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1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

Old 05-21-2008, 05:31 PM
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Shrky
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Default 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

I've started a 1/3 scale Nieuport 11 from my own plans. If there is any interest I'll continue with and online build.

Where I am so far.

Scott
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Old 05-21-2008, 06:25 PM
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Joe Westrich
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

I have a buddy that is not computer savvy that would be interested. If you continue, I will fill him in as I see him.

Thanks
Old 05-21-2008, 06:37 PM
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

There's always interest in build threads. Go for it!
Steve
Old 05-21-2008, 06:49 PM
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R/C Art
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

I am in the middle the making of a third scale N-11. I am using my own plans - well, developing the plans as I build, is a more accurate statement. I would be interested in following your build.
Is this the same project that is on-going on the Aerodrome forum?
I have the fuse rough framed, both bottom wings done and the right upper wing panel almost completed.
What power are you planning on using?
Old 05-21-2008, 07:50 PM
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

i'm certainly interested......i love Nieuports
i'm build the Proctor N11 and N28 at this time, but i'd love to build a bigger N11................count me in
Old 05-21-2008, 08:28 PM
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

OK, well great.

I'll go ahead and continue to document my progress here. However I work for the railroad with no specific schedule so updates won't come regularly.

I am in the middle the making of a third scale N-11. I am using my own plans - well, developing the plans as I build, is a more accurate statement. I would be interested in following your build.
Is this the same project that is on-going on the Aerodrome forum?
I have the fuse rough framed, both bottom wings done and the right upper wing panel almost completed.
What power are you planning on using?
Art, I'm also developing my plans as I go. As for power I'm not sure, I see a lot of G-62s in 1/3 scale WWI warbirds but I can't imagine needing that much power. I think when I get closer to finishing and have a better idea of the weight I'll be able to decide, right now I'm thinking something in the 40cc range. I have a Briggs and Straton 35cc four stroke but that might be to light on power.

Here's a look at the plans I'm doing so far.

Forgot to add the drawings.

Scott
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Old 05-24-2008, 06:13 PM
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R/C Art
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

Scott
I am thinking the same thing that you are on choice of power......I would like to come in at 18 lbs or so, 20 would be acceptable, and even 22 would fly fine, but probably not with the 34cc four stroke.......G-62 would be way too much. I have a Robins Suburu 34 cc four stoke gas engine which I would like to use. It is the core engine from which the Fuju 34 cc is made. It was converted by BCMA Engines (I think). I suspect this will be on the lower end of the power range but should produce a good combination for scale competition flying......I think that a G 45 would be the most power needed for sport flying and that a G38 would be a nice match.
I am currently finishing up a 1/3 Sopwith Pup and probably won't get back on my N-11 until later this summer.
Looking forward to your building thread.
Cheers,
Art
Old 05-25-2008, 12:07 AM
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

I thought I would add some pictures of the construction up to this point.

I started off with 3/8x3/8 spruce for the longerons. I soaked these in the bath tub with ammonia. These were formed over the plans, yes those are nails in my building board, with spruce this size pins don't cut it. The uprights between the longerons were made buy adding 3/16 square stock to 3/16x3/8 stock. The uprights on the original were "T" shaped and tapered top to bottom. I tried to do something resembling this as eye candy when the sun shines through the covering. I pinned the uprights and cross pieces with bamboo skewer stock. I stained the frame because...well WWI warbirds always seem to have the frame stained. I've also managed to add the rear tail skid supports.

Art,

I don't see this plane weighting more than 20-25 lbs. I'd sure like to use the B&S 35 cc four stroke if for nothing more than the sound. Also feel free to post pictures of your N-11 here I'd sure like to see what you've done and steal your ideas and methods

Scott

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Old 05-26-2008, 06:29 AM
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GianFrancesco
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

Hi Scott
The next model I will build is a 1/3 scale Macchi-Nieuport Ni 11! I have already in my hands the engine Titan ZG 38 SC, reduction drive and the "scale" 32/18 propeller all from Toni Clark in Germany.
I am very anxious to see the development of your Ni 11.
GianFrancesco
Old 05-26-2008, 03:19 PM
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Shrky
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

Gian,

What plans are you using? Are you working from prints? You'll find there are some minor differences between the French and Italian N.11s. I envy your Toni Clark reduction drive, I've looked at that but just can't justify the cost. Feel free to post your progress here if you like, we can all benefit from each others work.

