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Securing flying wires?

Old 04-18-2016, 12:04 PM
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abufletcher
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Default Securing flying wires?

I'm brainstorming for idea on how to secure flying wires to the fuselage. I need to be able to remove the wires (from the fuselage) for transport. Ideally, attaching them at the field should be as hassle-free as possible, i.e. be "fast" and not require any field adjustments. Obviously, it also needs to be strong given that if the flying wires come off the wings come off.

What has worked for you?
Old 04-20-2016, 04:21 AM
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abufletcher
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Here's what I'm playing around with at the moment. But it's tricky, difficult, and I'm not at all confident about that tiny eyelet on the 2mm brass turnbuckle.
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Old 04-20-2016, 05:25 AM
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radfordc
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This is how I did my 1/4 scale N-28.
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Old 04-20-2016, 06:44 AM
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Propworn
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First off are these flying wires functional (working as part of the structure) or are they cosmetic? What scale are they?

Dennis
Old 04-20-2016, 06:59 AM
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abufletcher
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Absolutely critically functional. If the wires go, the wings go. The model is 1/6 scale but has a wingspan of just over 2 meters.
Old 04-20-2016, 07:13 AM
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abufletcher
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Originally Posted by radfordc View Post
This is how I did my 1/4 scale N-28.
That looks good and practical. At the moment I'm liking good and practical. Since I decided to ditch the music wire UC and do a more scale version with custom made brass tubes, my own handmade brackets, bridge pieces, and main and auxiliary axles, I had a second chance to rethink how I do the attachments. I tend to go overboard on scale, but this is one area where it may pay to be practical.
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Old 04-20-2016, 08:13 AM
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Propworn
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Smaller than 1/4 scale becomes problematic but not impossible. Proctor has a lot of scale hardware http://www.proctor-enterprises.com/p...e/hardware.htm
Old 04-20-2016, 01:39 PM
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I use Du-Bro 2-56 Pull-Pull cable sets on several 1/6 scale biplanes that require functional flying and landing wires. I secure one end to a fitting on the fuselage and use the clip a the other end. I install the wires first and then use the interplane struts to tension them at assembly.

Jaybird
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Old 04-20-2016, 02:46 PM
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1/3 scale Waco. The turnbuckles under the top wings are the only ones that are undone when wings need to be removed, all flying wires stay attached to the fuselage.
tmac48.
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Old 04-20-2016, 04:48 PM
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abufletcher
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Stunning Waco!!! I like the idea of having the flying wires stay on the fuselage, but I've already missed that train since I've made scale attachment points for the struts, which on the original used a ring (in a cap) which the wire looped around. There's no turnbuckle on that end...only on the fuselage end. The way my 2-bay CI is designed, the wings will need to be transported as already assembled "cells" with the cross-strut bracing and outer bay flying and landing wires already in place. Field setup would involve connecting the cells to the fuselage (with a set of pins) and then attaching the flying, landing, and drag wires.
Old 04-20-2016, 06:35 PM
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FireBee
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Abu, I use the same as RadfordC did an a N-28 with Dubro 2-56 Clevis. But instead of pull pull cable of Dubro, I use 40lb stainless steel, 6 strand, fishing line. Sometimes called leader line. So my struts and wires stay with the wings , see pics of looped wires on brass strut mounts from Proctor. Second pic of fuse end with Clevis. First pic of struts and basic wire looped and crimped.

Note most flying wires are doubled up. Landing wires usually single line. You need Clevis as all wires tend to stretch over time if functional. Also have a locking nut on each too. To. Pretty it all up, heat shrink tubing can also cover the crimp and extra wire end.

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Old 04-20-2016, 06:45 PM
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For my Pup which has dual flying wires but attach right at the fuse and LG strut mounting point, makes sense as very strong area, I reversed it.

The wing strut attachment had the Clevis ends. At the fuse I took A thin stainless steel sheet and made a dual attachment point for the wires. But it extended about 3/4 of an inch. I bent it at the right angle and cut a "slot" in the LG block such that the stainless steel attachment could slide in. Kind of a tounge and groove. Then with a Allen head bolt it is secured up through the bottom of the LG as I tapped the wood for the bolt. Thus with 4 bolts all my wires are done.

I have no good pics but poss see it here. Look in far right bottom corner as attachment bolt (Black) goes up through the LG and secures the stainless steel tounge with the two landing wires.

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Old 04-20-2016, 08:16 PM
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Lots of good ideas here! I used something like the setup on your Pup with my Snipe and on the Flair Puppeteer. On the original CI there were only single flying wires (cables actually). You're right about the wires/cables slackening over time, so there needs to be some way to adjust them. Interestingly I've seen a photo of the cables being "pre-stretched" in the Albatros factory.

