Go Back  RCU Forums > RC Airplanes > RC Jets
Reload this Page >

Usher F-106 Roll Out

Notices
RC Jets Discuss RC jets in this forum plus rc turbines and ducted fan power systems

Usher F-106 Roll Out

Old 11-14-2005, 09:49 PM
  #1  
I-NAV
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (3)
 
I-NAV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Mililani, HI
Posts: 616
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default Usher F-106 Roll Out

After several years interupted by deployments and other projects it's done. Jet cat P-80, BVM T-Bird gear, functioning airbrakes and Andy Low light set. Weight is 19.5 pounds dry. 100oz of fuel with UAT. Engine runs didn't go well. The pipe collapsed at full power and have some paint blistering to fix. It's a full-bypass set up so damage was pretty light, but a bummer I didn't get to fly. New pipe in the works so I'll try again in a couple of weeks.

Mike
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	Om33128.jpg
Views:	278
Size:	51.6 KB
ID:	354523   Click image for larger version

Name:	Ni25023.jpg
Views:	207
Size:	62.1 KB
ID:	354524   Click image for larger version

Name:	Di10646.jpg
Views:	222
Size:	60.4 KB
ID:	354525  
Old 11-14-2005, 09:52 PM
  #2  
I-NAV
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (3)
 
I-NAV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Mililani, HI
Posts: 616
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out

Pics of the pipe.
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	Xv64818.jpg
Views:	265
Size:	60.5 KB
ID:	354526   Click image for larger version

Name:	Yt60476.jpg
Views:	383
Size:	58.8 KB
ID:	354527  
Old 11-14-2005, 10:25 PM
  #3  
WhoDaMan
My Feedback: (164)
 
WhoDaMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Davis, CA
Posts: 4,243
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out

Hi Mike:
Gorgeous plane. Why do you think the pipe did that?

Dave
Old 11-15-2005, 03:00 AM
  #4  
I-NAV
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (3)
 
I-NAV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Mililani, HI
Posts: 616
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out

We think it folded at the edge behind the exhaust. I heard a rumbling sound right before it collapsed. Since the lip had no flange or bellmouth it started resonating like a reed then went crunch. It then made a rude farting sound and the smoke started. [&o] The alu outer wall melted though in no time.

Mike
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	Vt58188.jpg
Views:	244
Size:	52.4 KB
ID:	354655  
Old 11-15-2005, 04:19 AM
  #5  
Aero65
My Feedback: (2)
 
Aero65's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Honolulu, HI
Posts: 922
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out

Hi Mike

That is one sweet looking bird! You have to see it in person to appreciate Mikes work. He does an awesome job of finishing his aircraft, inside and out. I can't wait to see it fly the F-106 is one of my favorite airplanes.

Yes that was such a weird sequence of events and sounds, im just so glad the damage was minimal. We will make sure and have the Hawaii tracking and telemetry group snaping pics for your first flight Mike.
Old 11-15-2005, 12:44 PM
  #6  
scale dail
Senior Member
My Feedback: (8)
 
scale dail's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Saugus, CA
Posts: 1,471
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out

I have been eyeing that kit for quite a while please keep us posted on the progress!
Old 11-15-2005, 01:02 PM
  #7  
grbaker
My Feedback: (29)
 
grbaker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: La Porte TX
Posts: 3,496
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out

Didn't Rich Fong fly one of those for a long time. Seems like I recall reading an article he wrote about 106 flights on the 106.

BTW Looks great Mike. Good luck with the maiden flight.
Old 11-15-2005, 01:35 PM
  #8  
patf
My Feedback: (4)
 
patf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 1,727
Received 13 Likes on 13 Posts
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out

glad to see you could put down the umbrella drinks for a bit mike! looks really good.. you might check with joey tamez on a new pipe if you cannot prcure locally..
Old 11-15-2005, 01:47 PM
  #9  
F106A
My Feedback: (2)
 
F106A's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Clifton, NJ
Posts: 1,856
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out

Gary,
Rich was the first to convert the F-106 to turbine power. He wrote three articles, around 5 years ago, in RCJI. The first two was a kit review, the 3rd was a followup article about a year later.
Rich modified the kit extensivly, replacing all the ply formers with c/f, he changed the wing hold down method, etc.
Anyone contemplating building the kit should get the back issues, if they're still available, to read Rich's comments.
He was very helpful whenever I had a question and he always reponded with the answer. This goes for Mike Lesher too, he always
answered my numerous e-mails and was a big help in completing my model.
Good luck with the 1st flight.
BRG,
Jon
Old 11-15-2005, 02:07 PM
  #10  
ghost_rider
My Feedback: (20)
 
ghost_rider's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Ft Wayne, IN
Posts: 4,488
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out


ORIGINAL: I-NAV

Pics of the pipe.
Mike

Who made the pipe?. At Spiderman Jets this year, my friend’s Tiger shark experienced similar problem and burnt to ashes. His Pipe was made in FL.

