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Knowledge Quiz for Warbird wiz

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Knowledge Quiz for Warbird wiz

Old 11-24-2020, 03:09 PM
  #19226  
Hydro Junkie
 
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I think I can arrange a few more clues for you Ernie, and anyone else that want's to take a shot at this.
Looking for an aircraft:
1) This plane was built by a well known manufacturer
2) This plane was designed to use tech that was new at the time.
3) This plane featured a single engine and crew of 2
4) The tech used in this plane was also used on planes manufactured by allies and adversaries, some of which became legendary
5) Several of the planes referred to in clue 4 had service lives of over 20 years
6) Only one of the subject aircraft was built
7) The plane was cancelled due to two things the government couldn't overlook
8) The engine was not manufactured by the country building the plane
9) The single engine design did not give the performance or survivability desired.
10) While the plane was destroyed during it's third year of testing, the pilot was unhurt due to bailing out
11) The plane in question shared a fuselage with another aircraft that was also destroyed during testing
12) While the plane was completed in June, it was not flown until November due to changes, reworks and technical issues that had to be resolved
13) The time taken to go from first test flight to reaching it's top speed and performance capabilities was just over a month
14) From first flight to destruction of the aircraft was 38 months

Good Luck
Old 11-25-2020, 07:08 PM
  #19227  
Ernie P.
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Originally Posted by Hydro Junkie View Post
I think I can arrange a few more clues for you Ernie, and anyone else that want's to take a shot at this.
Looking for an aircraft:
1) This plane was built by a well known manufacturer
2) This plane was designed to use tech that was new at the time.
3) This plane featured a single engine and crew of 2
4) The tech used in this plane was also used on planes manufactured by allies and adversaries, some of which became legendary
5) Several of the planes referred to in clue 4 had service lives of over 20 years
6) Only one of the subject aircraft was built
7) The plane was cancelled due to two things the government couldn't overlook
8) The engine was not manufactured by the country building the plane
9) The single engine design did not give the performance or survivability desired.
10) While the plane was destroyed during it's third year of testing, the pilot was unhurt due to bailing out
11) The plane in question shared a fuselage with another aircraft that was also destroyed during testing
12) While the plane was completed in June, it was not flown until November due to changes, reworks and technical issues that had to be resolved
13) The time taken to go from first test flight to reaching it's top speed and performance capabilities was just over a month
14) From first flight to destruction of the aircraft was 38 months

Good Luck
Thank you, Sir; Ernie P.
Old 11-28-2020, 06:01 PM
  #19228  
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No guesses? It must be time for another clue or two then.
Looking for an aircraft:
1) This plane was built by a well known manufacturer
2) This plane was designed to use tech that was new at the time.
3) This plane featured a single engine and crew of 2
4) The tech used in this plane was also used on planes manufactured by allies and adversaries, some of which became legendary
5) Several of the planes referred to in clue 4 had service lives of over 20 years
6) Only one of the subject aircraft was built
7) The plane was cancelled due to two things the government couldn't overlook
8) The engine was not manufactured by the country building the plane
9) The single engine design did not give the performance or survivability desired.
10) While the plane was destroyed during it's third year of testing, the pilot was unhurt due to bailing out
11) The plane in question shared a fuselage with another aircraft that was also destroyed during testing
12) While the plane was completed in June, it was not flown until November due to changes, reworks and technical issues that had to be resolved
13) The time taken to go from first test flight to reaching it's top speed and performance capabilities was just over a month
14) From first flight to destruction of the aircraft was 38 months
15) The plane is question had a top speed comparable to many of its contemporaries of the day
16) Since the plane was not produced, there was never any weaponry or hard points installed
17) The plane in question had a ceiling of almost 61,000 feet and a maximum range of almost 2400 miles

Good Luck
Old 12-01-2020, 04:35 AM
  #19229  
Ernie P.
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Originally Posted by Hydro Junkie View Post
No guesses? It must be time for another clue or two then.
Looking for an aircraft:
1) This plane was built by a well known manufacturer
2) This plane was designed to use tech that was new at the time.
3) This plane featured a single engine and crew of 2
4) The tech used in this plane was also used on planes manufactured by allies and adversaries, some of which became legendary
5) Several of the planes referred to in clue 4 had service lives of over 20 years
6) Only one of the subject aircraft was built
7) The plane was cancelled due to two things the government couldn't overlook
8) The engine was not manufactured by the country building the plane
9) The single engine design did not give the performance or survivability desired.
10) While the plane was destroyed during it's third year of testing, the pilot was unhurt due to bailing out
11) The plane in question shared a fuselage with another aircraft that was also destroyed during testing
12) While the plane was completed in June, it was not flown until November due to changes, reworks and technical issues that had to be resolved
13) The time taken to go from first test flight to reaching it's top speed and performance capabilities was just over a month
14) From first flight to destruction of the aircraft was 38 months
15) The plane is question had a top speed comparable to many of its contemporaries of the day
16) Since the plane was not produced, there was never any weaponry or hard points installed
17) The plane in question had a ceiling of almost 61,000 feet and a maximum range of almost 2400 miles