I have to say, I really HATE the look of these stock clevises on a nice scale model. It's too bad that no one manufactures a smaller more scale seeming clevis. (BTW, I once tried to modify a clevis by cutting down the ends and re-drilling holes for a pin, but try as I might I could not get the drill to go through!)
Old 04-21-2016, 04:09 AM
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One thing I would suggest on crimping the wires is to loop the wire back around & through the crimp ferrule again. Just pushed straight through & crimped can allow them to slip & loosen! Another lesson learned the hard way......Some pull-pull kits come with crimp ferrules too small to allow the cable to pass through 3 times, as needed in my suggestion. No worries, your local fishing dept. at the store has them for making wire fishing leaders in a variety of sizes.

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Old 04-22-2016, 09:39 PM
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abufletcher
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Crimping fills my heart with fear. So far, I've managed to avoid using rigging wires by using 0.6mm music wires (on scale models of aircraft which originally used wires not cables). But that's not appropriate for my CI. So I'm going to use braided stainless cable (0.60mm).

This morning one idea occurred to me regarding how to speed up the field assembly. I could keep the turnbuckle in place on the fuselage brackets but use a fork-end on the other end. Then a loop in the rigging cable could fit into the fork-end and be secured with a pin or a screw. So the procedure would be 1) loosen turnbuckle 2) insert cable loop 3) tighten turnbuckle 4) secure turnbuckle. Done about a dozen times.
Old 04-23-2016, 04:56 AM
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I never buy the rc flying wire hardware I always use the stainless fishing wire used for salt water leaders and downriggers. This stuff is stainless and comes anywhere from 20 lb test to over 100 lb test. Its usually plastic coated. They sell the properly sized wire cable crimps and crimping tool. If done correctly using the properly sized crimps the cable will break before the crimp fails.

Much less expensive in the long run. Last time I looked this stainless downrigger line 150 lb test at .030 diameter and 150 ft long was only 12 bucks.



Dennis
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Old 04-23-2016, 05:33 AM
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radfordc
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Originally Posted by abufletcher View Post
So the procedure would be 1) loosen turnbuckle 2) insert cable loop 3) tighten turnbuckle 4) secure turnbuckle. Done about a dozen times.
I've found that if my models aren't easy to assemble I tend not to fly them. My BUSA Spad has about 22 screws that have to be installed each time I fly. Even that keeps it on the shelf.
Old 04-23-2016, 06:46 AM
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I have an excellent system, but it's not scale.

Is that important?
Old 04-23-2016, 07:19 AM
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I'm fairly obsessed about doing things in a scale manner...even to the point of impracticality. Here's where I've gotten with with these scale undercarriage brackets, which retain the scale swivels for the turnbuckles. As a measure of how obsessed I've become, these brackets (as with all the metal parts) will be painted with lacquer produced by the very same German company that produced the original lacquer for the original Albatros in WWI. But I'm not happy with the brass eyelets; they are almost certainly too weak for a model that requires fully functional rigging.

Regarding the cable I use, it's from the local hardware store and braided stainless (no covering). It's very good, but little bits of the wire can be almost deadly if you get them in your fingertips (like little microscopic metal splinters)!

I'll have a look at the fishing shop for crimps (and crimping tools).
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Old 04-23-2016, 09:39 AM
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radfordc
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DuBro makes steel turnbuckles: http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXE075&P=8
Old 04-23-2016, 09:48 AM
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Those look very dependable but are too big for a 1/6 scale model. Mick Reeves sells steel turnbuckles (electroplated to look like brass) with an M2 thread size.
Old 04-23-2016, 03:38 PM
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I like using two crimps. Even on full size. It helps the end not cock a bit and spreads out tension
Old 04-26-2016, 06:43 PM
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Look at this! http://www.flying-wires.ch/flying-wires/index.html

You may have to rob a bank first.
Old 04-26-2016, 08:19 PM
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abufletcher
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Originally Posted by radfordc View Post
Look at this! http://www.flying-wires.ch/flying-wires/index.html

You may have to rob a bank first.
I've seen that in the past and I would be very tempted if I were building a 1/3 scale British aircraft that used flat-wires instead of cables. Yet another good reason that I should never be allowed to build at 1/3 scale!

But I do like the idea of those "quick release" setups.

Last edited by abufletcher; 04-26-2016 at 11:27 PM.
Old 04-27-2016, 04:18 AM
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The quick release looks like the end of a bicycle spoke silver soldered to a threaded barrel. The large hole doesn't look all that secure if one of the wires were to loosen up. Not much of a lip to keep it captured. I would think a keyhole shape in the plate would be much better where the flared end barely fits through the hole then a bit of a slot just wide enough to clear the diameter of the bent wire. Even if the wire became loose in flight the head could not pop out.

Dennis

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