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Futaba FASST feedback and TESTING

Old 08-13-2007, 01:37 AM
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cliffy227
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6

Paul


Thanks again for performing these tests. I too am anxious for Futaba's 14MZ module, however I just finished crashing my jet using the 14MZ on 72MHZ. (went into failsafe, shutdown and hit the ground on a close in turn to final after a 10 minuite beautiful flight). Anyway, as I am building my new jet, I have kind of been sold on the spektrum system primarily because of the additional recievers you can install around different places in the aiplane. The only problem: JR programming sucks for complicated airplanes. I want my 14MZ back and as the modules and recievers are to be out this month, I am very excited about your evaluations of Futaba's FASST system.

The only test that I did not see you do is the one that even Futaba seems to be concerned with which is typical jet structures. As these contain various amounts of composite materials such as Kevlar and Carbon Fiber I was wondering if you had a way to test this last concern of mine. All the experts seem to think that Carbon Fiber structures can very effectively block the rf signal from 2.4. It would be interesting to see what would happen through your testing if the reciever and antenna's were put inside a Carbon Fiber box.

I'll supply the CF if needed.

Let me know and thanks again,

Cliff Honeycutt
Old 08-13-2007, 10:38 AM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6

OK ...good one.
What i can do is place the rx inside my L39 tailpipe.
The fus is carbon fibre from the intakes back.
This will be a serious test as the rx will be inside a metal tailpipe with a carbon fus around that!
I will see if i can set it up this afternoon.........should be interesting

Paul

PS sorry about your jet. [][][]

Old 08-13-2007, 11:15 AM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6

Test complete.....

Test 3a

See 1st picture.

RX pushed into the tailpipe next to turbine.
This places it in metal surrounded by carbon and metal tape.
Aerials in line with each other (against Futaba). TX on low power.
NO clear line of site from tx to rx.
See pic 2.

Walked off with aerial on tx pointing at the model.(tx would have same view as the camera)

Ran out of garden again! 45 long paces..still working perfectly [X(]
Test 3b

Repeat test but push rx to mid length of tailpipe.
No change ...perfect operation.
Test 3c
Place aerials at 180 deg (inside tailpipe mid length) Rotate fus so it is sitting on its belly.

No change!!! perfect operation with the tx aerial pointing at the rx.

Amazing stuff.

Can not fault it





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Old 08-14-2007, 11:09 AM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6

Paul

Awsome! Thanks for doing that. I'm starting to gain quite a bit of confidence in the FASST system. Can't wait till the module shows up for the 14. I wonder why Futaba won't express any confidence in thier system for installation in jets. It's almost like pulling teeth to get Bax or any other Futaba rep to admit that their 2.4 link is any good.

Anyway, thanks again.

Cliff
Old 08-14-2007, 11:49 AM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6


ORIGINAL: cliffy227

Paul

Awsome! Thanks for doing that. I'm starting to gain quite a bit of confidence in the FASST system. Can't wait till the module shows up for the 14. I wonder why Futaba won't express any confidence in thier system for installation in jets. It's almost like pulling teeth to get Bax or any other Futaba rep to admit that their 2.4 link is any good.

Anyway, thanks again.

Cliff

i think the jetflyers did the most of the screaming when a few went in at the introduction of the G3 in the past.
since jets are in minority , why not just say : dont use them in jets..
the thins that puzzles me again is why the 6 channel version is not upwards compatible.
now that is bad , i just sold a couple of these sets to customers.
now they complain thay cant use them with their bigger tx,s..
Old 08-14-2007, 12:34 PM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6

Yes, I do not understand why Futaba are so backwards in coming forwards!
From what I have seen it is VERY solid link without the need for extra RX or aerials.

I am also disappointed that the RX will not work on the higher channel TX's. But the system 6 is very low cost and I am happy to use it on prop models to replace and old set of gear I have been using.
It was for me, all about learning to use the technology and building a confidence via testing; this, I have done and am happy with it.

If anyone can think of any other ways i can test the link on the ground please let me know.
Or if you have tested it in any way please add to the thread.
So far I have not heard 1 bad piece of feedback with regards to the RF link, everyone i speak to in the UK who is using it has the same opinion as me...it seems to be unbreakable.
But ...and this is the but...I do not know of anyone using it in a Turbine?
For me it is the number of channels that presents the problem, I have no models set up to use only 6, if I did, I would fly it tomorrow!
To be truthful, there should not be an issue based on what I have seen on tests, I have also heard from people using it in spark engine setups and high current electrics. NONE have reported a problem.

Paul
Old 08-14-2007, 01:13 PM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6

Sorry to correct you guys, but the Futaba 6ch FASST receiver will be able to work with the 12FG, 12Z and the 14MZ.

