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New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine

Old 02-12-2009, 11:19 PM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine

If you paid $25 for a knock off off Rolex you paid to much! The last time I was staying at the White Swan in Guangzhou, the street venders were selling them for $5.00 And just like the Chairman Mau watches for a buck, there good for one wind.
Old 02-12-2009, 11:31 PM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine

There is no way that Joe can make this turbine run- The decision process behind that statement is:
Turbines of this size MUST have ultra percise tolerances and quality control-period-no way around it.
Joe has proven over and over and over and over and over again that that is the one area in which he is totally retarded. The WREN 54 he copied was tough enough to produce for him, theJoe Jr is orders of magnitude harder to do. Just look at the SAME problems he has in this area with the 54 copy over , what is it, 4-5 years now-He still cant do it without having Gabe or whomever the JetJoe guru dejour is reworking them.
Sorry thats just how it is-read the hundreds of past threads on the subject.
Hes never going to get them to run reliably and put out anywhere 4 pounds-just aint gonna happen.
BTW looks like someone will have to get a WORKMATE JR. to run them on Scotty
Old 02-13-2009, 12:57 AM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine

after having quite a bit of experience with another brand, I can tell you the tolerances for a turbine of this size are almost beyond comprehension. When you hold and run one of these, it takes the term "precision" to a whole new level. I wish for the best to JJ, as competition is the key to progress (and lower prices) in this industry.
Old 02-13-2009, 02:05 AM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine

ORIGINAL: Josh_K

If you paid $25 for a knock off off Rolex you paid to much! The last time I was staying at the White Swan in Guangzhou, the street venders were selling them for $5.00 And just like the Chairman Mau watches for a buck, there good for one wind.
[:@] But my RolexJoe is just like a genuine Rolex an automatic watch, you don't need to wind them !!! Maybe that's why yours fail ?
But sh&# ! You are right, I might have paid 400% too much. Tolerances are still OK, it's a bit loose around the wrist but still OK for the value. LOL.

PS. Sorry for having mentioned Rolex.

But you guys are right, I can't wait for the Rolex prices to drop because of market pressure !

Nicolas.
Old 02-14-2009, 08:46 AM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine

so all the people that are negative about this company and their engines these people will apoligize when they get the jj junior turbine to run [>:][>:][>:][>:][>:]
Old 02-14-2009, 09:38 AM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine

I think the probability of anyone with a negative JJ opinion needing to apologize after the Jr. appears is so VERY low that we can effectively neglect it.
Old 02-14-2009, 09:43 AM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine


ORIGINAL: Woketman

I think the probability of anyone with a negative JJ opinion needing to apologize after the Jr. appears is so VERY low that we can effectively neglect it.

LOL... well there is "supposedly" going to be one at FJ 09 so who knows, maybe we will all be surprised.
Old 02-14-2009, 10:13 AM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine


ORIGINAL: invertmast


ORIGINAL: Woketman

I think the probability of anyone with a negative JJ opinion needing to apologize after the Jr. appears is so VERY low that we can effectively neglect it.

LOL... well there is "supposedly" going to be one at FJ 09 so who knows, maybe we will all be surprised.
Naaaahhh!! One hand picked, tweeked, engine that has been worked on for 100 hours to get it to run right should not impress any of these jet jocks.

Now 500 in a row that run perfectly out of the box.... that's different!!! But I don't see that happenin' here. Does anyone???
Old 02-14-2009, 10:17 AM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine


ORIGINAL: Woketman


ORIGINAL: invertmast


ORIGINAL: Woketman

I think the probability of anyone with a negative JJ opinion needing to apologize after the Jr. appears is so VERY low that we can effectively neglect it.

LOL... well there is "supposedly" going to be one at FJ 09 so who knows, maybe we will all be surprised.
Naaaahhh!! One hand picked, tweeked, engine that has been worked on for 100 hours to get it to run right should not impress any of these jet jocks.

Now 500 in a row that run perfectly out of the box.... that's different!!! But I don't see that happenin' here. Does anyone???

yea thats true..
Old 02-14-2009, 01:46 PM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine

The secret is out guys.

