How does one drive a tank
 

Okay so when I see video's of RC tanks or RC anything for that matter, There is one thing that kinda bugs me the driving does not look realistic. Trying to drive over or thru obstaclesthat that tanks normally just would not bother with.

One thing a friend of mine always told me when he used to fly his Spitfire, he would try to make it look as thou it was a full size plane. It looks like to me that we all need to learn how a tank is actually driven. My friend told me a story that when he was a tank mechanic in the Canadian Army way back in the 50`s they just got in either Crusader or Centurion ( can`t exactly remember)He challanged the the insructor of the British tank to a race because he felt that th bristish tank was way to slow at 20 miles per hour compared to the current Shermans that were capable of higher speeds.

So they agreed on the race course and off they went. The Sherman did win but not by much, but Doug did break the Sherman`s Transmission (which was apparently difficult to operate at best) Mean while the British tank just floated over most of the course in fact there men sitting on top of the tank the entire race. The instructor told Doug that in the Sherman there would have been a few injuries to the crew.

The point to this story was when you are simulating driving a tank the other objective is to preserve the equipment, smooth operation faciltates this. Maybe all you former tank operators can chime in. Now I know it is a little more difficult with these light weight tanks and the driving characteristics would be different but I would like to see some video`s that demonstrate this.

RE: How does one drive a tank
 

I particularly like to drive my tank slow....I mean really slow. I got it in my head at the start of this hobby, that these aren't race cars, so I drive them liketortoises. My tank rarely hit's top speed and when it does, it's to pinpoint what jiggles on my tank so I can correct it, so that it doesn't wobble when climbing things. I don't like it when the barrel or turret wobbles or anything on the tank, even minutely. Also, when climbing over obstacles, I like to go at a crawl tosimulateit's power. If it can't climb it at a crawl, I won't proceed any further. There are some things that I do, as it kind of takes the fun away if I didn't, like not stopping to turn my turret or not limiting the neutral turn to a single track turn on some of my tanks, or conducting a neutral turn while turning the turret the opposite direction and firing.<div></div><div>But I think for demonstration purposes, one should adhere to the realism of the tanks ability. But for entertainment purposes...it's hard to limit these functions as it would make it a tad bit boring for me.</div>

RE: How does one drive a tank
 

Yeah, that really bugs me about RC tank "combat"....with guys running thier tanks like racing sports cars, doing movements that were not possible...ie; pivot & back n forth with a Shermans T-34s or Pershings. [:'(] Semi pivot was possible with Panther and Tiger, but very, very slow and not possible with earlier panzers. M-3A1 Stuart M-3 Mediums and Shermans had a 5 speed totally unsynchronised crash box which required double clutching up and down...driving by sound/ear.. M-5, M-24 & Pershings had a semi auto transmission (similar to early Buick Dynaflow) which required shifting but no clutch, so were faster and a LOT easier to shift...but still, no sudden reverse-forward-reverse deal. The M-46 onwards had the Allison Cross drive tranny which was amazingly fast and permitted neutral steer(= pivot) as well as faster reverse. (also M-41) Some German panzers and most Russian tanks had a lock track, similar to a caterpillar tractor, where the driver could lean on the foot pedal and yank the lateral and have a semi pivot, but this was very hard on the tracks and the differential.

The race between the Centurian and Sherman was hands down in favor of the Centurian. Even the early marks had the pre-select transmission and could be steered with one or both laterals. Depending on which Sherman, the Centurian was prone to be faster, as the Sherman had to shift and wait for the transmission and generally had a top speed of around 25 mph. The Centurian could pre select the next gear, up or down, then tap the transfer pedal to engage.

Today's tanks are in a totally new world of maneuverability. Still when running mine, I adhere to what the tank was capable of doing
and make them run as realistic as possible. It's a bit difficult at times, but I like to traverse my turret onto target without presenting my flank to the enemy...unless there is no other way,. NEVER give your enemy a side view.

