Jeti USA

My bet still on $1990.00

Zb

chorner

i wish guys would get over this idiotic notion that everything needs to be somehow backwards compatible. You can't truly move forward without getting rid of the old. Not to mention, DSMX is pure crap compared to DMSS. 2048 resolution, 1mhz of signal bandwidth, horrible signal to noise ratios on the receivers with all the damn satellites, and servo signals spread out over many packets. As soon as you get over a certain number of channels, latency can more than double, and resolution goes to all hell at 512. Yes JR please support this crap on a flagship radio.... *sarcasmn*

Mike, and guys like Mike sit on forums ranting about **** they cannot afford. Guys like me buy it because they can afford top quality. I've bought a DX18 myself in the past, and it's a pile of garbage compared to the 28x.

Just saying

rmh

Pile of crap?
I have two of em - very nice systems
DSMX crap?-
Is the new JR system good ? I would suspect it is - having owned many top of the line JR-prior to the Spektrum introduction of 2.4 B
Being back compatible? a big issue for many fliers - for good reason.
It's nice you feel you can afford a system you feel is better- tho you obviously don't understand why.
Afteryou have had some actual time using the 28 (you did purchase one?) you may care to re evaluate your silly comparisons.

luv2flyrc

My Feedback: (6)

You don't have a clue what you are talking about.....just saying

Mike

Jeti USA

Backwards compatibly is one of the very important features, just look at the Futaba disaster. We have to carry 5x different Rx protocols, many times same receivers just different protocols. Jeti on other side all same, all fully firmware upgradable, all with Telemetry.


Zb/Esprit Model

chorner

DSMX isn't that great. If you dig up some information on it, you'll realize the protocol has room for improvement and the RF link while solid enough, isn't as good as the higher end options. DMSS being one of them. Perhaps pile of crap was a bit of a stretch, but in general I associate DSMX with Spektrum and after buying 3 DSMX based Spektrum radios I'll never touch one again. I know many others think they are great, but they also are OK with that general level of quality.

Yes I have just recently actually, purchased a 28x specifically to replace my Spektrum gear. I would've considered Futaba, if I felt their gimbals and radio construction in general was a clear step up but I didn't find it to be. Unfortunately something like a Jeti, I don't like the look and design of personally although it may be a quality piece of equipment and certainly looks like it's intended to be. What's support like, and can you buy one locally if you should decide you need to quickly obtain a part? Mostly though the design reminds me of an old Atari console you hold in your hands instead

Mike, if I'm wrong and you do buy high quality gear I don't understand why you can't fathom dropping support for an older, less capable, protocol. It's one thing if manufacturers switch protocols and drop support "every other year" but after 6-8 years, making a change for the better shouldn't be something that's laced with complaints about dropping previous protocols. Constantly switching protocols often and not offering upgrade paths I could see having an issue with as mentioned about Futaba, but even there... Futabas high end radios tend to have a a good service life. It's just the mid range stuff etc where you play the Fast, Faster, fastest, Super duper fast game is it not?

luv2flyrc

My Feedback: (6)

You missed my point which was when you drop your protocol with no upgrade path, you open the door for YOUR customer to entertain other systems. After all, they don't have to stick with you if they have to buy everything new anyway. This was a very big mistake on JR's part, particularly because they were very late into the market with their new 28x. At the time of this discussion it was nothing more than a phantom TX. Many of their loyal customers went to other brands. Since the 28x has been launched, many people who bought it purely on "JR faith" have been seriously disappointed with it.

If you honestly compare it to other high end tx's , at this stage it is far less capable. Guys can't even get it to give voice prompts that they would like ( BTW, as you know, a DX-18G2 can do this). There is a huge host of other inadequacies with it.

Personally, I took the opportunity ( change in protocol) to move to Jeti which was far more established and offered the proven abilities that I was looking for. This after being a JR customer for 17 years.

I took offence to your suggesting that I can't afford it. There is a difference in being able to afford it and choosing not to buy it because I don't think it is worth the money being asked of it. Remember, you're posting in the jet section here, I have landing gear with more money in it than a 28x LOL.

Mike

rmh

I always enjoy reading the reasons why various brands are claimed /perceived to be superior.
In today's world - perception is the new reality.
I don't fly expensive models anymore but I do enjoy the present day offerings -even more
The radios ?
Technology has reached a point where the RF link capable of flying ANY line of sight model ,can be had for a couple of hundred bucks
No superior chips -no superior protocols - read the regs -they all play the same way -by regulation.
So, what's really superior?
Mostly perception and lots of add ons.
Same as present day trends in cars -
all the add ons have not really improved transportation-
But if you think your choice is superior -- the ad guys have done their jobs.
That's the great part about hobbies-perception rules.

chorner

RMh, if you rate cars by add-ons that's your first problem. No they are not all the same, but by the same token marketing does play a large part in convincing potential buyers that cheap equipment is worth more than it is. The one thing I always say about my Audi when guys ask "how do you like your car" is that it has simply become "a car" to me at this point, but that when sitting in another car and coming back to drive my own car is when I notice the difference in all areas of attention to detail and quality in my car.