[sense-of-humor-ON]
The JetJoe 4lb-turbine is not a new engine. It's just the standard Jet Joe. All that's happened is that they actually measured the true thrust.
[/sense-of-humor-OFF]
Old 02-14-2009, 01:52 PM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine


ORIGINAL: XJet

The secret is out guys.

[sense-of-humor-ON]
The JetJoe 4lb-turbine is not a new engine. It's just the standard Jet Joe. All that's happened is that they actually measured the true thrust.
[/sense-of-humor-OFF]
Now why the heck did I not spot that!!! BRILLIANT! [8D]
Old 03-13-2009, 10:32 PM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine

Gentlemen, please. I get your point about "informing others of quality concerns" Now..... I realize that there has been quality issues with Jetjoe. Especially the older ones. We already know this. It's a cheaper chinese knock off. But to make blanket statements about how there is "no way" JJ can reach these tolerences......

People said that about the larger ones. A friend of mine just took delvery of his JJ1400 two week ago. (Really) Our experience has been good so far. It's the full autostart version. His engine was fully tested before it shipped. It starts up and runs as designed. We are installing it into a converted Falcon 120. The vendor has been extremely helpful. Unfortunaltely you don't read about many sucess stories in threads. I belive many people are only motivated to file a net report when things have gone wrong.

I am in total agreement that the toleraces involved in achievieving 240K rpm is quite precision. However, can we agree to make negative claims AFTER a complete failure on the part of the maunfacturer has occured? Flaming JJ in THIS thread is not only unhelpful, but is also insulting. I just want to get some "real" info on the new small JetJoe turbine. Have a beer and let's see how this plays out. There were the same negative people's comments when cheap lipo battery packs came out to compete with big names like thunderpower etc... Now I buy all my lipo's from hobbycity and they perform as well as, or better than my spendy ones.

On the other hand... (assuming the negative folks are current turbine pilots/enthusiats) More people getting into turbines because some knock off company is selling them cheap is not a bad thing. The price of your name brands may become more competitive. And dont forget about the "Club" aspect. How many fields where you live are turbine friendly? I live in central California and there is only ONE close to Sacramento. More people getting into your favorite portion of R/C will benefit us all. IMO. So.......

Beer, relax, and lets see where this seemingly impossible task goes.
Old 03-14-2009, 05:04 AM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine

ORIGINAL: friedclutch

Gentlemen, please. I get your point about "informing others of quality concerns" Now..... I realize that there has been quality issues with Jetjoe. Especially the older ones. We already know this. It's a cheaper chinese knock off. But to make blanket statements about how there is "no way" JJ can reach these tolerences......

People said that about the larger ones. A friend of mine just took delvery of his JJ1400 two week ago. (Really) Our experience has been good so far. It's the full autostart version. His engine was fully tested before it shipped. It starts up and runs as designed. We are installing it into a converted Falcon 120. The vendor has been extremely helpful. Unfortunaltely you don't read about many sucess stories in threads. I belive many people are only motivated to file a net report when things have gone wrong.

I am in total agreement that the toleraces involved in achievieving 240K rpm is quite precision. However, can we agree to make negative claims AFTER a complete failure on the part of the maunfacturer has occured? Flaming JJ in THIS thread is not only unhelpful, but is also insulting. I just want to get some "real" info on the new small JetJoe turbine. Have a beer and let's see how this plays out. There were the same negative people's comments when cheap lipo battery packs came out to compete with big names like thunderpower etc... Now I buy all my lipo's from hobbycity and they perform as well as, or better than my spendy ones.

On the other hand... (assuming the negative folks are current turbine pilots/enthusiats) More people getting into turbines because some knock off company is selling them cheap is not a bad thing. The price of your name brands may become more competitive. And dont forget about the "Club" aspect. How many fields where you live are turbine friendly? I live in central California and there is only ONE close to Sacramento. More people getting into your favorite portion of R/C will benefit us all. IMO. So.......