RC Tanks should be built with the operational restrictions inherrent to that particular tank...it would make RC "combat" a lot more interesting.:eek:

RE: How does one drive a tank
 

Actually, what that would do is limit battle fields to the best of the best RC tanks with the mostcapabilities, introducing a whole new kind of mundane field in myopinion.lol A battle field full of KT's and Tiger I. Why would one purposefully buy and field a worthless tank only to sit out every round it plays! lol

I think realism is great for demonstrations, but to merge it into a competition,....meh...people don't purposely choose to be the underdog, they get chosen by circumstances. lol

If realism is implemented on the field, there would have to be more Shermans on the field against the one KT or Tiger I, therefore a lot more members in a club.
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RE: How does one drive a tank
 

I have always been put off by the sprinting tanks darting about. It just looks fake. I think a good setup comprises of 3:1 or 4:1 gearboxes and a DBC with superspin disabled and the inertia function active. I think that is the best off the shelf system to accurately represent tank driving dynamics.

Perry

RE: How does one drive a tank
 

This subject has been a source of irritation to me ever since organized tank 'meets' began to happen.

Understand that I came into this hobby from a completely different angle. With my gas/glow powered models
you don't just charge them up and go. Maintenance has always been as important as running if not more so.
If I don't pay attention to where and how I run the models it can get expensive.

I can't tell you how many times I've been asked over the years why do I run so slow; why don't I run in mud, sand
gravel or whatever. And these questions have been often times asked by people who should already know the answer.
When I first saw the hot dawg, thrasher approach many take to running a model it makes my one remaining hair stand on end.

The fact is that tanks, fulls size or models can be driven over all manner of terrain using all manner of driving
methods. The question is simple if you were out in combat and your survival was dependent on this machine wouldn't
you drive like your life depended on it? I'm sure there were situations in all armored conflicts where caution was thrown
out the window but I'm certain those were acts of desperation when no alternatives remained. To wear parts out isn't my goal; A full size tank crew ( if they survive) can have their steed serviced and renewed at the expense of
their service organization; we modelers unfortunately have to fix it ourselves sometimes at a premium cost.
That said I'm not shy about running any of my models; I'm just very picky where and how.

At local club events I always tried to interest the members in setting up driving courses to practice and test driving skill
and I've received moderate to nil interest. To this day I still enjoying just driving as well as I am able just about more than anything else; no matter what scale. Whenever I saw the herky-jerky driving that ensuing in club combat my first reaction was to drive in the opposite direction...To me anyway it seems driving well in a realistic manner for many rc tankers is not high on their list but it should be.

Models are never going to exactly duplicate all aspects of a full size original, not matter boat plane or tank. We
should do our best to represent the full size machine to the best of our ability. It really is the last piece of detail that we can add to the model; one of the most authentic but yet least costly to recreate.

I'll quote two lines that have stuck in my mind over the years:

First when noting the near wheelies and spins turned by a local chap with his large model his reply: " It was expensive to buy it should be fast". Ah, I see....

Lastly there was (is?) a sign posted in a local boating marina that cautions those towing a boat to proceed:
"Slow and Majestic". Perhaps not quite befitting a tank but closer to how I drive than thrashing the tracks, popping the throttle and pulling a brodie on the way into combat...

But then I'm boring.

Jerry

RE: How does one drive a tank
 

LOL!!!!<span style="font-family: Verdana, Arial; font-size: 13px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 1px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 1px; ">" It was expensive to buy it should be fast"</span><div><span style="font-family: Verdana, Arial; font-size: 13px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 1px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 1px; ">
</span></div><div><font size="3" face="Verdana, Arial"><span style="font-size: 13px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 1px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 1px;">That's is one of the most asinine things I ever did read! How did you keep from laughing your tail off when you were told that?</span></font></div><div><font size="3" face="Verdana, Arial"><span style="font-size: 13px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 1px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 1px;">
</span></font></div><div><font size="3" face="Verdana, Arial"><span style="font-size: 13px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 1px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 1px;">Didn't realize cost alone should dictate breaking down abilities that shouldn't be there. Hell, my wifes engagement ring was +$10k and should come with unlimited daddy time! LMAO!! But it don't.....not so L-O-L.</span></font></div>

