RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

I don't live too far from TBM so I called this past Monday to go down there and pick up 2 of the Esm T-6'S or a 2 pc-9's along with recommended motors and whatever else to get them flying by April 19th, I noticed Vq-warbirds had the same t-6's for $339.00 and Tbm was selling them for $389. I called and talked to Bill first and Inquired about price matching vq warbirds he said he would find out and call me back in 30 minutes. A hour and half went by before I called back and was told by Gene that he is the supplier/Importer and VQ can't sell me the esm planes for that price and neither would he!!, minutes later the price on both websites went up to $449. I got the tone They will charge whatever because there is always someone out there who is going to pay it so Pretty much we found other models and even though TBM is Right down the street they've lost 3 customers. I don't think they understand that at some point even the folks with more money than sense are gonna wake up and smell the coffee.

RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

I feel for RoseK's frustration, but that is precisely my point and the very nature of the beast. Although, and this is only in the interest of playing a little bit of devil's advocate: I don't see how anyone paying 449 for an esm plane necessarily has more money than sense...after all I lost count of how many times I've heard this one "I don't see why your building Josh, it's gonna cost way more than an ARF" Now, that was not to start up the build vs arf nonsense. The point is, all of these ARF models are way popular so yeah, the prices are going to keep going up.

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RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

Well, I just bought a topflite giant p-47 and being a member, I paid $89 for shipping and I had a $50 coupon.. This was to be the ESM dornier335. Possibly the only plane rare enough to see me still buying. Maybe I'll get lucky and someone list theirs on site for sell:D at a reasonable price of coarse ..:D quite possibly the only way I'll own one now.

RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

So you want to be a flyer and no longer a modeler......[&:]

Jeff

RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

Yup, that's exactly what I am now. Is there a problem with that? Why do people have issues with the way others enjoy their hobby? If you want build, then all the more power to you. Of course I still believe kit built planes if done right yield the nicest results. I just can't find the time to build one. Before anyone says anything about spending my time on a kit instead of a arf, if I spent the little precious free time I have in my shop building a kit, I'd never get to the flying field.

RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

I didn't start the thread. And the thing that pushes my buttons is everything always has to turn into the arf debate. Why can't we complain about the price of our hobby increasing without being told to build a kit? Maybe the next time I see someone mention their kit prices increasing, I'll tell them to buy an arf. I wonder how well that will go over?

RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

I know several flyers that don't actually do the work. I have a whole club here that only builds FMS foams or there of. It doesn't mean their not pilots or modelers. They either just don't have the time, means or ability to build a full wood kit. And that's exactly some of the resoning you'll hear from those that continue to spend the extra on the ESM line! ESM kits were designed for these types of people that want a warbird but don't have the previously mentioned. That why they flourish... That's why they'll continue too.

RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

Spending $449 on this plane in this situation is a perfect example of having more money than sense. I would be Stupid to buy that plane now knowing someone had It for low $300 and even tbm had it for less than $400 10 minutes before a I talked to them. Why was the price raised?, Is it because it's tax time and they figure they can get a little more out of the modelers?, or they're charging more because gas Prices went up. Either way I'm also calling B.S on the price hike, can we say gouging just because...
I didn't not buy completely because of the price hike because the substitute cost $200 more and the motor costs more as well as well as all the components, it was the We set the price so we charge whatever as well as tell whomever to charge whatever attitude that didn't set well with me. Sad part is I really really wanted a Esm T-28, Corsair and a shockjet with the kingtech turbine, Other people sell the kingtech however since they are the final word where ESM are concerned I will never buy one. I wish them well and Thank god I live in America where I have choices.
Kevin

RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

I'm on the list for the new p-51 B mustang from Aeroworks.. The plane will cost $2100 for the completed arf and I'm local to Aeroworks. The arfs are excellent in every way and are true quality. These I can see the extra for as they require very little thinking on my part. Which is worth the money!:) when I'm finished with it.. I will have spent $200 less for a better quality Arf than I paid for my ESM Dora and bf109... Unfortunately, since I'm local.. I pay taxes which actually is more than what it will cost anyone else to have it shipped..[&o]

RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

Another issue I have with the price hike is that, every kit I've purchased from ESM has had broken parts.. At the previous prices that sucked, I'm sure with the price hike, the quality of the parts will stay the same..

Something I'll never have to worry about now!

RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

OK hearing the quality isn't that great from a few people now makes me feel not so bad. I still really really want a T-28 30cc or bigger, hopefully some else will manufacture one soon.
Kevin

RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

Why don't you all quit complaiing and go into the distribution business? You can get together and order a container full from the Chinese and then see how much shipping really costs.[&:] Fuel surcharges, taxes, import fees, etc...

RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

Raptureboy,
Does it make sense to be a distributor for a product just because you don't want to deal with less than honorable people?, think about it...Really think about your comment. Think about If everyone was to do that.... we have choices and obviously are taking advantage of those choices, you obviously would love for us to not use our right to free speech?. There Is a saying It's better to keep your mouth shut and let everyone think you're a fool than to open it and remove all doubt and That sir was a really foolish comment.

RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

Ditto...lmao!. ESM's prices were ok considering before the hike and it worked... Why throw a wrench into it! Poor call on their part?!! Tme will tell!

RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

Indeed time will tell, and while the distributer does put out the asking price it is the market that sets the price. Iguess that if someone is stupid to by an airplane for 400 that the last guy got for 300 that means that when housing comes back none of us should be able to sell our houses because only a moron would pay more than we did.