Beer, relax, and lets see where this seemingly impossible task goes.
Sir I think (with all due respect) that you need a check up, from the neck up...
In all honesty I think that you are taking self deception to the giddy limits. Your friend has bought oner of the things and now you wish to self justify that decision when, so much well experienced and well respected input on this forum and others, suggest that you are wrong. Good luck to your friend.
We had a couple of friends buy one of these through ignorance on coming back into the hobby, and after a while it ran and flew a model (down on power though). They got almost half a season out of it before if failed. Then it was scrap. They put it down to experience and bought a Wren which is still going strong 3 seasons later.
Not only are JetJunk engines of poor and variable quality, (and this is extremely well documented, so please no more "you are all wrong about poor old JJ quality"), but their design are, just as you have said, a rip off. To put it another way THEFT! Theft of intellectual property is still theft, and you sir are condoning it, suggesting that these guys are doing us all some kind of favour!!!
Are you completely barking mad sir? These people are undermining small cutting edge companies like Wren and Lambert, who are developing QUALITY products for the whole of the jet modelling scene. In what sense exactly is JetJunk doing us a favour by pushing these companies out of business?
As you may have detected, there is a lot of emotion surrounding the JetJunk topic, and long may it remain so. When the day comes that JJ spend there own money on their own engineers developing there own design of engine, and then produce a quality product that proves to be durable and reliable as well as produce the advertised the performance, I have no doubt that you will see a dramatic change in this point of view. But don't hold your breath.
Old 03-14-2009, 05:41 AM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine


ORIGINAL: JohnMac

ORIGINAL: friedclutch

Gentlemen, please. I get your point about "informing others of quality concerns" Now..... I realize that there has been quality issues with Jetjoe. Especially the older ones. We already know this. It's a cheaper chinese knock off. But to make blanket statements about how there is "no way" JJ can reach these tolerences......

People said that about the larger ones. A friend of mine just took delvery of his JJ1400 two week ago. (Really) Our experience has been good so far. It's the full autostart version. His engine was fully tested before it shipped. It starts up and runs as designed. We are installing it into a converted Falcon 120. The vendor has been extremely helpful. Unfortunaltely you don't read about many sucess stories in threads. I belive many people are only motivated to file a net report when things have gone wrong.

I am in total agreement that the toleraces involved in achievieving 240K rpm is quite precision. However, can we agree to make negative claims AFTER a complete failure on the part of the maunfacturer has occured? Flaming JJ in THIS thread is not only unhelpful, but is also insulting. I just want to get some "real" info on the new small JetJoe turbine. Have a beer and let's see how this plays out. There were the same negative people's comments when cheap lipo battery packs came out to compete with big names like thunderpower etc... Now I buy all my lipo's from hobbycity and they perform as well as, or better than my spendy ones.

On the other hand... (assuming the negative folks are current turbine pilots/enthusiats) More people getting into turbines because some knock off company is selling them cheap is not a bad thing. The price of your name brands may become more competitive. And dont forget about the "Club" aspect. How many fields where you live are turbine friendly? I live in central California and there is only ONE close to Sacramento. More people getting into your favorite portion of R/C will benefit us all. IMO. So.......

Beer, relax, and lets see where this seemingly impossible task goes.
Sir I think (with all due respect) that you need a check up, from the neck up...
In all honesty I think that you are taking self deception to the giddy limits. Your friend has bought oner of the things and now you wish to self justify that decision when, so much well experienced and well respected input on this forum and others, suggest that you are wrong. Good luck to your friend.
We had a couple of friends buy one of these through ignorance on coming back into the hobby, and after a while it ran and flew a model (down on power though). They got almost half a season out of it before if failed. Then it was scrap. They put it down to experience and bought a Wren which is still going strong 3 seasons later.
Not only are JetJunk engines of poor and variable quality, (and this is extremely well documented, so please no more "you are all wrong about poor old JJ quality"), but their design are, just as you have said, a rip off. To put it another way THEFT! Theft of intellectual property is still theft, and you sir are condoning it, suggesting that these guys are doing us all some kind of favour!!!
Are you completely barking mad sir? These people are undermining small cutting edge companies like Wren and Lambert, who are developing QUALITY products for the whole of the jet modelling scene. In what sense exactly is JetJunk doing us a favour by pushing these companies out of business?
As you may have detected, there is a lot of emotion surrounding the JetJunk topic, and long may it remain so. When the day comes that JJ spend there own money on their own engineers developing there own design of engine, and then produce a quality product that proves to be durable and reliable as well as produce the advertised the performance, I have no doubt that you will see a dramatic change in this point of view. But don't hold your breath.
Well said. Thanks

Chris
Old 03-14-2009, 09:21 AM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine

Right on the money JohnMac, right on the money!!!

