Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

Hello everyone,
I have a very personal build coming up with this P-40. (The P-40 was the first model my father and I ever built together. He died this year.)
So here it is. My question is simple. What engine should I choose? :) I want the engine to fit completely within the cowl, have the capability of being outfit with scale exhaust, and of course, it needs to be reliable, well made, and have great throttle response. Easy? *laugh*
My thoughts are these. MVVS/Evolution 58 has great power to size. But the posts I have read, say that they are a nightmare with the new ignition systems. The DA-50 is a great engine, but has slightly less power than I would like. The ZDZ-80 is not much bigger than the ZDZ-60 (Pretty much the same dimensions.), and has only a slightly longer measurement from crank to cylinder head, than the other two. Thus it should still fit within the cowl of the P-40 quite nicely. What do you all think? So far, I am leaning toward the ZDZ 80. Unless there is a reason I shouldn't. Anyone have experiences with these engines, or this model that would help me make the best choice for what I want? Cost is really not an issue I would like to fret over, within the price realms of these engines. Come one, come all! :D

Chris

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

A Zenoah G62, can be lightened by RCIGN1 with Electronic ignition. Makes it incredibly easy to start, they are bulletproof, have a long history, readily available service and parts....etc. And they can be had for half of a new 3W 80xi. They can use a flat plate mount on the rear case, which can make them incredibly short for full in cowl installations. RCIGN1 can also make a custom prop hub, to the length you need for firewall to thrust washer measurement.

I own a 3w80xi as well, and if it would fit in the cowl, I would have a hard time NOT installing it :)

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

Brillelli Engines has a 50 and 60 that mount very slim at 60 and 67 oz respectively. Those are RTF weights.

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

Chris,

I built the Yellow P-40 for a friend. He chose the 3W-75I, as the 80 was not yet available. The airframe has the first set of scale exhaust stacks built by Keleo Creations.

I'll attach pictures when the server cooperates to give you a sense of the size within the cowl. Nothing sticks out of the cowl, and I only needed to put two holes in the cowl for allen wrench access for the custom exhaust manifold.

Good luck and post pictures when you complete the project.

Regards

Craig

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

Thank Craig, :D

I have actually reviewed that build if I remeber right. To be honest, Keleo Creations exhaust systems are the customs I had in mind. *laugh* Their work seems to be top notch. Do you know if he has designed YA P-40 stacks to fit the ZDZ 80s?

Chris

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

Chris,

The stacks are the same as far as I know. The difference is the mounting of the cross-over manifold and header. Kelvin will send you some wood to mock up your setup, and will make the components from your mock up. His duplication of my mock up dropped right in, and was powder coated.

The attached picture illustrates the mock up.

Good luck.

Regards

Craig

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

Wow,

I AM impressed. Wonder if the added price for that process is just as impressive? ;)

Chris

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

Kelvin's charges are reasonable and if you consider the quality and form to fit, his mufflers are a bargain. I have two of his creations.
Carl

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

i've built scale exhaust in the past so what he charges is not enough. granted it easier for him with the proper tooling. if he charged for what the development cost's we would not even be in the scale exhaust game.
and i agree with the r/c ignitions g-62 lite with a prop extension. ralph is awesome to deal with and his engines run like a top, strong as hell and easy to start. if the carb wont stick out that is.

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

A good friend of mine built his yellow P40 with a DA-50 up front. He was turning a 3 blader and it was a fast plane. IMO a G-62 or similiar size would be more than enough power for this bird. I don't think they will come in much over 25 pounds RTF. The only advantage you would have with the ZDZ 80 would be to turn a larger diameter 3 blade prop. A buddy of mine has a ZDZ 80 in a Yellow Jug. He lives in Denver and even at that altitude it's an absolute rocket.

Dave

edit - sorry about the pic size. I can't seem to make them larger on here.

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

Dave,

You hit that one on the nose for me. :D I liked the ZDZ's initially, and after reading up on them. I have pretty much settled on that engine choice. A few folks I know from Ohio built their yellow P-40s with 80s in the cowl. They had inverted pitts style mufflers. With a little creativity, they were able to fit those side mounted mufflers under the cowl, with no cutting. So I figure ZDZ 80, scale exhaust, and bigger 3 blade prop would be a great combo. I am just going to have to get VERY creative with ballast in the tail from what I hear. Maybe some lead filled brass tubing in the vert stab. But that is the fun part! Right?....Now if I can just explain that to my personal financial advisor......... (Wife) ;) She's Hungarian...maybe if I play the ZDZ/Eastern European relation card. I'm grasping for straws here people........Shoulda been a doctor........