Good Luck
Sir; please post a new clue. Thanks; Ernie P.
Old 12-01-2020, 05:41 PM
  #19230  
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Sorry guys, it's been a busy weekend and, worse yet, none of it was work related. I've got a couple of new clues for you all. I'll throw in a second pair so tomorrow will be covered as well.
Looking for an aircraft:
1) This plane was built by a well known manufacturer
2) This plane was designed to use tech that was new at the time.
3) This plane featured a single engine and crew of 2
4) The tech used in this plane was also used on planes manufactured by allies and adversaries, some of which became legendary
5) Several of the planes referred to in clue 4 had service lives of over 20 years
6) Only one of the subject aircraft was built
7) The plane was cancelled due to two things the government couldn't overlook
8) The engine was not manufactured by the country building the plane
9) The single engine design did not give the performance or survivability desired.
10) While the plane was destroyed during it's third year of testing, the pilot was unhurt due to bailing out
11) The plane in question shared a fuselage with another aircraft that was also destroyed during testing
12) While the plane was completed in June, it was not flown until November due to changes, reworks and technical issues that had to be resolved
13) The time taken to go from first test flight to reaching it's top speed and performance capabilities was just over a month
14) From first flight to destruction of the aircraft was 38 months
15) The plane is question had a top speed comparable to many of its contemporaries of the day
16) Since the plane was not produced, there was never any weaponry or hard points installed
17) The plane in question had a ceiling of almost 61,000 feet and a maximum range of almost 2400 miles
18) One of the "legendary" aircraft had side by side seating for the crew while the aircraft in question had tandem seating
19) The "legendary" aircraft was originally designed to have the same mission as the aircraft in question but, due to operational requirements and results of testing, it's mission profile was changed
20) The "legendary" aircraft, other than the seating arrangement, actually looked very similar to the plane in question
21) The manufacturer of the aircraft in question has been around for close to 100 years

Good Luck
Old 12-01-2020, 07:44 PM
  #19231  
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Okay, I'm curious. Is there anyone else still following this thread, other than Ernie and I? I would have thought I'd have seen at least one or two guesses by now
Old 12-02-2020, 05:58 AM
  #19232  
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Yo!
Old 12-02-2020, 06:29 AM
  #19233  
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I'm here just befuddled!
Old 12-02-2020, 09:16 AM
  #19234  
stang151
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Been poping in from time to time, just too busy to put any time into the research.
Old 12-02-2020, 09:23 AM
  #19235  
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I'm here too, but not actively looking for stuff. Just haven't seen anything that gives me a starting point yet.
Old 12-02-2020, 03:51 PM
  #19236  
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Now wait, I thought it was Ernie's job to confuse everyone. Okay, give me a bit and I'll throw out another clue or two for you guys to mull over
Old 12-02-2020, 04:03 PM
  #19237  
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Okay I came up with a three clues for you all.
Looking for an aircraft:
1) This plane was built by a well known manufacturer
2) This plane was designed to use tech that was new at the time.
3) This plane featured a single engine and crew of 2
4) The tech used in this plane was also used on planes manufactured by allies and adversaries, some of which became legendary
5) Several of the planes referred to in clue 4 had service lives of over 20 years
6) Only one of the subject aircraft was built
7) The plane was cancelled due to two things the government couldn't overlook
8) The engine was not manufactured by the country building the plane
9) The single engine design did not give the performance or survivability desired.
10) While the plane was destroyed during it's third year of testing, the pilot was unhurt due to bailing out
11) The plane in question shared a fuselage with another aircraft that was also destroyed during testing
12) While the plane was completed in June, it was not flown until November due to changes, reworks and technical issues that had to be resolved
13) The time taken to go from first test flight to reaching it's top speed and performance capabilities was just over a month
14) From first flight to destruction of the aircraft was 38 months
15) The plane is question had a top speed comparable to many of its contemporaries of the day
16) Since the plane was not produced, there was never any weaponry or hard points installed
17) The plane in question had a ceiling of almost 61,000 feet and a maximum range of almost 2400 miles
18) One of the "legendary" aircraft had side by side seating for the crew while the aircraft in question had tandem seating
19) The "legendary" aircraft was originally designed to have the same mission as the aircraft in question but, due to operational requirements and results of testing, it's mission profile was changed
20) The "legendary" aircraft, other than the seating arrangement, actually looked very similar to the plane in question
21) The manufacturer of the aircraft in question has been around for close to 100 years
22) Unlike planes used in earlier wars, the plane in question used a feature developed by an ally that prevented compression issues in a dive
23) This plane's given name was used again on another aircraft that was not only successful but has seen combat operations
24) Like the "legendary" aircraft referred to in clue 18, the aircraft in question was designed to be used by both the Air Force and Navy of the developing country. Neither plane ended up meeting that goal

Good Luck

Last edited by Hydro Junkie; 12-03-2020 at 03:40 AM.
Old 12-03-2020, 08:10 PM
  #19238  
Ernie P.
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Originally Posted by Hydro Junkie View Post
Okay I came up with a three clues for you all.
Looking for an aircraft:
1) This plane was built by a well known manufacturer
2) This plane was designed to use tech that was new at the time.
3) This plane featured a single engine and crew of 2
4) The tech used in this plane was also used on planes manufactured by allies and adversaries, some of which became legendary
5) Several of the planes referred to in clue 4 had service lives of over 20 years
6) Only one of the subject aircraft was built
7) The plane was cancelled due to two things the government couldn't overlook
8) The engine was not manufactured by the country building the plane
9) The single engine design did not give the performance or survivability desired.
10) While the plane was destroyed during it's third year of testing, the pilot was unhurt due to bailing out
11) The plane in question shared a fuselage with another aircraft that was also destroyed during testing
12) While the plane was completed in June, it was not flown until November due to changes, reworks and technical issues that had to be resolved
13) The time taken to go from first test flight to reaching it's top speed and performance capabilities was just over a month
14) From first flight to destruction of the aircraft was 38 months
15) The plane is question had a top speed comparable to many of its contemporaries of the day
16) Since the plane was not produced, there was never any weaponry or hard points installed
17) The plane in question had a ceiling of almost 61,000 feet and a maximum range of almost 2400 miles
18) One of the "legendary" aircraft had side by side seating for the crew while the aircraft in question had tandem seating
19) The "legendary" aircraft was originally designed to have the same mission as the aircraft in question but, due to operational requirements and results of testing, it's mission profile was changed
20) The "legendary" aircraft, other than the seating arrangement, actually looked very similar to the plane in question
21) The manufacturer of the aircraft in question has been around for close to 100 years
22) Unlike planes used in earlier wars, the plane in question used a feature developed by an ally that prevented compression issues in a dive
23) This plane's given name was used again on another aircraft that was not only successful but has seen combat operations
24) Like the "legendary" aircraft referred to in clue 18, the aircraft in question was designed to be used by both the Air Force and Navy of the developing country. Neither plane ended up meeting that goal

