LaserSVT

As some of you know i had just got my Art-Tech Shark 450 Electric heli today. Even though we are having 12 mph winds I couldnt wait and had to test it out.
I have to say the helicopters construction is verynice and the parts look great. Its very light and when I learn how to fly it I am sure I will have allot of enjoyment out of it.

Well it took me a bit to trim it out. Had to trim it starboard all the way on the right stick and it still wants (just a hair) to slide left still so I will move the horn one spot over and it should be good. I have a grave driveway and launched off a large section of MDF so it was flat. The problem is its a tad windy at 7-8 MPH and brief 12 mph gusts so it was far from optimal. I also told myself I wouldnt fly it till the wood blades came in cause I didnt want to spend $30 for carbon blades every time I crash but with it starring at me I just had to go try it out. So after trimming it out I got it about 6" and tried to hold it there bot could only manage a 6 foot circle at best. I was afraid to go higher because of the wind and the fact that I was doing it in the driveway instead of my open 30+ acres in the back so I had trees, house and fence to wory about. I knew prop wash would be an issue but I wanted to hold it more stady before going higher. Well it started to back up and I cut power cause it was only 1" up. The carbon tail fin caught a weed and snapped and then the heli twisted smacking its blades into the ground. So I epoxied it and cut off a paperclip to reinforce the sides. Nothing else seemed to be broken. Fortunatly I had ordered a new tail rotor, main rotor, tail fin, tail shaft, main shaft and feathering shafts on Monday cause I know thats the stuff people break. I also ordered a Rotor Head and tail pipe mounts because for some reason they were listed as free and it only cost me .60 extra for shipping so I figured why not. Anyway, I got that fixed and pulled my car out of the car port and tried gain in there. I noticed it had sever vibration and checked it to see the feathering shaft was slightly bent. It was easy to grab the blade holders and straighten it out. (Prolly the wrong thing to do) So I tried it again and it was as smooth as when I opened the box. I got a nice shallow hover after sliding it around for a couple minutes. The landing gear was off the ground with only the training gear balls scraping the ground. I started to feel more confident and wanted to bring it 2-3' off the ground so I could get out of the prop wash and see if I could hold it a bit more still. That was my downfall. I should have kept it low and slow. The helicopter started to go backwards with the wind and was going right towards my Lincoln. I gave it some forewad stick but it was still going backwards so I gave it ALLOT of foreward stick like I would in my coaxial heli and that was a big mistake. It tilted its nose almost straight down and flew that way. Thats all it took, split the ends of both carbon blades and stripped two teeth off the main gear. Fortunatly nothing else is broken at all. I cant see any frame dammage and the main shaft isnt bent nor is the feathering shaft. Here is the big bummer now, the main drive gear is not available anywhere. Everyone is sold out. The head and belt and all that are compatable with the T-Rex but IDK about the gear. Gonna have to do some research.



So here are my questions. Can the main drive gear from a T-rex fit the Art-Tech? Are there others out there that would work as well?
The rest is about the radio. Do I want the servo throw switch set at 70% or 100%? By the idle up or 3-D switch is a knob thats labeled flaperon, what does that do? On the other side is a switch for "head lock" and "normal" What position do I want that in? It also has a knob in front of it that says "pit", again, what does that do?
I should note that the knobs have different labels for each mode. The knob by the head lock switch says: its "moving range" in aeroplane mode, "mixing rate" in v-tail mode and its "PIT in Heli mode.
The know by the 3-D switch says "Flaperon" in aeroplane mode, "moving range" in v-tail mode and "PLT" in heli mode. All new stuff to me.

The owners manual just does not give any info on that.

LaserSVT

Well I guess I have an answer on the main gear. The bearing on mine is pressed in so to make a T-rex gear work I also need the bearing assembly that attaches with the 4 screws.
They are cheap and I can get 4 packs of the gears for unde $6 on ebay. They have them in white, blue, dark blue and a couple other colors. Are the different colors different tooth counts?

noobflyer01

here's a thread about the shark 450  http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_66...tm.htm#6957857

LaserSVT

Thanks noob! That helped quite a bit.