It's just not compatable with the lower end - 7ch, 8ch & 9ch sets.

But the good news is that the new 7ch receiver will be the same retail price as the 6ch unit - in the UK that is, and that works with all of the sets.

modtron
Oxford UK
Old 08-14-2007, 02:28 PM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6

Thanks for that info.

Paul
Old 08-14-2007, 02:37 PM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6

Paul,

First of all I think it's great you're taking the time and effort to test this system. The RC community benefits from this.

Maybe you could test the max range on the ground(full power on tx) i.e. drive away 600 mtrs. and check if the link is ok drive away 1200mtrs check link etc. At max range try if the link stays up if you change the attitude of the plane. What happens at max range if a person stands in front of the transmitter?

Just a few tests I was planning to do when the 14MZ modules become available.

Best regards,

Martin Lozano
Old 08-14-2007, 03:23 PM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6

OK
Thanks for that, i will see what i can do at the flying field on Sunday.
I do not think our field is big enough to test the max range at full power!
I have not been able to reach it in teh air, flying as far as i can risk.
But i will get some more data.
Any more ideas?

Paul
Old 08-19-2007, 06:16 PM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6

No tests this weekend due to bad weather.[&o]

I may get to do some in the week.

paul
Old 08-19-2007, 11:37 PM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6

I thank you for your test
I've been a futaba die hard for years
I'd like to try the 7 module in my 9c.. it was going to be in late august
but tower hobbies just pushed the date back till mid sep.
which is very close to late september when I can get the 8 channel module or better yet the 12FGA
wish they would hurry up
one of my new planes is almost done

Ronnie
Old 08-20-2007, 01:19 PM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6

For UK info.

I have just had an e-mail from Ripmax, letting me know that the modules and receivers for 7 ch operation are leaving Japan at the end of this week by Air.

Should be available for sale sometime the following week.

Still no dates for the 8ch systems.

modtron
Oxford UK
Old 08-20-2007, 06:18 PM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6

I was informed last week that 2.4 Ghz will be prohibited soon in Belgium by the authorities (BIPT)....
I do hope they change their mind and allow this giant technological leap forward like in the rest of Europe, before it is officially published !

http://www.flytovml.com/flytovml/Default.aspx?tabid=212

Best Regards,
Nicolas.
Old 08-20-2007, 11:27 PM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6


...Why...?..
Old 08-21-2007, 01:13 AM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6

Good question. The text states the BIPT did not give any answer to this explicit question ; the VML (Flemish RC Aviation Federation) also pointed out that radios on 2.4 GHz have been sold in Belgium already in the retail and such news is really bad news for those who made the investment already. At this moment, these pilots are in the 'grey zone' until 2.4 GHz will be officially banned for RC.
I have some full carbon fuselages too and want to get rid of that risky vertical whip aerial as well !
Robbe/Futaba Germany informed me the 2.4 GHz sets (other than the 6EX, which is in the market already) should be available from them in October.
(Unsure if they did know about the intentions of the Belgian BIPT....)

Best Regards,
Nicolas.
Old 08-21-2007, 01:42 AM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6

Paul,

Thanks again for your efforts. We all appreciate it.

Cliff
Old 08-21-2007, 01:50 AM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6

Sorry to hear about the Begium situation, seems a bit odd that[sm=confused.gif]
Keep us informed please.

Also, the weather here in the UK is, to say the least crap! so no testing at the moment.

Thanks for the thanks and feedback.

Paul
Old 08-22-2007, 03:20 PM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6

Same rumors for Germany. "10 mW only" for France. Time to join forces, european modellers ! Stupid bureaucracy is in front of us [:@]
Old 08-23-2007, 01:50 AM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6

I agree with you !
Old 08-30-2007, 01:50 AM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6

Any more news on this 10mw situation in Belgium?
Old 08-30-2007, 02:10 AM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6

Not yet, the website of the VML is showing no update on the subject.
Nevertheless, I have ordered my Futaba TM8 module and receivers yesterday anyway in Germany for my 9ZAP.
This should be shipped in two weeks from now.
I have studied all options very carefully for good RF reception in completely carbon fibre jet fuselages of two layers of 200 gr/Sqm, and although the Weatronic receiver system seems to be a total solution system, there still is a huge difference between a 200 grams receiver with two long aerials against the new 2.4 Ghz receivers at 9 grams plus those tiny aerials which I can fit easily in the top of the canopy (only spot not shieelded by CF). I read your favourable comments on good reception inside metal walls, I'll test what the results are in my jet.
I would like to test it, and if they are really going to publish the ban (IMHO : what a mistake !) I'll see what I'll do with this equipment later on.
I am still interested in Weatronic, great features without any doubt (also better voltage safety,...) but I would prefer lowest weight, lower cost, and most of all getting rid of those risky and unesthetical vertical whip antennas.