That is what needs to be said over and over.
Old 03-14-2009, 09:28 AM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine


I wonder what ever happened to the Artes Jet Central "FLEA"?



I was told that it would be released March 15th and it would be $1500.00 US Dollars, for everything.

Here is the E=Mail:

Hi Dennis:

J Jr only in assembly turbine, no kit version.
will on market Mar 15 2009
The introduction price is $1500.00 including turbine, ECU, all runing accessories complete ready to run.


B.rgds
Joe
Old 03-14-2009, 08:51 PM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine

There are so many things wrong with your post, I cant touch on it all. First off.... I never said "You are all wrong about JJ quality"

"Self deception to giddy limits?"

Your cheap shot at my character reflects your lack of professionalism. I just want some actual info and facts on this new product and I believe that JJ quality is alot better than it used to be. I've done the same reading that you have. For the most part I agree with you. I was only asking folks to keep on topic of the thread. You can start your own JJ quality rant thread if you feel there such a need for "public awareness".

"Theft of intellectual property is still theft, and you sir are condoning it."

This has to be one of the most biased and uneducated statements I've heard in a long time. Tell that to every internal combustion engine manufacturer, external, or turbo unit in existence today. Its all the same technology tweaked in different ways. What I "condone" is free enterprise in a free country. Is Wren and/or Lambert companies in that bad of shape? Is it so bad, in fact, that thier reps are backing up claims in an internet forum in an attempt to disparage a consumer who had a positive thing to say about a brand you dislike? If Wren and Lambert were so cutting edge and ground breaking in engineering, then they would be seeing the sucess of Jetcat. Really. Since we're still name dropping I may as well join in the fun. Thanks for the public insults gentleman. I will definetely steer clear of your username in the future if I can. Its only a fundamental difference of opinion here guys. Most of us run into this situation daily and can keep it clean.


::TO:: cairoman: //"IJMC-Cyprus, JET-TRONICS' REP
WREN'S REP in Cyprus".

................................................ You may want to double check your maketing strategy. Instead of agreeing publicly with an angry consumer who's insulting potential customers.. Might I suggest the following... Dear Friedclutch: If you're looking into a new turbine engine of small size, be sure to check out "this" product as well. Its only "this" much more and the warranty, reputation, and thrust numbers are impeccable. Respectfully, cairoman.
Old 03-14-2009, 10:33 PM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine

"Here, Here!" Friedclutch.....................very well said.
Old 03-15-2009, 01:48 AM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine

Amen friedclutch!!!!!!
Old 03-15-2009, 01:55 AM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine

nuf said!! cant wait to get my JJJ i own Wren engines an SS and a 44 there great engine.
Old 03-15-2009, 05:00 AM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine

ORIGINAL: friedclutch

There are so many things wrong with your post, I cant touch on it all. First off.... I never said "You are all wrong about JJ quality"

"Self deception to giddy limits?"

Your cheap shot at my character reflects your lack of professionalism. I just want some actual info and facts on this new product and I believe that JJ quality is alot better than it used to be. I've done the same reading that you have. For the most part I agree with you. I was only asking folks to keep on topic of the thread. You can start your own JJ quality rant thread if you feel there such a need for "public awareness".

"Theft of intellectual property is still theft, and you sir are condoning it."