LaserSVT

I finnaly found a simulator that works with my remote and on Vista. Now that I can really check it out I am very suprised just how radically different the 3-D heli is from my coaxial machine. This has saved me allot of headache and repair by playing with it for the last few hours. Now I see why I was having such a hard time and that I have to BRING the helicopter back from a movement and that it wont just return to a centered hover like the coaxial.

Beachcomber

Your crash "tilted its nose almost straight down and flew that way" sounds like classic over-control, so don't feel bad. I recommend you do reduce your servo throw (70% is a good place to start) because that will give you less heli movement for the same amount of stick movement. Tame it down a bit.

LaserSVT

Thanks Beach. I have learned a ton using the simulator onmy PC now. Since it will still be a little bit untill my new parts show up I wanted to learn all I could on the simulator. I have killed 3 sets of batteries so far on the transmitter! lol! I have even setthe simulator up with 5 MPH wind and 12 MPH gusts so I can learn how to controll it should the wind push it where I dont want it to go. I can controll a hover in front of me now with the heli pointing any direction and can set it down in any one of 6- 2' x 2' boxed inthe sim.

I finnaly got to the point where I dont crash unless I am trying some 3-D stuff and it gets my heart racing in the sim so it will be some time before I really try it.
I know a sim is a bit easier then real flight so I am using it to the fullest.

When I first tried the sim I was amazed how the heli responded exactly like it did when I tried to fly it and the first 10 or so times I did the nose down, blades into the ground thing.
I finnaly got to the point where I am making the correction before the heli does what I dont want it to.

My friend at the RC shop said it best. "When flying one of these first you tell it what to do then what not to do then what to do then what not to do then what to do followed by what not to do" lol! I thought he was kidding!
I had a hard time the first couple batteries with my Axe CX but then goot real good, I cant believe how much more there was to do with a collective/pitch machine. I have a ton of respect for thoes that can hold it pefectly still in a hover, very impressive.

LaserSVT

well that was fun and expensive.

My new heli parts showed up way early and the weather was perfect so I took her for a flight. Had some trimming to do at first and put the blades in the soft dirt which bent my main shaft. So I swapped on a new shaft and had back at it. I was so thrilled to keep it within 10' of me for a good 15-20 seconds with minor corrections, I was just happy as could be. Well Izzabella (my painted horse) is very curious so she was walking up to inspect this big bird and I dont have enough skill to keep it from sliding into he so I gave a little more throttle and got it above her head and was just impressed with its controll. Well it started sliding towards the corral so I gave some more throttle to clear that and try to make it come back so I could land it and catch my breath (its a bit nerve racking). Very minute movements really gave it speed fast and it was instantly over 150' away. I paniked and gave some more throttle to do a climbing stall turn and it was beautiful! Got up a good 80'. pirouetted and brought it back but man did it move fast! I was already pulling back for level flight before it was even done with the turn but the thing shot past me doing well over 50 mph. I banked it and brought it around for a wide slow turn (trying to do minute stick changes) and was doing alright. I tried to keep the altitude low to controll it better but it was so far away I mis judged which way the tail was pointing and when the heli went  a little sideways I ended up correcting the wrong way and watched it slam into a very tall fence post doing 35+ mph. What an impact! Parts everywhere. I went to go get it and it shattered both new blades and really twisted the feathering shaft as well as totally destroyed the canopy. The fly bar was slightly bent too but its so pliable it was easy to straighten. Big bummer is it stripped the gears from a servo too so now I need a couple of those (need a spare). So all together about a $30 crash +/-.

I was bringing it back home thinking what the hell did I buy something like this for. My father reminded me that the first few flights were expensive on my little heli but I learned quickly and now fly it great. The thing was so freaking cool flying past my head at 50+ mph and while it was flying I was just over joyed. So I will stick with it and order the new stuff next week and give it another go.

Man these things are hard to fly. The inpact was so severe though I cant believe how well everything held up though. Heli is a real trooper!