This is not about kits or arfs or modelers or flyers or distributers trying to do anything but run a profitable business. If it turns out that all consumers of ESM products share the opinion that prices are too highthen sales for TBM and VQ will fall off of a cliff, and they will return to the old pricing with their tails between their legs. Or, the consumer will be willing to pay the new price and that is that. We all have choices, Ican't remember who posted that, but it is the truth. If you decide that the price is more than you are willing to pay then you may choose not to buy the product.Also,it is not price gouging when the product is something that you don't really need in the first place.

RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

Any company that has exclusive rights to distribute an item basically sets the price that they determine the market will bear. If the item doesn't move fast enough, you will see discounts or sale prices. The problem I see with exclusive rights is when they sell to other businesses at their business price which has some room for profit for the business but then dictate to those businesses what they can sell their product for. At that point, it borders on price fixing, which if I'm not mistaken, is illegal. Let's say the distributor sells to the open market for $400. His price to another retailer might be 20% less or $320. For the distributor to tell the retailer that he HAS to sell the item for $400 is basically price fixing. He can suggest but that should be the extent. For him to contact the other retailer and then bump the price up $60 is just plain spiteful and really makes little business sense. Unless of course the demand far exceeds the supply and we all know what that means, look at gas prices now. We're producing more gas at oil prices that are not too far from where they were when gas used to be about $2.50 but we're all paying close to $3.90 because alot is being shipped overseas to other nations that are paying alot more per gallon. Global economy fooey, global price fixing is more like it.

The only real way to get the price to come back down is to limit the purchases to where the supply starts to build up to the point where they need to move product. If it goes too long, the product will just disappear because they feel not enough profit is being made. I'm not a lawyer and I'm sure no economist but I know how the process works. And it works for everything from fruit to nuts. When the price of a grapefruit went to $1 a piece, I stopped buying grapefruit. Supply and demand, need and want. Their supply might be short so they think they can demand a lot. I don't need it but want it so I just pass it by and tell myself it can rot on the shelf and see how much they get for that and maybe they will rethink how much to sell it for. Let those ARFs sit in storage collecting dust and you will see the price start to come down when they're losing money and their stock is just sitting there or worse, something better comes along.

As for adding to the price for shipping, that's just a way to circumvent reporting profits for the government. Kind of like found money. Charge $50 to ship when it really costs $40 and you found $10 extra that isn't figured into the profit on the item. And it seems like everyone is doing it. Not all are doing it but there are a lot. Check that major auction site that starts with an E and just for giggles, look to see how much shipping is on a plastic model kit that probably weighs about 6 ounces. You gotta laugh. I just add that as part of the price because you know they're padding their profit and it alters what the end price is and what they are charged by the auction company. In that case they are offsetting their charges. Almost makes it acceptable.

OK I rambled enough. Just wanted to voice my opinion.

Regards,

RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

the price of doing buisness

RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

If I had a business used for income and decided that I could make more money by raising the price, I would raise the price; even if it meant losing customers. I wouldn't subsidize a person's hobby to be a nice guy.

I don't care about shipping cost. When I buy on Ebay, I look at the price of an item plus the cost of shipping as what I am paying for it. If an arf is $1 and shipping is $50, I don't care about the shipping cost.

- Brian

RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

I'm glad I got my Raiden and D9 before the hike. Actually got the D9 at the WRAM show so I got a deal. Still eying the Do-335...and the new BH Westland Wyvern.

The ESM planes are all very nice and were a steal at their previous prices, now they are just slightly less that much of a deal.

RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

And that Is exactly what is happening everyone can see it however as long as some keep buying it at these prices and paying the rip-off "gouging" prices and shipping It will go on forever. Simply it is gouging because they have a short supply of an item in demand and decided to raise the prices because they know they set it and only them and the folks they control sell it. I Really do wish them well and really would have bought the planes I wanted even at those prices except for the snide "We won't sell it to you for that price and neither can they" comment. Everyone runs their business the way they run their business to be profitable, some businesses will take advantage of you until they get caught or someone else comes along selling that same or better product for cheaper or with BETTER CUSTOMER SERVICE.John you hit the nail on the head and I personally wish them well but they will never get a penny from me and from what I'm hearing the list I'm on is growing daily...
Kevin

RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

Hah! you should see what the importer (Austars) asks for them in Australia
http://www.austars-model.com/disprde...03052131400136
And our dollar is worth more, around 105 US cents to our Dollar.
From all reports, they are low quality, heavy, and need all the hardware replaced.
When I was looking for a Stuka I looked at the esm and the black horse, I went with the black horse as it's $200 less (in Australia)and a hell of a lot lighter.
The strange thing is that in the USA the two models are about the same price.

RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

[quote]ORIGINAL: 3136


Hah! you should see what the importer (Austars) asks for them in Australia
http://www.austars-model.com/disprde...03052131400136
And our dollar is worth more, around 105 US cents to our Dollar.
From all reports, they are low quality, heavy, and need all the hardware replaced.
When I was looking for a Stuka I looked at the esm and the black horse, I went with the black horse as it's $200 less (in Australia) and a hell of a lot lighter.
The strange thing is that in the USA the two models are about the same price.
[/quote

I really should send them a thank you note for saving me the trouble...lol, I was directed to blackhorse models and should be putting together the 80cc edge 540 v3 starting Monday, hopefully I like it and how it flys because they sell a few models I'm interested in.

RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

Just completed the Val. Love the plane but all the hardware is junk, directions seem to be written by a 6th grader, the paint job has minor issues. Looked forward to another Japanese plane from esm but know I will forgo. Wish aeroworks would build more warbirds nice planes price point is reasonable. Just saw the p51 in person it's nice

RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

Personally I'd rather get a painted ESM bird and replace the hardware than the Monokoted AeroWorks P-51. I am sure it is of top notch quality but something isn't right with it's profile...

RE: ESM price increases?!!
 

When the cost of fuel goes up everything else has that added expense added on just to keep even.
Everything.