Ernie P.

My Feedback: (3)

Then the Petlyakov Pe-8 Soviet heavy bomber would fit. Thanks; Ernie P.


The Petlyakov Pe-8 was a Soviet heavy bomber designed before World War II, and the only four-engine bomber the USSR built during the war. Produced in limited numbers, it was used to bomb Berlin in August 1941. It was also used for so-called "morale raids" designed to raise the spirit of the Soviet people by exposing Axis vulnerabilities. Its primary mission, however, was to attack German airfields, rail yards and other rear-area facilities at night, although one was used to fly the People's Commissar of Foreign Affairs (Foreign Minister) Vyacheslav Molotov from Moscow to the United States in 1942.
Originally designated the TB-7, the aircraft was renamed the Pe-8 after its primary designer, Vladimir Petlyakov, died in a plane crash in 1942. Supply problems complicated the aircraft's production and the Pe-8s also had engine problems. As Soviet morale boosters, they were also high-value targets for the Luftwaffe's fighter pilots. The loss rate of these aircraft, whether from mechanical failure, friendly fire, or combat, doubled between 1942 and 1944.
By the end of the war, most of the surviving aircraft had been withdrawn from combat units. After the war, some were modified as transports for important officials, and a few others were used in various Soviet testing programs. Some supported the Soviet Arctic operations until the late 1950s.

The Mikulin AM-35 was a 1930s Soviet piston aircraft engine.[1] Derived from the AM-34FRN, the AM-35 entered production in 1940 and was used on the MiG-1 and MiG-3 World War II fighters as well as the Petlyakov Pe-8 heavy bomber. The engine was very similar to the AM-38F of the Ilyushin Il-2 Shturmovik, and built in the same plant (Kuybyshev, in late 1941). It was for this fact that Mikulin was forced to focus production on the AM-38F, thus discontinuing construction of the AM-35.

adavis

Pe-8 is correct - Over to you...

Best Regards,
=Adrian=

Ernie P.

My Feedback: (3)

Thank you, Sir.

Gentlemen;

I have been holding on to a couple of questions which will, I think, prove to be fairly easy to answer; but which will illustrate a couple of little known, but important, facts about WWII aviation. Have fun with this first one. And don't over think it! Thanks; Ernie P.

Question: One third of US aircraft losses in WWII were to a single cause. Roughly one third, actually just a bit over, were to another cause. And just a bit less than one third were to yet another cause. What were those three causes; where did they occur; and what were the numbers involved?

Clues:

(1) One third occurred in a single country.

uncljoe

My Feedback: (8)

the country was the good old USA they were training accidents
Semper fi
Joe

Ernie P.

My Feedback: (3)

Uncljoe; you're on the right track. But; you need to read the question more closely; and answer all three parts of the question. Thanks; Ernie P.

"What were those three causes; where did they occur; and what were the numbers involved?"


Gentlemen;

I have been holding on to a couple of questions which will, I think, prove to be fairly easy to answer; but which will illustrate a couple of little known, but important, facts about WWII aviation. Have fun with this first one. And don't over think it! Thanks; Ernie P.

Question: One third of US aircraft losses in WWII were to a single cause. Roughly one third, actually just a bit over, were to another cause. And just a bit less than one third were to yet another cause. What were those three causes; where did they occur; and what were the numbers involved?

Clues:

(1) One third occurred in a single country.

(2) One third occurred in a number of countries.

Ernie P.

My Feedback: (3)

More clues. I want to know what caused the losses, where they occured, and how many were lost to each cause. Uncljoe already has part of the answer. Thanks; Ernie P.

Gentlemen;

I have been holding on to a couple of questions which will, I think, prove to be fairly easy to answer; but which will illustrate a couple of little known, but important, facts about WWII aviation. Have fun with this first one. And don't over think it! Thanks; Ernie P.

Question: One third of US aircraft losses in WWII were to a single cause. Roughly one third, actually just a bit over, were to another cause. And just a bit less than one third were to yet another cause. What were those three causes; where did they occur; and what were the numbers involved?

Clues:

(1) One third occurred in a single country.

(2) One third occurred in a number of countries.

(3) The same with the final third.

Ernie P.

My Feedback: (3)

And another clue. Thanks; Ernie P.


Gentlemen;

I have been holding on to a couple of questions which will, I think, prove to be fairly easy to answer; but which will illustrate a couple of little known, but important, facts about WWII aviation. Have fun with this first one. And don't over think it! Thanks; Ernie P.

Question: One third of US aircraft losses in WWII were to a single cause. Roughly one third, actually just a bit over, were to another cause. And just a bit less than one third were to yet another cause. What were those three causes; where did they occur; and what were the numbers involved?

Clues:

(1) One third occurred in a single country.

(2) One third occurred in a number of countries.

(3) The same with the final third.

(4) The last third were deliberate acts.

pilotal

first 3rd training losses

pilotal

first 3rd training losses, 2nd- combat losses, 3rd - post-war destruction of obsolete prop aircraft due to intro of jets

Ernie P.