Good Luck
I'm having a hard time figuring this one out. The most significant clues seem to be 3 and 17. Thanks; Ernie P.
Old 12-03-2020, 08:24 PM
  #19239  
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Actually, Ernie, no they aren't. There are a couple of clues that are VERY IMPORTANT as they may lead you all in the right direction. That said, time for more clues.
Looking for an aircraft:
1) This plane was built by a well known manufacturer
2) This plane was designed to use tech that was new at the time.
3) This plane featured a single engine and crew of 2
4) The tech used in this plane was also used on planes manufactured by allies and adversaries, some of which became legendary
5) Several of the planes referred to in clue 4 had service lives of over 20 years
6) Only one of the subject aircraft was built
7) The plane was cancelled due to two things the government couldn't overlook
8) The engine was not manufactured by the country building the plane
9) The single engine design did not give the performance or survivability desired.
10) While the plane was destroyed during it's third year of testing, the pilot was unhurt due to bailing out
11) The plane in question shared a fuselage with another aircraft that was also destroyed during testing
12) While the plane was completed in June, it was not flown until November due to changes, reworks and technical issues that had to be resolved
13) The time taken to go from first test flight to reaching it's top speed and performance capabilities was just over a month
14) From first flight to destruction of the aircraft was 38 months
15) The plane is question had a top speed comparable to many of its contemporaries of the day
16) Since the plane was not produced, there was never any weaponry or hard points installed
17) The plane in question had a ceiling of almost 61,000 feet and a maximum range of almost 2400 miles
18) One of the "legendary" aircraft had side by side seating for the crew while the aircraft in question had tandem seating
19) The "legendary" aircraft was originally designed to have the same mission as the aircraft in question but, due to operational requirements and results of testing, it's mission profile was changed
20) The "legendary" aircraft, other than the seating arrangement, actually looked very similar to the plane in question
21) The manufacturer of the aircraft in question has been around for close to 100 years
22) Unlike planes used in earlier wars, the plane in question used a feature developed by an ally that prevented compression issues in a dive
23) This plane's given name was used again on another aircraft that was not only successful but has seen combat operations
24) Like the "legendary" aircraft referred to in clue 18, the aircraft in question was designed to be used by both the Air Force and Navy of the developing country. Neither plane ended up meeting that goal
25) The feature that tied all of the "legendary" aircraft to the aircraft in question was actually experimented with by an adversary earlier in the century.
26) The feature that was referred to in the previous clue was only able to be used on the ground when it was first tried. The "legendary" and subject aircraft were able to use the feature in flight
27) One of the "legendary" aircraft became famous for an operation that it was used to accomplish while another was made famous not just for what it did operationally but also by what the military did to "show it off"

Good Luck

Last edited by Hydro Junkie; 12-03-2020 at 08:28 PM.
Old 12-04-2020, 02:13 PM
  #19240  
Ernie P.
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Originally Posted by Hydro Junkie View Post
Actually, Ernie, no they aren't. There are a couple of clues that are VERY IMPORTANT as they may lead you all in the right direction. That said, time for more clues.
Looking for an aircraft:
1) This plane was built by a well known manufacturer
2) This plane was designed to use tech that was new at the time.
3) This plane featured a single engine and crew of 2
4) The tech used in this plane was also used on planes manufactured by allies and adversaries, some of which became legendary
5) Several of the planes referred to in clue 4 had service lives of over 20 years
6) Only one of the subject aircraft was built
7) The plane was cancelled due to two things the government couldn't overlook
8) The engine was not manufactured by the country building the plane
9) The single engine design did not give the performance or survivability desired.
10) While the plane was destroyed during it's third year of testing, the pilot was unhurt due to bailing out
11) The plane in question shared a fuselage with another aircraft that was also destroyed during testing
12) While the plane was completed in June, it was not flown until November due to changes, reworks and technical issues that had to be resolved
13) The time taken to go from first test flight to reaching it's top speed and performance capabilities was just over a month
14) From first flight to destruction of the aircraft was 38 months
15) The plane is question had a top speed comparable to many of its contemporaries of the day
16) Since the plane was not produced, there was never any weaponry or hard points installed
17) The plane in question had a ceiling of almost 61,000 feet and a maximum range of almost 2400 miles
18) One of the "legendary" aircraft had side by side seating for the crew while the aircraft in question had tandem seating
19) The "legendary" aircraft was originally designed to have the same mission as the aircraft in question but, due to operational requirements and results of testing, it's mission profile was changed
20) The "legendary" aircraft, other than the seating arrangement, actually looked very similar to the plane in question
21) The manufacturer of the aircraft in question has been around for close to 100 years
22) Unlike planes used in earlier wars, the plane in question used a feature developed by an ally that prevented compression issues in a dive
23) This plane's given name was used again on another aircraft that was not only successful but has seen combat operations
24) Like the "legendary" aircraft referred to in clue 18, the aircraft in question was designed to be used by both the Air Force and Navy of the developing country. Neither plane ended up meeting that goal
25) The feature that tied all of the "legendary" aircraft to the aircraft in question was actually experimented with by an adversary earlier in the century.
26) The feature that was referred to in the previous clue was only able to be used on the ground when it was first tried. The "legendary" and subject aircraft were able to use the feature in flight
27) One of the "legendary" aircraft became famous for an operation that it was used to accomplish while another was made famous not just for what it did operationally but also by what the military did to "show it off"

