issues with HL tiger
 

I got my first tiger a day ago, and everything was fine.

broke in the steel gears the lazy way after that I put some lithium grease on the gears.
it has plastic tracks and is the S&S tank

charge the battery on my piranha charger and it drove fine. for a day but only was getting maybe 15 minutes of strong running
on cement, carpet, short grass lightly covered with snow, gravel. it never got wet on the inside of the tank.

now for the issues at hand that might be causing the underlying problem.

main problem: with what I think is a fully charged battery the tank starts up and drives fine for a few minutes then everything stops working
except the sound which just sits at idle??? also smoke works.

The battery, I have not been able to charge it at 2 amps which it is rated for 2000mah, and if I charge it at say 1 amp it puts about 1000mah in the pack or less. so I've been stuck at charging at .5 amp for a very long charge.

the battery has a voltage of 7.99 with no load, is this right?

has anybody had a problem like this?

I really think its the battery, is there a proper way to discharge and charge the Ni-cd battery

thanks

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

Stock Heng Long battery? They're crap. Chuck em in the garbage and get a decent pack. It sounds like the pack has at least one bad cell, which results in it reading good voltage and charging at moderate rates okay, but as soon as you try to fast charge it or load it down while driving, the cell craps out and the pack's voltage plummets until it has a chance to sit for a few minutes.

D.

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

I reckon its the transmitter - loose crystal or antenna.

Reason being -- if the battery is flat or going flat, the noise/sound is first to go -- I mean it distorts to all heck when you move (especially with the smoker on). I have never had a tank just "go flat" on me, they usually go until its so slow you can't be bothered with it (charge time!)

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

The stock packs are OK, I run them in all kinds of things here -- I suppose you guys with the peak chargers pumping 2A into them might think differently after a few charges, but trickle charge them (4-500mah) and they're fine...

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

Well I don't think it's the transmitter, because when I do charge the battery it works fine for awhile.

but the sound does seem fine and not garbly.

I'm not sure what it is but I am thinking it is a crappy battery.

I'll be getting a new one, as soon as I work this problem out.

I have the battery trickle charging now so I'll see what happens when it is done.

thanks

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

Stock batteries are fine for testing or running for a half hour! Believe me spend the 30 or 40 bucks and you will be so much happier!

The Blitz

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

so Nobody thinks it's more than the battery, I mean it could be the transmitter but I'm not to sure about that.

regardless it doesn't seem like the main board.

I'll go get a new battery right now and see what happens.

thanks

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

My tank did this a few times my bulldog. it would drive to the other side of my 18ft living room and just stop with sound on idle. I had to get closer to the tank for it to fire back up again. The tank however outside gose further and don't stop at all.

Could it be somthing in the house like Internet wireless doing this or TV or summat ??

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

I found that one of the few transiters on the motors has broken, could this cause the problem.

thanks

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

the bypass capacitors (filter spikes/noise - take the load when it stalls) you mean, bridged across the poles (+ and -) on the motor?

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

Yes the ones on the motor light browny yellow only one is broke will this make what is happening happen???

I wouldn't think so?

I'm going out right now to get a new battery, I really hope this fixes it.

I've tryed it a couple more times already and same thing, with no tracks so not alot of load it goes fast not slow but then stops a few secounds later.

I charged the battery for 20 minutes, then tryed it and it lasted longer at full throttle but only like 1 minute.

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

Run it flat somehow, I usually cycle my NiCads, especially when new (run them flat, charge them fully - repeat x3).

You're doing an awful lot of charging at the moment!! With the bypass caps, I've ran them with, ran them without, but never half-half

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

Well I might as well add my 2 cents worth and also ask a question.I assume when you say it sets there idling with the sound still going that the light or lights on the front stay on in a continueouse mode and they are not flashing.?????
When it does that do you have control of any of the other features.?????
My experience with battery's is the tank just gets slower and slower when they start loosing power.Not saying it can't be the battery but they normally don't do that.The lights and what they are doing will help tell you whats going on and where.
The little guy on the motor is a "resistor" (thats my guess)but could always be wrong.(you said transistor) (wacky says capacitor)and I don't think it is either of those.It is what I call a draw down resistor and also used for a noise filter in a way and controls volt spikes.
One of the electrical gu-ru's will straighten us all out I hope.
I know everyone has there own opinion on charger's and battery's,mine being that I think those peak charger's just kill these stock battery's.And if you use the one that came with the tank it takes a long time to fully charge the battery. Good luck BIGMIG ;););)

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

Whilst it they might "look" like a resistor, but they are very much a non-polarized capacitor used for stopping noise and reducing spikes created. Also known as "Decoupling capacitor" ([link=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decoupling_capacitor]wiki[/link])
Further images & comparative graphs (with/without) [link=http://www.seattlerobotics.org/encoder/jun97/basics.html]here[/link]

http://www.gogoboard.org/cocoon/gogo...bypass_cap.jpg

Bypass capacitors
When driving an inductive load such as motors, the load sometimes generate noise back to the board. This noise can mess-up the power of the board. If this happens, you need to add a small capacitor across the motor leads.

