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What are the best 180-220 sized turbines today?

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What are the best 180-220 sized turbines today?

Old 01-31-2016, 03:53 PM
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MattyMatt
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Default What are the best 180-220 sized turbines today?

I just read through the Jet Cat service thread, and have been watching the last two years at jet events, about what works and what doesn't.

I belive we are at the point with Turbine Jets, that many people are coming into this segment, from other disciplines, such as IMAC, pattern... And we are expecting more uptime for the turbines. And, even those that have been into this segment for a long time are really spending all their time and $'s in jets only.

Ive watched all of them fail at events, and am wondering what really is the best 180-220 sized turbines. Best as in, reliable, consistent power in the mid range, throttle response, weight, and of course if there is an issue or just time for maintenance... Service.

I'd like this to be an adult discussion.... And no sponsor BS.

What really is the best?

Your experience and your view.

Last edited by MattyMatt; 01-31-2016 at 03:59 PM.
Old 01-31-2016, 06:24 PM
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jws_aces
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Hey Buddy you know what I use.

I really have been satisfied with the service. I have had some very small issues with my Kingtech turbines and every time I had them repaired and back to me very quickly. I know none of the brands are perfect like you said.

I can say I haven't missed any event because I could get support or service on my Kingtech turbines.

I am getting my second 210g to go back into my Hawk for the RedFlag event.

The 210g is the best bang for the money. I also see Craig South is selling one for a good deal with low time. I would have bought it but I already picked up a new one.
Old 01-31-2016, 06:47 PM
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George
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Matt,

I doubt you'll get very many objective comments because It's very subjective and biases will skew observations, whether intented or not.

I have been doing this for a decent time using almost every brand over the years; and I can tell you none are perfect and ALL can and do have problems with some being bigger than others, and some which are just quirks.

As you know, you can learn a lot at the events. If you're not happy with your current equipment, you'll get the best information in person.

We'll talk next time we're at the same meet.
Old 01-31-2016, 07:14 PM
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Delta Mike
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The AMT/NL OLYMPUS HP has been unchanged since 2004. Now producing 55lbs of thrust, it is in a class by itself. No other turbine on the market has had that long of a service record without being redesigned! Yes, it may be a few pounds heavier but nothing can compare to its record of reliability, performance and service. NOTHING!
Old 01-31-2016, 09:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Delta Mike View Post
The AMT/NL OLYMPUS HP has been unchanged since 2004. Now producing 55lbs of thrust, it is in a class by itself. No other turbine on the market has had that long of a service record without being redesigned! Yes, it may be a few pounds heavier but nothing can compare to its record of reliability, performance and service. NOTHING!
100% bang-on !!!

BUT....unfortunately they do not offer a turbine in your specified range.

Cheers,

Jan

Last edited by Springbok Flyer; 01-31-2016 at 09:42 PM.
Old 01-31-2016, 11:36 PM
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MattyMatt
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Originally Posted by George View Post
Matt,

I doubt you'll get very many objective comments because It's very subjective and biases will skew observations, whether intented or not.

I have been doing this for a decent time using almost every brand over the years; and I can tell you none are perfect and ALL can and do have problems with some being bigger than others, and some which are just quirks.

As you know, you can learn a lot at the events. If you're not happy with your current equipment, you'll get the best information in person.

We'll talk next time we're at the same meet.


Hey George,

I'm asking this because that is exactly the issue... All having their quarks and such. I'm not the only one asking this. I've spoken with a lot of people about this and there are several of us that have had this discussion.

It it seems to me that it is rare to find turbines that 90%+ make it to their normal service intervals without some kind of failures, with normal use. All are basically 25-50 hours, and it seems rare to find them make it without failure.

With as many Turbine manufactures out there... Should it be this way?

I expect to be able to fly to the normal service internals without any issues... Several hundred flights, with out a hiccup.

For example, (not picking in them or Jeff), As Jeff mentioned above, a bunch of guys are flying Kingtec, and the service seems to be very good. But, again... They aren't normally making it to the service internal of 25 hours, consistently. This is what I observe.


I completely understand, as most people do, that these aren't bullet proof and ALL manufactures have their issues, no matter what you are buying. BUT, today's expectations are that things will work consistently well, and when there is an issue that the service is there to support.
Old 01-31-2016, 11:47 PM
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darryltarr
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With my limited turbine experience (15 years, and having worked with almost every brand), I would consider the following nowadays:

Behotec JB-220
Jet Italia (Kaiman 190 or Atom 250)
evoJet B220ex
Old 01-31-2016, 11:47 PM
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MattyMatt
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Originally Posted by Delta Mike View Post
The AMT/NL OLYMPUS HP has been unchanged since 2004. Now producing 55lbs of thrust, it is in a class by itself. No other turbine on the market has had that long of a service record without being redesigned! Yes, it may be a few pounds heavier but nothing can compare to its record of reliability, performance and service. NOTHING!
Hey Mike,

I've heard that consistently.

I only see two issues, they are very expensive and heavy. But, from a reliability stand point... What you've said is what I hear and haven't seen any issues with people that have them.
Old 02-01-2016, 01:29 AM
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The same experience like Tarryltarr with Behotec JB 180 / 220.
No truble in use with both and the have 74 h and 78 h in use less any maintenance !
Old 02-01-2016, 04:31 AM
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ajp
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I have been flying turbines since 1999 and have been thru the following brands

-Ram
-Jetcat
-Wren
--Jetcentral

Having flown Jetcentral, for the last 3 years I have noticed their maintenance standards slipping lately. My next brand to try will be. Merlin jetmuts
Old 02-01-2016, 05:31 AM
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raron455
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Kingtech 210, runs flawlessly, quick spool, tons of thrust, had problems with it in the beginning, but that was my fault on a plumbing issue. Sent it in to be checked after losing my last airframe, 2.5 weeks, and its back on its way home after multiple runs on the test bench said it runs in perfect condition.
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Old 02-01-2016, 08:00 AM
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RCISFUN
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The New Jet Central Rhino SE 200, 45 Lbs of thrust, brand new "Jet Central" designed electronics (SE).