Good Luck
HJ; please confirm this aircraft was an independent named and/or numbered aircraft, as opposed to a variant of another aircraft. For example, it would not be a one-off version of the F-16. Thanks; Ernie P.
Old 12-04-2020, 02:47 PM
  #19241  
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Good question. It used the same name as other aircraft built by the same manufacturer(clue 23). The fuselage, with some minor changes, was the same as another experimental one off plane(clue 11). AFAIK, it was unique other than those two things. Now, time for more clues.
Looking for an aircraft:
1) This plane was built by a well known manufacturer
2) This plane was designed to use tech that was new at the time.
3) This plane featured a single engine and crew of 2
4) The tech used in this plane was also used on planes manufactured by allies and adversaries, some of which became legendary
5) Several of the planes referred to in clue 4 had service lives of over 20 years
6) Only one of the subject aircraft was built
7) The plane was cancelled due to two things the government couldn't overlook
8) The engine was not manufactured by the country building the plane
9) The single engine design did not give the performance or survivability desired.
10) While the plane was destroyed during it's third year of testing, the pilot was unhurt due to bailing out
11) The plane in question shared a fuselage with another aircraft that was also destroyed during testing
12) While the plane was completed in June, it was not flown until November due to changes, reworks and technical issues that had to be resolved
13) The time taken to go from first test flight to reaching it's top speed and performance capabilities was just over a month
14) From first flight to destruction of the aircraft was 38 months
15) The plane is question had a top speed comparable to many of its contemporaries of the day
16) Since the plane was not produced, there was never any weaponry or hard points installed
17) The plane in question had a ceiling of almost 61,000 feet and a maximum range of almost 2400 miles
18) One of the "legendary" aircraft had side by side seating for the crew while the aircraft in question had tandem seating
19) The "legendary" aircraft was originally designed to have the same mission as the aircraft in question but, due to operational requirements and results of testing, it's mission profile was changed
20) The "legendary" aircraft, other than the seating arrangement, actually looked very similar to the plane in question
21) The manufacturer of the aircraft in question has been around for close to 100 years
22) Unlike planes used in earlier wars, the plane in question used a feature developed by an ally that prevented compression issues in a dive
23) This plane's given name was used again on another aircraft that was not only successful but has seen combat operations
24) Like the "legendary" aircraft referred to in clue 18, the aircraft in question was designed to be used by both the Air Force and Navy of the developing country. Neither plane ended up meeting that goal
25) The feature that tied all of the "legendary" aircraft to the aircraft in question was actually experimented with by an adversary earlier in the century.
26) The feature that was referred to in the previous clue was only able to be used on the ground when it was first tried. The "legendary" and subject aircraft were able to use the feature in flight
27) One of the "legendary" aircraft became famous for an operation that it was used to accomplish while another was made famous not just for what it did operationally but also by what the military did to "show it off"
28) All of the other aircraft built(AFAIK anyway) with the the new tech, regardless of manufacturer, had at least two engines
29) Speaking of engines, one of the issues with the subject plane's engine was that it came from another continent, something that made shipping and receiving problematic in the event of hostilities.
30) Even though the subject aircraft was single engined, unlike the others from other manufacturers, it was supersonic capable like all of the other's with it's new tech
31) This new tech, used on the subject aircraft as well as the several "legendary" aircraft, was even planned to be used on the initial design for a Boeing built rival to the Concord that never got past the mock-up stage. That transport was later revised to a delta design with separate horizontal stabilizers
32) Some of the "legendary" aircraft were named after animals. Others were named after various types of weather.

Good Luck

Last edited by Hydro Junkie; 12-05-2020 at 12:17 AM.
Old 12-05-2020, 09:40 AM
  #19242  
Ernie P.
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HJ; I think I have the answer, but I'm also pretty sure your performance specs (ceiling and range) were for another, closely related but twin engine version of the same plane. Maybe I'm wrong, but it's the best guess I have at the moment. Either way, you have a fascinating subject plane. It's difficult to find out much about the plane, and I suspect you are using information from a source other than the internet. Thanks; Ernie P.




Answer: The Dassault Mirage G; (Or, possibly the Ling-Temco-Vought (LTV) 505. I'm having trouble verifying data for the LTV 505. Everything points to the later, twin engine, LTV 507.)


Dassault Mirage G



The Dassault Mirage G was a French two-seat twinjetvariable-geometry prototype fighter, built by Dassault Aviation in the late 1960s. The type was further developed into the twin-engine Mirage G4 and G8 variants as a multi-role jet fighter capable of both interception and nuclear strike missions. Although Dassault built and flew prototypes, the entire programme was terminated in the 1970s without the aircraft entering production.


Development



In 1964 the French defence ministry requested a development programme on variable-sweep wing aircraft for dual land and aircraft carrier use. France had participated with the Anglo-French Variable Geometry aircraft (AFVG) before abandoning their interest; later Dassault received an order for a prototype, powered by a single Pratt & Whitney/SNECMA TF-306 turbofan in October 1965.



The first variable-sweep aircraft from Dassault emerged as the single-engined, two-seat Mirage G fighter in 1967, essentially a swing wing version of the Mirage F2. The wings were swept at 22 degrees when fully forward and 70 degrees when fully aft and featured full-span double-slotted trailing edge flaps and two-position leading edge flaps.



Flight trials were relatively successful but no production order ensued, the Mirage G programme being cancelled in 1968. Flying with the Mirage G continued however until 13 January 1971 when the sole prototype was lost in an accident.


Variants

Mirage G



Single-engined initial version, first flight 18 November 1967. Crashed 13 January 1971.


