Dealer ethics
 

Recently I did a transaction with a company for over $500 bucks on a item listed on RCU (another warbird, like I need another and yes.. It was a FW190..lol). I was told that the item was in stock and would ship out to me soon and would be delivered to me within the next few days (the following week). I also would receive a tracking number for the transaction when it shipped later that day.

When this didn't happen, I contacted the company all to find out that they deceived me and the item wasn't actually in their possession but they were taking delivery of the items the following week and upon inspection of the item, they would send me one depending on if they had one without damage which ment I wouldn't get it for another week at best.

This was not what I was told initially so I asked for my money back through paypal which it was made through as there are other companies that have the items in stock and are shipping...

They told me that I couldn't get my money back for another four days..why is that? With pay pal, all you have to do is hit the refund button on the payment link to issue a full or partial refund.

Through several emails, they stated they contacted paypal about the issue (why). I also contacted paypal and they called the vender which the vender decided not to answer the phone but the vender sent me a email asking me to call to about it..why, just send me my money back, how hard is that?

I was never given a reason as to why my refund was to be delayed.. I'm sure we know why!

Why do companies do this? There should be if there isn't a BBB for this hobby other than word of mouth, a site to view as most of us don't find out that companies don't have good business ethics (doing the right thing) until we've been screwed over.

If theres not, then this is it! Tell everyone about your experiences with conpanies be it good or bad so that this already expensive hobby is less painful with bad customer services and poor businesses relations!

I say this because the company didn't take my offer through the site but sent me a invoice through paypal, this prevents me from leaving them a feedback.

Ethics is something we develope over our years of experience, it's sad when we have to force companies to retain some.

RE: Dealer ethics
 

Paypal will handle vendors like this.

steve

RE: Dealer ethics
 

It would be nice if after so many complications like this that paypal fines or penilizes the vender for continouse complaints. Like if you miss a credit card payment and your interest rates go up. I personally will never do business with VMB as a direct result of this transaction. I'm sure others have had reasonable service with them but there are always those that don't and were not able to express our feedback.

RE: Dealer ethics
 

This is not uncommon. I understand that RC Universe, Model News and others make someof theirfunds when listing the Ads....But we look to your trust to have good companies to buy from. What should you do....I can't say, but only to read our issues and take the action needed. I am not hitting you guys but I just had to make that note...

I will add names to the companies that have done the same so you will know who to think about buying from. Hobby King is one. You pay for shipping and when a product is bad you have to pay again to send it back to get a replacement who knows down the road..they should should pay us for that postage for one. The other thing about this company is that when you place an order as I have done (and it was a large one) it took almost a year...yes a YEAR to get my order only because they were waiting for two of my items..HELLO..What. They make all this money from us and they will not send what they have and the rest later (like Tower will do.), or at least e-mail you and tell you that this is the issue and then give you the choice to cancel the back order( it is not even a back order they just don't have it).

Banana Hobby has bad customer service. I gave them a few chances..They sent me the wrong color F-16 then told me that that is what I ordered even after I resent them my oerder showing the desert camo I get the skyblue camo. I ended up keeping the plane because they would not pay for the postage to send it back. (I got some WOWfoam hardner from Wowplanes then repainted it) Then the next time I got my son one of there units and it never came...I noted in the remarks to have it signed for. To get a replacement was hell. Now here it is three years later..I will try one more time..That New F-18 with folding wings They sent me a Disclaimer sheet. I am not even going to go into it.........But it is TRASH..

Some companies will give you the best support while you are about to buy their plane but after you have it...WHOAREYOU....They say this will work or that and when you buy the items and they don't seem ti fit/work that tech support is like WHAT..........you have already cut into the unit now what....

I have gotten an few planes from.....N.P........right you know that had to be a full rebuild. It must have been a bad day..no month in China. The box had mice droppings in it rust on parts frame bend because the formers were not in place right. and when I called them and sent photos. it was questions questions then no reply.. I should post the photos so you can be the judge.

This is what we should do, one month we all pick a company that has done this to the most of us and not buyfrom them for three months. Then only then willthey understand.

RE: Dealer ethics
 

I don't know about everyone else but being that I'm new to ARF's, the company that has served me best has been, Arfpros. I ordered several birds from them and reserved several and they keep me posted and call me prior so Im not shocked when the bill hits the bank.

Much appreciated!

RE: Dealer ethics
 

WOW Tuskegee. Rat dropping!!! Yeah, that would absolutely do it for me! I've always wondered about Hobby King, Ive never heard anything good other than their prices but have heard many bad things about them especially when it came to shipping out your items. I've also heard that Bannana Hobbies customer service is seriously below standards! They've had several items I've wanted but based on what I've heard, Ive stayed clear of them. Rather not run the risk!