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/rc-j...ts-2016-a.html
Old 02-01-2016, 08:06 AM
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When I read a while back (wish I could find the thread for you, but I am RCU 'search'-challenged) that Ali Machinchy had pretty much gone all Kingtech, that was good enough for me. Don't know if this is still true, but I do know I recall reading his comments about switching to Kingtech and being very satisfied with the move.
Old 02-01-2016, 08:50 AM
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I have to echo the sentiments expressed on the AMT NL Olympus. I have used turbines from most of the manufactures over the years. Those that I haven't used it is because I didn't feel comfortable with their reliability, or I was treated poorly by their sales team. No hard feelings, I don't have to use any particular engine. I started with RAM turbines back in the day, 2000 to be exact. I had my ups and downs with RAM. Then I bought my first AMT Pegasus. The AMT never gave me a hiccup. I've been with other manufactures who's engine ran very well and had minimal issues but I keep coming back to AMT. I currently have four AMT engines and when choosing the engine for my JMP Firebird the Olympus was the only choice. Not that there wasn't other engines that would work, but in an airframe that is designed for speed and is almost a certain guarantee of problems if the engine quits, there was simply no other choice. 16 years of turbine flying and never once have I had an AMT quit or fail in any capacity. They are more expensive, they are heavier, and they do seem somewhat archaic, but peace of mind for me outweighs the other things. When you are talking jets large enough for an Olympus the extra weight and size are negligible.
Old 02-01-2016, 08:53 AM
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yeahbaby
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Originally Posted by Delta Mike View Post
The AMT/NL OLYMPUS HP has been unchanged since 2004. Now producing 55lbs of thrust, it is in a class by itself. No other turbine on the market has had that long of a service record without being redesigned! Yes, it may be a few pounds heavier but nothing can compare to its record of reliability, performance and service. NOTHING!

+1
Old 02-01-2016, 08:57 AM
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yeahbaby
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Also might consider the JB220. I only have limited experience with mine but I'm impressed thus far and looking forward to more flying this year.
Old 02-01-2016, 09:02 AM
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If you want the best quality available on the market, go for what most UAV operators use: AMT, Behotec and BF Turbines.
They are more expensive but for a reason...


For info, the Behotec 220 was the first engine with a 160 can size to produce 220 N + of thrust 6 years ago. At this time, most people were saying that this was a scam, that he engine would blow out... However we are still operating the first 220 and it is running strong. Since then, everyone has copied this specific design, but no one has matched it yet...
It has still the best power to weight ratio ever tested by RCJI, second best TFSC, with an unmatched level of reliability.
Old 02-01-2016, 02:08 PM
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More jetcat engines are used in commercial uav operations than all other manufacturers combined.
I also vote for Behotec, the 180GOLD and JB 220 have been excellent.
Old 02-01-2016, 02:19 PM
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The Behotec and BF units are indeed beautiful to look at and seem extremely well made. Unfortunate that they chose the ProJet ECU .. not that it's a bad ECU, I'm sure it's terrific but they have very little support from the telemetry gang, and from what I have read here, the ProJet team has very little interest in making info available to the telemetry guys who want to support them.

That would be the only hesitancy I'd have about them.

Dave
Old 02-02-2016, 06:10 AM
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Stick with the big brands .JetCat and Behotec in this class.
I never had a problem with JetCat and i have experience with more than 40 turbines in the last ten years.
The fails you sometime witness can also be from bad installation you know.
Old 02-03-2016, 10:54 AM
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JimBrown
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Originally Posted by ww2birds View Post
The Behotec and BF units are indeed beautiful to look at and seem extremely well made. Unfortunate that they chose the ProJet ECU .. not that it's a bad ECU, I'm sure it's terrific but they have very little support from the telemetry gang, and from what I have read here, the ProJet team has very little interest in making info available to the telemetry guys who want to support them.

That would be the only hesitancy I'd have about them.

Dave
Dave, have you had a look at this item?

http://www.vspeak-modell.de/en/ecu-converter/hornet

I've got one installed for my JB-66 in my Phoenix. Telemetry to my Jeti DS-16. No need for the GSU, the Jetibox emulator on the DS-16 lets me see and operate the ECU the same as the GSU. That is in addition to telemetry values that I can display and/or set alarms for.

Also works with other TX brands.

Got a second one for my 180 Gold in my Scorpion.

...jim
Old 02-03-2016, 12:03 PM
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ww2birds
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Wow .. that's really cool. I do still have one Wren 180 with a ProJet ECU so it would be really useful to have one of those.

Many thanks Jim!

Dave
Old 02-03-2016, 12:20 PM
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Hello,
A well-known brand in Europe Frankturbine
http://www.frankturbine.com

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHFAwnVuR3w&feature=share
Old 02-03-2016, 03:31 PM
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bem
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Hi,

You may want to check what Hawk Turbine can offer also:

http://www.hawkturbine.com/

Most of the dealers are in Europe but one is in Canada.

/Bo
Old 02-06-2016, 02:23 PM
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MattyMatt
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Originally Posted by bem View Post
Hi,

You may want to check what Hawk Turbine can offer also:

http://www.hawkturbine.com/

Most of the dealers are in Europe but one is in Canada.

/Bo
looks good... Any support in the US?

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