Mirage G4



The basic Mirage G was developed into a twin-engine, two-seat nuclear strike fighter, the Mirage G4 after a separate contract was issued in 1968 for two aircraft to be built. These aircraft were intended to be powered by Snecma M53 turbofans in production.[2] While the aircraft were under construction the requirements changed and the French military requested that the design be converted into a dedicated interceptor, the Mirage G8.[2]

Mirage G8

Mirage G4-01 was redesignated G8-01 and remained a two-seat aircraft (first flight 8 May 1971) with the second aircraft, G4-02 becoming a single-seat version, G8-02 (first flight 13 July 1972).[2] The G8 variants were equipped with Thomson-CSF radar and a low-altitude navigational-attack system based on that used in the SEPECAT Jaguar and Dassault Milan. As no funding was included for the Mirage G8 in the 1971-1976 French defence budget the aircraft did not enter production.


Cooperation on LTV V-507



Main article: Vought Model 507

In the late 1960s, the US manufacturer Ling-Temco-Vought (LTV) was seeking technical data on variable-geometry wings, within the framework of a bid for the US Navy's VFX carrier fighter contract. As a result of the publicity gained by the Mirage G, LTV sought the assistance of Dassault, as well as General Dynamics, which had secured a contract with the USAF for a variable geometry fighter-bomber/attack aircraft, the F-111A. Two agreements were signed by Dassault and LTV in 1968: one for general cooperation and the other specifically in regard to variable-geometry wings. This resulted in two LTV designs, the Vought V-505 and V-507, as well as construction of a full-scale, non-flying mockup of the second design. There were two competing bids, both with variable geometry: the McDonnell F-4(FVS), which was a variant of the Phantom II, and the Grumman 303. The latter was successful and was developed into the F-14. However, during its development, Grumman approached LTV for details of the V-507, including some of the same technical solutions devised for the Mirage G.



Some of the same data also contributed to the Vought Model V-1100, which competed for the Pentagon's Light Weight Fighter program in the 1970s. However, this LTV design did not include variable geometry (and was more closely related to the LTV A-7 Corsair II). This particular proposal was also rejected and the F-16 and F/A-18 were eventually selected for production.




Specifications (Mirage G8-02)



General characteristics

·

· Crew: 1

·

· Length: 18.8 m (61 ft 8 in)

·

· Wingspan: 15.4 m (50 ft 6 in)

Lower wingspan: 8.7 m (28 ft 7 in) swept

· Height: 5.35 m (17 ft 7 in)

·

· Empty weight: 14,740 kg (32,496 lb)

·

· Powerplant: 2 × SNECMA Atar 9K50 after-burning turbojet engines, 49.03 kN (11,020 lbf) thrust each dry, 70.1 kN (15,800 lbf) with afterburner



Performance

·

· Maximum speed: Mach 2.2

·

· Range: 3,850 km (2,390 mi, 2,080 nmi)

·

· Service ceiling: 18,500 m (60,700 ft)
Old 12-05-2020, 03:17 PM
  #19243  
Hydro Junkie
 
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And yes, it was the Mirage G I was looking for. Let me throw some clarification on a few of these clues:
1) This plane was built by a well known manufacturer That being Dessault Aviation of France
2) This plane was designed to use tech that was new at the time. That being the "Swing Wing"
3) This plane featured a single engine and crew of 2
4) The tech used in this plane was also used on planes manufactured by allies and adversaries, some of which became legendary The "Legendary" aircraft included the F-111, F-14, Tornado, Mig-23, B-1 and Backfire bombers
5) Several of the planes referred to in clue 4 had service lives of over 20 years
6) Only one of the subject aircraft was built
7) The plane was cancelled due to two things the government couldn't overlook
8) The engine was not manufactured by the country building the plane
The engine originally used was built by Pratt & Whitney
9) The single engine design did not give the performance or survivability desired.
10) While the plane was destroyed during it's third year of testing, the pilot was unhurt due to bailing out
11) The plane in question shared a fuselage with another aircraft that was also destroyed during testing
12) While the plane was completed in June, it was not flown until November due to changes, reworks and technical issues that had to be resolved
13) The time taken to go from first test flight to reaching it's top speed and performance capabilities was just over a month
14) From first flight to destruction of the aircraft was 38 months
15) The plane is question had a top speed comparable to many of its contemporaries of the day
Even with the single P&W engine, it was capable of around mach 2+ according to my source
16) Since the plane was not produced, there was never any weaponry or hard points installed
17) The plane in question had a ceiling of almost 61,000 feet and a maximum range of almost 2400 miles
18) One of the "legendary" aircraft had side by side seating for the crew while the aircraft in question had tandem seating
This clue, and the next two, referred to the F-111
19) The "legendary" aircraft was originally designed to have the same mission as the aircraft in question but, due to operational requirements and results of testing, it's mission profile was changed The F-111 was converted to a bomber
20) The "legendary" aircraft, other than the seating arrangement, actually looked very similar to the plane in question
21) The manufacturer of the aircraft in question has been around for close to 100 years
Dessault opened it's doors, according to my source, in 1929
22) Unlike planes used in earlier wars, the plane in question used a feature developed by an ally that prevented compression issues in a dive This was the full moving horizontal stabilizer, pioneered on the F-86 Sabre
23) This plane's given name was used again on another aircraft that was not only successful but has seen combat operations The name Mirage was used on several fighters designed and built by Dessault
24) Like the "legendary" aircraft referred to in clue 18, the aircraft in question was designed to be used by both the Air Force and Navy of the developing country. Neither plane ended up meeting that goal Both the Mirage G and F-111 were slated to be land and carrier based fighters
25) The feature that tied all of the "legendary" aircraft to the aircraft in question was actually experimented with by an adversary earlier in the century. The "swing wing" was actually tried by a German firm late in WWII. How far that design got I don't know
26) The feature that was referred to in the previous clue was only able to be used on the ground when it was first tried. The "legendary" and subject aircraft were able to use the feature in flight
27) One of the "legendary" aircraft became famous for an operation that it was used to accomplish while another was made famous not just for what it did operationally but also by what the military did to "show it off" T
he plane that became famous for one operation was the F-111 bombing of Libya, the plane that was shown off was the F-14 due to it's participation in the movies "Top Gun", "Final Countdown" and TV show "Jag"
28) All of the other aircraft built(AFAIK anyway) with the the new tech, regardless of manufacturer, had at least two engines
29) Speaking of engines, one of the issues with the subject plane's engine was that it came from another continent, something that made shipping and receiving problematic in the event of hostilities.
30) Even though the subject aircraft was single engined, unlike the others from other manufacturers, it was supersonic capable like all of the other's with it's new tech
31) This new tech, used on the subject aircraft as well as the several "legendary" aircraft, was even planned to be used on the initial design for a Boeing built rival to the Concord that never got past the mock-up stage. That transport was later revised to a delta design with separate horizontal stabilizers
32) Some of the "legendary" aircraft were named after animals. Others were named after various types of weather.

