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skymaster 1/6 f-16 3D flying

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skymaster 1/6 f-16 3D flying

Old 05-18-2014, 07:49 AM
  #26  
Justflying1
 
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Bikecrasher so in post 22 you explain to me that centrifugal force is what causes stress on the bearings which I'm not going to dispute as I don't know much on this. However you than state in post 25 how you have done nearly 50 hours with your Kingtech with no apparent affect which seems to me to contradict your previous statement.
You than turn this on Jetcat which must make you a real WANKER to do that.

Last edited by Justflying1; 05-18-2014 at 07:51 AM. Reason: Spelling
Old 05-18-2014, 01:11 PM
  #27  
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Haha wanker???? Righto..... just saying that kingtechs at my field has been more reliable than jetcat including my own engines.
for you to even say that for metioning that well you have issues mate.
have a good life stooge
Old 05-18-2014, 05:56 PM
  #28  
Airplanes400
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Originally Posted by cigartoyz View Post
So i am in the market for another jet. I have a carf ultra flash that i love and i wanted to get a scale jet. Originally i was looking at the skymaster mig29 with thrust vectoring. I have had a change of heart for a multitude of reasons. One is budget and the other is the design of the jet. I recently saw a video of the skymaster f16 1/6 scale flying 3d. Has anyone built this jet with a thrust vectoring pipe. I would like to get some input on the setup. I am waiting on an answer from Anton but i figured i would throw it out there.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIWMTLda3jY
That is some awesome flying. It was entertaining, and some of the best flying I've seen. Wish I was that good.
Old 05-18-2014, 06:25 PM
  #29  
cigartoyz
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And it was confirmed by Anton Lin that the avanti xxl VT nozzel will work with the f16 and the airframe can handle that type of flying.....
Old 05-18-2014, 08:16 PM
  #30  
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Bikecrasher,

I own 3 KingTech's and agree they are at the top of their game when it comes to quality, dependability, service and TRUE thrust you can trust but if I'm not mistaken, the manual says to send the turbine in for 25hr service cycles. Yep, I just read from pages 38-43 and every model requires a 25hr service. You state you have 50hrs on your 170? Are you running special oil & fuel that allows you to exceed the factory specs or do you run your turbines until they puke their guts out? I don't think KingTechs lifetime warranty would cover blatant abuse.


Just sayin,

Ghostrider 1
Old 05-18-2014, 08:44 PM
  #31  
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I run em until I get a problem then send them in for service. Dont mind paying for ware and tare on them. For the record I have 5 kingtechs one jetcat one amt two behotecs and wren.
I have been in jets for a long time plus I used to rebuild full size stuff for GE.
not to mention that I own and restoring my own fullsize mig21 and have restored other full size warbird components in my working life.
Old 05-19-2014, 09:13 AM
  #32  
cigartoyz
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awesome!! i wanna see pics of the 21.
Originally Posted by bikecrasher View Post
I run em until I get a problem then send them in for service. Dont mind paying for ware and tare on them. For the record I have 5 kingtechs one jetcat one amt two behotecs and wren.
I have been in jets for a long time plus I used to rebuild full size stuff for GE.
not to mention that I own and restoring my own fullsize mig21 and have restored other full size warbird components in my working life.
Old 05-19-2014, 09:23 AM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by gunradd View Post
I disagree that doing 3D hurts your engine. I pull way more Gs doing my high speed turn at full throttle then I do when flipping at almost no airspeed doing 3D with my F22.

I thought just the same thing the other day after reading some of these posts. I'll do a tight turn at 200mph with my bobcat and a P120, that has to load the bearings on the turbine 10X more than a flat spin. No? I'm not an engineer, but I do think I have a fair amount of common sense.
Old 05-19-2014, 09:41 AM
  #34  
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Yeah and I guess you don't mind loosing warranty because if you don't send them in for service after 25 hrs say bye bye to your warranty
Old 05-19-2014, 05:29 PM
  #35  
Airplanes400
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Well, then I guess I shouldn't tell you that I buy & replace my bearings myself when I need them. They only cost $142.00 for a pair. That's much cheaper than sending the engine out. Several other guys I know do it too. We found a bearing supplier that sells bearing for JetCat, Wren, Kingtech, Behotec, AMT, PST, etc. In the long run, it works out better.

Last edited by Airplanes400; 05-19-2014 at 05:51 PM.
Old 05-19-2014, 06:57 PM
  #36  
cigartoyz
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Originally Posted by Airplanes400 View Post
Well, then I guess I shouldn't tell you that I buy & replace my bearings myself when I need them. They only cost $142.00 for a pair. That's much cheaper than sending the engine out. Several other guys I know do it too. We found a bearing supplier that sells bearing for JetCat, Wren, Kingtech, Behotec, AMT, PST, etc. In the long run, it works out better.
Boca bearings?
Old 05-19-2014, 08:49 PM
  #37  
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Some low cost bearings on the market the one I replaced had different coloured ball bearings lighter in colour then the boca ones didn't last long maybe 5 hours.
Old 05-20-2014, 11:18 AM
  #38  
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Airplanes400,

Doesn't the turbine have to be balanced after you take it apart or do you have your own balancing machine?
Old 05-20-2014, 03:49 PM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by cigartoyz View Post
Boca bearings?
That's it.
Old 05-20-2014, 07:52 PM
  #40  
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Here you go cigar!!!! The silver one is from out of Poland. Its still over there I need to go and pull it down and bring it back. the camo one is from Tulsa in Oklahoma. Its a ex Egyptian air force bird with just over 400 hours total time.
They both will be overhauled and flown for supersonic and adventure flights here in Perth Western Australia.
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Old 05-21-2014, 04:17 PM
  #41  
Airplanes400
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Holy crap !! That's amazing, and it sure blows away anything I do with my toy jets.

