here's a good one !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Ok you radio experts see if you can deal with some of this action. The question...What radio should I get?
I have a yellow f-18 and here is what I want to be able to do with it.

droop the ailerons and still control roll

droop the leading edge and trailing edge flaps and the ailerons at the same time, and control roll with ailerons

control roll with both ailerons and stabilator

control roll with both ailerons and stabilator while ailerons are drooped


basically I want what the real f-18 has, is there a radio that can be mixed and flight moded(new word) to give me these abilityies and also give me the ability to turn some of them off and on.

here's a good one !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

The futaba 9C can do all of these mixes, the only thing is that if you mix the ailerons and the elevator to also act like ailerons (tailevons) then you cannot adjust this mix in flight. Ie they will be at a constant. The ailerons just need to be mixed into a flaperon mode (most computer radios have this mix) and when you drop the ailerons for flaps they will still be able to control yaw control. To mix the forward flaps, just assign them to an aux channel and mix them with flaps, this mix can be turned on and off from the transmitter. So in short the 9C can do all of this for under $400. I think the setups starts at about $379 at tower and go up depending on reciever and servo choices.

Michael

awesome answer
 

I thought that I would have to spend big dough on the 9z or jr 10x. I wonder if, for such a complicated model I should do it anyway, what you think on that...and what else should I be looking for in a new radio of this calibre

here's a good one !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Well, the 9C can be used on FM or PCM bands, so I would imagine that the PCM signal from a 9C is just as good as that on a 9z or 10x, and I'm not sure what features the more expensive radio's would have that the 9c doesn't that you would actually use. I do know that the 9z has a few more 3 position switches than the 9c. But in terms of praticality I can't see the more expensive radio's offering all that much more. However, if you have the biggest and baddest jet around, I guess it would be natural to have the biggest and baddest radio controlling it.

Michael

here's a good one !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Backstab, I would find out what everyone else close to you is flying. If you decided to get what they have, they would be able to help you should you need it.....

hey
 

I would be on the upper end of radio requiremnets in my circle. I have a jr 8103 but I am not sure that will cut on this bird..I got brakes airbrake gear this that the other thing...........

here's a good one !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

I think if you really want to do all that stuff, then the 9C or better yet the 9Z WCII will get you there. The question I have for you is: are prepared to do all that stuff while flying the model, or are you doing it for the scale effect on the ground. There is no telling, yet, of what the plane will do in flight with all these mixes activated. The jet will roll perfectly with ailerons only. The real F18 is computer controlled in that manner because it is actually unflyable without all these mixes!!

here's a good one !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

I will say that I was the first one in my area with the 9C and I have had absolutely no problems programming it at all. Its sooo easy to use, I would definately recommend it for ease of programming.

both
 

I dont agree that a conventional plane like the f-18 is unflyable without the computer to mix the surfaces ,I believe the computer knows the job of efficiency on how to achieve what the pilot wants better than the pilot, and decides which surfaces should do the task depending on the flight regime. the drooped surfaces are for short field landing of a 40+ pound plane and I like the idea of scale controllability, and superior handling at low speeds, this coupled with a short grass strip lead me to desire the "umbella wing" on final approach. I will concede that the risks are high with all the uncertainty associated with mixing, but he its only money right. Part of me wants to explore this area of contollability....a high alpha approach at maybe 1.1 stall speed, getting the stab to assist in lateral stability leaves the ailerons in the flap position which disalows them to agrivate the flow of air at the tio of the wing. what say u on this tangent :)

oh yeah
 

I am listening to you fellas on the radio recommendations too, i just got off on a rant there, the 9z wc....any arguements or experience with jr 10x...

Well
 

I am not even smart enough or wealthy enough to give "first hand" advice but...

When I see world class Jet pilots fly, I see alot of 10X's, Multiplex, and 9Z's-

I own a 9C and have flown quite a bit on the 8103 and they are awesome- But if you are going turbine and have the dough... :eek: Go JR-10X, Fut. 9Z, or Multiplex...

I am a mere D/F flier ;)

Best of luck with the droopy wings!
james

here's a good one !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

You dont have to spend big $$$ to get a capable radio! The 9C has all of the features you want and you dont have to morgage your house to buy one..... Now, if you need 10 channels..... 10X ;), 12.....Multiplex

Todd

hey
 

I think I might need at least 9 channels and I'm sure I can find a use for 10 or more.

Drooped ailerons
 

I'm not sure you want to droop the ailerons as the full scale does. This will in effect be like adding wash-in to the wing. You may have a problem with tip stalls at high AOA. As was mentioned earlier, the real one has computers to assist with flight control. If you look at most models designed with flaperons, the flaperon does not extend all the way out to the wing tip as ailerons normally do. In fact some people were programming crow into sport jets for better control at slower speeds. With crow the flaps go down as normal, but the ailerons move up. This adds drag and stability.
I too have an F-18 and would love to be able to simulate this on the model. But I don't think I'd be willing to take a big chance on destroying the plane.

i agree
 

It would add washin, a bad thing, i plan at that point when the leading edge and trailing edge are all drooped to make the slabilator the prime roll control device thereby leaving those wing tips alone to produce lift only. This is a theory only and will be tested up high and in increments or, I could transfer roll control to both tailerons and inboard flaperons....the whole point of this thread was to make sure I have the right radio to pull this stuff off if I desired.. you all have valid points and I am learning and considering all, who knows whats possible till someone tries.

any other thoughts from anyone

here's a good one !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Drooped ailerons will not necessarily cause a washin condition at the wingtip. Washin/washout is the difference in airfoil incidence, going from inboard to outboard. To prevent a washin effect, one can simply have a higher flap deflection (example, 30 degrees) than the ailerons (example, 15 degrees). This way, the entire wing is considered flapped - the outboard panel just won't be creating anywhere near the increased lift increment as the inboard flapped panel.