Mike, that makes sense and it seems I mis read on that level of understanding (in terms of putting other brands in line with JR at present for you having to "start again" so to speak). You're right in your comment about not being able to afford it... but I have to say hanging out in the jet section means nothing in terms of how much money an individual has I know a couple of jet guys at MMFC who fly nothing but foam jets

To speak honestly about the 28x I would have to say there are 2 main dissapointments in the radio for me. 1) being the silly 10 second limit on the main gear sequencer timeline at this point and 2) the fact that programmable voice commands are done through the flight mode menus, and that the synthesized voice isn't the best voice for clarity IMO. 2 things the DX18 currently does better.

Overall though, the hardware is miles better. With a couple small software fixes, for me, it'd be perfect.

rmh

You like your choices - warts n all -
Does not make em better choices for others . Can you imagine everyone driving Audis?
the line up at the service desk would go for miles -----

chorner

I've only ever visited the service desk on my scheduled service dates I'd hate however to sit in the line up at the local Ford dealer... my family loves Ford trucks and Explorers. I can't count the number of times on both hands that the vehicles have been in for service. Always something wrong. A high quality car, just like a high quality radio is not for everyone... but to simply state it is up to personal preference is naive. Better quality is better quality, whether one person "likes" it or not. I loved my old Mustang GT... had more personality than my Audi and definitely had fun driving it, but in no way shape or form was it a better built car that's for sure. Just like the DX18 I bought had some nice features, but there's no way it's even remotely in the same league overall as this 28x... just a fact.

rmh

Yeh - well price n quality are not necessarily hard linked .
My brother had an extremely successful business buying lease/rental - and reselling the cars
The relevant part here , is that original price of the cars and the required repairs /maintenance to make them ready for resale was not related.
The best?
Toyota family, Subaru and Honda family.
The worst ?
Maserati-Ferrari and the "odd ball" miniature cars
The RC radio business is somewhat similar .
The residual value is a very good indicator of the long term value.
Perceived value --very important to some - and if the buyer is pleased -that's all that counts
Actual performance capabilities of the radios TODAY-- another matter altogether.
The majority of RC sales favors radios in the 200-600 buck range
Excellent RF and 90% of the "add on"features available at any price.

chorner

rMH, pretty sure you're derailed enough to now be completely missing the point. When you buy a radio you don't buy it based on resale value. Put it this way... I would not buy used to begin with, but if I did... Let's say you can afford a $2,699 radio. What would someone sell it for used, that someone in the target market would actually buy it for? Think about it. The more expensive the radio the more you lose relative to the retail purchase price. If you chopped $500 off the radio, at that point I'd rather just buy new. $1000 off and now there's a big enough difference to get my attention, and the radio would have to be in mint condition but even then... I'm buying something not within a price bracket but a quality bracket. Two different lines of thought.

Residual on RC radios has no bearing. Yes the majority of radios sold are probably within that range. But the 28x is not aimed at those people who shop based #1 on price. Your excellent performance is my piece of crap...

rmh

I was only attempting to address how one could assess the difference in price and value

Can I afford the $2600 radio? If I could ever find a reason why the price was justified --I would buy a couple in a heartbeat .
- I could never rationalize it, simply because I can't find any reason to spend that much .
But -I do rationalize my spending cars, comm, audio visual equip etc.- we all have our failings----
My radio equipment is hardly crap- - it works perfectly -or I would never have kept it.
Pretty is as pretty does.
.

chorner

You cannot compare a Spektrum radio or the Spektrum RF protocol to this new system. It's just nowhere near as good. Period. That's really all that needs to be said. It's not "marketing", it's simp,y better. As a matter of fact, JR has pretty poor marketing while Horizon/Spektrum have the best in the industry. Seems their marketing has made you believe Spektrum is just as good anyhow I'm done with the convo here in this thread

FalconWings

My Feedback: (57)

Meanwhile my JR 9303 with the Spektrum 2.4 conversion is just as good as ever.

JR really needs to work on their marketing as it is just not getting to me..........................These new radios look very pretty though.