LaserSVT

So is straightning the fly bar accetable? Its so pliable it seems it was designed that way. I had a del on a blade balencer but it fell through so with my parts budget I can eaither get a balencer or spare flybars. Whats the better choice.

This will be my spare parts inventory:
4-pairs fibreglass main rotors
5- pair tail rotors
6- Main shafts
5- feathering shafts
5- main gears
1- autorotation gear
1- tail boom
2- metal gear BB servos ( I am ordering four and installing two)
1- Rotor head
1- pair boom mounts


What else spare parts are a good idea to have around?

LaserSVT

Well this has been one interesting learning experience. All my new stuff showed up today so I went to work. Had to change some stuff to use the T-rex gears and the servos were another trip but I got it all together and working. Just have to wait for the main blades, not sure why they didnt show up.
The metal gear/ ball bearing servos are much nicer then what was on there. They respond so much better and return to center much better then the old ones. I was suprised that they all moved in reverse from what the other servos did but that was easy to fix. Also had to adjust all the linkages because the servos are a hair taller. I also wanted to make sure the gyro was ok so I set the heli down and ran it on its lowest speed setting to see where I was at. I adjusted the tail with the remote and after centeringthe stick the gyro over shot the center and man did that little heli spin around fast and slam into my foot. So I lowered the gain and the throw (throw was WAY too far)and I hope I have it good to go. I hope the blades show up Monday cause after workingon the heli for the last few hours I reallywant to fly it.

Expensive damn hobby! With all the parts I also had to order some specialty tools to work on the damn thing. Also got my balencer and a decient extra battery.

Its a little ugly cause I was having a hard time with the blue and white canopy against the sky so now (untill I learn the damn machine) I got a bright ass yellow canopy and red rotor blades.

helimangler

From my learning experience.... A few more tail booms and boom supports are handy to have around. Be sure to check Heli set-up real well. Here is a few links that may help. [link=http://www.slyster.com/heli/trex450bible.html]450 Bible[/link] and [link=http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=41692]Beginner setup tips[/link]

Hope they help, they did for me.

This is an addicting hobby!! Expensive for beginners, but even pros have their bad days. LOL!! (I'm not a pro by any stretch) Backflips, tic-tocs, rolls.... about it. FUN THOUGH!!! LOL! But I crash often enough too. [:@]

I fly Trex clones HK450 from Hobby City and CopterX 450AE (all aluminum version) from Ehirobo to keep costs down. Parts from Hobby City take time but are worth the wait sometimes. Then some EXI parts from Xheli for quick fixes. All 450 compatible of course. It is a learning curve for sure.

I am most pleased with the CopterX 450AE kit that for $82 Delivered was a fairly high quality bird. I equip these birds with G401B gyro, DX480 tail servo, Hextronic MG14 (all metal) on cyclic. These electronics cost (for all of them) around $80. Then I put in a $50 6200e Spektrum receiver for my radio (DX6i). So... about $210-$220ish for the bird.

Ehirobo had some very good Carbon City 325 blades for a decent price. Good quality. I have bought some as low as $11 dlvd, but the quality was not up to high standards. Yet they (after balancing) flew quite nice. Cost not a problem? Go with the Align, Esky, or name brand of your choice.

Good luck and mostly HAVE FUN!!

LaserSVT

Thanks for the links! I have some reading to do!

I hope I did right by turning the gain down a hair. Just sitting there the heli was trying to rotate eaither direction very very fast and after I turned the gain down it sat still and responded better. Wont really know till I can get it air born again.

helimangler

Be careful that if you reverse things that you didn't mess with the gyro settings. If you reverse it, it will make you spin out fast. I have done this a couple times, by not making sure the gyro was responding correctly BEFORE lifting off. LOL!!! I hold the heli and swish the tail back and forth and watch which way it is compensating. The back side of the tail blade should turn the direction you move the tail. The front part of the tail blade should cut the air in opposite direction of tail movement.

helimangler

I straighten my flybar most of the time. If it gets too kinked, I replace it. Balancing is helpful, but tracking is the most help. Be sure you track your blades. I usually eyeball it, but sometimes I put a contrasting piece of tape (white, pale colors, etc.) and use a laser pen pointed at the blades to identify the lower or higher blade. The brighter dot will be the one with the lighter tape. (Or in the case of white blades and black piece of tape the one without the tape)

Correcting tracking will effect the pitch curve some. Blade pitch 101 is a good thing to vew in the links for beginners on my previous post.