RE: How does one drive a tank
 

Jerry, when I was tooling around in OD field gear and uncle Sam was paying the repair bills, it was OK...BUT, when I had my own 1;1 scale tank and put too much $$$ getting it rolling, the "hot dog tree & brush crashing" came to a halt, except for certain occasions.
Scale model or full scale, it still costs money...except a 1;16 scale you can carry to the transport vehicle. [:-]

RE: How does one drive a tank
 

<div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; background-image: initial; background-attachment: initial; background-origin: initial; background-clip: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-family: Arial; font-size: 12px; "><span style="font-size: small; ">I think we must first differentiate the difference between demo/leisuredriving and competitive IR battle and historic IR/Air soft battle (if thatexist.), historic hobbyist, etc.. There's different classifications that one can define themselves as, but what ever it is....we all must keep this in mind; simply because someone enters this hobby or owns an RC tank, doesn't mean they have to adhere to the limitations of their real life counter parts. In my opinion, at no other time should anyone be offended that the tank is doing something it shouldn't, unless the driver/hobbyist has claimed to follow aguidelinethat should lead anyone to believe he/she has the intent to portray realism. Simply because it is a tank, isn't enough.</span><div><span style="font-size: small; ">
</span></div><div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; background-image: initial; background-attachment: initial; background-origin: initial; background-clip: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-family: Arial; font-size: 12px; "><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; background-image: initial; background-attachment: initial; background-origin: initial; background-clip: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-family: Arial; font-size: 12px; "><span style="font-size: small; ">I think it's hard for people to want to experiencerealisticdriving because the experience isn't realistic to begin with. It would contribute many limitations that make the choice of a particular tank to enter a field of competition evident as a bad one.</span><div><span style="font-size: small; ">
</span></div><div><span style="font-size: small; ">We're all driving from a birds eye view which isn't realistic to a battle experience or driving experience. While I've never had theopportunityto go to a meet, those that I have watched on the Tube don't appear all that interesting in regards to battling realism. I think it's hard to implement the desire for realism because there is a disadvantage/advantage applied to potentially realistic battles because of thisaerialview which transforms it to laser tag. Dodging and ducking is conducted a lot from what I've seen, avoiding to commit going from point A to point B because they do know what lurks around the corner or to take advantage of an open spot between a water fountain and bush that protects them.</span></div><div><span style="font-size: small; ">
</span></div><div><span style="font-size: small; ">A lot of the video's I have seen withpeopleparading their tanks around their battle field seems like they have the intent to implement realism, but when battles take place, that's thrown out the window where they quickly jerk back the tank to hid sensors behind the telephone poles and twigs.</span></div><div><span style="font-size: small; ">
</span></div><div><span style="font-size: small; ">So, to me. It's the battle between the best player vs best tank on the field or the best player to manipulate the limited functionality of a tank on the field.</span></div></div></div><div><span style="font-size: small; ">
</span></div></div><div><span style="font-size: small; ">Then there are those who bought a tank to have the best of both worlds, or somewhat. A machine to abuse and get down and dirty. Those have been the ones that aren't really driven by the desire to imitate realism that plague youtube. Driving into ditches and spinning tracks at high speeds to get out, etc.</span></div><div><span style="font-size: small; ">
</span></div><div><span style="font-size: small; ">What ever it is that we see. Surely we can't expect everyone to share the same level ofpassionand portrayal of realism because they are driving a tank. While I do agree that I too like to drive my tank like it's real life counterpart,....it's just not a taboo to everyone and shouldn't be.</span></div></div>

RE: How does one drive a tank
 

Just my 2 cents. These aren't "real" tanks. They are simulacrum of tanks. I sometime drive mine slow, sometimes fast. Depends on my mood. If my Tamiya would take the abuse, I'd drive it full steam through all obstacle that would be under my tracks. To me, a tank is something that can't be stopped. One day, I'll build 16th scale destructible buildings so I can have the video of a tank crushing a house to chalk dust. I would also love to see my KV-1 catch air. ;)

RE: How does one drive a tank
 

I have built roads around my place and I can tell you that these tanks will cover much more groung by taking the road and driving senceabily than by going cross crontry and going over everything you can find.