Hope that clears up any questions on the clues
Old 12-05-2020, 03:56 PM
  #19244  
Ernie P.
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Originally Posted by Hydro Junkie View Post
And yes, it was the Mirage G I was looking for. Let me throw some clarification on a few of these clues:
1) This plane was built by a well known manufacturer That being Dessault Aviation of France
2) This plane was designed to use tech that was new at the time. That being the "Swing Wing"
3) This plane featured a single engine and crew of 2
4) The tech used in this plane was also used on planes manufactured by allies and adversaries, some of which became legendary The "Legendary" aircraft included the F-111, F-14, Tornado, Mig-23, B-1 and Backfire bombers
5) Several of the planes referred to in clue 4 had service lives of over 20 years
6) Only one of the subject aircraft was built
7) The plane was cancelled due to two things the government couldn't overlook
8) The engine was not manufactured by the country building the plane
The engine originally used was built by Pratt & Whitney
9) The single engine design did not give the performance or survivability desired.
10) While the plane was destroyed during it's third year of testing, the pilot was unhurt due to bailing out
11) The plane in question shared a fuselage with another aircraft that was also destroyed during testing
12) While the plane was completed in June, it was not flown until November due to changes, reworks and technical issues that had to be resolved
13) The time taken to go from first test flight to reaching it's top speed and performance capabilities was just over a month
14) From first flight to destruction of the aircraft was 38 months
15) The plane is question had a top speed comparable to many of its contemporaries of the day
Even with the single P&W engine, it was capable of around mach 2+ according to my source
16) Since the plane was not produced, there was never any weaponry or hard points installed
17) The plane in question had a ceiling of almost 61,000 feet and a maximum range of almost 2400 miles
18) One of the "legendary" aircraft had side by side seating for the crew while the aircraft in question had tandem seating
This clue, and the next two, referred to the F-111
19) The "legendary" aircraft was originally designed to have the same mission as the aircraft in question but, due to operational requirements and results of testing, it's mission profile was changed The F-111 was converted to a bomber
20) The "legendary" aircraft, other than the seating arrangement, actually looked very similar to the plane in question
21) The manufacturer of the aircraft in question has been around for close to 100 years
Dessault opened it's doors, according to my source, in 1929
22) Unlike planes used in earlier wars, the plane in question used a feature developed by an ally that prevented compression issues in a dive This was the full moving horizontal stabilizer, pioneered on the F-86 Sabre
23) This plane's given name was used again on another aircraft that was not only successful but has seen combat operations The name Mirage was used on several fighters designed and built by Dessault
24) Like the "legendary" aircraft referred to in clue 18, the aircraft in question was designed to be used by both the Air Force and Navy of the developing country. Neither plane ended up meeting that goal Both the Mirage G and F-111 were slated to be land and carrier based fighters
25) The feature that tied all of the "legendary" aircraft to the aircraft in question was actually experimented with by an adversary earlier in the century. The "swing wing" was actually tried by a German firm late in WWII. How far that design got I don't know
26) The feature that was referred to in the previous clue was only able to be used on the ground when it was first tried. The "legendary" and subject aircraft were able to use the feature in flight
27) One of the "legendary" aircraft became famous for an operation that it was used to accomplish while another was made famous not just for what it did operationally but also by what the military did to "show it off" T
he plane that became famous for one operation was the F-111 bombing of Libya, the plane that was shown off was the F-14 due to it's participation in the movies "Top Gun", "Final Countdown" and TV show "Jag"
28) All of the other aircraft built(AFAIK anyway) with the the new tech, regardless of manufacturer, had at least two engines
29) Speaking of engines, one of the issues with the subject plane's engine was that it came from another continent, something that made shipping and receiving problematic in the event of hostilities.
30) Even though the subject aircraft was single engined, unlike the others from other manufacturers, it was supersonic capable like all of the other's with it's new tech
31) This new tech, used on the subject aircraft as well as the several "legendary" aircraft, was even planned to be used on the initial design for a Boeing built rival to the Concord that never got past the mock-up stage. That transport was later revised to a delta design with separate horizontal stabilizers
32) Some of the "legendary" aircraft were named after animals. Others were named after various types of weather.

Hope that clears up any questions on the clues
Thanks, HJ; I'll get something posted tomorrow. As to the German WWII aircraft, the Messerschmidt P.1101, I've included some info below. The single prototype was never completed, being only about 80% complete when the war ended. Thanks; Ernie P.


The Messerschmitt P.1101 was a single-seat, single-jetfighter project of World War II, developed as part of the 15 July 1944 Emergency Fighter Program[2] which sought a second generation of jet fighters for the Third Reich. A prominent feature of the P.1101 prototype was that the sweep angle of the wings could be changed before flight, a feature further developed in later variable-sweep aircraft such as the Bell X-5 and Grumman XF10F Jaguar.