OK.... I'm outta here.

Take care and good luck!!!

LaserSVT

Thanks again! Yeah its turning the right way and responding fine. I gave it a little throttle and held the heli and rotated it in my hand quickly and watched the gyro adjust the tail correctly to hold the heli straight. I have my limits set right now too. The videos were very helpful and I found some more that really simplified everything for me. I have a very good electronics and mechanical understanding so learning what does what was fairly easy for me. I have everything level now and the servos have the right travel without hitting thier limits.

I wish I could get more info onmy radio though.
Today I am trying to learn how to set up the pitch curve on my radio. It has no instructions and I cant find any online. It wasnt at zero pitch when set in 3-D at half stick. I dont have a pitch gauge so I did the folded blade method. My radio has two knobs marked "PIT" and "PLT". So I put it back in normal mode and unlocked the radio. The best I could do after messing with it for an hour is about -1 to -2* at zero stick, about 5* at mid stick and 10-11* at full stick (in normal mode). "PIT" is obviously pitch but I am not sure what "PLT" is. I think it is like a pitch gain cause it affects how much pitch is given for throttle travel but its linear. The radio does not seem to be programmable to set exactly how much pitch I want for each stage of throttle travel.
But now in 3-D mode its 0* at mid stick and has full travel in both directions with no servo chatter at the maximums now so I guess I am close. I ordered a pitch gauge last night but it will be some time before it comes. I couldnt see spending $11 for a gauge from an american shop when the same exact gauge was $.99 shipped from China.

helimangler

Sounds like you have the pitch perfect to me now. Who needs a stinking pitch gage! [8D]

Ahhhhhh, the radio is like the 22E/Eagle 50 birds. I have one of those too. You have them figured out too. But a manual for the 22E/Eagle 50 will have info on these controls. I haven't flown my 22E in forever. It is in intensive care in a box somewhere from my last flight/mangle.

Flying my HK450 this Sunday, somehow my elevator servo (HXT900) stripped a gear in 3D mode. I was tic-tocking it and suddenly lost that control. Luckily was close to the ground and it went down (with me like a mad man on the sticks) without a major smash. Bent the main shaft, but not the feathering shaft. Broke a blade and somehow a couple teeth off of the tail drive shaft and main drive gear. Fixed it in an hour and was back in the air. Lots of little things that can go wrong in these things. Keeps it interesting.

Those vids are great and they are free!! Lots of help and info in there. Finless Bob is a great guy for doing those.

Have fun and happy flying!

This is a picture of my hanger a few weeks ago. Always changing a bit though. LOL

LaserSVT

So here is my tiny hangar. Gotta start somewhere though.
At least the box has enough stuff for 5 or 6 serious crashes in it.

Got the blades on and balenced, now I just have to go tune the tail. Wish it would stop raining.

LaserSVT

Woot woot!!!
Took a few minutes to get the tail set right.
I had to slide the tail servo back just a hair and then give a hair more gain on the servo and it does not spin at all. Also had to lengthen the link on the port servo one turn and the foreword/back servo link down one turn and now its perfect!
I was in my car port and the space is small. It is two cars wide but with a 4' deep work bench on one side and a rider mower on the other its only a few feet wider then my Mark VIII. The port is also only a couple feet longer then my Lincoln so really I only had the size of my car as an area to hover it.

I spent the rest of the battery hovering it about 2 cm off the ground. I had to set it down and catch my breath about 5 times as the wind gusted. I could correct the gust and have it still again but its such a small space I got nervous. But then it started to fly weird and I looked at my radio to realize I was hovering for 12 minutes.  I killed the battery and not the heli. I slapped in my new battery and went back at it. I hovered an inch off the ground and kept it pretty still for 2 minutes before I set it down to settle down. Every time it was sliding toward the bench or mower I was holding my breath as I corrected. I was doing really well with not over correcting too.
I eventually brought the gear up to about knee level and was just as happy as could be. After 8 and a half minutes the battery was dead (first charge) and I set her back down.