Personally, giving the fact that none of this is cheap in this hobby and word of mouth is what brings a lot of these venders business, you think that customer service would be a higher priority then what it is...

RE: Dealer ethics
 

I know what you mean about Hobby King. Had to wait three months because a cold weather glove for the transmitter wasn't in stock. However, it was when I ordered it and when I clicked order it was out of stock. All my other items were held until that glove came in.

Finally got the shipment and my battery has a bad cell. (lipo) I paid $8+ for it. I got it ready to ship it back and it cost $15. So I said screw it. I can't believe you have to pay for a defective product. Fortunately I was able to fix the bad solder on the battery and it out performs my Thunder Power battery.

I called several times and tried their live chat but they never answered a phone and the live chat was like talking to a brick wall.

A lot of the guys at the field buy from them religiously, everything from servoes, batteries, rx, planes, and etc. They haven't had any issues but have all complained about having to wait so long for their items to arrive.

Joe

RE: Dealer ethics
 

I've got one...

S.G.S.
Paid nearly $1000 over 2 months for a set of scale 1/5 Main retracts, retracting tail wheel and scale main and tail wheels. All emails to them about for pricing and shipping the items was responded to in 24hours or less. Even on sundays! When asking for a formal invoice through paypal, that showed up in 12 hours or less. I got all the stuff in less than a week (only a few states over). Items looked fantastic, and service up to this point was GREAT.... Once i got to the point of installing the retracts, one of them fell apart at the down lock brace pivot point after just a few cycled of the gear by hand. After doing some investigating, I found that the particular shoulder bolt had only about 1/2 of a thread on it and a regular machine nut with red loctite to hold it on (REALLY!!?). The other landing gear had a shoulder bolt and a full lock-nut on it holding it together (perfect!). So after 2 or 3 weeks of sending emails (with photos) explaining what was happening and asking for replacement hardware, no response was received. I finally got some time to make a phone call, he said no problem he'd send the parts... 3 1/2 weeks later they showed up (good thing i wasn't in a hurry). So i put the gear back together with the new parts, went to put the gear up, and it only went about 3/4 of the way up... More investigating and i discovered that the new lock-nut was hitting the actual landing gear strut. Very strange as there are no problems with the other gear and they are now identical. So, 3 or 4 more weeks of emails, no responses... wait 2 weeks... more emails.. no response... a few weeks later and the plane is now done and ready to fly. So I try one more email to figure out whats going on (and a phone call that goes un-answered), and again, no responses. So i end up having to file a groove into the landing gear strut in order for the gear to work correctly. And i figure my issues are over. I get the airplane out to do some engine runs and taxi tests. 1/2 way through the first taxi test, the tail gear collapses (not surprised, as i was still tracking down air-leaks) so i figure the air had just leaked out. NOPE! The Air-cylinder on the tail gear had broken free from the rest of the tail gear, it had been assembled with CA!!!!!!!!!!!! So another email that goes unanswered. I ended up repairing this tail gear by placing a little bit of silicon at the base of the air cylinder, and using some green loctite to hold it into the machined tail gear base. Oh, remember all those air-leaks, after i repaired the tail gear they were GONE!!!!!!!!!!!

Unfortunately, the company is so well known for their landing gear that i will unfortunately have to do business with them again, as they are miles better than Robart.

RE: Dealer ethics
 

Yeah, RAmstein44. I took it out side and use my shop vac on everything. I was so up set in part Ijust set it aside itis now built the thing was a mess. for one thing it said that a gas engine would work in it. but what they are saying is that the power from a 120 would match a 20cc. Not that a 20cc will fit in this VERYSMALL cowl. That is misleading. So when you get the plane the box states NITRO....not gas. So with alot of cutting you can put the 20cc in. but it will not look like the plane you wanted. I ended up putting in a 130 2c. in that Nitro Planes Tucanno. The retracts I got from Hobby People and they were great getting me the right size and all. Mike is good people Thanks, Mike.

RE: Dealer ethics
 

I hear you on Sierra, personally, I love their product as do many god knows other as their gear are the best in the word that we know of and they're in high demand! But how did it get to this... Word of mouth from those that have them! But now that they're at the top, the customer service has gone down the drain!

I've had about seven sets of their high dollar gear and I've been and have been pretty much satisfied with them. Some time ago, I had a meister scale fw190D that went in and the gear were damaged, Sierra took care of them and they looked like new again, basically they were but the customer service was fantastic... This was before they were known as the best!

