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Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

Old 09-27-2010, 11:44 AM
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Default Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

Seems like it is a good idea to have a sub to play with when I go ice-fishing
Any tip of extra features needed ?
Old 09-27-2010, 02:48 PM
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Default RE: Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

...warm long johns
Old 09-27-2010, 05:42 PM
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Default RE: Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

We have a rule up north about subs.

Never ever drive your boat in water colder then your willing to dive in to get your boat back. It also effects your seals and such.. I would warn against it. get a hovercraft or one of those kyosho Blizzards to occupy you instead.
Old 09-27-2010, 06:10 PM
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Default RE: Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

Any *усская hobby submariner living in Siberia want to prove Nuke wrong ?

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Old 09-27-2010, 07:36 PM
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Default RE: Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

You should put one in the water and prove us wrong!

Actually it is a sub ron 4 policy. Im sure subron8 and subronon all abide by the same policy.
Old 09-27-2010, 08:42 PM
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Default RE: Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

A CRAZY submariner already did , of course nobody else is that crazy yet [youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vxN7qtZfZE[/youtube]
Old 09-27-2010, 09:02 PM
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Default RE: Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

That is just nuts! Are you close to the ontario sub group?
Old 09-28-2010, 06:04 AM
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Default RE: Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

WOW! very nice Submarine and ship!! that must be fun! doesn't the hull get scratched?
Old 09-28-2010, 12:31 PM
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Default RE: Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

No, I am not close to any marine hobby club unfortunately.

Hey, there is nothing wrong with being CAREFUL and advising people to be careful based on previous experience, because no matter how good your RC sub is, there is still a chance of accident. Advising new-comers to be careful, not to pull crazy stunts is the RIGHT thing to do. I remember many years ago, 'one day when I was young' , I saw an experienced submariner lost his beautiful big ' Surcouf ' with its sail-plane onboard in a pond during travelling club meet in Rochester, Michigan.
Even with 'unlimited' fund, MILITARY have lost the K-19, the Kurst, the Thresher, the Scorpion ......

However, the theory to play in icy water is not completely impossible because the water during icy winter, under the ice is a little ' warmer ' ( 4 degree Celsius ) while the air temperature could be -10 degree. Experience from cars, shows that rubber seals are not reported to be damaged by driving in a deep freeze, but from overheating the engine.
In summer, a submarine that dives, faces shifting to negative bouyancy due to 1) Pressure squeezing the hull to become small. 2) Lower temperatures at depth reduces the hull bouyancy further due to shrinkage. In icy diving. #2 does not hold during steady state.
Battery is a problem like starting a car during deep freeze, yet can be solved by insulation and adding a small heated gel pad as well as limiting to a pre-tested safe playtime time limit.
Can our hobby radio waves ( not allowed to use the military long waves) penetrate ice as good as water interface, requires another expert advice.
The risk can be further reduce to an acceptable level by a safety heavy duty fishing line , my low tech innovation.
All I need now, is some field EXPERIENCE feedback advice so that I might be able to modify it to play in our fall weather of chilly water. I am not crazy enough to launch any sub into icy water.
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Old 09-28-2010, 03:38 PM
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Default RE: Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

Never ran subs in icy conditions but I'm pretty sure that I wouldn't want to take a swim in 4 degree water! :P
Old 09-28-2010, 06:42 PM
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Default RE: Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

Absolutely, if you lost control of the sub, you have to accept that it is lost.
Anybody who jumps into, or falls through thin ice, into 4 gegree water is as good as dead ! Even if you came out, you will be frozen in minutes. Believe me, I spent my first year in Canada in Thunder Bay ( a.k.a. Port Arthur and Fort Williams), which has cold days of -35 degree fahrenhite and I know how dangerous cold is and it requires respect [:@].
Old 09-28-2010, 07:05 PM
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Default RE: Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

Actually, I myself, DO NOT INTEND to play the RC submarine in icy water. I DON'T EVEN ICE-FISH although I do see ice-fishermen on and off at the local river .
I present this question scenario on the basis that if I can learn from the best, the most extreme, I can apply it with ease to run my sub in the fall weather of slightly chilly water.
That is why I did not post that CRAZY British video right away.
Who on earth would launch a RC sub in freezing cold weather if you can launch your sub in an indoor heated swimming pool instead ???
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Old 09-29-2010, 10:23 AM
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Default RE: Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

