beginner questions
 

I have flown R/C airplanes for several years, and the time has come to buy my first heli. I'm looking for some basic information before I start. That's where I hope you can help me.

Which radio would you prefer, Hitec Eclipse 7 or Futaba T6XH, and why?

Will I need any special tools? Is it difficult to set pitch angles and other adjustments?

Is the main rotor running at constant rpm in flight? (I don't understand the link between throttle and pitch)

RE: beginner questions
 

with regards to your radio question,i don't have any experience with either of those radio's so i can't advise you.there are some special helicopter tools you will need but not that many,a pitch guage and a blade balancer spring to mind.it can be tricky to set a helicopter up if you havent done it before,that is assuming you can at least hover,as this is required in order to set the heli up for a basic flight set up.if you have never ever flown a helicopter before,THEN IT WILL BE IMPOSSIBLE TO SET IT UP YOURSELF!this is the catch with helicopters,you must find somone who can set the heli up for you before you fly it.this can be a friend at your club or even the model shop where you bought the model.after this,you can learn to fly it on your own,unlike a model aeroplane,you don't have to have someone to take off and land for you.you progress a little at a time as fast or as slow as you like.after you have learn't to hover at will,and can take off and land perfectly,then you will be able to take off the training sticks from the bottom of your helicopter and fly without them{all begginers must have the training sticks strapped to the bottom of the heli to learn to fly}you will also then be able to set up your own helicopter!with regards to the rotor rpm,it should stay constant in flight,as the pitch increases,the throttle opens more to compensate and so the rpm stays roughly the same,this can be adjusted in the radio set up to achieve the desired response.throttle and pitch are controlled by the same stick at the same time.

RE: beginner questions
 

sandal,

I don't know about the Hitec, but the 6XH is too limited IMO. It doesn't have 5 point throttle and pitch curves, which I consider a minimum requirement. I would recommend the JR X378 or the 9C Futaba (that's unless the Hitec has "enough" features).

You don't need alot of specialty tools to get started, but a pitch guage, balancer, and ball link pliers would be the tools to get first.

The link between throttle and pitch is fairly simple in theory, but takes some work to get setup. I usually tell people to think of the throttle stick as actually controlling the collective pitch and the transmitter mixes in throttle control according to your throttle curve.

Example:

Let's say you want to hover at the half-stick position (used to be recommended to beginners, but I think learning at 3/4 stick is better). Set all your linkages for cyclic and pitch servos at 90 degrees to the servo arm (with the throttle stick at exactly center) and adjust the pitch links so that you have between 5 and 6 degrees positive pitch in the main blades. In your pitch curve you should be at 50% at center stick. Then move the throttle stick to full up (this will put you at 100% in the pich curve) and check the amount of positive pitch in the main blades. Lower the % value for this position until you have about 9 degrees of positive pitch. Now move the throttle stick to full down and raise the % value for this point until you have about 2 degrees negative pitch. The 1/4 stick point should be half way between full down and 1/2 stick values, and the 3/4 stick point should be half way between the full up and 1/2 stick values.

That'll give you a linear pitch curve.

The throttle curve has to be fine tuned by test flying, but you can start with 0,25,50,75,100. The object is to match the throttle position to maintain a constand headspeed throughout the pitch range.

Hope that gives you a better understanding.

Ben

RE: beginner questions
 

Thanks!

I see that I should have explained a little more...

My intentions are:

1) read and learn as much as I can about helicopters, setting up the radio for heli use etc.
2) buy the equipment
3) use what I have learned and the instruction manuals to build and set up the helicopter and radio
4) get someone from the nearest heli club to have a look at it, correct my mistakes and test fly it
5) learn to fly with an instructor, simulator or both.

I am currently at number 1 above.

pitch/throttle:
If I understand it right, the "throttle stick" controls the angle of the main rotor blades. More pitch requires more engine power to keep rpms constant, and to achieve this the throttle is opened (mixed in by the radio) as pitch increases? The throttle curve is a way to set how much power to add to the corresponding pitch angle? The more adjustment points, the smoother and "better" the throttle curve will be? If set properly, rotor rpms will not change at all regardless of "throttle stick" position?

carburettor adjustment:
How do you set the needles? With airplanes we usually hold the plane, give it full throttle, and adjust it a little rich from peak rpm. Obviously this isn't the way to adjust a heli engine?

RE: beginner questions
 

You're on the right track.

As for setting the needles, start with the factory recommended settings. Adjust the low needle for good idle. The high needle requires flight testing. I usually hover a few tanks at the factory setting (or slightly richer) and then do some full power climb outs. Probably not a good idea for a beginner, but hopefully you'll have someone who can help you. You want the engine to be able to transition smooth and not bog when pulling full pitch. You also want to make sure you're getting plenty of smoke from the exhaust. If you aren't, you're too lean. I always try to keep my heli engines slightly rich.

Some, if not most, heli engines also have a midrange needle that can be used to fine tune the transition from idle to full throttle.