Those wings are so tiny, thin and short. Basically, those jets are really missiles with enlarged fins!

Best of success to you.
Old 05-21-2014, 04:58 PM
  #42  
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Thanks airplanes....
it been a long time coming. I cant wait to feel the power of the afterburner. With all the stuff removed that I dont need and rebalanced it should have just over 1 to 1 power to weight fully fueled with two guys in it.
im runnung the r25 engines that have around 7000kg of thrust.
Cant wait.
Old 05-22-2014, 05:07 AM
  #43  
cigartoyz
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sweet bike.....if you ever fly that bad boy to the US look me up....I want a ride!!
Old 05-22-2014, 05:10 AM
  #44  
cigartoyz
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Just an update of the 3d f-16. I have been in touch with the owner of the plane along with skymaster and jet central and everything is more than capable to handle 3d. There is more stress on the airframe at high speed than 3d. It looks like it may be a GO!
Old 05-22-2014, 05:48 AM
  #45  
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Originally Posted by Bobneal1 View Post
If you do a lot of flipping and flopping you need to service your bearings at half the normal time interval minimum ! I lost my euro to a bearing failure. You tube has lots of videos of engines locking up on TV model aircraft.


Just my 2 cents.
Bob Neal
+1

Just to be clear, flat spins aren't the problem, it's the constant change in directions experienced in "flipping and flopping" or very aggressive snap rolls; and not a single change in direction by a high speed turn or pull. And it is not isolated to one or two manufacturers, every single engine (four different brands) I have done this type of flying with has had premature failure, but I have not lost a plane from it, just burned a couple. The engines that have not experience these forces have had no problems, so in my experience, it is a problem!

I would not discourage anyone from wanting or having an "aerobatic / 3D" jet, I love having a plane that I can do this with, just know if you are "hard" on the engine as I have described, you may experience the same. Good luck with your project.
Old 05-22-2014, 06:12 AM
  #46  
cigartoyz
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I hear what you are saying. I dont think i will be flying hard every flight. I just want the ability to fly 3d. More hovering and super high alpha more than flipping and flopping.
Old 05-22-2014, 06:58 AM
  #47  
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Originally Posted by Airplanes400 View Post
Well, then I guess I shouldn't tell you that I buy & replace my bearings myself when I need them. They only cost $142.00 for a pair. That's much cheaper than sending the engine out. Several other guys I know do it too. We found a bearing supplier that sells bearing for JetCat, Wren, Kingtech, Behotec, AMT, PST, etc. In the long run, it works out better.
+1
Old 05-22-2014, 09:16 AM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by Airplanes400 View Post
Well, then I guess I shouldn't tell you that I buy & replace my bearings myself when I need them. They only cost $142.00 for a pair. That's much cheaper than sending the engine out. Several other guys I know do it too. We found a bearing supplier that sells bearing for JetCat, Wren, Kingtech, Behotec, AMT, PST, etc. In the long run, it works out better.

Yeah and I suppose you use your DUBRO balancer to make sure the turbine wheel is still in balance too ehh?

And probably use clorox to clean your injectors....with a toothbrush
Old 05-22-2014, 10:57 AM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by DrScoles View Post
I thought just the same thing the other day after reading some of these posts. I'll do a tight turn at 200mph with my bobcat and a P120, that has to load the bearings on the turbine 10X more than a flat spin. No? I'm not an engineer, but I do think I have a fair amount of common sense.
Mike, its not the centrifugal force (G loading) that's the issue. Its the gyroscopic effects of the axis of rotation changing quickly, causing loads on the bearing in addition to G's pulled.

A ~10G turn will give high centrifugal loads, but a shaft assembly weighing 10X the weight still isn't much. In that case, the change in rotational axis direction is actually quite slow as well. 3D manuvers and flopping around, etc. are low centrifugal but very high gyroscopic due to the rapid change in shaft orientation. I haven't done any of the math, but that's the underlying reason.

Kelly
Old 05-22-2014, 11:07 AM
  #50  
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+1 on gyroscopic effects.

Also, I don't know if the bearings are necessarily the (only?) problem. When the first P-120s came out, if we did any sort of snapping maneuver with too high of a turbine shaft RPM, the compressor blades could touch the diffuser cover and break the recurved tips off.

Later on I had a P-160 in the prototype of the CARF Rookie (long story) and I flipped it all the time with the pitch nozzle, no problem.

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