I recently sent them some gear to update and they jumped right on them. The problem I had was that I paid for extra parts that they didn't include when they shipped them back. Were still trying to get them on the phone or reply to an email. I feel duped because a few days prior, communications was great ( before they had my money) and I bragged about it on another site.. Now I'm in the same boat as those previously complaining about their customer service.

I often wonder how companies become so popular or successful when the communications go down hill after the fact. Sadly like you stated that since their the best and you have their product, you have to continue to at least attempt to do business with them.

What options do you have! You want to maintain some kind of positive business with the company as it mutually beneficial..but they have the upper hand. Now that you've bought the product, we need them for support..

Expensive product... Poor customer service..[&o]

RE: Dealer ethics
 

Tuskegee, so not only was the company misleading but the documentation on the box was too? Was this a china man ARF? ( aren't they all..lol) somebody was seriously off their game!

RE: Dealer ethics
 

I guess if you don't name that company, they will continue with their careless attitude.
It helps everyone to expose the good and bad guys out there....

JG

RE: Dealer ethics
 

JGrc, The vender I'm mentioning, the only RCU vender with the letters of VMB is Virginia Models Builders.. S.G.S, stands for Sierra Giant Scale which is the only known company where everyone agree that their retracts are the best (read every warbird forum and the name comes up dozens of times).

By all means, we don't want venders to get away with what they're doing so let's not abbreviate them especially for those that dont know them.

RE: Dealer ethics
 

Some points need to be cleared up here about hobbyking that has been said by a couple.
First....I AGREE that if there are out of stock items, the rest of the order should still be sent. BUT....and this is something those few that complained here about them DIDNT mention, is the fact that Hobbyking states right up front and during check out that if any items are backordered, they will hold the entire order until those parts are instock.

Yes..thats right...they explicity inform you of this. They do this to save shipping costs obviously, but that also translates into lower prices on the actual items as well.
Now it does suck if stock status shows Instock, but when checkout, it says backordered. Possibly someone else ordered the same thing and got theirs in before you...who knows. In any event, if that happens, you can easily cancel the entire order and place a new order for the parts that ARE in stock and place as separate order for those backordered items OR even put them on email alert so when they are back in stock you are auto notified. ive done that very thing...ie cancel and reorder so it CAN be done.
Common sense.

Also.....ive never had issues with hobby Kings service. I have had a couple batts with bad cells and sent them an email and I had a replacement to me in less then a week that I didnt have to pay any shipping for. Hell...I was even sent a few planes by them to do reviews on that i NEVER even ask to do. All in all.....they sent me about $1100 worth of merchandise at no charge just to do reviews on for which I had never previously asked for nor had applied for reviewer status. i simply got an email one day and was asked if id mind doing reviews on some of the products in the list. Thinking theyd only send me one, I sent back a list of 4 Id be willing to do and not 2 weeks later, I got 2 huge packages and got all 4 plus servos, esc's, motors, batteries....even retracts. I built them one after the other and did the reviews and sent them in as well as posted them on rcg where they asked me to do so. I didnt sugar coat anything....if there were flaws...I mentioned them. If there were issues with the build....I mentioned it. After doing the flight tests and such on all 4 and sending in the results......I was contacted again and given thanx and asked if id want to do more. I simply didnt have the room really to accumlate more at the time so politely turned them down.

Are they perfect?...hell no. But they arent the bad bad wolf some claim them to be.

As for nitroplanes.....Ive ordered a good deal of stuff from them and never had any issues. However, I have ordered a few ME-109 CMP planes from them and there were actual living spiders inside the CMP boxes. Planes themselves were fine. Should be noted though that I also ordered a CMP plane from Ak-models and there were also spiders in the box, so they had come from China that way. Id still buy more CMP planes and the CMP Corsair I had bought had no extra visitors in it....but having a can of bug spray handy might be a good idea.

While I have heard all sorts of horror stories with Bananahobby, the few orders I have nade have arrived rather quickly.

Another company....BVM....I ordered a few parts from them 4 months ago and STILL havent received them and the parts WERE listed as in stock.

Sierra Giant are really well made gear for sure. The only problem ive had with them is soft air line nipples prone to breaking on the air cylinders. But.....on only one set of me-109 gear. I have others as well as corsair rotating gear and they work flawlessly. Email though is hard to get responses from them.

RE: Dealer ethics
 

kahloq. sounds like you've been very fortunate other then having the issue with Sierra.

RE: Dealer ethics
 

I really havent had any problems with customer service from any of them except trying to get a hold of Darrel at SGS.