My Feedback: (3)

You're getting there, but still need to fine tune things. No, these were all losses suffered in WWII. Planes that took off and didn't come back. The question is why, and what were the numbers. Thaks; Ernie P.

zippome

How about,
1/3 Combat losses
1/3 Training accidents/losses
1/3 losses due to weather related crashes.
Thanks,
Zip

Ernie P.

My Feedback: (3)

Closer and closer. Still not quite there, though. This should help. Thanks; Ernie P.


Gentlemen;

I have been holding on to a couple of questions which will, I think, prove to be fairly easy to answer; but which will illustrate a couple of little known, but important, facts about WWII aviation. Have fun with this first one. And don't over think it! Thanks; Ernie P.

Question: One third of US aircraft losses in WWII were to a single cause. Roughly one third, actually just a bit over, were to another cause. And just a bit less than one third were to yet another cause. What were those three causes; where did they occur; and what were the numbers involved?

Clues:

(1) One third occurred in a single country.

(2) One third occurred in a number of countries.

(3) The same with the final third.

(4) The last third were deliberate acts.

(5) The first and second β€œthirds” were from the same causes; just in different locations.

Ernie P.

My Feedback: (3)

And yet another clue. Thanks; Ernie P.


Gentlemen;

I have been holding on to a couple of questions which will, I think, prove to be fairly easy to answer; but which will illustrate a couple of little known, but important, facts about WWII aviation. Have fun with this first one. And don't over think it! Thanks; Ernie P.

Question: One third of US aircraft losses in WWII were to a single cause. Roughly one third, actually just a bit over, were to another cause. And just a bit less than one third were to yet another cause. What were those three causes; where did they occur; and what were the numbers involved?

Clues:

(1) One third occurred in a single country.

(2) One third occurred in a number of countries.

(3) The same with the final third.

(4) The last third were deliberate acts.

(5) The first and second β€œthirds” were from the same causes; just in different locations.

(6) Total losses to all causes were over 65,000.

Ernie P.

My Feedback: (3)

Last clue for the day. Thanks; Ernie P.


Gentlemen;

I have been holding on to a couple of questions which will, I think, prove to be fairly easy to answer; but which will illustrate a couple of little known, but important, facts about WWII aviation. Have fun with this first one. And don't over think it! Thanks; Ernie P.

Question: One third of US aircraft losses in WWII were to a single cause. Roughly one third, actually just a bit over, were to another cause. And just a bit less than one third were to yet another cause. What were those three causes; where did they occur; and what were the numbers involved?

Clues:

(1) One third occurred in a single country.

(2) One third occurred in a number of countries.

(3) The same with the final third.

(4) The last third were deliberate acts.

(5) The first and second β€œthirds” were from the same causes; just in different locations.

(6) Total losses to all causes were over 65,000.

(7) The first β€œthird” were losses suffered totally within the United States.

zippome

Ok... lets try again...
Total aircraft lost 1941 t august 1945 ,
65,164
1.Non-combat losses within CONUS 21,583
2.Non-combat losses outside CONUS 20,633
3.Combat losses (worldwide) 22,948
How's that Ernie?
Thanks
Zip

Ernie P.

My Feedback: (3)

That's what I wanted Zip. The idea was to highlight the simple fact that 2/3 of all losses were due to training accidents or mechanical failures; and half of them were within the United States. Still, we managed to build the world's greatest air force in just a few years. But there was a price to be paid. You have the conch shell, buddy. Thanks; Ernie P.



Question: One third of US aircraft losses in WWII were to a single cause. Roughly one third, actually just a bit over, were to another cause. And just a bit less than one third were to yet another cause. What were those three causes; where did they occur; and what were the numbers involved?

Clues:

(1) One third occurred in a single country.

(2) One third occurred in a number of countries.

(3) The same with the final third.

(4) The last third were deliberate acts.

(5) The first and second β€œthirds” were from the same causes; just in different locations.

(6) Total losses to all causes were over 65,000.

(7) The first β€œthird” were losses suffered totally within the United States.

(8) The second β€œthird” were due to the same causes; but suffered overseas.

(9) The last β€œthird” were suffered mainly over North Africa, Europe and the Pacific.


Answer: One third of losses were due to training accidents and mechanical failures (within the continental U.S.). One third were due to training accidents and mechanical failures (outside the U.S.); and one third were due to enemy action.

During WWII, the USAAF lost 65,164 aircraft t all causes. Of that number, 21,683 were lost within the United States; IOW, 33 percent of all aircraft were lost at home. Of the 43,581 American aircraft destroyed overseas, 22,948 (over half) were lost to accidents or mechanical failures. Only 20,633 were destroyed by enemy action. In total, 68 percent of all aircraft losses were to accidents or mechanical failures.

(From various sources)
Finland: Reported losses during the Winter War totaled 67, of which 42 were operational, while 536 aircraft were lost during the Continuation War, of which 209 were operational losses. (Overall 603).