No wrecks or even touches of anything! I did notice both batteries got pretty damn warm. You could hold them but they were still pretty warm. The ESC was barley warm at all and the motor you could touch with no problem as well, it stayed very cool. :shrug: Is that normal for the battery to get warmer then the ESC or motor?

drobin

Be careful on how low you get the batteries. By getting them too low will cause the lipos to puff. Getting warm is normal hot is not.Than they are dangerous to use. They can catch fire or blow up. Do you have a decent charger?? I run my lipos 7-8 minutes. This will also extend the life of the batteries.

LaserSVT

Yeah, I keep reading how hot is bad on them and they dont get hot but they are as warm as an electric blanket. The motor is definatly cooler.
The problem is I figured 8 minutes of flight time should be right and thought since I was just doing a low hover that a couple minutes extra would be OK, I guess I thought wrong. Learn something new. The first battery though was just me neglecting to watch my timer on the radio. Since I kept setting it down and tweaking the servo and gain and then lifting off again I lost track of time under power. Also I bet the initial start up eats some juce while spooling up.

LaserSVT

Woot woot! Killed two more batteries without dammage...much. The first battery I was hovering about a foot off the ground and went to trim it a hair right and the main blades just kissed the trash can. They didnt break or even move cause it was barley any contact but it did take a little red paint off the tips. Guess I have to rebalence them. I ran it for 6 minutes fly time and then landed it before and power difference became evident.
The second battery as soon as it was a foot or so in the air it stayed there for 5 minutes straight. No landing and no impacts. Half way through the pack I was able to keep it in a 2' circle. At just over 5 minutes my phone rang and it startled me cause it was in my shirt pocket and I knocked the heli out of shape but controlled it quick enough where it landed fine and then took back off to hover for another minute before shutting it down.
Batteries are staying cooler and the motor is just a tad hotter then the pack now.

I am thuroughly addicted! I love the way it sounds as its hovering there! Very cool.

helimangler

That is great!!! You will notice that at about 6 feet up the air is more stable for hovering when it's calm. Closer to the ground gives ground wash effect and such.

Yep, I killed a few batteries running them too low. I am thinking I should get an alarm for them so that I MAYBE could hear when they are low if I happen to push it a bit too far. I have a timer on my receiver that goes off, but a few times I miss guessed the setup on my bird and it was going dead waaay before the alarm.

It gets funner and funner. I got a Lama4 co-axial for in da house and a 4#3B Walkera fixed pitch (very small). Heck, I even have a co-axial china special flashy heli too. Get them for $20 delivered. They are popular with the kiddies. LOL

I started with just a little box too. LOL!! I became obsessed and two years (and some bucks) later I got what I showed you.

Happy Flying!!!

briangp

This moment sponsored by Mastercard 

LaserSVT

My helicopter brokted.
Just starting to take off and the tail fin I had to glue together before just snapped and went into the tail rotors. Busted both links and snapped both screws in the hub. [X(] Landed just find but damn, that really sux.
Just going to get an Align tail assembly thats complete. That way I can use the Align links and tail fin should they break again.
Was the damndest thing. Hovering about 1' up and then I hear POP POP and the heli starts to spin. Wasnt near anything eaither, plenty of space.

Oh well, more stuff to play with I guess.

helimangler

I know the feeling!! Iwas flying my blade today. I was on my third battery pack and it just shut off in mid air about 40 feet up. Spun down and nosed into the ground on a dirt road behind my property. Busted the nose a bit and broke my lipo battery. Battery caught fire (one of three cells only) and melted stuff. Here is a couple pictures. I am starting to think my Blade is cursed. LOL!!! I didn't get all the smoke and stuff because I was busy unplugging it. All is working except the battery. hehehehe!!!!