A typical bypass capacitor size is 0.1uF (0.1 Micro Farad). Don't use polarized capacitors (i.e. ones that have one lead longer than the other).


My white-motor Suntech's have 2 x 0.1 uF (100000pF) "104" capacitors for this function.

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

Would never have guessed those would be capacitors,usually think of a capacitor as being able to store and give enitial boost or shot of power to "for instance" starting an electrical motor.All the capicators that I have worked with were usually Round. BIGMIG ;););)

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

"Install a .001 ufd ceramic disc capacitor directly across
each motors brushes and between each brush and their
motor case for RFI protection."

Above is quoted from Vantecs manual.......I noticed the cap value is .001uFd as opposed to .1uFd(maybe due to the larger input voltages on the motors coming from the Vantec ESC.The caps act as a type of "filter".

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

***** main problem: with what I think is a fully charged battery the tank starts up and drives fine for a few minutes then everything stops working
except the sound which just sits at idle??? also smoke works. ******

It happened to my Tiger 1 as well at the first few weeks out of the box. Also when upgrade the Pershing to Li-Po battery came across the same problem.

[link]http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_6256756/anchors_6256756/mpage_1/key_li%252Dpo/anchor/tm.htm#6256756[/link]

The wire that connects the antenna and receiver board is usually badly oxidized and filters out the RF signals. Replace this piece crap of wire with a new one or change to Pz's easy antenna mod.

The broken capacitor across the motor brush also the cause of interference and make the tank stall. Get a replacement and solder it back.

Hope this help.

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

I doubt it's a broken noise suppression cap. The fact that it occurs after a few minutes of running (ie. after the battery discharges somewhat) and that the battery won't take a charger well unless it's a low charger rate suggests that it's a bad pack. A battery pack with a bad cell does not behave nicely...it will very suddenly loose voltage...then slowly regain it after a few seconds, then drop when you reapply load, etc. They charge inconsistently, and there's really nothing you can do but replace the pack/cell.

A peak charger doesn't really damage the cell, it's the person setting the dial. Most RCers end up switching to a peak charger at some point. The real control factor is how fast you charge the pack. *GOOD* NiCds can be charged up to 12-15C, though it does lessen their lifespan. Poor NiCds can only be charged at 1-5C, though that's still a "fast charge" and reduces the life a little bit (depending on the quality of the cells). If you set a peak charger for a slower charge (say 1/2-1/5C) it will be easier on the pack. You can even set your peak charger for the same rate as a Heng Long POS charger, and it will treat the pack the same *and* terminate the charge when the pack's full as opposed to the HL charger which will start heating up the pack and reducing it's lifespan. It's not the charger....it's how you use it.

D.

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

PatPat's post did suggest something to me...perhaps it's a combination of bad RF (bad wire, broken noise suppression cap) *combined* with a bad pack which is dropping voltage, which makes the radio function poorly. I've seen the Heng Long ESC board (the big one) crash/lockup if it gets really bad signals. Happened when I was experimenting building the DBC and I munged the signal a bit...

Just a though.
D.

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

OK back from the RC shop, got a new battery and a capacitor for the motor,

The lights stay on and it will smoke but no turret, no firing, no movement.

The only thing about the antenna is it will start up every time, but when it happens I can't turn the engine off with the transmitter.

I'm charging the new battery now, so I will solder the capacitor anf check the transmitter.

thanks for the help.

I've taken the main board out but kept it all plugged in and ran it, nothing smoked and nothing got hot, so I think the board is good.

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

OK hooked up the new battery and drove it 3 feet then it stopped again!

so I'm guessing it is not the battery[&o] I checked the antenna on the transmitter and in the tank, they both look good.

I have the new capacitor soldered on, I'm lost now.

I guess it is the main board???

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

The antenna wire from the board to the antenna -- replace it, report back :)

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

What about the radio, frequently the casing that the batteries sit in the radio is scketchy at best, does the led lit up bright? Are you getting radio interferance, ie excessive powerlines, cb antena, metal shelving? And like Wacky said check the solder connection from ythe reciever board make sure that the single release connector to the antena wire is getting good contact and make sure that the antena itself is tight to the brass pole anf the screw on the brass pole is tight, then get back to us!

[sm=shades_smile.gif]

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

I think you have finaly guesed right,after all you have done it apears to be a faulty board.I did have some crystal problems with 3 of my tanks that were new,but when the tank was turned on the lights would flash and it just would not start.Your's apears to be trying to start and just won't take the signal to continue on.Did you buy it from Mato seeing you live in Canada,they may just send you a new board if you e-mail them.???? BIGMIG ;););)

RE: issues with HL tiger
 

I did resolder the antenna wire that was on the board, and it will start from far away, so I think the antenna is fine.
The light is bright on the radio, brand new batterys(duracel) bought yesterday, I will try new batterys but not tonight.

anything else to try I will try it.

I did by it from Mato.

I will ask them about a new board.

thanks for the help so far guys