DSMX, Horizon, and JR
03-15-2011, 10:44 AM
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DSMX, Horizon, and JR
It seems to be quite a coincidence that Horizon and JR appear to be reworking their distribution arrangement for North America at the same time that Horizon is announcing DSMX modulation.
Since DSMX was announced, Horizon Hobby has started taking pre-orders for the Spektrum DX10t here in North America:
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products...odID=SPM2800US
When this product was first introduced, folks were told this radio wouldn't be offered to North American customers because of contractual restrictions between Horizon and JR. Spektrum radios could only be marketed as 8-channel or fewer, while JR would have the 9-channel and higher market segments. That's why North America didn't get the Spektrum DX10t or the JR XG7. Now, all of the sudden, we're getting the DX10t at the same time DSMX is popping up.
Of all of the Spektrum-branded transmitters offered by Horizon here in North America, the DX7/DX7 SE was the only one reported to be manufactured for Horizon by JR. The DX7 appears to have been adapted directly from the JR 7202 radio platform, while the DX5e, the DX6i, the DX8, and the DX10i are reported to be manufactured by a third party supplier under contract to Horizon Hobby. Now, with the DSMX announcement, comes the news that the DX7 and DX7 SE are discontinued.
How has the introduction of DSMX impacted the relationship between Horizon Hobby and JR? Will Horizon introduce a new radio to fill the giant gap between the DX6i and the DX8 in Horizon's product line-up? Why does Horizon suddenly wish to offer the DX10t to North American pilots? Why does JR no longer wish to manufacture the DX7 for Horizon.
I don't have any answers, or even any good inside rumours to pass along. I'm hoping some of you do, though. Let the rampant speculation begin!
Since DSMX was announced, Horizon Hobby has started taking pre-orders for the Spektrum DX10t here in North America:
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products...odID=SPM2800US
When this product was first introduced, folks were told this radio wouldn't be offered to North American customers because of contractual restrictions between Horizon and JR. Spektrum radios could only be marketed as 8-channel or fewer, while JR would have the 9-channel and higher market segments. That's why North America didn't get the Spektrum DX10t or the JR XG7. Now, all of the sudden, we're getting the DX10t at the same time DSMX is popping up.
Of all of the Spektrum-branded transmitters offered by Horizon here in North America, the DX7/DX7 SE was the only one reported to be manufactured for Horizon by JR. The DX7 appears to have been adapted directly from the JR 7202 radio platform, while the DX5e, the DX6i, the DX8, and the DX10i are reported to be manufactured by a third party supplier under contract to Horizon Hobby. Now, with the DSMX announcement, comes the news that the DX7 and DX7 SE are discontinued.
How has the introduction of DSMX impacted the relationship between Horizon Hobby and JR? Will Horizon introduce a new radio to fill the giant gap between the DX6i and the DX8 in Horizon's product line-up? Why does Horizon suddenly wish to offer the DX10t to North American pilots? Why does JR no longer wish to manufacture the DX7 for Horizon.
I don't have any answers, or even any good inside rumours to pass along. I'm hoping some of you do, though. Let the rampant speculation begin!
03-15-2011, 11:03 AM
#2
RE: DSMX, Horizon, and JR
ORIGINAL: bigedmustafa
It seems to be quite a coincidence that Horizon and JR appear to be reworking their distribution arrangement for North America at the same time that Horizon is announcing DSMX modulation.
Since DSMX was announced, Horizon Hobby has started taking pre-orders for the Spektrum DX10t here in North America:
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products...odID=SPM2800US
When this product was first introduced, folks were told this radio wouldn't be offered to North American customers because of contractual restrictions between Horizon and JR. Spektrum radios could only be marketed as 8-channel or fewer, while JR would have the 9-channel and higher market segments. That's why North America didn't get the Spektrum DX10t or the JR XG7. Now, all of the sudden, we're getting the DX10t at the same time DSMX is popping up.
Of all of the Spektrum-branded transmitters offered by Horizon here in North America, the DX7/DX7 SE was the only one reported to be manufactured for Horizon by JR. The DX7 appears to have been adapted directly from the JR 7202 radio platform, while the DX5e, the DX6i, the DX8, and the DX10i are reported to be manufactured by a third party supplier under contract to Horizon Hobby. Now, with the DSMX announcement, comes the news that the DX7 and DX7 SE are discontinued.
