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DS6 Spread Spectrum
Anybody tried one in a jet, even a DF model?
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RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
ET,
Every flight of my Alfa Mig has been made with a DS6. I have flown as far as I can see the model with out any problems. I flew it at Fl Jets during "foamy hour" many times as well. I LOVE explaining to people that "I don't need a frequency pin." I have gone out and bought three additional receivers and am converting all of my foamies to the DS6. Its the greatest thing to happen to them since brushless motors and LiPo batteries. You will love it! Bob |
RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
Yup, I"ve got one in a small electric hotliner - 55" span or so, a Mini-fan 480 size F-20 and a small T-rex helicopter. They work great, for your Kamdax and Toki powered stuff it would be fine. Just watch out for metalic covering and metalic content paint...
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RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
ET,
Just got back from the flying field. I put my DS6 into an old .70 4 cycle powered Pizzaz. This puppy is about 6 or seven years old. Anyway...I set the failsafe up for low throttle and proceeded to climb out almost directly overhead (but not over the pits). I can tell you, when it did failsave, it was a tiny little dot. From past experience with an altitude watch on board I was easily at 4,000 feet AGL. TRUST me when I say this. I've had the model to 5,000 feet on occasion (naked eye with other spotters to help out) and it was close to this height. It came down for a few seconds and the throttle duly advanced when back in range. Again, I was easily at 4,000 feet AGL when it went into failsafe mode. No one else was flying so we all could hear as best as we could. At this extreme range no glitches we felt what so ever. ROCK solid until out of range. With MY experience I see no reason NOT to fly this radio in a 40 or even 60 sized sport plane. In fact, I'll be loading all my sport stuff into it shortly. Dave Rigotti |
RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
One of the guys at our field has installed a DS6 radio into his Raptor 30 heli. 4 Gallons later and no problems. He is also using one digital and 4 other high end servos with the mini receiver that comes with the DSS system.
Mark |
RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
Im sure horizon "JR" is working on this now,no doubt they probably have already solved the range issue if there ever really was one.. ill bet by mid-summer you will be able to get new JR radios or Modules to convert the radio you have.. ..Im sure it IS in the future.. Cant wait... Russ
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RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
The techno hardware is out now. Problem as I hear it is with the FCC. Futaba and Jr DSS radios are out now around the world except for here in the USA. Spread spectrum has a wide band to use. Futaba wants to use the whole wide band in itself, where FCC tell Futaba and other radio manufacturers "you can only have half of the band" So when this is settled between the two, we will then have the full blown spread spectrum radios here in the US of A
Mark |
RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
just another level of government red tape.. Russ
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RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
ORIGINAL: rcguy! ET, Just got back from the flying field. I put my DS6 into an old .70 4 cycle powered Pizzaz. This puppy is about 6 or seven years old. Anyway...I set the failsafe up for low throttle and proceeded to climb out almost directly overhead (but not over the pits). I can tell you, when it did failsave, it was a tiny little dot. From past experience with an altitude watch on board I was easily at 4,000 feet AGL. TRUST me when I say this. I've had the model to 5,000 feet on occasion (naked eye with other spotters to help out) and it was close to this height. It came down for a few seconds and the throttle duly advanced when back in range. Again, I was easily at 4,000 feet AGL when it went into failsafe mode. No one else was flying so we all could hear as best as we could. At this extreme range no glitches we felt what so ever. ROCK solid until out of range. With MY experience I see no reason NOT to fly this radio in a 40 or even 60 sized sport plane. In fact, I'll be loading all my sport stuff into it shortly. Dave Rigotti So, you're telling us that you can see your .40 sized plane at 5000ft and distinguish if youre getting glitches or not? From all the flying I've done, at about that altitude your plane would look like this: . sorry but I could be wrong but I don't buy it. I will add though that I too am interested in the performance of the Spread Spectrum radios. (flame suit on) |
RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
So, you're telling us that you can see your .40 sized plane at 5000ft and distinguish if you’re getting glitches or not? From all the flying I've done, at about that altitude your plane would look like this: hmmmmm ... i had my BVM BobCat (using a 10X JR ) up at just under 4500' AGL going straight up vertical ( verified with an altimeter ) and at that point i just completely lost sight of it. I retarded the throttle, and threw all surfaces full deflection ( plane would tumble/spin straight down this way) .. it took maybe a good 5 - 10 seconds for me to catch sight of the plane again ... it was a blue sky and I was against a nice white cloud.. my plane is black ... i doubt any 40 sized trainer would be visible at 5000' ...i'd give it 3000' max, at which point you would not be even able to tell orientation .. i guess bottom line is that this is another great attestation of the DX6 range and reliability ..... Wojtek |
RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
ORIGINAL: trioval00 The techno hardware is out now. Problem as I hear it is with the FCC. Futaba and Jr DSS radios are out now around the world except for here in the USA. Spread spectrum has a wide band to use. Futaba wants to use the whole wide band in itself, where FCC tell Futaba and other radio manufacturers "you can only have half of the band" So when this is settled between the two, we will then have the full blown spread spectrum radios here in the US of A Mark |
RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
ORIGINAL: Tar Baby just another level of government red tape.. Russ Government OUT of the radio spectrum! Let the most powerful transmitter win! That's the free market! |
RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
ORIGINAL: wojtek So, you're telling us that you can see your .40 sized plane at 5000ft and distinguish if you’re getting glitches or not? From all the flying I've done, at about that altitude your plane would look like this: hmmmmm ... i had my BVM BobCat (using a 10X JR ) up at just under 4500' AGL going straight up vertical ( verified with an altimeter ) and at that point i just completely lost sight of it. I retarded the throttle, and threw all surfaces full deflection ( plane would tumble/spin straight down this way) .. it took maybe a good 5 - 10 seconds for me to catch sight of the plane again ... it was a blue sky and I was against a nice white cloud.. my plane is black ... i doubt any 40 sized trainer would be visible at 5000' ...i'd give it 3000' max, at which point you would not be even able to tell orientation .. i guess bottom line is that this is another great attestation of the DX6 range and reliability ..... Wojtek |
RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
There is a difference between luck and actually data that something is working. The regulations for the DS6 are pretty explicit. The power output is limited to less than 100 milliwatts. A 72 mHz radio's output is 500 milliwatts. Range is a function of power. Also remember, power does not fall off linearily. 1/5 the power does not mean 1/5 the range. Power falls off as the square of the distance at best. At worst as a cube. So 1/5 the power means 1/25 the range.
Up here in Canada, MAAC, AMA equilivent, says that fields have to be 5 kilometers apart to prevent interference. So, you could say that comes to a safe range of what 2.5 kilometers. (1.5 miles for Americans) A 1/25 of that would be 100 meters or so. That is pretty darn close to what is written on a DS6 box. SO, if you wish to risk you $5000 jet and risk hurting someone, you may try it. I sure would not. And, I stick to what the AMA, MAAC and the manufacturer say. For use by park flyers. Small stuff you fly within a 100 meters or so of yourself. DW_Crash |
RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
Anyone know if AMA coverage is in effect when using these radio's in anything bigger than a park flier, since the manufacturer specifically states that's the type of model the system was designed for.
I sure hope we won't have to find out! BRG, Jon |
RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
At the WRAM show I spoke with Bob Brown and Carl Maroney and one of the topics that did come up was the DSS radios. It was made loud and clear to us and everyone around us, DSS are only for Park Flyers at this time, if you should fly an aircraft with the DSS that is larger then a Park Flyer and have a problem, AMA will not cover the accident. You are on your own...
Mark |
RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
How many parkflyers use the INCLUDED retracts and throttle cut function???? These are clearly labelled on the TX and RX.
