Panzerfaust77

Hey guys.

I treated myself to a vsTank! It's the late production Tiger 1, desert color with zimmerit. Apologies if I'm stating the obvious but up until now I've only had HLs so I was blown away by the level of detail and quality of the thing. I've fallen in love with 1/24! The drivetrain is solid - no sloppy wheels and they even got the swing arms reversed on one side - and I was expecting rubber tracks so it was another bonus when I discovered they were individually linked. Excellent paint job too and the dimensions seem spot on! This is the airsoft version as that's all I could get but it shoots HARD. The overall construction feels top notch.

Cons
14 AA batteries?!!! I'm glad I used rechargeables but DAMN. [X(]

The controls are the biggest issue. The remote has the same quality build but the way you control this tank is bloody idiotic. There are three buttons for 'forward' at various speeds although the the difference is negligible so no smooth control here. Similar for reverse. So that's 5 buttons just for bask forward and reverse. There are no less than 4 buttons for neutral spins. Turning is accomplished via 4 buttons. So that's 13 (THIRTEEN) buttons for the same functionality afforded by a single analog stick on the Hl remote. And there are two buttons for changing the gun elevation (which cycles anyway so the second button is meaningless). Given the quality of everything, the massively over-engineered remote seems like a huge miss. Controlling this tank is not easy. And just changing the batteries in the remote requires removing two screws in the back panel. WHY?! [:@]

The sound is pretty awful. The engine (which sounds extremely rough!) only runs when that tank is moving so it stops and starts which emphasizes the awful digital controls. The sound it makes when firing without the airsoft is like that of a 20mm flak gun, not a mighty 88 and it makes a different sound with the airsoft. Why? Is there anyway to turn the sound off or adjust the volume? Even HL tanks sound better than this.

So my main gripes are with the clunky digital controls and the sound but this is still a solid, quality tank. I'm not a big fan of the Tiger but if vsTank where to do a Panzer II or 38(t) I would be all over it! Given that this cost only a little more than an S&S HL, the difference is even more stark!

I give the vsTank Tiger four 88 shells out of five [8D]

[Edit: I got it from Backyard Tanks and it appears to be the 2006 or 2007 model based on the vs 2007 product guide in the box. In regard to the sound, I can probably put in a spare HL volume pot]

shenlonco

My Feedback: (2)

Yes that's why they are going to make a better tank line version in the future with 2.4ghz and better sounds and so forth... it's going to cost more but probably will be worth it and they will have upgrade kits for all the older tanks... 2 tank lines am version now less money and the top of the line 2.4ghz versions for more money... Go to www.vstank.com click global site and join the club and in that section you can vote for some future products.

borealis

When coming from a HL experience, the first impact with vstank controls is bad. But after all the newer controls are better than the 2007 ones.
I have just bought a T-72 IR (pretty same as the tiger), which I already modded for on-board battery charging (the plug is under the commander left hatch). Since I tested the Leo2 A5 in the past, I must say that the newer remote is better. The double speed for spin turns still is a nonsense, but the newer large curve radius control, as well as the double speed in reverse is fine. On my t-72 the different speeds are noticeably different. however. The T-72 turret is so small that the inside is a masterpiece of engineering.
They developed a new compact unit for elevation (mounted on the side of the gun), and a compact unit too for turret rotation.
Both those units should be kept into account for any custom build, since they are available as spares.
Finally, the detail level is quite good.

Panzerfaust77

Oh it's good that they don't compromise the dimensions to shoe-horn in the components like HL do. Actually I had to open the tank up yesterday because the left sprockets stopped working. The case is assembled the same way as the HL tiger which necessitates the removal of the tracks (I like how the tracks just snap together without needing pins!). I had to take apart the gearbox (the design of which is about as simple as it can be) and one of the motors to find that a piece of wire had somehow got in there, stopping it from turning. The layout inside was quite neat but alas the the control unit is sealed and I didn't feel like stripping it down just to find the speaker wires.