How has the introduction of DSMX impacted the relationship between Horizon Hobby and JR? Will Horizon introduce a new radio to fill the giant gap between the DX6i and the DX8 in Horizon's product line-up? Why does Horizon suddenly wish to offer the DX10t to North American pilots? Why does JR no longer wish to manufacture the DX7 for Horizon.
I don't have any answers, or even any good inside rumours to pass along. I'm hoping some of you do, though. Let the rampant speculation begin!
It seems to be quite a coincidence that Horizon and JR appear to be reworking their distribution arrangement for North America at the same time that Horizon is announcing DSMX modulation.
Since DSMX was announced, Horizon Hobby has started taking pre-orders for the Spektrum DX10t here in North America:
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products...odID=SPM2800US
When this product was first introduced, folks were told this radio wouldn't be offered to North American customers because of contractual restrictions between Horizon and JR. Spektrum radios could only be marketed as 8-channel or fewer, while JR would have the 9-channel and higher market segments. That's why North America didn't get the Spektrum DX10t or the JR XG7. Now, all of the sudden, we're getting the DX10t at the same time DSMX is popping up.
Of all of the Spektrum-branded transmitters offered by Horizon here in North America, the DX7/DX7 SE was the only one reported to be manufactured for Horizon by JR. The DX7 appears to have been adapted directly from the JR 7202 radio platform, while the DX5e, the DX6i, the DX8, and the DX10i are reported to be manufactured by a third party supplier under contract to Horizon Hobby. Now, with the DSMX announcement, comes the news that the DX7 and DX7 SE are discontinued.
How has the introduction of DSMX impacted the relationship between Horizon Hobby and JR? Will Horizon introduce a new radio to fill the giant gap between the DX6i and the DX8 in Horizon's product line-up? Why does Horizon suddenly wish to offer the DX10t to North American pilots? Why does JR no longer wish to manufacture the DX7 for Horizon.
I don't have any answers, or even any good inside rumours to pass along. I'm hoping some of you do, though. Let the rampant speculation begin!
Rampant speculation seemsto be of interest in crap such as Face book etc
Why not try to get really relevant info about the new products?
03-15-2011, 11:10 AM
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RE: DSMX, Horizon, and JR
Well, I was thinking about buying a DX7 for bind-n-fly models when the whole DSMX thing came out. Now I've learned that the DX7 is discontinued. I'm trying to understand what is going on with Horizon and JR so I can figure out if I should wait for a DX7 replacement, settle for a DX6i, or forget about bind-and-fly models until I want to spring for a DX8 or JR 9503.
Also,rmh, I thought the news that the Spektrum DX10t is now available in North America might qualify for "really relevant info about the new products."
Also,rmh, I thought the news that the Spektrum DX10t is now available in North America might qualify for "really relevant info about the new products."
03-15-2011, 11:11 AM
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RE: DSMX, Horizon, and JR
Why does JR no longer wish to manufacture the DX7 for Horizon.
Let's see... Horizon own Spektrum and therefore any and all profits made under the Spektrum brand go to them. Get the Spektrum factory to build 1000's of units and the cost per unit falls to a mere pittance, getting JR to make them means additional costs and of course JR need to make a profit and so the unit cost is higher.
The cynic in me also views this as a way to deny JR the DSMX firmware upgrade thereby locking them out of the consumers market.
Horizon have been very clever and probably have a greater market share than anyone else. As most people want the latest and greatest toys/version then the vast majority will want to upgrade to DSMX eventually. IF JR is locked out of this upgrade then current JR users will in time migrate over to Spektrum so as to prevent having to change out all their receivers.
Or am I being to cynical ?
03-15-2011, 12:20 PM
#7
RE: DSMX, Horizon, and JR
If anyone looks inside th new DX8 -they will instantly see why the older designs are being dropped from new product sales
The wildfire advances in electronics have rendered the old approachs obsolete - not unusable but absolutely, obsolete!
FWIW - new electronics are far smaller - do far more -run on lower power (they have to ) and permit complete reprogramming as required.
As another example - pull apart any old 72 MHZ rx - it's full of discrete bits n pieces some which need final tweaking after assembly .
The 2.4 g stuf - - a chip or two - thats it.
JR will catch up -they MUST-to stay in the game
What was the latest stuf yesterday is old hat today- sure -it still works but you can't stay competitive selling equiment that has higher production costs -less modern approaches, etc..
Bluntly put - when Spektrum introduced the 2.4 equip -they caught all the others with their pants down and most are still nothing more than the old school stuff with 2.4 g output.