Does AMA have a clearly defined "limit" as to where parkflyer status ends and "real" R/C begins? 200MPH? 55 pounds? 8 cell 3000 watt Lipos? .049? Is "Parkflyer" the type of aircraft OR the type of operating environment? For example..non AMA chartered flying field??? Comments please..... Dave "asbestos underwear on" Rigotti |
RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
Dave,
Most modelers know what the term "park flier" is relative to size/power, and AMA certainly does. YOU can define it anyway you want, but if there is an accident that results in a claim, and if it's not a park flier, you won't be covered. The radio manufacturer is covering their butts by their disclaimer, for whatever reason, and AMA is saying, in essence, that the manufacturer has the most knowledge of the design their product, therefore we defer to them on how it should be used. If you're not flying under the AMA, you can do whatever you want, AMA has no control. However, if there is an accident with a non-park flier type model that results in a claim against you, you WILL be held liable, since you did not use the product in accordance with the manufacturers instructions, i.e., you willfully ignored the instructions by putting the radio in non park flier type model. BRG, Jon |
RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
Hi
Does anyone know when the big radio manufacturers are going to bring out a Spread Spectrum radio for something bigger than a park flyers? Mike |
RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
So how exactly does the AMA or JR SPECIFICALLY define a "Park Flyer"?
If they are going to deny coverage for someone that used the radio in an inappropriate airframe, they better damn well have defined it and done so specifically! |
RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
Does anyone think that Horizon started out to design a park flyer system? If it had the range to use in larger planes don't you think they would have marketed it that way? A few very unscientific tests of the range of the system only shows us that it isn't reliable at greater distance than recomended. If it was indeed at 4000 feet without any obstructions and lost range that tells me that it is nowhere near the range of the 72mhz stuff. I havn't heard of any of the glider guys say they went into failsafe at those distances.
The restrictions on power output at the higher frequencies makes SS a very tough nut to crack. BTW ET, those Casio Altimeter watches were not very accurate at all. |
RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
Well I did a little research with a firm that I do work for and they specialize in RF engineering for military applications.
The layman's explanation of using the 2.5 Ghz as opposed to the 72 Mhz frequency is that we are limited to 4 watts of output power. They told me that it takes less output power at the lower frequencies to get more range. So at 4watts of out put at 2.5 Ghz the range would be considerably less that using the usual 72 Mhz. That may be why they are limiting them to park flyers. After taking with him I would not recommend it in anything that needs good response at long range like our jets. Those that are using it like the glider pilot in the above post are really on borrowed time. Hope I explained it alright. Marty O |
RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
ORIGINAL: Woketman So how exactly does the AMA or JR SPECIFICALLY define a "Park Flyer"? If they are going to deny coverage for someone that used the radio in an inappropriate airframe, they better damn well have defined it and done so specifically! When pressed, John Adams said "32 ounces total weight" He was very definitive when he finally decided to speak up. 2 pounds = a park flier. The landing gear in my F-4 weighed a lot more than that. |
RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
FWIW... JR includes a Safety First Card bright orange with the "spektrum radio"
("Despite the fact that our testing indicates that your DX6 ar6000 rx outperforms any competitor in its class We remind you that it is intendeded strickly for use with parkflyers,foamies,micro & mini helicopters So while the ar6000 superior range may tempt its use in models which are typically flown at greater distances from the tx. than typical smaller electric ppwered models,We strongly urge restraint your safety & success are our principal concerns. so please enjoy this product solely in the types of applications for which it was intended )" I'm no lawyer but with that being included... Horzion hobbies is off the hook & the ama is too Semper Fi Joe |
RE: DS6 Spread Spectrum
ORIGINAL: uncljoe FWIW... JR includes a Safety First Card bright orange with the "spektrum radio" ("Despite the fact that our testing indicates that your DX6 ar6000 rx outperforms any competitor in its class We remind you that it is intendeded strickly for use with parkflyers,foamies,micro & mini helicopters So while the ar6000 superior range may tempt its use in models which are typically flown at greater distances from the tx. than typical smaller electric ppwered models,We strongly urge restraint your safety & success are our principal concerns. so please enjoy this product solely in the types of applications for which it was intended )" I'm no lawyer but with that being included... Horzion hobbies is off the hook & the ama is too Semper Fi Joe Lee |
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