My opinion is that anybody that wants a nice and reliable pipe for his airplane should dial 1-800-CALL-TAM. He makes the best pipe as far as I am concerned.


Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	Pm34829.jpg
Views:	346
Size:	64.0 KB
ID:	354830  
Old 11-15-2005, 09:34 PM
  #11  
Darryl Usher
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Cornelius, OR
Posts: 624
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out

It seems that the line up turbine to inner ducting was not right, the normal JetCat engine mount is not on the center line, this may be the problem.
Darryl Usher
Old 11-15-2005, 11:39 PM
  #12  
EASYTIGER
Banned
My Feedback: (119)
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: nyc, NY
Posts: 7,676
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out

Beautiful model, nice work.
Old 11-16-2005, 01:05 AM
  #13  
Molar mender
 
Molar mender's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Lake Tapps, WA
Posts: 804
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out

ORIGINAL: I-NAV

We think it folded at the edge behind the exhaust. I heard a rumbling sound right before it collapsed. Since the lip had no flange or bellmouth it started resonating like a reed then went crunch. It then made a rude farting sound and the smoke started. [&o] The alu outer wall melted though in no time.

Mike
Mike

If the edge folded, then it produced a misdirected exhaust flow which, as I recall from some older posts, set up a lower pressure inside the pipe causing the higher atmospheric pressure on the outside of the pipe to crush it. All the extra noise are the residual thrust trying to find its way through the maze. Sorry about your pipe. Nice looking six.

Roy
Old 11-16-2005, 01:19 AM
  #14  
I-NAV
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (3)
 
I-NAV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Mililani, HI
Posts: 616
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out

Turbine was lined up using a laser in the exhaust nozzle shinning onto a target in the center of the pipe at the front and rear. Mounts were adjusted in height to match the Jetcat mount so I think I had that covered. What about the bypass being too small for the turbine causing a vacume at the rear? See pics. I'm going to move the turbine back an inch in the duct to allow more flow. Any thoughts?
Old 11-16-2005, 02:09 AM
  #15  
Molar mender
 
Molar mender's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Lake Tapps, WA
Posts: 804
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out

Mike

Sounds like you had the pipe lined up correctly. Rich Fong flew his F-106 here at Whidbey in 1999 and did his article in RCJI about that same time. The attached photo is from the Dec 99/Jan 2000 RCJI and shows a great shot of the rear outlet ducting. As I recall the external bypass had a slight flair at the very end which the photo shows. That could produce a scavageing effect that would keep the pressures in their proper proportions. I am looking through the rest of my mags to see if I can find the rest of his article.

Roy
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	Ec87229.jpg
Views:	217
Size:	211.6 KB
ID:	355237  
Old 11-16-2005, 08:33 AM
  #16  
f106jax
My Feedback: (16)
 
f106jax's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Lebanon, PA
Posts: 961
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out

Mike,

I took additional measurements from the bypass in my Six and found that the leading edge of the inner pipe is 5/8 inch behind the turbine tailcone. At the trailing edge, the inner pipe ends 3/4 inch before the end of the outer pipe. I have 7 flights on my Six with the aluminum outer pipe before I had Darryl make me a stainless outer pipe. My aluminum outer pipe experienced minor crumpling which is why I wanted the stainless pipe constructed.

Keep at it, you'll enjoy flying the Six! You've motivated me to get the final paint work done and get mine back in the air next year.

Roy,

What appears to be a flair on the external pipe is actually a fiberglass "rocket nozzle" that is scale. The actual pipes, inner and outer, do not have any flairs on either the front or rear.
Old 11-16-2005, 08:48 AM
  #17  
f106jax
My Feedback: (16)
 
f106jax's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Lebanon, PA
Posts: 961
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out

Mike,

In looking much closer at your number 2 photo in post 2, I believe that I may have found the problem. The outer tailcone of the P-80 does not extend as far back as the tailcone of the P-120, which is what I'm using. It appears that the inner exhaust tube was too far behind the turbine outer tailcone, permitting hot exhaust to strike the rear of the fiberglass bypass and also enter the space between the inner and outer exhaust tubes. Just a guess on my part based on the photo. I know that you'll get this cat skinned soon and will be in the air shortly.
Old 11-16-2005, 10:07 AM
  #18  
tomcatman
Senior Member
My Feedback: (2)
 
tomcatman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Brandon, FL
Posts: 910
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out