The wildfire advances in electronics have rendered the old approachs obsolete - not unusable but absolutely, obsolete!
FWIW - new electronics are far smaller - do far more -run on lower power (they have to ) and permit complete reprogramming as required.
As another example - pull apart any old 72 MHZ rx - it's full of discrete bits n pieces some which need final tweaking after assembly .
The 2.4 g stuf - - a chip or two - thats it.
JR will catch up -they MUST-to stay in the game
What was the latest stuf yesterday is old hat today- sure -it still works but you can't stay competitive selling equiment that has higher production costs -less modern approaches, etc..
Bluntly put - when Spektrum introduced the 2.4 equip -they caught all the others with their pants down and most are still nothing more than the old school stuff with 2.4 g output.
03-15-2011, 01:03 PM
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RE: DSMX, Horizon, and JR
You can get the DSMX upgrade for your JR 11X, etc.
And all new JR radios will be X.
03-15-2011, 01:21 PM
#9
RE: DSMX, Horizon, and JR
ORIGINAL: slarty
In the USA you can as Horizon is also the importer / distributor for JR .
Perhaps in the USA (due to the above reason), but JR are migrating towards DMSS for their new radio systems.
You can get the DSMX upgrade for your JR 11X, etc.
And all new JR radios will be X.
low output power etc..
03-15-2011, 01:32 PM
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RE: DSMX, Horizon, and JR
Sorry, you lost me there....
You are talking mainly DSM2 levels ( 128 mW EIRP for the USA variants) against 100 mW EIRP for the EU. When going to Frequency Agile they will be the same levels,
You are talking mainly DSM2 levels ( 128 mW EIRP for the USA variants) against 100 mW EIRP for the EU. When going to Frequency Agile they will be the same levels,
03-15-2011, 03:41 PM
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RE: DSMX, Horizon, and JR
I heard that JR and Horizon are going to split up....Just what I heard. Man, what a crazy time for radios. On the bright side WE ALL benifit from this. All the crap that's going on is for us, The RC Flyers!
03-15-2011, 05:23 PM
#13
RE: DSMX, Horizon, and JR
ORIGINAL: RickShane
I heard that JR and Horizon are going to split up....Just what I heard. Man, what a crazy time for radios. On the bright side WE ALL benifit from this. All the crap that's going on is for us, The RC Flyers!
I heard that JR and Horizon are going to split up....Just what I heard. Man, what a crazy time for radios. On the bright side WE ALL benifit from this. All the crap that's going on is for us, The RC Flyers!
03-15-2011, 09:38 PM
#14
RE: DSMX, Horizon, and JR
Rumors ,Rumors ,Rumors You say !
But these Rumors are coming true!
Remember the so called Hobby Shop letter that stated Horizon wouldn’t be selling JR DSM2 anymore? It was just another Rumor, Right?
Well it looks that ended up being True, Don’t you think.
JR Radios from Horizon will now be using Spektrum’s DSMX for RF. (When they are available, that is. When? IF?) Another Rumor!!
And here is another Rumor !!
DSMJ (Spektrum’s Hoping System) was developed ONLY for Legality reasons for Japan. Fact or Fiction? Rumor was, it was better than DSM2.
Looks like that Rumor was true with Spektrum releasing (DSMX) Spektrum’s US Hoping System. Hop,Hop,Hop!
Keep playing that Rumor card, Rumors don’t just come from the Great Blue Skies!
You want to hear some more Rumors? JR DMSS
But these Rumors are coming true!
Remember the so called Hobby Shop letter that stated Horizon wouldn’t be selling JR DSM2 anymore? It was just another Rumor, Right?
Well it looks that ended up being True, Don’t you think.
JR Radios from Horizon will now be using Spektrum’s DSMX for RF. (When they are available, that is. When? IF?) Another Rumor!!
And here is another Rumor !!
DSMJ (Spektrum’s Hoping System) was developed ONLY for Legality reasons for Japan. Fact or Fiction? Rumor was, it was better than DSM2.
Looks like that Rumor was true with Spektrum releasing (DSMX) Spektrum’s US Hoping System. Hop,Hop,Hop!
Keep playing that Rumor card, Rumors don’t just come from the Great Blue Skies!
You want to hear some more Rumors? JR DMSS
03-16-2011, 05:16 AM
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RE: DSMX, Horizon, and JR
[/quote]
I heard all the radio guys in Utah are being replaced by TV guys - Of course this is simply speculation- and wild guesswork-with absolutely no basis in fact
[/quote]
And how is that you know I do Radio? Are you the one in Murray? I heard about JR & Horizon splitting from a rep that works at a huge RC company. I won't say on here.
