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90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

Old 03-12-2008, 09:54 PM
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Michael211
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Default 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

As title says, ran the engine on test stand for the 4th time today (w/16 oz tank) and the end of the muffler is already starting to come loose. I could hear a strange noise today while it was running, then after taking it off the stand and looking it over closely I see there is a dark grey paste all around the end of the muffler and once it cooled down I can wiggle the muffler tip around... it's about to pop out.

What is RCV doing to address this problem? I've read of other RCV muffler failures, both in this forum (on a 120SP) and in the Warbirds forum. Mufflers should not come apart! [:-]

My engine isn't even broken in yet and the muffler is about to pop apart most likely the next time I run it. In the Warbirds forum a H9 Corsair with a 90SP lost the end if it's muffler in flight and the pilot didn't realize it... exhaust gases ended up burning the crap out of the underside of the plane as a result (without muffler pressure, engine leaned out and got hotter than normal).

My prop (18 x 12 break-in prop) is perfectly balanced on a magnetic Du-Bro high-point balancer to the point where it can be put in any position on the balancer and it will not move. I'm running CoolPower 10% Nitro in the engine and the needle is still quite rich for break-in purposes. As per the observation of others, the engine is still running somewhat rough... though it seems to get smoother and "free'er" with every 16 oz of fuel run thru it.

While I could buy an OS 91 Surpass muffler for my *new* RCV 90SP, I shouldn't have to!

Please advize. []

- Michael [&o]
Old 03-12-2008, 11:06 PM
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Default RE: 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

If you get in touch with RCV they will most likely send you a new muffler. The replacement ones sent for the 120SP's had 2 screws in the barrel to hold the end piece in.
This fix will work for a WHILE.

Your only option for a permanent fix is get a muffler with the end WELDED in place.

Also, if the oil content is any higher than 15% the engine will always run rough. The 120SP will also detonate which ends up destroying the motor.
Old 03-13-2008, 09:06 PM
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Default RE: 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

Michael

Coolpower is not your best choice of fuel for RCV's.

You would be better off with Omega.

RCV recommend that the fuel contain 3% to 6% castor oil, and not more than 16% total oil content.

Old 03-15-2008, 11:29 PM
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Default RE: 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

Mandatory castor is correct as per the instructions, but as a RCV rep now states on this forum Coolpower(synthetic only) is fine for the SP series.

Also, Bill at BJ's(RCV's authorized service ctr) prefers the Coolpower 15% and recommends it for the SP series. He indicated the 15% nitro improves the idle, and synthetic is much cleaner - it won't leave the castor stains all over(as mine did on the muffler), nor the carbon buildup. I burnt about a half-gal of Omega 10% thru my 60SP, and it appears to have loads of "protective" castor varnish now. So my plan is to switch over, since they now say synthetic is ok.

About a mth ago, my 60SP had to be sent in to BJ's for service after problems during run-in. He did several "revisions" apparently RCV still hasn't addressed. Although after several hrs run-in my muffler never came loose, that is one of them he did without my asking. I believe he brazed it in, or something to that effect. They also machined smooth the carb flange, and replaced a fiber washer w/metal lock washer on the carb i'm unable to see. I haven't yet tested it, but they state it now runs like a top(16 x 12 @ 5700rpm) without the stalling or rough-running issues i had. We shall see - hopefully within a couple wks when my plane is done. I'm not sure about revisions to the 90 or 120, but imagine they are similar? Other than my motor coming back with a slightly boogered outer prop lock nut and missing the crankcase vent cover(resulting in some oil coming out in the bag), i would not hesitate to contact him about getting any needed revisions done to them under warranty. Bill is very knowledgeable, helpful, and accessible. All it will cost is the shipping(mine was ~$10).
Hope this helps...

Mark



Old 03-16-2008, 11:28 PM
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Default RE: 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

Well I don't have a tach unfortunately, but with Coolpower 10% I can get the idle so low you can actually see the prop as it swings around... and it'll idle like that for several minutes without loading up. Not bad for an engine with only a little over 1 hour's run time on it.