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

Hi Guys,

I recently maidened a Yellow P40 with a 3W80 and a Keleo muffler. SWEET combination!

I agree that a good 50 is enough, apparently G62s are common as well, but require a 1" prop extension.

I did the larger motor only because I wanted to spin a 24" 3-blade prop, and even a G62 can't do that.

The price to pay is weight, and especially with the long nose of the P40 this can get interesting. I have a good CG with all the main servos and the batts well back in the fuse. Maybe the world's only nose-heavy-prone warbird :-)

Ditto on all the great comments about Kelvin at KELEO .. wonderful guy, excellent craftsmanship, very easy to do business with.

I'll post a picture of the install..

Dave

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

Here is one for you. My friend is building one right now putting a ZDZ 100 inline twin swinging a Solo 3 blade prop. We are looking forward to the maiden flight but has a way to go yet.

Randy

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

ZDZ 100??? Yee ha!!!! A pal of mine has one in a Ziroli P47 and it really hauls the mail .. would be awesome in the P40 .. great sound too...

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

How refreshing it is to be on a thread where folks aren't afraid to 'power' the heck out of their warbirds. On another one I nearly got killed after talking about my plans to install a lightened g62 into a 81" P47 :) Man, I bet that twin scoots that bird along....wahooo!

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

Yea I can hardly wait since I get to maiden it for him. Looking at possible scale exhaust from Keleo but we are still waiting for the motor to arrive to mock it all up and see what room we have. His main reason for the 100 was he wanted to swing a scale prop from Solo which he has already and sure looks nice and this will do it.

Randy

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

Chris,

The lead in the copper tubing works really well. Be sure to do this before you glue the hinge points in for the rudder. I cut a generous section out of the rudder post, between the hinge points to access the vertical stab. After we balanced the airplane, I cut off a bit of lead to cover the cloth, resin and foamofil used to hold the ballast in place. After we buttoned up the tail, we rebalanced the bird, using a slight bit of weight in the tail wheel area. It really worked out sweet and will NEVER break loose.

Good luck.

Regards

Craig

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

What's the diameter on that Solo? I barely have ground clearance with the 24x12 Mejzlik .. as you know the gear "squat" down to the stiffer spring end point as soon as the airplane is sitting on them... would be cool if it can be made to work, tho.

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

How does this plane fly, land and ground handle?

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

Craig,

That is great to hear! :D I wasn't sure if the tubeing idea would work or not. Always nice to have the confirmation from someone who has turned the idea into reality. Ooh....I got final confirmation from my "Financial Advisor!". "AC 2001, you are clear for take off". ;)
Separate question. Since this will be my first in-depth composite build, I am going to take some serious time with it. Therefore, I won't get around to the engine mounting for some time. Is it possible to mock up the engine placement for the scale exhaust? Or should I wait a while? I spoke to Kelvin from Keleo Creations, (By the way, the guy is one of the nicest people I have ever spoken to. Fantastic person. No doubt about it!) [8D] and no one has mocked a ZDZ 80 up for him yet. Soooo, he will need me to do this before he can send one out. I'm not familiar with the yellow kits, and I don't know if this is even possible, or adviseable prior to being at that particular point in the build.

Chris

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

Chris,

IMO, I would mount the engine and then build the mock up to avoid any possible misalignment. There is little to no room for error inside the cowl. You will not be disappointed with this route, as everything will fit just right. You also may have to make some modifications to the front end of your engine box for the larger engine, depending on the footprint of the mount. I ended up making an additional front mounting plate to fit my custom engine mount plate, as the stock plate hole locations just missed the inside of the engine box. The rear intake on the engine presented a few challenges, but what the heck, I am always up for a challenge!! The choke and throttle servos are mounted above and below the fuel tank. The pushrods (rodchuck style) had a bit of an offset to avoid the fuel tank. I also made a fresh air intake from the stock location on the nose, to an opening in the engine box. With this addition, we are ensured that fresh, cool air is fed to the carb (see the attached picture for reference)

Good Luck.

Regards

Craig

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

Craig,

The channeling of the air to the carb box from the stock opening at the top of the nose is a great idea. [8D] This is why I LOVE building these things.

Chris

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

Chris,

I know what you mean.:D Feel free to ask away as you progress through your build, and don't forget to post pictures!!!

Regards

Craig

RE: Yellow Aircraft P-40 Engine?
 

I have one of the Yellow Aircraft P-40's in ARF form. I will be installing the radio and engine pretty soon. I am using the ZDZ Super 80 and I'm on the list for a Keleo exhaust. I will be mocking up the exhaust for this Super 80. Not sure if the regular 80 will be different or not. I think it might be different.

Jim