I play hunt and ... missions and the road is always best unless you need to sneak up on an ambush.  Off roads, they are too slow to be a threat.

Bouncing over every rock and hill makes you a target for a tank moving on a road that can move and aim at the same time.  Off roads is for hiding and ambush, not for being mobile.

I supose real tanks are the same.

RE: How does one drive a tank
 

That my friend, I want to see. So get to work! Build that wall and tear it down!!! lol

RE: How does one drive a tank
 

I must admit that I once built a little rock wall and did a movie of my tiger crashing through it.  It just went over it with no problem.  To scale it was 4' tall and it was so easy I delited the file. 

I ran over one of those three piece iron road blocks too.  Crushed it.

Perhaps a 6' tall wall...

RE: How does one drive a tank
 

lol! I plan to do that with my Tiger. Make a plaster wall with more water than necessary to make it as brittle as possible. But, that's just a thought. Will I ever commit to it is the question! Also wanted to do that with cars, and crush them. You could easily make mock cars with aluminum foil. Cover a car up with aluminum and press it around the car to form fit it and you have a shell left, paint it up and there you have a crushable car. But again....will I commit to it....hmmm, maybe later. lol

RE: How does one drive a tank
 

It's fun.

The wife thinks it's kind'a crazy.

My 5 year old son LOVES crashing through little walls we build together!</p>

RE: How does one drive a tank
 

Hello All,

In all my videos I attempt to make the tank as real as I can . Sometines I have to haul ass to make the suspension work and then slow it down. I believe in 3 to 1 gear sets and ESC with no silly spin. This makes the tank to me easier to run as well as give power.

I agree that these two options are the best things you can do to an HL to add realism.

My best to all here and your views.

Be well,

David....owner of one Bulldog...so far.

RE: How does one drive a tank
 

Wel I'm glad that I didn't open a can of worms. I just try to drive my tank as smooth as I can. One of the reasons for that is that I have a RC sailboat which requires small inputs, but I would imagine that airplanes would be even more sensitive. So I just try to translatethat to my tanks.

So yes to each their own and drive the way you want. As long as your having fun,is that not what this is about. Thanks for all of your opinions, it was interesting reading that's for sure.

And Big Tony don't you have a couple of tanksto finish before you can go crashing thru walls LOL.
Ray

RE: How does one drive a tank
 

Man, try six! lol.....may be seven if the ebay seller doesn't cancel my budget hobby engine leo....oh I hope he does! But, almost done with one.http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/js/f...wink_smile.gif

RE: How does one drive a tank
 

I like slow moving WWII tanks, and the odd video I make I try to always capture the power of a tank. That is why I am a 3:1 gear user. IT makes everything about the tank movement look more realistic.

My favorite video is of my Sherman plowing through deep snow at a snails pace. Not running getting stuck, jerking back and then taking another run. Just plain slow, "nothing but an incoming round" is going to stop me look.

For Heng long users the DBC is more then just a battle system. It gets rid of the superspin and the flaky recoil, and then adds in momentum. Even if you are not into IR, a DBC will make your Heng Long run that much better.

RE: How does one drive a tank
 

Try glow power Helicopters ..... without gyros... like balancing a dinner plate on a pencil. Not relaxing at all; I
stopped trying years ago before gyros became common and efficient.