I'm a bit peeved about the muffler coming apart... to be fair, I had read up on these engines quite a bit before deciding to buy one so I was already aware that there've been reported failures of the RCV mufflers. However I'd *hoped* that RCV had addressed the issue and fixed it promptly and that a brand new engine wouldn't come with a poorly built muffler by now. [:@]

Brazing or somehow welding the end of the muffler end into the casing is the only way it'll ever hold together... a press fit just isn't sufficient. Why isn't RCV taking care of this defect in their design?

I like the engine so far, I'm annoyed about the muffler though. Would like to see RCV step up to the plate here on this issue. [&o]

- Michael
Old 03-17-2008, 12:08 AM
  #6  
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Default RE: 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

To give an idea, i purchased mine 12/07 from Hobby Barn reportedly as "new" shipment from the UK. Yet it was manufactured in Jan/Feb 07. I do not know what to make of that, but maybe it's a reflection they do not make many SP series. They may have in fact corrected the muffler issue by now, but there's only one way to find out - ask.
I never owned a tach before getting my RCV, but took the proper break-in of it very seriously and got one for that purpose. It cannot be properly done without one, as specific the procedure is with needle settings etc. For one you can't get an exact reading on your idle needle, as the specific difference needed with glow connected/disconnected is impossible to accurately tell by sound. Bill at BJ's has a great tip sheet for RCV setup, and being very specific regarding rpms and needles doing it minus a tach is not reliable. I'd highly recommend you buy or borrow one.
RCV has excellent service, so contact them and i'm sure they'll solve your problem. But be prepared for a scolding trying to break in their engine properly without a tach...

Good luck to you -

Old 03-17-2008, 11:47 AM
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Default RE: 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

Katman,

I also run around the house with scissors and I've broken a mirror or two... boy am I ever gonna be in trouble!

Ok so how does one get hold of Bill at BJ's? I'd like to just send the muffler to somebody who can braze (or whatever is needed) the end on solidly. I just want the muffler to be right and not fear it falling apart in flight on my new Mustang. []

No problem not having a tach right now, as I'm not running the engine till the muffler is fixed anyways apparently.

Thanks!

ps. How do you find the birth certificate info for these engines? ie. How can I tell when mine was actually built?

- Michael
Old 03-18-2008, 01:35 AM
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Default RE: 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

Obviously unless you want to pay for it, you need to contact RCV first provided yours is new under warranty? If you haven't registered it with them yet now would be the time - it is supposed to be done within 30 days. I'm sure they're glad to send you a new one, but i'd request sending you a "revised" muffler or a return auth # to send the entire motor to Bill(that way any other revisions Bill can do then too).
I do not have Bill's contact info handy, but once you contact RCV they'll give it to you. It is listed all over this forum though. RCV can tell the mfg date from the serial #, it was in correspondence Angela of RCV sent to Bill....
Old 03-18-2008, 06:36 PM
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Default RE: 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

Ahhh! IC. Yes my engine is already registered with RCV I did it online within days of receiving it earlier this year (late Jan 2008).

I'll figure out how to contact RCV then I guess... they must've stopped monitoring this forum apparently. [&:]

Thanks for all the advice Katman. I do appreciate it.

- Michael
Old 03-19-2008, 10:34 PM
  #10  
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Default RE: 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

Laurenne of RCV was a VERY regular, attentive, and informative visitor to this forum....unfortunately she's gone now.
I'm not sure why they're not getting involved here, lots of the time this tends to happen when they're away attending conventions etc - maybe even here in the states. But they should have someone else tending to customer service if that's the case. Normally they are on any customer's issues immediately. My dealings since i got mine were w/Angela, who was very helpful. The way i contacted RCV w/my problem was i just replied to the warranty registration confirm she sent me....don't have that?

Let us know how it turns out for you -
Old 03-20-2008, 08:23 AM
  #11  
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Default RE: 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

Hello Michael 211,

We are sorry to hear of the problem with your muffler. We will gladly supply you with a replacement muffler for your RCV90SP. If you could please send your full name and address to [email protected] with your engine serial number that will be great.