I'm certainly no turbine expert, but I would tend to agree with Mike. It appears the tail cone was too far away from the pipe. I know I've seen this posted elsewhere before, but what exactly is the ideal separation between the tailcone and the pipe? Also, and I'm sure this goes without saying, if you move the engine back an inch, please don't forget to compensate for any changes in CG. Good luck on your maiden!! Regards,

Richie
Old 11-16-2005, 10:42 AM
  #19  
Molar mender
 
Molar mender's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Lake Tapps, WA
Posts: 804
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out

ORIGINAL: f106jax

Roy,

What appears to be a flair on the external pipe is actually a fiberglass "rocket nozzle" that is scale. The actual pipes, inner and outer, do not have any flairs on either the front or rear.
Mike (F106JAX)

Thanks for your input. Nice to hear from you. It was 1999 when I last saw Rich's 106 so the mind can do strange things in six years, especially at my age. Rich must have done such a fantastic job on his six tailcone that it fooled me into thinking it was part of the pipe. Nothing like firsthand knowledge and measurements to get Mike (I-NAV) back in the air.

Roy
Old 11-16-2005, 12:48 PM
  #20  
f106jax
My Feedback: (16)
 
f106jax's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Lebanon, PA
Posts: 961
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out

Roy,

When might you be coming east again? It was great having you in town a couple of years ago. You're always welcome and I look forward to your next trip east. Cindy and I are planning another cross country motorcycle trip for either next year or 2007. Hopefully, we'll be able to catch up with you at one of the northwest jet meets again.
Old 11-16-2005, 01:27 PM
  #21  
Darryl Usher
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Cornelius, OR
Posts: 624
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out

Mike: As to centering the turbine I used wooden feeler gages up the rear of the bypass. I think you would need to take off cone on the rear to us a laser light. The turbine wheel is just about 1/8" in front of hatch cover at the top.
Darryl
Old 11-16-2005, 05:17 PM
  #22  
JohnMac
 
JohnMac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Leeds, UNITED KINGDOM
Posts: 1,431
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out

Hi Mike,
What a great looking bird. Whilst I love modern jets, these cold war warriors have so much more character. And you don't see them everyday. I hope you get the pipe problem resolved soon and get her safely in the air.
Best Regards,

John
Old 11-16-2005, 06:41 PM
  #23  
Props4ever
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Mississauga, ON, CANADA
Posts: 4,196
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out

Hi Mike,

Very impressive looking bird, i have been pondering for yrs to build plastic but never got around to it, but you model being R/C turbined powered really blows me away...i would love to know how it flies and its flying chericterstics.

Sammy
Old 11-16-2005, 07:04 PM
  #24  
Molar mender
 
Molar mender's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Lake Tapps, WA
Posts: 804
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out

ORIGINAL: f106jax

Roy,

When might you be coming east again? It was great having you in town a couple of years ago. You're always welcome and I look forward to your next trip east. Cindy and I are planning another cross country motorcycle trip for either next year or 2007. Hopefully, we'll be able to catch up with you at one of the northwest jet meets again.
Mike

We were planning to be at your event this past year but the Madigan Army Medical Center called and scheduled my wife's cataract surgery. As a military retiree family, when they call you for medical treatment, you go. Reading all the posts for the Liberty Bell Jet meet, it sounded like you had a great time.
Next year, our district JPO rep is trying to put together a jet meet in Kalispell, Montana, possibly in late July. Last year we did not have the High Plains Jet meet in Deer Lodge so he is planning an alternative. I went to the Idaho jet meet in June at Cascade, Idaho and had a great time. They are also planning to continue that jet meet, only a little closer to Boise. We are still having Jets Over Whidbey during the last weekend in August. Dean has now changed the Princeton BC Canada Scale/Jet meet in mid Sept to just a jet meet, so there should be some activity in the Pacific NW for you to come and visit. Look forward to seeing you and Cindy again.

Roy
Old 11-16-2005, 09:45 PM
  #25  
I-NAV
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (3)
 
I-NAV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Mililani, HI
Posts: 616
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Usher F-106 Roll Out

Thanks to all on the comments and advice. Molar Mender was my dentist when I was 2nd Lt back at Mather and he's still helping me fix stuff. Mike and Daryl as well. So, it's turbine back a little in the duct, pipe closer to the cone, replace melted air lines and wire, prime, paint and fly. I'll give a PIREP in a couple of weeks when my bud finishes the pipe. This ones .010 so it should be bullet proof.

Mike
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	Ay73503.jpg
Views:	157
Size:	40.2 KB
ID:	355591  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.