I heard all the radio guys in Utah are being replaced by TV guys - Of course this is simply speculation- and wild guesswork-with absolutely no basis in fact
[/quote]
And how is that you know I do Radio? Are you the one in Murray? I heard about JR & Horizon splitting from a rep that works at a huge RC company. I won't say on here.
03-16-2011, 05:44 AM
#17
RE: DSMX, Horizon, and JR
ORIGINAL: pitstop000
Rumors ,Rumors ,Rumors You say !
But these Rumors are coming true!
Remember the so called Hobby Shop letter that stated Horizon wouldn’t be selling JR DSM2 anymore? It was just another Rumor, Right?
Well it looks that ended up being True, Don’t you think.
JR Radios from Horizon will now be using Spektrum’s DSMX for RF. (When they are available, that is. When? IF?) Another Rumor!!
And here is another Rumor !!
DSMJ (Spektrum’s Hoping System) was developed ONLY for Legality reasons for Japan. Fact or Fiction? Rumor was, it was better than DSM2.
Looks like that Rumor was true with Spektrum releasing (DSMX) Spektrum’s US Hoping System. Hop,Hop,Hop!
Keep playing that Rumor card, Rumors don’t just come from the Great Blue Skies!
You want to hear some more Rumors? JR DMSS
Rumors ,Rumors ,Rumors You say !
But these Rumors are coming true!
Remember the so called Hobby Shop letter that stated Horizon wouldn’t be selling JR DSM2 anymore? It was just another Rumor, Right?
Well it looks that ended up being True, Don’t you think.
JR Radios from Horizon will now be using Spektrum’s DSMX for RF. (When they are available, that is. When? IF?) Another Rumor!!
And here is another Rumor !!
DSMJ (Spektrum’s Hoping System) was developed ONLY for Legality reasons for Japan. Fact or Fiction? Rumor was, it was better than DSM2.
Looks like that Rumor was true with Spektrum releasing (DSMX) Spektrum’s US Hoping System. Hop,Hop,Hop!
Keep playing that Rumor card, Rumors don’t just come from the Great Blue Skies!
You want to hear some more Rumors? JR DMSS
the present generation of radio on 2.4 is still DSM2 inc DSMX - backwards and forwrds compatible - for Spektrum and JR in the USA
Oh yes and it still includes Bind n Fly and Model match servo match etc-
The Japanese setup was for Japan.
Guess who developed it
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm?
Who else has as much up to date stuff?
03-16-2011, 06:41 AM
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RE: DSMX, Horizon, and JR
I can't really imagine Horizon and JR dropping their distribution agreement for North America. Whatever changes might be occuring in that distribution relationship, both companies would likely suffer without each other.
From Horizon's perspective, the 9503, 11X, and 12X fit perfectly above the Spektrum line as competition-class radio platforms. Horizon also enjoys exclusive distribution rights to JR's extensive and popular servo product line. Horizon needs JR air radios and JR servos to complete their product lines, and there isn't another legitimate manufacturer who could replace both of those product lines. Horizon would either have to steal Futaba away from Hobbico (cold day in Hell) or sign Hitec to an exclusive distribution agreement for North America.
Even if Horizon signed an exclusive agreement to distribute Hitec, Horizon would either have to develop a 12-channel Spektrum platform or surrender the high-end air radio market to Hobbico.
From JR's perspective, there really isn't anywhere else to go for North American distribution. Hobbico is married to Futaba, and Global doesn't do anywhere near the volume of business that Horizon does. What is interesting, however, is that the current Airtronics air radio lineup fits nicely under the JR Radio line-up much like the Spektrum radio line-up does. Being a second line of air radios and a second line of servos at Global can't be better than being the primary servo line and secondary air radio line at Horizon, can it?
From Horizon's perspective, the 9503, 11X, and 12X fit perfectly above the Spektrum line as competition-class radio platforms. Horizon also enjoys exclusive distribution rights to JR's extensive and popular servo product line. Horizon needs JR air radios and JR servos to complete their product lines, and there isn't another legitimate manufacturer who could replace both of those product lines. Horizon would either have to steal Futaba away from Hobbico (cold day in Hell) or sign Hitec to an exclusive distribution agreement for North America.
Even if Horizon signed an exclusive agreement to distribute Hitec, Horizon would either have to develop a 12-channel Spektrum platform or surrender the high-end air radio market to Hobbico.