FalconWings

My Feedback: (57)

Spektrum for 8 years, same radio.......never a hit or anything. Must have a good one LOL!

rmh

As long as the system works -is easy to setup , cost effective and reliable - what else is required?

chorner

My old 42Mhz Futaba radio still works, it's awesome! All I could ever need... it works, it's reliable, never dropped a signal... boy these new radios sure are shiny though!

lol... I hope you guys finally stop being such fuddy duddys, that's the only reason you don't see that this new radio is excellent and of course costs more than a run of the mill radio suited for old fuddy duddys I guess I can hear you guys now "aww come on, why does a business have to try and improve their products and sell us more stuff? I don't get it. Why isn't every radio $200 and the same as the one 10 years ago... awe man this new protocol and switching gear because of it... why do they got to go and ruin this hobby"?

Hahaha I've got you guys finally figured out

FalconWings

My Feedback: (57)

Zzzzzzz Zzzzzzzzzz

Sorry to dissapoint you but this is not radical. This reminds me to the Homer mobile. When 2.4 came out, that was radical, a game changer........When PCM came out, that was another game changer, when Futaba S Bus came out, another game changer................adding Android so I can watch porntube while I wait to takeoff sounds nice......but yout have to try harder...................gimme another game changer.......and this fuddy daddy who probably has more creativity and technical knowledge than you (trust me on it ;-) ) will follow you.

chorner

Haha! ... good try Falcon. This has turned into a fun flame fest. I happen to own a successful business programming applications for companies such as John Hancock, Holiday Inn, BMO and others. I'm pretty sure I know a thing or two about this "creativity" and "technical knowledge" you boast. My background is in computer engineering. PM me for the link to my business site if you're interested; we can have a chat.

Call this radio what you want, or mock whatever you think it's being pinned as. Separating themselves from DSM(x/s), and going their own way in creating a better protocol, then creating their next generation flagship radio is as good as any company has ever done. I don't know why you're arguing and getting bent over this in such a negative light. Do they have to "invent" 5Ghz RF modules now to do something "creative"? lol I suppose you could say the same about Apple products (or any other product type... insert here)... oh that gosh darn iPhone was nothing radical adding a touch-centric OS in a small format, so you can watch PornTube more easily. I guess it's "not radical" enough for your creative and technical genius and a waste of money, since Microsoft and HP had tablet concepts previously.. and Apple didn't do it first?

Hilarious

This right here immediately gives away your IQ. A true quote for the people! hahaha -> "Folks use complex systems in their models and still lose them to stupid mistakes. I try to keep things simple and minimize stupidity" - The Falcon

FalconWings

My Feedback: (57)

Dude you had me at Holiday Inn. Stop!

rmh

Niche marketing is tricky (That's where JR is at this point in time).
At one point in time - they commanded a good share of the US hobby market.- I used many of the JR types. Top notch stuff.
The majority of the market was the low end Futaba.
Spektrum -with their intro of 2.4 use, left the others wondering what happened -
That is old news of course .
The scramble for the crumbs , then a better market share ,has proven interesting .
The explosion of phone technology and the availability of cheap ,advanced "chips" made anyone with a few bucks, a player.
Toys costing retail, 39.95 have 2.4 technology, GPS, stabilization etc..
Now how do you command ove r$2000 for the SAME basic technology?
Tricky- the FCC sets parameters which box you into the SAME window as the $39.95 stuff.
Chips are not something you can churn out over a backyard grill-- so you are left with using chip technology which is available to just about everyone. And it is incredibly good and cheap.
That leaves you with hardware and programming and last but not least some method of convincing new buyers you have something worth the price you need to grab a chunk of the market.
Marketing manufacturing and support are essential in this market -and are COSTS which can kill you. If you can't spread costs over many units -you have to charge a LOT more - for the same product!.
That can seriously affect how different your product can actually be.
I don't envy them But niche markets exist -always have - I once sold to only the "carriage trade"

Problem is -it is a fickle market.
Without a volume product , things just get very tricky
Your product has to be as capable and still offer features not available for less money elsewhere Avery tall order
Futaba has their high end stuff -and since it's inception - I have seen very few in use in our area.
The new JR28 has lots of features they hope will attract new customers
Honestly I believe the technological advancements-which keep coming at an increasing rate, will force the prices on all of our radio equipment------ down.

Jeti USA

You need another step in evolution, here it is:
This is something for new DS/DC-24 radio, new radio will have 2x RF 2.4GHz and 1x 900MHz modules.
The 900MHz link will be used as backup.

There are places where the 2.4GHz spectrum is getting to the point of saturation, tons of noise.

Zb/Jeti USA

FalconWings

My Feedback: (57)

Not only that, with military UAV contractors starting to really enjoy the easy access to commercial Tx/Rx use, they will quickly find that 2.4GHz is extremely easy to jam using low-tech equipment.
Something has to be done within the commercially available 2.4 band, and I think modelers will benefit from it very soon.