This has to be one of the most biased and uneducated statements I've heard in a long time. Tell that to every internal combustion engine manufacturer, external, or turbo unit in existence today. Its all the same technology tweaked in different ways. What I "condone" is free enterprise in a free country. Is Wren and/or Lambert companies in that bad of shape? Is it so bad, in fact, that thier reps are backing up claims in an internet forum in an attempt to disparage a consumer who had a positive thing to say about a brand you dislike? If Wren and Lambert were so cutting edge and ground breaking in engineering, then they would be seeing the sucess of Jetcat. Really. Since we're still name dropping I may as well join in the fun. Thanks for the public insults gentleman. I will definetely steer clear of your username in the future if I can. Its only a fundamental difference of opinion here guys. Most of us run into this situation daily and can keep it clean.


::TO:: cairoman: //"IJMC-Cyprus, JET-TRONICS' REP
WREN'S REP in Cyprus".

................................................ You may want to double check your maketing strategy. Instead of agreeing publicly with an angry consumer who's insulting potential customers.. Might I suggest the following... Dear Friedclutch: If you're looking into a new turbine engine of small size, be sure to check out "this" product as well. Its only "this" much more and the warranty, reputation, and thrust numbers are impeccable. Respectfully, cairoman.
Sir,

I did not mean to offend you personally in any way. I apologise if you felt that I did.

If you do not wish to buy any of the products I represent in my country, so be it, you could not become a customer of mine, anyway, unless, if you decided to move to Cyprus. I only know that intellectual property theft is punishable by the law and anyone buying stolen property is moral acomplice. The rest is cookie-talk, as Kramer could have said (seinfeld)

Regards,
Chris

Old 03-15-2009, 05:08 AM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine

I didn't realise that "free enterprise" included theft. Uneducated! Really! JJ purchased parts from Wren purporting to be a home builder. He then copied these and passed the resultant product off as his own. Allow me to educate you, that is THEFT of intellectual property and you are in writing in support of this approach.
I do not imagine you have a house full of stolen goods, purchased from a local thief, do you? So why then can you not see that this is just the same thing? Intellectual property represents peoples skill, knowledge and honest hard work, as well as a substantial investment of cash.
Try this, buy some software, say Windows Vista, take it home and change the look and the name of it to your brand. Then try selling it! See what happens.
Or start a rock band, put out a few albums under the name of the Beatles. Yeah, that would work.
It is theft, But you seem happy to receive stolen (intellectual) property. Then you have the gall to say I am attacking your character. Well it seems you have done that job for me.[X(]
Oh, BTW. Another fundamental principle that underlines our western democracies is "free speech", but those with something to hide only want it to work one way.
Old 03-15-2009, 05:59 AM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine

ok

so lets all pay mr withle and mr schreckling for their work then....
they seem to invent this stuff
Old 03-15-2009, 07:23 PM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine

Gents,

Aren't we off topic here? People are talking this and that about various issues....But, has anyone actual seen, touched or run this new JJ-Junior? That is where this thread started.

As for JetJoe's past quality issues. I am VERY aware of them. I got stuck, by a scammer, with an early one that had issue. JetJoe took the engine, under warranty, in 2006 and rebuilt it. They realized from ther records that this engine had faults. Sure, In Canada, we don't get a great amount of flying in, but the JJ1400 ran first try out of the box from China. And, it has run every time I asked it to. In a few years, I'll see if if last as long as the WREN, Behotec or Hawks that I have. Till then, I will just fly it and have fun.

Then, there is this IP topic. I understand that all of the basic designs have their origins with the GTBA. GTBA had a group of dedicated hobbyist that developed the basics of all the engine we se in 54 or 66 mm size. So, in a way, all vendors have 'borrowed' and tweeked basics developed by the GTBA. Does anyone have patents, registered commercial designs or even copyrights that they have defended in court to establish their validity? Claim all you want, wee what a judge says when he reviews all the paperwork. Been there , done that.

So, let's get back to the start......What does anyone know about the JJ-Junior?

DW_Crash
Old 03-15-2009, 07:31 PM
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Default RE: New JetJoe J-Junior 4lbs turbine


ORIGINAL: Woketman

I could not disagree more. The history of JetJoe quality is VERY relevant to this thread. Sure, we don't have to talk about other brands. But we SHOULD discuss the issues with quality that MANY Joe buyers in the past have experienced. That should make anyone considering a JJ purchase in the future think twice... no 58 times.
Marc,

Have you ever owned a JetJoe engine?

Dave

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