on the bearings first as they are plated chrome and nitro is hygroscopic which means it attracts water big time, these are normally the first things nitro will destroy and it happens fast in some cases depending on the engine manufacturer. Marvel is cheap insurance and is highly availible and safe on your engines and burns off after startup.


Fly crazy.

Mike.

RE: After Run Oil And Omega Fuel ( Morgan )
 

Beware! I am going on just my memory here. But!?
Nitro does not attack chrome and is not very hygroscopic. Nitro will only absorb about 2% of its weight in water. Its the alcohol that absorbs water. You may be confused because drag racers used to clean their nitro fuel tanks with a mild acid like vinegar. This was to neutralize any alkalies in the tank, alkalies can react with nitro to form a contact sensitive mixture. By contact sensitive I mean the whole tank of fuel could go Kaboom during a crash. Also rust can react with a fuel additive propylene oxide which makes it contact sensitive to shock and static. The mild acid will also help remove any minute iron oxide which may be present but not visible.

RE: After Run Oil And Omega Fuel ( Morgan )
 

wow, bunch of opinions here. I just run the crap out of an engine. throw it in the van when the day is done, hang it in the basement if I dont leave it in the van and then fly it again next week with the fuel left remaining in the tank . works great for me and my wife loves me too.......:)

RE: After Run Oil And Omega Fuel ( Morgan )
 

I too noticed to "no after run oil needed" tag a couple weeks ago when i bought a new gallon. i ignore it though. I paid enough for my 4 stroker that a little marvel mystery is good. after a day of flying i squirt a bunch into the glow plug hole, i pull of valve cover get valves and rockers, squirt down pushrod tubes, and i squirts a bunch down the crank case vent tube. then i rotate the engine without plug about 20 times, then i put the plug in, give it a few more flips and put it away. I swear by mystery oil, its the best stuff! I go to pep boys or auto zone and get a gallon of it. lasts a long time and is worth it. why would anyone not use afterrun oil? its like ice cream desert for our engines after a day of flying!

sean

I know I'm replying 12 years later, "Seriously?" Anyway, I like you never use ARO. And I'm so glad i haven't bothered to buy it, pull the glow plug at the end of each day and spend my time and money dumping it in my engines. I run 2 & 4 strokes engines from .40 cu.in. up to 2.00 cu.in. displacement. I run the planes and dump the fuel from the tank back into my gallon after ea day. Then I fire up the engine and burn up the fuel in the line. Once i hung up the planes for about 6 years when my wife completed medical school and we got her settled in her career (few moves to different states looking for something permanent). Later when I got back into the hobby there was still oil residue (from the fuel) on the engines and they were in the exact same condition as I left them 6 years prior. The first engine I decided to fire up was an O.S. FS .91 Surpass II. It was a cold day so I used a heat gun to warm the engine until i saw the gummy oil began to soften and flow. Then I popped the spark plug and shot a quick squirt of WD40 into the engine. I then turned it over by hand to distribute the WD40. That was it! I filled the tank and fired it up and it purred like a kitten. The oil in the fuel is plenty of protection for me. Heck i know a guy who crashed his plane in a lake and several years later when the lake dried up enough he could actually see a part of the old plane so he went out and sure enough recovered it. When he dismantled the engine the inside was still shiny and like new! The outside didn't look like new of course but the film of oil simply from the fuel perfectly preserved the inside of the engine even though it had been under water for 2 years. I don't know if it's that the modern day fuels are better or if it was always more of a gimmick but these days it seems that ARO's are really not needed. Unless maybe you live in a very damp or wet environment but shucks I spent most of my time on this hobby in Northern Oregon where it rains almost every day and I've never had a problem. PS I use fuel with 10-15% nitro (depending on whats available) and a castor/synthetic blend.

old thread,....so what,.....there are new people on this forum everyday, that may have questions about this issue.
I've used Marvel Mystery Oil in every engine ( both air plane and briggs kart racing engines) I ever used as an after run oil, and never had any problem. sometimes, people make too much of an issue (over thinking) about details that don't really matter. a lot of what is put on packaging, is put there to protect the manufacturer from law suite about any and every little potential problem...... they need to think of just about anything that the consumer might do with their product. Big insurance companies have people who do nothing but think of things that their clients might be sued for.

Interesting discussion, I have been flying control line for over 50 years. In that time I have used OMEGA fuel and even COOL POWER. At one point I did find that After Run Oil was a good thing even with the fuels that said they had castor in them. Some components of the mix were attracting lots of water and in the older steel/iron pistons would form rust. ARO stopped this.

I think the main reason for the warning was because of hydraulic lock from having too much ARO put into the engine then having it hit with a starter and damaging it. Reading how much ARO some flyers were putting into their engine seems way to much and supports the idea of hydraulic lock. You only need a few drops on the front bearing and 3 -4 drops in the carb/venturi, then hand flip it half a dozen times and its good to go. Don't over do it, the ARO also cuts the heavy oil and keeps the engine from getting stiff so its easy to start next time out.

Best, DennisT

yes, it doesn't take a lot. the real key is to get it spread around in the engine. I usually put a few drops down the carb, and a few drops in the exhaust, pull the plug loose and then bump the engine briefly with my starter. not much worry about damage if you only put a few drops in each spot and that is really all that is needed.......don't drench the engine !. I pull the plug because I don't like getting a good plug full of oil. if you have an old dead plug,... that can be put in and then the engine bumped as well. having the engine under compression spreads the oil around good. it doesn't take much ARO to protect the engine if you can spin it under compression with a starter,......just be sure to use only a few drops in each spot.