Nicolas.
Old 08-30-2007, 03:24 AM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6

Hi all,

Just read through the 4 pages of thread--- Well done to Greyuk for your work and sharing the results--- and to the feedback from everyone---

I have just last month bought a Futaba 12FG set, but with the standard Modual and 14 rx, 5114 second generation G3 rx i beleave, its on 40mhz---
Now im a long time JR man, flying a 9x11, on 36mhz, but got the 12FG put under my nose by a flying buddy, after looking through the programing features and playing some i decided to give it a try--- now im interested in FASST, and 2.4, but yet to be willing to take the leap--- but shortly the Futaba importer will have the moduals and RXs avalable for this set--- so maybe i shall give it a try after gaining confience from this thread---
The 12FG looks pritty user friendly, and one of the things im currently trying to sort out is the program for my Rookie11 jet, but first as my JR is used and proven i shall have to fly on that--- 12FG to get into a prop plane in a couple weeks for some airtime---
Jay.
Old 08-30-2007, 04:12 AM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6

Hi Jay,

Just curious... if you did buy the 12FG, why didn't you wait a month and buy immediately the just released T12 version in 2.4 Ghz ?

I was about to pre-order myself the new T14MZ in 2.4 Ghz last month (I heard from Robbe/Futaba they will officially launch that one in early October) and price difference will be only 80 euro, so I guess it is the same price difference for the T12 ? Nowadays, I have become very careful after the recently pending ban in Belgium for 2.4Ghz R/C...
I am traveling a lot worldwide, have seen many T14's being sold with (for my like) the wrong RX (5014 instead of 5114), or not my frequency option in 35 MHz (the sometimes offered Asian/Oceanian band is much less channels than the European band), and T'14s not having the here on RCU much commented new and safer "Mode B" transmitting option. Add on top of my requirements also Mode 1 configuration and a need for a MAZ (not MHZ) and you'll understand I have had a lot of sets in my hands but not been able yet to find one during my business trips in all those shops visited the PERFECT combo and it makes me more and more reluctant to order one which I was not able to completely checkmark myself. It is very tempting, nonetheless, because in several places I visit worldwide they are willing to give me a very good deal - on top of the suffocating high European VAT of 21% which I can avoid by doing so -.
It is true, however, that it will be very easy to swap between 2.4 Ghz and my good old 35 MHz band, at reasonable cost, but I need to be sure that what I would get for the 35 MHz swap is completely correct too. Ordering now a 2.4 Ghz T14 and finding out later on that the internal software for 35 MHz does not support my frequency and/or the safer B-mode modulation (if ever needed by me), would be a true shame seen the huge cost of this equipment. I only buy one single radio once every eight years, but then expect I get it right the first time...
Two months ago, there were plenty of 5014 receivers on offer NIB from (mostly German) modelers on eBay (I don't know at present). Is everyone dumping their 14 channels RX's which they were forced to take with the set and still hope to get a good bargain for it // or was it everyone preparing already for the newly announced FASST 2.4 Ghz modules ?....
Anyway, I decided for now to take the safe choice myself and convert my 9ZAP first and try it out and see what will happen with the pending local ban... When I am confident enough, I might take the big leap. The conversion gives only 8 channels and ideally you need 9 or 10 for a jet.

Nicolas.
Old 08-30-2007, 06:12 AM
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Default RE: Futaba FASST 6

Hi Nicolas,

Yes i follow what your saying, it will be interesting to see what happens with the pending ban in europe of 2.4, in New Zealand we have lots of channels to chose from, 35, 36, 40, 72, and now 2.4, however there are a lot of phones on 2.4, and i now see phones going to 5 something !!! Not sure if that means anything or not ???
My purchase of the 12FG was based on a offer i cant refuse, and so i took it up which then allows me to play with the program and see what i think before the FASST comes out---

One of my flying buddys just bought a 14 mz out of Japan, personal handlugage, thus saved lots on freight and our 12.5% vat--- or gst as we call it--- However our money is only worth half of the euro, one dollar buys 0.51 euro--- a 14mz sells for $4250 retail here, but with 4 servos--- a full set as such---
I dont know much about the 5014 RX, other than reading a little on RCU just recently--- my set has the 5114, as does my friends new 14mz--- And what is the A & B Mode all about ???????? Im hoping that when the FASST moduals and recievers come we can run both systems with the set--- but if you buy a set on FASST will it have the frequency changing program in it ?????????
It has to be good to be backwards compatable with excisting gear we own---
If i get attached to the Futaba system i shall get a 14mz as well--- otherwise a JR 12---

Keep us informed on what you do---
regards Jay.

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