Design and development



Within nine days of the 15 July 1944 issuance of design specifications for the Emergency Fighter, the Messerschmitt design bureau, under Dr. Woldemar Voigt, had formed a preliminary paper design for the P.1101. The aircraft which was developed initially had a short and wide fuselage, tricycle landing gear, and mid-mounted wings with an inner sweep of 40°[3] near the fuselage, and a shallower 26° outboard.[2] The single HeS 011 jet engine was to be mounted internally within the fuselage, being aspirated by two rounded intakes located on either side of the cockpit.[2] The high tail was of a V configuration,[2] and mounted on a tapered boom which extended over and past the jet exhaust, while the cockpit was forward-mounted, with the canopy integrated into the fuselage and forming part of the rounded nose of the aircraft.[4]



By late August 1944, the design, still in paper form, had evolved into a sleeker incarnation, with the previously stout fuselage lengthened and narrowed with a conical nose section, added in front of the cockpit. The compound sweep wing was also abandoned, with the outer wing of the Me 262 instead being adapted. Proposals for a pulsejet and rocket combination, the P.1101L, were also put forth.[2] The design was further developed, including a longer nose,[2] and after the wind tunnel testing of a number of wing and fuselage profiles, the decision was made to undertake the construction of a full-scale test aircraft. This finalized design and associated test data were submitted to the Construction Bureau on 10 November 1944 and the selection of production materials was begun on 4 December 1944.



On 28 February 1945, the RLM settled on a competing design, the Focke-Wulf Ta 183, as the winner of the Emergency Fighter program. This decision was based in part on the considerable design difficulties being encountered by the Messerschmitt P.1101 design team. For example, the cannon installation was proving too crowded, the mainwheel retraction and door mechanisms were too complex, the fuselage needed a great number of "strong points" to deal with loads, and the anticipated performance had fallen below the RLM specifications, due to increased weight.

Production prototype

Since considerable work had already been done on the P.1101 design, the RLM decided to continue reduced funding in order for Messerschmitt to carry out experimental flights, testing the swept back wing at anticipated speeds up to Mach 1. The worsening war situation led to the expedited, but risky, approach of building a full-scale prototype in parallel with detail construction and continuing statistical calculation, while existing components such as the wings (Me 262), landing gear (extended Bf 109), and flight components were utilized where feasible. It was also intended for the test flights to be conducted with 35, 40, and 45-degree wing sweep. Production of the V1 prototype was begun at Messerschmitt's Bavarian Oberammergau Complex with a projected first flight in June 1945.



The P.1101 V1 prototype was of duralumin fuselage construction, retaining the outer wing section of the Me 262, but with larger slats and, as mentioned previously, the wing sweep could be adjusted on the ground from 30, 40, to 45 degrees; this was for testing only and never intended as an operational feature.[2] The fuselage-mounted tandem intakes of the preliminary designs were replaced by a single nose intake, and the canopy became a bubble design, which afforded better allround vision than the initial integrated canopy offered. The production prototype also incorporated a more conventional swept tail design, which was constructed out of wood and remained mounted on the tapered tailboom. A T-tail was also designed. The tricycle undercarriage consisted of a steerable, rearward-retracting nosewheel and long forward-retracting[2] wing root-mounted main gear. The prototype was fitted with an apparently inoperable Heinkel He S 011 jet engine, but given the non-availability of this engine, a Jumo 004B was fitted for test flights. (Changing the type of engine was meant to be comparatively easy.)[2] In addition, the production model was to be equipped with a pressurized cockpit and armored canopy,[5] and to be armed with two or four 30 mm (1.2 in) MK 108 cannons, Ruhrstahl X-4 air-to-air missiles, or both.


Postwar



By the time an American infantry unit discovered the Oberammergau complex on 29 April 1945, the V1 prototype was approximately 80% complete.[6] The wings were not yet attached and appear to have never had skinning applied to their undersides. The airframe was removed from the nearby tunnel in which it was hidden and all associated documents were seized. There was some lobbying by Messerschmitt Chief Designer Woldemar Voigt and Robert J. Woods of Bell Aircraft to have the P.1101 V1 completed by June 1945, but this was precluded by the destruction of some critical documents and the refusal of the French to release the remaining majority of the design documents (microfilmed and buried by the Germans), which they had obtained prior to the arrival of American units to the area.[7][page needed]



The airframe meanwhile became a favorite prop for GI souvenir photos. Later, the prototype was shipped first to Wright Patterson AFB, then to the Bell Aircraft Works in Buffalo, New York in 1948. Damage ruled out any possibility for repair although some of the Me P.1101's design features were subsequently used by Bell as the basis for the Bell X-5, which was the first aircraft capable of varying its wing geometry while in flight.
Old 12-07-2020, 08:53 AM
  #19245  
Ernie P.
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Sorry, guys; I'm moving a bit slowly right now, due to a bad back. Not a big deal; just something that hits me every few years. Okay; time for a quiz about a pilot, rather than a plane. I hope this one educates you; or at least entertains you. And I'll drop a trio of clues to make up for my tardiness. Thanks; Ernie P.


What warbird pilot do I describe?



1. This pilot was not at the top of the “aces list” for his country.



2. But he was certainly in at least the “top ten’ for his country.



3. In fact, he was the highest scoring ace for an iconic aircraft.
Old 12-07-2020, 10:21 AM
  #19246  
Top_Gunn
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OK, just a guess to get the ball rolling: Otto Kittel, top Fw 190 ace.
Old 12-07-2020, 10:24 AM
  #19247  
Ernie P.
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Originally Posted by Top_Gunn View Post
OK, just a guess to get the ball rolling: Otto Kittel, top Fw 190 ace.
Not Kittel, Top_Gunn; but not a bad guess. And, you get a bonus clue to reward your participation as well. Thanks; Ernie P.


What warbird pilot do I describe?