Ben

RE: beginner questions
 

if you want to set up your heli engine the same way you do your aeroplane engines,then you can buy a set of "head loaders" this will enable you to replace the main blades with the loaders and strap the heli secure so that you can run the engine at full throttle with a load,without the heli taking off,that way you can set the engine up without having to perform the full power climb out previuosly mentioned.

RE: beginner questions
 

bdphil;
this looks like the procedure for adjusting RC car engines. Make adjustments, drive a little to see how it works, adjust some more etc... I thought of strapping the heli to a tall heavy table and making adjustments at various throttle settings, but your way seems better.

alvin1;
would I achieve the same result with an airplane prop (which I have "tons" of)?

Then "today's new question":
How do you start a helicopter? Do you switch on throttle hold before starting to keep it at idle?

RE: beginner questions
 

in answer to your first question"yes",technicalyit is possible to remove the engine and strap it to a test bed,then attatch an aeroplane prop to the crankshaft,this way you can run the engine in with the prop and set the needles,however,it isn't really practical to do this,because apart from removing the engine from the heli,you would have to remove the clutch and the flywheel in order to attatch the prop and then when you have finnished you must re install it in the helicopter and realign the clutch in the clutch bell.as you know from your aeroplanes,somtimes the weather and or fuel types will necessitate readjusting the carb and this is too much trouble to go to,in order to do this.far better to stick to the head loaders until you are capable of fullsticking the heli and performing a climbout.as for the second question,there is no need to engage throttle hold when starting the heli,just make sure that the throttle/collective stick is at full bottom when you start it and hold the rotor head.

RE: beginner questions
 

If you're just gonna be learning to hover you don't really need to worry about having the needles set for the abolute maximum performance. I would recommend setting the needles to the factory settings, start the engine and adjust the low needle to get a reliable idle, leave the high needle at the factory setting and start flying. When you run the engine up enough to start hovering, take note of the amount of smoke you're getting. If you're not getting a fairly heavy smoke trail (or the engine sounds rough), richen the high needle a click or two at a time until you are. When you are capable of doing a full power climb out, you're probably ready to try and squeeze more performance out of your engine. There really is no reason to run the engine in with a propeller, or investing in headloaders (which I've never personally used nor would I).

I usually start my heli's in Throttle Hold, but I have a tendency to bump things. Until you have the throttle linkage travel and idle needle adjusted you may need to be able to operate the throttle to get it started. Just be careful when you start it the first few times, making sure that you're throttle servo is working the correct direction and you have your radio set to the correct model (I've hot started my ST a few times because I was on the wrong model).

Ben

RE: beginner questions
 

I ordered a Hitec Eclipse 7 and a Hirobo Shuttle Plus today. :D:D:D

bdphil;
are you saying that the engine will be broken in ok if I mount it in the heli and run it rich for my first flights? I have never flown a heli before, so there will be quite a lot of half throttle flying in the beginning, learning to hover...

RE: beginner questions
 

Heli wont take of i have a hirodbo shuttle plus i was told by the hobby shop to leave my main blades loose ie so i could move the blades with my hands? also that the tracking should be at approx 5 degrees stupid question is that 5degrees with the thicker part of the blades pointing upwards My blades are spinning so fast that i am hiding behind a wall i am sure the darn things are gonna come off BUT i aint getting no lift Regards dave from England

RE: beginner questions
 

I think what he/she meant was that the heli is supposed to hover at approximately 5 degrees pitch. For learning, I'd suggest -2 degrees when the stick is all the way back, and +9 degrees at full forward stick. This is what I used to learn to hover, and I think it was ok. Not too sensitive.

The best way to set the correct pitch angles is probably by using a pitch meter. If there is a heli club near you, you might be able to borrow one - or even better - get someone with experience to help you. If you have a tachometer, a good starting point is 1500 rpm (main rotor) for hovering.

I found a lot of good info here: http://www.littlerotors.com/setup/
...but nothing is better than the experienced pilots in your club.

RE: beginner questions
 

I have exactly the same problem, however, with me it is even worse: I have never flown anything. But I can tell you that they are all correct. You need somebody who has experience. Even if it is for just one afternoon. Me, I don't one someone else helping me out, because I want to do it all by myself. So I started reading arround and stuff. And I have to say, it is possible to do it all by yourself.

The best thing to do is:
1) Ask arround a lot. You'll have to find somebody on the internet for example (this is even a good place) to which you can ask everything. For example: what a specific part is for, or is a specific part can be used with another one. (ex: does a reciever work with a specific helicopter)
2) Get all the info you can by yourself. (I'm planning on making a complete "how to do it by yourself guide" for the Raptor .30 V2, since this is the most commonly used nitro helicopter for beginners.
3) The best thing to do is: BUY Ray's Authoritative Helicopter Manual !!! It is said to be one of the BEST books for beginners. You'll get all the info you want in that one book. Don't want to make advertising, but you can buy it [link=http://www.helihobby.com/html/rc_helicopter_training.html]here[/link]

One of these days I will try to put up all the parts you need on a webpage. (I've only started one week and I've already got a complete list of everything you need + where you can buy it :D => so you see, it's doable for a novice)