With regard to the radio, I think you need to sit down and figure out what exactly needs to be operated, then figure out what your minimum channel requirements will be.

1.) Ailerons.
2.)H-Stab for pitch. Will need extra channel for roll capability (ch.6)
3.) Throttle.
4.) Rudder/Steering.
5.) Retracts.
6.) See 2.
7.) Brakes (could put on 2.)
8.) Flaps. Could also use this for LE Flaps.
9.) Speedbrake.
10.) If ailerons are used as flaps, ch.1 cannot be Y-harnessed for ailerons, so you'll need this channel.
11.) Need this for the pilot salute before launch!...
:)

ahahahahaha :)
 

The pilot salute nice one:) thanks ..

here's a good one !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

You're right Ron.

I forgot the flaps would be down also. The only way it would create washin is if the ailerons were drooped more than the flaps.

here's a good one !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

You might wanna take a scan through these threads if you are still trying to decide what radio to buy.

http://www.rcuniverse.com/showthread...hlight=10x+wc2

http://www.rcuniverse.com/showthread...221#post226716

http://www.rcuniverse.com/showthread...hlight=10x+wc2

http://www.rcuniverse.com/showthread...hlight=10x+wc2

One thing that I found interesting was in comparing some RCU polls done about whether the 10X or Wc2 was better. A poll in the radio forum found that more people favored the Wc2 ; a poll in the jets forum found that more people favored the 10X. Just goes to show that different types of users want different things out of their radios.

If you go with Futaba, give serious consideration to whether the 9C will do what you want - it's less 'powerful' in it's programming than the Wc2, but to me it seems to be WAY more user friendly to program. It's also a chunk cheaper.

Also don't forget that Multiplex, Graupner etc also produce great radios... in my personal opinion, these brands are generally less "comfortable" for the way I like to hold & operate the controls, but way more powerful & flexible than the more ergonomic radios. See if you can find someone who has one of these radios & try it for 'feel'.

Good luck with your choice, whatever you end up going with.

Gordonn

here's a good one !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

PS .... if you are struggling a bit for channels -- I don't know how it works yet, but JR has this new "Channel Expander" doodah which might help out.

If that interests you, maybe one of the JR guys could give us a technical descriprion of what it does, as well as whether there would be any problem in using it in conjunction with other brands of radio equipment.

Gordon

here's a good one !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Backstab,

I also have a yellow F-18 that I'll be doing similar with, although I didn't do LE flaps. I have a 9c now that I've just started flying with and have been pretty impressed with the programming capabilities, especially considering the price of the radio. Non jet related, but my first "real world" programming was on a B-17, where I mix left / right wing throttle servos with rudder input for ground steering assist. (totally unneccesary, but fun anyways!) Anyway, I was very impressed with the flexability.

Keep in mind that the 9th channel is only available in PCM mode, and I think it's simply an on/off function (non-proportional)

Things that are NOT built into the programming are servo "delay" between mixes (i.e. gear doors open, pause, gear comes down) unless of course I just haven't found it yet!

Bob

good to hear
 

I may need servo delay so that after the le flap retracts a pin can be slid in there to lock it in flight for rigidity, is there a radio aound that will delay a servo input for you?

here's a good one !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Good points from Bob regarding the ninth channel. You may need a higher end radio than the 9c.

Could you perhaps use retract servos to deploy the LE flaps? I'm assuming only 2 positions would be required... This would give you maybe 3 seconds or so for the surface to travel, and due to the ~180 degree rotation, this would act as a lock on the LE flap. Plus, no servo power is drained in the up and down flap positions...

Might not be a good choice if you want to use the LE flaps as a "maneuvering flap" device though...

how strong
 

I am not too familiar with the retract servo functions, you say it locks on either end of its travel. How strong are they , lots of torque, it will be required!!

Re: good to hear
 

Yup. HarryC has made a number of posts here on RCU showing how you can use the extensive delay features of the Multiplex radios. There's also a servo-slow capability from JR and Futaba, though as far as I can tell they are no where near as capable as the Multiplex in this respect.

Of course, another option is to do this activation by air cylinder instead of directly from the servo - then you could use variable rate air valves to control the respective speeds, plus air switches triggered by one component reaching its end point before the next component starts moving, etc. Lots of options. Lots of potential for little bits of added weight. Lots of things to not work perfectly every time.... make sure that you don't get in over your head with the complexity.

Gordon