France: From the beginning of the war until the capitulation of France in 1940, 892 aircraft were lost, of which 413 were in action and 234 were on the ground. Losses included 508 fighters and 218 bombers.(Overall 892)

Germany: Estimated total losses for the war totaled 27,875 aircraft, of which 7,000 were total losses and the remainder significantly damaged. By type, losses totaled 4,452 fighters, 2,037 bombers, 5,428 trainers, 1,221 twin-engine fighters, 8,548 ground attack, 3,733 reconnaissance, and 3,141 transports.

Italy: Total losses were 5,272 aircraft, of which 3,269 were lost in combat.

Japan: Estimates vary from 35,000 to 50,000 total losses, with about 20,000 lost operationally.

Netherlands: Total losses were 81 aircraft during the May, 1940 campaign.

Poland: Total losses were 398 destroyed, including 116 fighters, 112 dive bombers, 81 reconnaissance aircraft, 36 bombers, 21 sea planes, and 9 transports.

Soviet Union: Total losses were over 106,400 including 88,300 combat types.

United Kingdom: Total losses in Europe were 22,010, including 10,045 fighters and 11,965 bombers. (This figure does not include aircraft lost in Asia or the Pacific.)

United States: Total losses were nearly 45,000, including 22,951 operational losses (18,418 in Europe and 4,533 in the Pacific).

http://newsgroups.derkeiler.com/Arch.../msg01403.html

There were a total of 43,581 losses overseas and 21,583 losses in the
US. Keep in mind this includes combat losses but I can almost
guarantee nearly all the 21,583 Continental US losses were accidents.
The Continental US does not include AK and HI, the only places in
North America that had direct combat with the Axis.

While en route from the US to the theater, 909 planes were lost.

Airplane losses on combat mission by theater states a total of 22,948
aircraft were lost during combat. If we subtract this from the 43,581
total overseas losses figure above, we get 20,633 aircraft lost not
during combat.

I found these figures absolutely overwhelming and much more than I
ever would have thought. Total losses due to accidents for WWII may
never be know, or at least it is beyond my researching skills, but I
do think it was in the thousands. It gives me even more appreciation
for that generation.

On a lighter note, here are some other figures just for fun....

9,707,109,000 gallons of gas used form Jan. '42 to Aug. '45.
459,750,000 round of ammo expended overseas from Jan. '42 to Aug.
'45.
107,886,000 hours of flying time from Jan. '43 to Aug. '45.
7,952,020 bombs dropped overseas from '43 to '45.
2,057,244 tons of bombs dropped overseas from Dec. '41 to Aug. '45.
2,362,800 combat sorties from Dec. '41 to Aug. '45.
299,230 aircraft accepted from Jan. 1940 to Aug. '45
808,471 aircraft engines delivered from Jan. '40 to Aug. '45.
799,972 propellers delivered from Jan. '40 to Aug. '45.
40,259 enemy aircraft destroyed Feb. '42 to Aug. '45.

zippome

Ok Ernie!
Lemme make some chowder outta that Conch, and I'll dig up a question tomorrow!
Thanks!

zippome

Well, ok maybe I'll have a go tonight instead....

pilotal

National Insignia ?

zippome

Ernie P.

My Feedback: (3)

The use of guidons or streamers? Both knights and military aircraft use streamers to distinguish leaders in battle. Thanks; Ernie P.

a65l

My Feedback: (17)

Smoke systems?

zippome

Ernie P.

My Feedback: (3)

Might you be speaking of a cockade or roundel? Thanks; Ernie P.


Also from the 18th century various European states used cockades to denote the nationalities of their military. Ribbon-style cockades were worn on tricornes and bicornes just as the French did, and also on cocked hats and shakoes; metal cockades were worn at the right side of helmets; small button-type cockades were worn at the front of kepis and peaked caps.

During the Napoleonic wars, the armies of France and Russia, had the imperial French cockade or the larger cockade of St. George pinned on the front of their shakos.
In particular, the German Empire used two cockades on each army headgear: one (black-white-red) for the empire; the other for the individual German provinces and kingdoms, which had used their own colors long before. The Weimar Republic removed these, as they might promote faction which would lead to the dissolution of Germany into petty principalities again. In the Second World War, the imperial or Kaiserliche colors of black on the outside, then white, and red on the inside were used on all army caps.

France began the first Air Service in 1909 and soon picked the traditional French cockade as the first national emblem, now usually termed a roundel, on military aircraft. During World War I, other countries adopted national cockades and used these coloured emblems as roundels on their military aircraft. These designs often bear an additional central device or emblem to further identify national aircraft, those from the French navy bearing a black anchor within the French cockade.

Metal cockades continue to be worn to the present day by the armed forces of Germany and Russia.

zippome

Ernie wins again!
I was indeed looking for "Roundels". Piloatal was Soooooo close , and on the first clue!
Ok ernie, You're up