From JR's perspective, there really isn't anywhere else to go for North American distribution. Hobbico is married to Futaba, and Global doesn't do anywhere near the volume of business that Horizon does. What is interesting, however, is that the current Airtronics air radio lineup fits nicely under the JR Radio line-up much like the Spektrum radio line-up does. Being a second line of air radios and a second line of servos at Global can't be better than being the primary servo line and secondary air radio line at Horizon, can it?
03-16-2011, 10:06 AM
#19
RE: DSMX, Horizon, and JR
ORIGINAL: rmh
Yes you are noting just more rumor which has a life of it's own
the present generation of radio on 2.4 is still DSM2 inc DSMX - backwards and forwrds compatible - for Spektrum and JR in the USA
Oh yes and it still includes Bind n Fly and Model match servo match etc-
The Japanese setup was for Japan.
Guess who developed it
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm?
Who else has as much up to date stuff?
ORIGINAL: pitstop000
Rumors ,Rumors ,Rumors You say !
But these Rumors are coming true!
Remember the so called Hobby Shop letter that stated Horizon wouldn’t be selling JR DSM2 anymore? It was just another Rumor, Right?
Well it looks that ended up being True, Don’t you think.
JR Radios from Horizon will now be using Spektrum’s DSMX for RF. (When they are available, that is. When? IF?) Another Rumor!!
And here is another Rumor !!
DSMJ (Spektrum’s Hoping System) was developed ONLY for Legality reasons for Japan. Fact or Fiction? Rumor was, it was better than DSM2.
Looks like that Rumor was true with Spektrum releasing (DSMX) Spektrum’s US Hoping System. Hop,Hop,Hop!
Keep playing that Rumor card, Rumors don’t just come from the Great Blue Skies!
You want to hear some more Rumors? JR DMSS
Rumors ,Rumors ,Rumors You say !
But these Rumors are coming true!
Remember the so called Hobby Shop letter that stated Horizon wouldn’t be selling JR DSM2 anymore? It was just another Rumor, Right?
Well it looks that ended up being True, Don’t you think.
JR Radios from Horizon will now be using Spektrum’s DSMX for RF. (When they are available, that is. When? IF?) Another Rumor!!
And here is another Rumor !!
DSMJ (Spektrum’s Hoping System) was developed ONLY for Legality reasons for Japan. Fact or Fiction? Rumor was, it was better than DSM2.
Looks like that Rumor was true with Spektrum releasing (DSMX) Spektrum’s US Hoping System. Hop,Hop,Hop!
Keep playing that Rumor card, Rumors don’t just come from the Great Blue Skies!
You want to hear some more Rumors? JR DMSS
the present generation of radio on 2.4 is still DSM2 inc DSMX - backwards and forwrds compatible - for Spektrum and JR in the USA
Oh yes and it still includes Bind n Fly and Model match servo match etc-
The Japanese setup was for Japan.
Guess who developed it
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm?
Who else has as much up to date stuff?
Keep Spinning it, Keep trying to Spin it !
If enough people read it without commenting against the statement, it must be true, go with that philosophy!
Yes you are noting just more rumor which has a life of it's own
The Japanese setup was for Japan.
Guess who developed it
Guess who developed it
Why do you think JR developed their own DMSS system?
It’s very embarrassing when for JR (Japan)own pilots crash during demo flights due to someone else’s RF [X(]
Of Course it’s a known Fact that all DSM systems are Horizon/Spektrum, No matter how their marked 2, J, X pick a letter or number.
Oh yes and it still includes Bind n Fly
Were talking Radio Here not add on Accessories.
Who else has as much up to date stuff?
You can call it up to date stuff. I call it a FIX that others already had.
03-16-2011, 10:56 AM
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RE: DSMX, Horizon, and JR
The Japanese setup was for Japan.
Guess who developed it
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm?
Guess who developed it
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm?
Now the shackles are off, JR have released their own ( and quite probably their original design) system known as DMSS.
03-16-2011, 01:23 PM
#25
RE: DSMX, Horizon, and JR
weird in that all of the facts (?) I have seen here are simply NOT the facts I get from those actually involved in the product!!
The evolution of the Japanese 2.4 especially
- sorry but that's what I see.
Where is any proof from the mfgrs of these products re: your info ?
The evolution of the Japanese 2.4 especially
- sorry but that's what I see.
Where is any proof from the mfgrs of these products re: your info ?