1. This pilot was not at the top of the “aces list” for his country.



2. But he was certainly in at least the “top ten’ for his country.



3. In fact, he was the highest scoring ace for an iconic aircraft.



4. An iconic aircraft flown by at least a couple of much more famous aces.
Old 12-07-2020, 11:08 AM
  #19248  
Hydro Junkie
 
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That takes out a lot of pilots. I listed all US pilots(that I could find anyway) with 20 or more kills. This is not to slight the rest of the pilots that have flown in combat, regardless of their country or branch of military they flew with:
  • Richard Bong 40
  • Thomas B McGuire Jr, 38
  • David McCampbell 34
  • Gregory Boyington 28
  • Francis S Gabreski 28+6.5 in Korea
  • Robert S Johnson 27
  • Charles H MacDonald 27
  • George E Preedy Jr. 26.83
  • Joseph J Foss 26
  • Edward V Rickenbacker 26 WWI
  • Robert M Hanson 25
  • John C Meyer 24+2 in Korea
  • Cecil E Harris 23
  • Eugene A Valencia Jr 23
  • Lance C Wade 23 Flew with RAF
  • David C Schilling 22.5
  • Gerald R Johnson 22
  • Neel E Kearby 22
  • Dominic Gentile 21.83
  • Frederick J Christensen 21.5
  • Raymond S Wetmore 21.25
  • Kenneth A Walsh 21
  • Walker M Mahurin 21+3.5 in Korea
  • Donald N Aldrich 20
  • Francis W Gillet 20 Flew with RAF in WWI
  • Thomas J Lynch 20
  • Robert B Westbrook 20
One thing that did surprise me was some of the famous pilots that didn't make this list. That list includes:
  • Hubert Zemke, leader of the 56th Fighter Group, known as the "Wolf Pack" and feared by many German pilots
  • Charles Yeager, pilot of several "X" planes
  • George Welch Jr, one of the few to fly against the Japanese at Pearl Harbor
  • Alexander Vraciu, who flew off the USS Enterprise at Midway and through the fierce fighting off of the Solomons
  • John Thatch, inventor of the "Thatch Weave" and survivor of the USS Yorktown at Midway
  • Edward "Butch" O'Hare, another veteran of the USS Enterprise that was lost during the first night intercept of Japanese attack planes while flying a Hellcat. Chicago's O'Hare Intl Airport is named after him
  • Marion Carl, one of the earliest pilots assigned to the "Cactus Air Force", flying Wildcats from Henderson Field on Guadalcanal
  • Don Blakeslee, commander of the 4th Fighter Group during some of the heaviest fighting over Europe

Last edited by Hydro Junkie; 12-07-2020 at 11:43 AM.
Old 12-07-2020, 11:51 AM
  #19249  
Ernie P.
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Originally Posted by Hydro Junkie View Post
That takes out a lot of pilots. I listed all US pilots(that I could find anyway) with 20 or more kills. This is not to slight the rest of the pilots that have flown in combat, regardless of their country or branch of military they flew with:
  • Richard Bong 40
  • Thomas B McGuire Jr, 38
  • David McCampbell 34
  • Gregory Boyington 28
  • Francis S Gabreski 28+6.5 in Korea
  • Robert S Johnson 27
  • Charles H MacDonald 27
  • George E Preedy Jr. 26.83
  • Joseph J Foss 26
  • Edward V Rickenbacker 26 WWI
  • Robert M Hanson 25
  • John C Meyer 24+2 in Korea
  • Cecil E Harris 23
  • Eugene A Valencia Jr 23
  • Lance C Wade 23 Flew with RAF
  • David C Schilling 22.5
  • Gerald R Johnson 22
  • Neel E Kearby 22
  • Dominic Gentile 21.83
  • Frederick J Christensen 21.5
  • Raymond S Wetmore 21.25
  • Kenneth A Walsh 21
  • Walker M Mahurin 21+3.5 in Korea
  • Donald N Aldrich 20
  • Francis W Gillet 20 Flew with RAF in WWI
  • Thomas J Lynch 20
  • Robert B Westbrook 20
One thing that did surprise me was some of the famous pilots that didn't make this list. That list includes:
  • Hubert Zemke, leader of the 56th Fighter Group, known as the "Wolf Pack" and feared by many German pilots
  • Charles Yeager, pilot of several "X" planes
  • George Welch Jr, one of the few to fly against the Japanese at Pearl Harbor
  • Alexander Vraciu, who flew off the USS Enterprise at Midway and through the fierce fighting off of the Solomons
  • John Thatch, inventor of the "Thatch Weave" and survivor of the USS Yorktown at Midway
  • Edward "Butch" O'Hare, another veteran of the USS Enterprise that was lost during the first night intercept of Japanese attack planes while flying a Hellcat. Chicago's O'Hare Intl Airport is named after him
  • Marion Carl, one of the earliest pilots assigned to the "Cactus Air Force", flying Wildcats from Henderson Field on Guadalcanal
  • Don Blakeslee, commander of the 4th Fighter Group during some of the heaviest fighting over Europe
Its nice to see such a high level of participation; and even though no guess was hazarded, I will award another bonus clue. Thanks; Ernie P.


What warbird pilot do I describe?



1. This pilot was not at the top of the “aces list” for his country.



2. But he was certainly in at least the “top ten’ for his country.



3. In fact, he was the highest scoring ace for an iconic aircraft.



4. An iconic aircraft flown by at least a couple of much more famous aces.



5. Both of whom are considered by many to be the best pilot of their war.

Old 12-07-2020, 01:04 PM
  #19250  
Hydro Junkie
 
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Sticking to my US list:
  • Bong is the top US ace so that takes him out
  • McGuire was second to Bong flying the P-38 over the Pacific
  • McCampbell was the top Hellcat ace
  • Boyington was the top Corsair ace
  • Gabreski was the top P-47 ace
  • Preddy was the top P-51 ace
  • Foss(AFAIK) was the top Wildcat ace
Now, with that all said, let's go with the top P-39 ace, Alexander Pokryshkin

Last edited by Hydro Junkie; 12-07-2020 at 01:06 PM.

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