Who, the extream would and that is I the crazy one from originaly the North ,I have at least 4 years experiance in Icy waters,i would sail with say an inch or 2 of Ice in Pine Lake washington  .The Subs would be the mighty 1/96th Typhoon and De bore Skip Jack,Typhoon  she had to dive under the ice since her bow was not an Ice breaker although it worked well at full speed impact known as ramming speed.I would then proceed to a pree aranged course set around a peir over the lake,the water black and deep to about 25 ft,if she went down I would have to iether wait till spring or get a diver.Fortunatly and I mean fortunatly she never had a problem just ran her course ,found  a good spot to punch threw and then retracted the dive plains then  blew all mains!
It was quite a sight to see the Typhoons sail then body crack the ice and lift it up like it was not there,one needs some seriuse ballast system for this to occur with plenty of reserve!.
I then opened the missle doors and launched the 2 SLBMs ,closed the doors and  pumped up the on bourd ballast systems air banks to max  of 60lbs. and once full turned it off.
Hit the the dive switch and extendid DP, slowly the monster sub dove straight and level to about a foot,then ahead 1/4 on all motors and she moved back under the ice to the next spot to surface,or around the area in a large U shaped pier  circuit.I would go to full speed on the straight aways and just at  the right moment reverse the starbourd motor and full on the port and full rudder to make a very sharp tun before hitting the pier,it was awsome to see that monster list about 35 degrees at high speed under the clear ice then just strighnen right up and keep on going. 
Everthing ran fine had no seal deterioration or anthing that Nuke mentioned,no radio glitches but again I use a PCM radio and no other in ice.
For several years.
Sure its nuts to run in the ice but its like no other sub run you will ever experiance and I miss it and would gladly with eagerness do it again after getting well climatized after being in sunny warm Florida for years now,man what a shock that would be !Blubber needed!

Remember that you have to have a very relible sub that you know its limitations and very well maintained .

One time I did have a problem but it was in the fall no ice,she would not surface and she was in the deep fotunatly the bubble tracer was working as usual and led me exactly where she was,after about 3 tries to get her I was well climatized to the water,even my daughter at the age of 4 swam in icy water,I then made a big gulp down I went there she was stuck on a submerged branch and fishing line ,hate that stuff,I pulled her up to the surface and kept on with the run.She was painted as all of the big subs where back then silver due to the black water,made a huge difference!
Some place I have the video its awsome but not the launches the camarra guy got scared!
I still don't see where Nuke comes with the malfuntons,maybe the wrong kind of seals?
Oh the run time went down to about 2 thirds the colder it got as the bats where in the wet.Antyfreez in the motor water cooling system.
Dave   
Old 09-29-2010, 10:25 AM
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Default RE: Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

And yes the ice will mess with your paint job,funnn
Old 09-29-2010, 07:50 PM
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Default RE: Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

Depends on what seals you use. Im sure you guys will figure it out though.
Old 09-29-2010, 08:31 PM
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Default RE: Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

you need to tell us so that we might be more informed.
Old 09-29-2010, 08:35 PM
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Default RE: Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

No you will likely argue.
Old 09-29-2010, 08:36 PM
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Default RE: Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

no i just don't use them.
Old 09-30-2010, 12:51 PM
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Default RE: Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

you seem to be experts <div>Where should i get a ballast tank. The one that uses a motor to suck in water without a venthole i was referring to one that spins a thread to move the wall  inside the ballast tank....Also is 75mhz okay to controll my submarine? (im not sure if my explanation is understanable)</div>
Old 10-10-2010, 08:01 PM
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Default RE: Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

Atcom,

I believe you are talking about an Engel piston tank. Available in different sizes and different voltages. Not cheap but very reliable. Also, 75Mhz is the preferred frequency for the underwater crew.

Pete
Old 10-10-2010, 08:04 PM
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Default RE: Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

I dont think hungary uses 75mhz
Old 10-10-2010, 08:51 PM
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Default RE: Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

40Mhz is what you use in Europe for rc submarines.
Regards,
John
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Old 10-11-2010, 11:49 AM
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Default RE: Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water

If you want to save a ton of money and still have a sub that can hover which is esential ,make your own ballast system like I do see diagram cost around 30 bucks.Love it! With no
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Old 10-11-2010, 11:58 AM
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Default RE: Need tips on sub to static-dive in icy water



And for proper breaching of the Ice I used the Onboard compressor System like the full size do,that realy punches threw!

Dave</p>
Old 11-05-2021, 12:06 AM
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That is just nuts! Are you close to the ontario sub group?

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