Sigh. That aside, just wish I could buy a good ready-to-run tank where I didn't have to think about doing some major mod to correct some egregious design flaw 5 minutes after turning it on.

Gex

is there an easy way to turn the volume down or disable it altogether on the tiger I? I kind of wish it just had a little volume knob

j z

You have to admit, for what you pay for one and the quality you get , it's pretty hard to beat. I have three so far and they work well. I wish they would release plastic or metal tracks for the T-72, but I guess it will come sooner or later. AS far as volume, I soldered a small resistor in line with the positive speaker wire and it lowered the volume by half, but a volume control would be nice. Regards, JZ

shenlonco

My Feedback: (2)

Hi that's not a good way to lower the speaker volume as you are adding resistance to the amplifier in the board ...kind of like adding a 2 ohm speaker on a amp that's meant to drive only 8 ohm speakers ..you are over straining the parts in the amp and heating things up and somethings going to blow in the long run..

j z

I didn't realize it would over load the board. But isn't a volume pot a sort of variable resistor ? I'm no electronics expert so correct me if I'm wrong. Guess I'll remove that resistor before I make problems for myself ! Thanks Shen. Regards, JZ

borealis

You can completely disable the sound by unplugging the speaker, of course. I have yet to try soldering inline a spare HL volume knob: I want to find a suitable place to hide it before mounting it.

condor11

Actually that's the first thing I do in my VsTanks (I have 12). Open the control box and disconnect the speaker. It is very easy, just unscrew the top of the box, open it, and disconnect the speaker. The layout of the box is accurate so you won't mess up anything. If you could fix the gearbox, the control box will be a piece of cake for you.
The tank sound A LOT BETTER without the sound, trust me!

pcsguy88

I love my 5 VsTanks, but the first thing I do is open them up, pry the speaker off and put a 1/2" piece of memory foam between the speaker and the shell. This works wonders for drowning out the engine sound to an acceptable level. After a week, you will not haveany problems controlling the tank smoothly. The Tiger is a pain to open, but the rest just split in half with 4 or 5 screws. The Tiger is also very slow, taking away the point of the different speeds. The T-72 is by far the best, but the rubber treads hinder it's use on carpet. the rest are way too fast, but are fun once plastic treads are added. The Type 90 handles like a sports car with the addition of M1A1 treads. It combines the speed of the old gearbox with the smoothness of the T-72 & Tiger. The T-72 uses a gearbox like the Tamiya Leopard combined with high torque motors. The KV2 has a volume control added and I think the Sherman does too. VsTank really listens to it's fans. The quality is outstanding and they are quick to replace a faulty tank, only requiring a picture or video of the problem and shipping the treads, wheels and battery cover to them which costs about $6. Unfortunately it is about 2wks each way to China.

I love my HL Bulldog to conquer the yard and being able to get my hands dirty working on it, but I do wish the quality was on par with VsTank. Can't wait for the Challenger 2 to come out, but I hope they release the new electronic upgrade kits and hard treads for the T-72 first. If you buy any more, make sure you get the IR because it's impossible to hit each other with airsoft. I have 1 T-72 airsoft, my Tiger, Abrams, Leopard A6, Type-90 and camo T-72 are all IR for great driveway battles in the summer.

shenlonco

My Feedback: (2)

The volume controle is in line with the pre amp of a amplifier it's a low voltage signal that feeds into the amp it's self from a pre amp...you cant put a volume control on the amps out put wires that go to the speaker you will burn or over heat the board with the amp on it.... Put it this way it's like playing your home audio system on loud now if you put a adjustable resister or volume control in line with your speaker wire you will make the ohms of the speaker change and there for burn out your audio systems amp..

shenlonco

My Feedback: (2)

Sure you can hit another tank with airsoft you just need to use heavy bb's .20 or .25's because the .12 bbs are so light they fly up in the air way to high and float making it impossible to aim at a target that is low to the ground like another tank..

borealis

Thanks shenlonco for the explanation, I will avoid to try that change, then.