I can see that my comments slightly ruffled a few feathers, you know anyone can drive their model tank anyway they wish.
I as some others also try to run as reasonably as I've seen tanks run; except as in the propaganda films we've all seen;
Tigers lumbering through a house; Stewarts flying over hills.

I don't want to give the impression that everyone is a driving dolt, no way. I'd say most chaps do a good job. It's just the ones
that don't really stand out. I recall several events I attended years past as a participant, between runs of different classes/ scales of models the sniggering that went on in the audience during some of the events as tanks scooted hither and yon; some of the tanks looked like rodents.

I've always run my models, be they boats ( once had 4 large ignition gas boats, one live steam and a 32nd || Typ 7c sub) , helis ( I had 6 once) or tanks in a reasonable semblance of the full size version. Not always to be sure but I try. That's just me.

The only thing I ever really was guilty of hot dogging with was a Kyosho Landjump with custom tires/rims and power by a very hot OPS 21. Boy that sucker could cook! I jumped, drifted and wore out 4 sets of tires, 1 drive chain and 2 sets of shocks before I sold it. I wish I hadn't...I had a great open flat dirt space by the Marin Civic Center in the late 1970 - early 1980s that was just perfect for running that thing flat out. I never once crashed. I owe it to learning to drive well doing the basics; driving like the proverbial
old lady to begin with.

Anyway, to each his or her own; just have safe fun. This thread was simply a convenient place to stand on my soapbox... and you all know I love that!

BTW here's a old video link of me running a gas model ( Panther A) for the old tech TV series - ""Screen Savers" about 7-8 years ago; I was there with a now ex-BAT member Fred Dorn ( another superb builder!). Even on TV I didn't ham it up too much...stayed in first gear the whole time.....

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...1233291393814#


Jerry

RE: How does one drive a tank
 

That glow powered Panther is the business.

RE: How does one drive a tank
 

I've put Turnigy chips in most of my tanks, and said chip goes a LONG way towards making driving realistic. While tanks may have vastly different listed max road speeds, the reality is the off road speed in a given AO is going to be pretty much the same for any tank, given the composition of the local ground and cover.

RE: How does one drive a tank
 

I enjoy driving tanks for realism. From countless black and white war documentaries (remember B&W?), I learned how they drive and react to real terrians.

Even when ‘lazer tag’ battling I try to show realism. I lose a lot of battles that way but I enjoy the realism more.

The Leo on the other hand, has exceptional capability, so I can drive it more like a hot rod!

Seeing that Russian parade video of the T-90 catching air on that ramped jump always makes me cringe with awe. So I know the real modern MBT’s can pull off some of the stunts (with major repairs afterwords).

RE: How does one drive a tank
 

<p style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt" class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt; mso-bidi-font-family: Arial">I greatly admire the highly talented rivet counters who produce stunningly accurate facsimiles of historic armored fighting vehicles, and I have the greatest admiration for the many clubs who seek to “battle” in modestly realistic ways, but I really don’t require my little RC tank to be quite so “realistic”.<span style="mso-spacerun: yes">  </span>If I were inclined to require full realism I would demand miniature petrol or diesel engines, cannons which can fire explosive penetrating ammo, and the ability for the each tank to detonate its little fuel cells and ordinance in a vicious conflagration to signal its destruction.<span style="mso-spacerun: yes">  </span>Oh, and each time a tank is hit the RC operator could also be shot or flayed to properly emulate real battlefield wounds and death.

</p></span></p><p style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt" class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt; mso-bidi-font-family: Arial">

 </p></span></p><p style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt" class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt; mso-bidi-font-family: Arial">Nope, that’s not for me.<span style="mso-spacerun: yes">  </span>I’ve already done my duty serving in harm’s way.<span style="mso-spacerun: yes">  </span>I expect these cute RC vehicles to be about as realistic as a video game, which is supposed to be “fun” without the danger of the real-life events they’re supposedly depicting.</span></p>

RE: How does one drive a tank
 

indeed, that thing is most excellent