Ive also bought stuff from VQwarbirds and have nothing but stellar service. Tomas is a good guy so when I need ESM stuff...I contact him.
Ive also bought stuff from arfpros and troybuilt models as well a myriad of other online places.

RE: Dealer ethics
 

I guess for hobby king, the key is to order your items when their listed with high quanties available so when you order the chances of the item slipping away from a faster bidder is lessened and also to only buy from the U.S. dealer for hobby king. Also only order what's known to be fully in stock again with higher quanties to prevent shipping delays.

RE: Dealer ethics
 

I to have had no end of trouble with sierra retracts and appear to have joined the long list off pi$$ed of customers I have phoned Darrell 5 times now from new Zealand at 3am in the morning my time so to not miss him last time I finely got him and explained that the FW190 sierra retracts I ordered from him had a huge leak in the ram outlet (couldn’t fly the plane is was that bad) he was all promises of a new ram asked me to send him pictures of the ram so he would know which side, I did this that was 2 months ago to date nothing from him doesn’t answer emails doesn’t answer phone calls. You pay a bundle for his retracts and the guy won’t get of his ***** to help anyone yes top retracts but the after sales service is non existent I invite you Darrell to respond to this post and to the many other postings in regards his slack service I have copy’s of all phone calls and emails sent all I want is a guy to honour his work surly in today’s world honour hasn’t been forgotten.
Currently doing the FW190d9 I ended up ordering the retracts through skinflint order done and sent to me here within 3 days ive been in the modelling game now for 42 years have 3 turbines scale storch scratch built won the (Tasman master scale event) to mention a few and would have the better part of over 80 thousand invested in models never have I had such bad service from any one than I have experienced with Darrell and I have been buying world wide for years
Regards in flying Frank

RE: Dealer ethics
 

Regarding payment:

PayPal is an eBay company. It was invented by eBay in order to make shopping on internet go smooth.

I allways use PayPal if the seller company use it.

It is easy for companys to become a user of PayPal.

It gives the buyer security.

And everytime I shop something, I never have to enter my name,my address, my debet-card number.

It is easy for you to become a paypal user. Just go to www.paypal.com and register.

Easy to send money to other people too.

www.paypal.com

RE: Dealer ethics
 

How's that saying go, "bad new spreads faster than good news"?  Or is it, "one bad apple spoils the whole barrel"? 

It takes one or two belly achers to whiz all over the toilet seat to ruin the crapper.  Then because of someone not reading the fine print, all of a sudden HK or some overseas vender is bad?  Post 14 kahlog is right.  HK tells it up front! 

Someone open up a poll.  List the top 10 venders and ask if we have had a bad experience with that particular vender and then all of us can make up our own mind based on the results.  I've waited for weeks to get orders from HK but they tell you ahead what the expected delivery date is.  IF you want a part fast, a Chinese company half the way around the globe having to deal with customs and regulations isn't the place to order it people.  That's why they make LHS'! 

PayPal will refund ANY "not received" payment without argument!  They are consumer friendly to say the least.

I'm done ranting.  Does someone have any Lysol to clean off this toilet seat?

</p>

RE: Dealer ethics
 

If one orders from Hobby-King; Since they tell you up front what is on back order; Divide your order in two;

The stuff you want immediately; In one order.

The back order in another order.

Or, better; Mark the items not in stock so that you are informed when they are in stock again.

Then order them when you get the message.

Those web-shops that dont give you a clue on whether its in stock or not; Dont order from them if you have a choice.

Those that lie on in stock or not; Name them here, please, and I wont order from them.

:D:D:D

RE: Dealer ethics
 

Paypal STINKS... if the item is purchased from eBay there are minimal protections. A direct purchase is a crap shoot. You never know what they are going to do.

If you are going to use PayPal to purchase, only link the account to a credit card... that is the only protection you have. If you are selling, set up a separate account and drain the account immediately after each transaction. Never let PaySteal hold your money... you never know what they are going to do.

My advice, use credit cards for every transaction that you can.

RE: Dealer ethics
 

For custom landing gear and the like, there is not much else one can do but order and wait. But for batteries, a person could always order through their local hobby shop. It may be a half hour drive or more, but you get to hang out in a fun place. That being said, I have to admit that I ordered online recently and stopped by Hobby-Lobby on my way to work this past Friday. I picked a battery.

RE: Dealer ethics
 

if you really want to cover your ***** dont use paypal

RE: Dealer ethics
 

AMEX will stop payment on any transaction if you provide them with a plausible, and verifiable explanation. The other card companies put you through a long process, require a written statement, and are not as easy to deal with on matters like this one.

Just a word of advice from one who has dealt with these issues from time to time.