Panzerfaust77

I'm no expert but surely you can wire the pot with a capacitor in parallel so that as resistance to the speaker increases, it is compensated for? I'm sure it's something like that (been years since I studied this).

shenlonco

My Feedback: (2)

Never seen anything done like that before as like i stated above a volume controle should be in the pre amp section not out of the amps power wires to the speaker ..

Panzerfaust77

Well I unplugged the speaker. Nice little PCB. What a massive difference! The natural sound of the motors sure beats that awful sound 'effect'. Who are they kidding with these cheap ass sound effects? It's unfortunate to lose the gun sound but small loss.

As for my earlier comment the idea is to keep the resistance across the amp output the same while lowering the voltage to the speaker. Have a second resister across the speaker inputs?

shenlonco

My Feedback: (2)

yep what i been telling VS since there first 1/24 scale tank...the first ones sounded like somebody hitting a bongo!!! then the next version was supposed to be a improvement but to me sounds even worse than the first version with it's anoying toyish sounding clancking sound!!

If VS only would listen if they made the motor sound like HL 1/16 scale a low deep humming sound they would sell alot more tanks and you would not mind all the tanks using the same motor sound..... But as they are now all using the toyish clancking sound it drives guy's NUTS!!!

Most guy's don't buy VS tanks because when they hear the motor sound it's a BIG turn off and first thing that comes to there mind is it's a TOY and not hobby grade....

It needs to be improved the canon and machien gun sound ok it's that darn cluncking blubbering clancking sound that bothers everyone!!!

condor11

BTW, does anybody know, what kind of motors do VsTanks have? Are they brushless motors? Why do they have those capacitors at the back?

Panzerfaust77

I had to take one apart completely and no they're not brushless. Pretty standard stuff. The gearbox was not impressive but it works at this scale. The ceramics caps on the back are also common - they provide some small measure of damping so the motors stop a little smoother when used with digital electronics (I think).

Panzerfaust77

And yet they produce everything else to a very high quality - the paint work, even the historical accuracy (reversed swing arms etc). As with the digital controls, it doesn't make sense. You have these small scale tanks that are almost perfect and then you have a massive fail in the sound department (which is compounded by the lack of a volume adjustment or even a goddamn off switch!!! How cheap!).

They should do what elmod does - put the sounds on an SD card so that they can be changed. That would be awesome.

condor11

Interesting, thanks!
Can you elaborate on the gearbox flimsiness? (Touch wood) I've never stripped it even though I've been running my tanks outside including in the snow. One Tiger I have has about 40 hours on it running in the snow over the last 2 winters.

shenlonco

My Feedback: (2)

Hi the caps on the motors help stop interfearance from the brushes arcing on the motors com...just like with big real RC's you need them or you can get radio glitches interfearance problems.... As for the gear boxes they pretty tuff ..but VS is planing on doing a all metal gear box for upgrades in the future.... I put a micro on off switch out the exhaust on my tiger I so i can turn the speaker on and off.... Just was out site with it in the dark running it on top of the snow worked pretty well since the snow it very hard and packed on the surface...

VS is probably going to do metal gear boxes because with there metal upgrade tracks i would think the standard plastic gears will blow after a while from all the extra strain the metal tracks will put on them..

O and there is a way to kind of mask the sound that would be to use a RAM sound unit so that it will play as the standard sound is playing it will kind of switch the sound...I never bothered with a Ram unit though.

pcsguy88

I'm telling you guys, .5" of memory foam dampens the sound, mixing it with the natural motor and track sounds and still allows for cannon & MG sounds.

shenlonco

My Feedback: (2)

Yep he's correct guy's try it out!! I put a 1/2 inch thick of the memory foam over the speaker openings and put my tiger back together it's the perfect volume now the tanks much more enjoyable to run...I can hear my motors humming and the tracks going and even hear the wheels sqeeking now! I need some oil on em!
Funny thing the guns both of them still sound very good it seems to really dampen the motor clancking sound....
I would definitly do this if you own a VS tank it's 100% better now!!

[8D]Thanks for the info pcsguy88