Many thanks

Stephanie Lawrence
NB. Please note we will be closed for the Easter holidays until Tuesday 25th March.
Old 04-01-2008, 08:58 PM
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Default RE: 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

Thank you Stephanie! I was starting to worry if anybody from RCV was around or not... good to see ya'll are still here.

I've been super busy with work the past 2 weeks and haven't had time to deal with this issue further. But I'll get the engine SN and e-mail it to you in just a few minutes here.

I'm annoyed by the muffler problem, but still in awe of this engine ya'll are making!

ps. Yes I have a Hanger 9 optical tach now. However my only 4 runs of the engine have been with the needle valve left in the factory "rich" position so I wasn't trying to adjust the carb... now once I get the muffler problem fixed, guess I'll have to get serious about breaking it in and adjusting it. LOL! [>:]

- Michael
Old 04-08-2008, 12:23 PM
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Default RE: 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

Hi! I received a new muffler in my mail just yesterday... very fast! Thank you very much!!!

The new muffler appears to have the end MUCH better attached than the original muffler that came with the engine. While apparently still crimped on somehow, the amount of overlap is significantly greater. I'd hope this is the muffler that will be shipping with all future RCV engines!

ps. I ran it briefly with the new muffler yesterday and using the new optical tach I bought from Hanger 9 I was able to read an idling RPM of under 1600 rpms (as low as 1550 rpm with no loading up or dying!), but I'm not able to get over 4500 rpm's on the top end so far. Of course this was just my 5th time to run the engine. Still getting some droplets of fuel coming out the front seal I noticed too, which concerns me a little bit. Tuning engines is not really my strong suite. I'll keep re-reading the instructions and doing test runs till I get the thing set right.

Regards and many thanks!

- Michael
Old 01-13-2009, 11:18 AM
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Default RE: 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

Oh boy! Michael gets 1600 rpm on a 90SP with just 4 tanks?
I have rn 2 gallons of fuel in mine and I still cannot get less than 2000 rpm (with glow driver on).
What's the trick?
Leonardo
Old 01-13-2009, 12:33 PM
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Default RE: 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

I have no idea what the trick is.... but the thing will idle so low that the prop blades can be clearly seen swinging around. LOL! It has a very scale-like idle.

The lowest idle I have on it so far is 1450 rpm according to my optical tach, swinging the MA 18x12 2-blade break-in prop. That's without the glow on. I've let it idle that low for up to 5 minutes at a time without any sign of loading up, and it transitions right back to wide open throttle without hesitation. Could be my location, since I'm only about 30 feet above sea level here in Houston Texas. Also I've been running only CoolPower 10% full-synthetic fuel in it since day one. The engine looks and feels just as nice as it did the day I 1st took it out of the box (aboutg a year ago to date). I highly recommend this fuel for this engine!

The replacement muffler has held up very well I'd like to add... much better design than the original muffler it came with that was falling apart.

Regards!

- Michael
Old 01-14-2009, 11:41 AM
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Default RE: 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

Maybe I should change for a 15% content oil fuel (I`m using 18%).
The engine also dies when I move the throtle fast to idle position.
I will write a letter to RCV asking for advice.
I dont feel confident to put this engine on my plane.
Leonardo
Old 01-14-2009, 02:06 PM
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Default RE: 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

I don't know what the oil content is in CoolPower 10% airplane fuels actually. I just know that this engine seems to like this fuel.

If yours is dying in transition from idle to full throttle then you have a carb tuning problem most likely. Reset the needles back to factory initial start-up specs and try adjusting them again.

Regards.

- Michael
Old 01-14-2009, 06:25 PM
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Default RE: 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

Michael,

On your recommendation, I'm switching to CoolPower 10%. My 120SP runs nicely on Omega and will idle indefinitely @ 1400rpm on the stuff. I just don't like the black crud on the muffler really like the idea of the engine running cooler. I've run 1 gallon of Omega through the engine and it seems to be pretty well broken in. (Things are no longer vibrating loose!) I haven't had the chance to try the CoolPower yet. You had stated on another thread that you got more rpm from the Coolpower. What gain did you get?