Scott
Old 05-26-2008, 04:35 PM
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R/C Art
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

Scott
Looks like you are going for a more scale internal structure than I am. I am using my own method of construction, mostly regular model building techniques with the goal of a scale outline and airlfoil.
The intent is scale competition and proto-typical flight. This time I am trying to keep the cockpit a little cleaner and maybe get some scale detail around the pilot. I am kind of occupied for the next couple of three weeks with the pup and a couple of fly-ins (one a charity, Wings for Kids in Louisville). After that I can get more into the N-11......and get the parts and pieces out, drawings,etc.....get some pictures and post some of what I have. Its a slow process ......in the meantime I will look in on your build.
Your construction so far is very nicely done!
Cheers,
Art
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Old 05-26-2008, 04:51 PM
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

Hi Scott
sorry but at present the Ni 11 is only in my ...brain! I owe some "paper" : 3view from the old M.A.P. = Model&Allied Publications Ltd. I got in 1981 regarding the Italian Macchi built Ni11; plus Winsock International and Windsock Datafile Special and an italian booklet about "Nieuport - Macchi 11 & 17" from Intergest.
I will draw my own plans with Autocad ........but before to commence is better that I complete a damnedly small (1/6 scale) Albatros C III that is on my building board from the year 2006!
GianFrancesco
Old 05-26-2008, 05:37 PM
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

Art,

I am trying to at least give the appearance of prototypical construction. I am hoping it will come out well enough to compete with. I've never competed in scale competition before but there is a Scale Masters qualifier and a Dawn Patrol meet held in the area. (or at least there was last year) However my main goal is to build a nice looking, good flying, scale aircraft. I do look forward to seeing how you do somethings on the N.11 for instance the landing gear. The real Nieuports used a cast piece that both the landing gear legs slid into and I'm racking my brain on how to simulate that.


Gian,

If you going to do the Macchi N.11 then you have to go to http://ark.com/~mdf/nieuport.html. He has a number of factory drawings of the Macchi N.11 and offers them and many other drawings on CD. I wish I had CAD skills, I'm limited to doing my plans on CorelDraw. I look forward to seeing yours started.

Scott
Old 05-26-2008, 06:39 PM
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

ORIGINAL: GianFrancesco
.....but before to commence is better that I complete a damnedly small (1/6 scale) Albatros C III that is on my building board from the year 2006!
Hmm....I'm soon going to be starting a 1/6 scale Albatros CI and it'll be the largest model I've ever built!
Old 05-27-2008, 10:17 AM
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

Scott
Thanks for the information; I have already asked for the CD.
Regarding the landing gear it would be fine to make it with stainless steel oval tubing (from Toni Clark Catalogue page 108) and some laser cut inox plate silver brazed......and bolted to the fuselage structure.
GianFrancesco
Old 05-27-2008, 11:05 AM
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

Shrky,
There is a Dawn Patrol again this year in MollalaOR, Aug 15-17.You should go as it's a great event and this year could possibly be the last.

Regarding the use of a Briggs&Stratton engine,I would recommend AC of @16lbs for the 34cc and 20lbs for the 40cc.They won't handle a lot more than that,although I did fly my 23+ lb DVII with the 40cc.I may have a 65cc Stihl 4-stroke flying at the Dawn Patrol event so you could check that out.

J
Old 05-27-2008, 02:08 PM
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

Hey Art, come on, we will be old and dead before you finish :-)

Dave
Old 05-27-2008, 04:15 PM
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

J,

Who's the club that putting that on? I know it's held at the Mollala Radio Control Assc. field but another club is actually the sponsor. I know your right about the engines I was just hoping.

Scott
Old 05-27-2008, 04:46 PM
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

Shrky,
It is sponsored by the Northwest RC Aviators,but I wouldn't call it a "club" as such, but a group of like-minded people(WWI and classic AC).If you google NWRCA Dawn Patrol you will get their website.

J

PS: RC Art,the Subaru/robin/fuji has no more power than the Briggs 40cc.
Old 05-27-2008, 04:49 PM
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

Ouch!
Dave.......You should be more respectful of your elders!
I predict that the N-11 will be flying next contest season! (just a couple of years late!)

Congrats again on the arrival of you new son!

You just might have to grow up a little bit now, huh?
Old 05-27-2008, 08:51 PM
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11


ORIGINAL: Shrky

As for power I'm not sure, I see a lot of G-62s in 1/3 scale WWI warbirds but I can't imagine needing that much power.
I would love to follow your build. I have the BUSA 1/4 version, looking forward to building it, but will be a while. Maybe I can unabashedly "steal" your ideas

As for the huge chunk of engine on the 1/3 scalers, there's three reasons I can think of.

One is balancing weight. If you are going to have to add weight to make the short nose balance, it might as well be useful, and not a bunch of lead.

Two is to be able to swing a scale diameter prop (or close to it) at a slower engine speed. The reduction drive mentioned above would do that also, but there is still the balance issue, plus the reduction drive is more complex than a lot of modelers want to mess with.

Three is that there's a lot of drag going on here, that big engine will come in handy. Sort of goes along with #2.

Keep the build thread going. It's going to be a nice plane.
Old 05-27-2008, 11:06 PM
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

Well I'm glad to see so much interest. Had to go out today and get some more hook eyes for the fuse rigging. What I'm doing is using nylon cord and some plastic beads my wife found for me to simulate the wire rigging in the fuse. Although this will be covered I'm hoping it with show through the fabric especially when the sun shines through it, also I'm sure it will add some support to the fuse although it doesn't really need it.

Don,
Remember contrary to what a lot of people think, bigger flies better/easier/more stable. The one thing that won't scale down is the air density. Trouble is the bigger you build them the more detailing you have to do. They just look to barren without it, ask any model railroader.

khodges,
I've never really obsessed about nose weight, I add what it needs to balance and so far all my planes have been good fliers. I'm also a big believer that a plane flies on it's wings not it's propeller, I always seem to use smaller engines in my planes than other people with the same plane. On the other hand though when I dumb thumb it it's usually the end as there is no reserve power to save it.

J,
Went to website, looks like a great bunch. Now I'll have to have the Bebe ready by the mid Aug. I was a member of the Mollala Radio Control Assc. last year, I haven't had time to get out there this year due to work but the weather hasn't really turned to summer around here yet either.

Art,
Thanks for the complement the hard parts are yet to come, I hope they come out as well.

Scott
Old 05-29-2008, 08:32 AM
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

Guy's, from what I have been reading on the engine "conversion" forum a lot more power can be made by going to a gas/glow mix for the 4-stroke gassers. I am in the process of doing this with a 40cc B&S. It's not as easy or convenient as straight gas but I think it will be worth it. Don't need any ignition, just a battery connected to the glow plug with a switch or you can go the onboard driver route.
Old 05-30-2008, 10:49 PM
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

Got a little more done on the Bebe,

Finished the faux bracing wires and turnbuckles (still need painting). Added the turtledeck bulkheads and stringers. I need to build and fit the horizontal stab before I can finish the turtledeck. I have all the aluminum tubing I need for the stab/elev/rudder so I think I'll start there next.

John,
For me the whole point of going gas is getting away from the cost and mess of glow.

Scott

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Old 05-30-2008, 11:18 PM
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Default RE: 1/3 Scale Nieuport 11

Scott, aside from mixing the fuel there isn't anything different than running gas and a EI except you get more RPM's. It seems to be the best way to get the most performance from these gas 4-strokes and without the expense of an EI. I am using 33% nitro for cars which has a very low oil content and the B&S 4-stroke has a wet sump oil system so no other oil in the fuel. It's really a pretty clean solution. A quart of the 33% nitro is $14. and will last for quit awhile mixed with the gas. Your Nieuport is looking good.

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