Thanks
Joe
Old 01-14-2009, 09:13 PM
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Default RE: 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

Michael:
Actually the engine goes very well from idle to full power.
The problem is in the opposite direction.
I have to slow it down very slowly, otherwise it will die.
And below 2200 rpm it can stall at any time.
I've just sent an e-mail to RCV. Lets see what I get...
Leonardo
Old 02-02-2009, 03:21 PM
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Default RE: 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

ORIGINAL: Michael211

Well I don't have a tach unfortunately, but with Coolpower 10% I can get the idle so low you can actually see the prop as it swings around... and it'll idle like that for several minutes without loading up. Not bad for an engine with only a little over 1 hour's run time on it.

I'm a bit peeved about the muffler coming apart... to be fair, I had read up on these engines quite a bit before deciding to buy one so I was already aware that there've been reported failures of the RCV mufflers. However I'd *hoped* that RCV had addressed the issue and fixed it promptly and that a brand new engine wouldn't come with a poorly built muffler by now. [:@]

Brazing or somehow welding the end of the muffler end into the casing is the only way it'll ever hold together... a press fit just isn't sufficient. Why isn't RCV taking care of this defect in their design?

I like the engine so far, I'm annoyed about the muffler though. Would like to see RCV step up to the plate here on this issue. [&o]

- Michael
To be fair, the end has been falling out or rattling on OS Surpass engines for 20 years. Very nasty, since that black goop is powered aluminum. My fix has always been to use JB Weld. I wash the assembly with dishwashing soap and water. Then dry it with paper towel. Then swab down with alchohol and dry again. Then mix up the JB, push the end in as far as it'll go, squish the JB around. Twist the end a bit to spread it inside and out. Pull the end flush, wipe off the excess and wait 24 hours. The OS 26 and 48 engines I did this on have been good every season since 1984.
Old 02-02-2009, 03:46 PM
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Default RE: 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

Joe I don't recall saying that I got more power on Coolpower fuels... only that the engine remains pristine, like new, with the full synthetic oil in Coolpower fuels. I only ran it once (very 1st time starting the engine new) on a tank of borrowed ModelPower fuel with Caster Oil and it left bad stains all over the muffler (which ended up falling apart anyways.... RCV replaced the muffler with a new one within a few days and the new muffler is much better built where it's end is crimped in!).

My 90SP is taching around 5400 max at the prop, and idles down to a nice slow 1400. Transition from idle to WOT and back is smooth and nearly instantaneous. Still, I haven't actually flown the engine yet... I'm still working on the Mustang for it to go into. It's only getting run on the test stand periodically. I'm at around 1 1/2 gallons of Coolpower 10% thru it now. Darn thing runs forever it seems on 16 onces of fuel...

- Michael

Old 02-02-2009, 03:48 PM
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Default RE: 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

Never thought of that, deothoric. I wouldn't have thought JB Weld would hold up in such a location honestly. The replacement muffler RCV sent me is MUCH better crimped on the end! It's shown no signs of coming apart at all, and I don't think it ever will.

Thanks for the tip though.

- Michael
Old 02-02-2009, 03:50 PM
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Default RE: 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

I don't get that problem Leonardo. I still suspect it's got something to do with your carb settings though. Mine goes from idle to WOT and back without any hesitation whatsoever and has never stalled or died like you describe. Did RCV ever get back with you with any suggestions?

- Michael
Old 02-02-2009, 06:16 PM
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Default RE: 90SP Muffler failure on run #4.

I tried the JB weld and it didn't work for me. I guess it couldn't take the heat. Anyway, I had the end welded on like the OS mufflers. That fixed it for good.

Michael, thanks for the info on the CoolPower. I'm going to break into my new gallon as soon as it warms up some. I'm still on the test stand as well.

Joe

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