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Tell me what you think about this

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S.P.A.D. Aircraft - Coroplast design Discuss the growing area of S.P.A.D.S. (Simple Plastic Airplane Designs). Coroplast type aircraft, pizza box planes, etc..

Tell me what you think about this

Old 05-12-2004, 09:26 PM
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BalsaTree
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Default Tell me what you think about this

Okay, I am currently flying a DPS with a TT 46 Pro. This is my second plane and I'm having a lot of fun with it, but I am beginning to find some limitations that I want to eliminate in a new plane. The American PVC fuse has developed many cracks and is currently being held together by CA and packing tape. The flat bottom wing and high wing mounting position make for more sloppy axial rolls than I want. Inverted flight is also not confidence inspiring. I think perhaps too small an elevator surface, or too little downward elevator throw also may contribute to this. Lastly, the rudder does not have the control I want. Knife-edge is impossible, and the rudder does not have the influence to control a stable hovering position. I think this is largely due to the fuselage being too short, but a larger control surface couldn't hurt either. Okay, those are the problems I want to solve with the next SPAD (I'm not interested in building a balsa plane).

Here are my thoughts so far: First, I plan to use a square aluminum tube for the fuse like the SPA3DT uses (I'm not looking to win any beuty contests). I will use another .46, probably another TT Pro or possibly a Magnum, or one of the other cheap but good engines. I want a symmetrical wing. I'll probablybuild the wing similar to the Spazzler wing, although I would like to get a more round leading edge. I've read something about scoring the leading edge three times, instead of once to get it more round. How far apart should the scores be? I want to slide the fuse through the middle of the wing. I found a picture of a plane that is built very similar to this, but it had no building details. I'll post the pic so you can see what I mean. I do not know what dimensions to use. I don't want this plane to be super fast, I guess i kinda want a 3D/funfly plane that can do fairly accurate aerobatics. I have flown a SPA3D and that is not what I'm looking for. So my initial thoughts is to mimic the basic dimensions of a plane that flies the way I want this one to. So I found some dimensions for a U Can Do 3D. It's wing is about 56"x16" Is that going to be too big for what I want, given that the spar will be about 2" thick? My DPS is a hair under 40 inches from the tip of the spinner to the back of the rudder. The U Can Do web site says it's 58.5 inches. That would certainly gain me the extra length I'm looking for, but is it too much? So basically I looking at building the plane pictured below, with the dimensions I jsut listed, and a round leading edge. Will it do what i want it to? Are there already plans for a plane floating around that you think is what I'm looking for? Thanks for any input!

Old 05-12-2004, 10:15 PM
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FrankC29
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Default RE: Tell me what you think about this

Hey that looks familiar! It flies great, but I bet with a triple scored le it would fly even better ( you score three lines instead of one for the le fold, I believe about an 1/8" apart, and sort of massage them to resemble one large curve). This one, which I call a Spazzler on a Stick, flies very much like my Sig Somethin Extra. Rolls are spot on axial, and after reading what you are after, then it would be a good choice for you. It's basically a Spazzler wing and a 33" aluminum fuse. 2 aileron servos really help with the rolls, especially with those monstrous ailerons. The cg has a very wide range, which is kind of typical for these thick funfly wings. If you go to my website, you will find some good pics on how I made the wing for the fuse to slide through. It worked out well, I put this plane through a lot of abuse and so far it's just like new. I did shorten the lg and put bigger wheels on it, and it looks much better now.
Old 05-12-2004, 10:32 PM
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Default RE: Tell me what you think about this

Cool! I was hoping you would reply! Do you have a picture of how you mounted the aileron servos? Are they zip-tied into the wing with PVC doublers? So your wing is made from a single sheet of 2 mil, with 4 mil ailerons sandwiched in? Do you think the plane would perform well with a 58" overall length, and a 56"x16"(plus ailerons) wing size? Lots of questions, I know, but this will be the first time I will be deviating from an existing plan and kinda making my own thing.
Old 05-12-2004, 10:35 PM
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BalsaTree
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Default RE: Tell me what you think about this

Oh yeah, how did you secure the wing to the fuse? Are there screws on the bottom screwing the wing to the fuse at the front and back, or something?
Old 05-13-2004, 01:22 AM
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FrankC29
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Default RE: Tell me what you think about this


Cool! I was hoping you would reply! Do you have a picture of how you mounted the aileron servos? Are they zip-tied into the wing with PVC doublers?
No, I don't have any pics of that, however I simply cut out holes fore the servos about 3/8" beneath the spar and glued small strips of pvc to the top and bottom, and then drilled and mounted the servos standard fashion. Works fine.

So your wing is made from a single sheet of 2 mil, with 4 mil ailerons sandwiched in? Do you think the plane would perform well with a 58" overall length, and a 56"x16"(plus ailerons) wing size? Lots of questions, I know, but this will be the first time I will be deviating from an existing plan and kinda making my own thing.
Yes a single piece of 2mm with the 4mm ailerons sandwiched in. I see no reason whatsoever that a 56" 2mm funfly wing would not work great, go for it. But do go with the triple scored smooth le, from every account I've read it beats the sharp le on the funfly wings hands down. There are pvc doublers glued to the wing top and bottom at the le and te where the aluminum shaft passes through, you can see them in the picture. If you look close you can also probably see the 1/4" nylon bolts (2 total). There are metal nuts and plastic washers on the other side. That's it, that's all that's holding the wing on, and it works fantastically.
Old 05-13-2004, 01:27 AM
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FrankC29
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Default RE: Tell me what you think about this

BTW, for a 58" total length, you'd need about a 50" length of aluminum. That's a bit much, you might get a lot of flex. For C-channel, I wouldn't go beyond 35-36". You could go longer with box channel, but then you're all up weight will be like that of a standard DPS or maybe even a bit more, not exactly a funfly weight, but it will still fly fine and be very very stable in hammerheads and tailslides, very pattern like I'd imagine.
Old 05-13-2004, 03:02 PM
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BalsaTree
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Default RE: Tell me what you think about this

I was planning on using 1" x 1/16"wall square aluminum tube. The C-channel seems to have too much flex. Maybe I'll shorten it up a bit and go 52" or so. Pattern-like sounds good, though.[8D]
Old 05-13-2004, 04:01 PM
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FrankC29
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Default RE: Tell me what you think about this

If you want to go through the trouble, drill some lightening holes in it, it helps and doesn't give up any strength. Not a bad project, sounds like it should be a great flier, let us know how it goes (and pics!).
Old 05-13-2004, 05:56 PM
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BalsaTree
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Default RE: Tell me what you think about this

I was thinking about speed holes. I don't know if I want to do that yet. I'll prolly try it without and if I think it needs to be lighter drill them later. One of my top priorities here is strength. I'll definately post pics and flight results. Anyobody else have any opinions on this project?
Old 05-15-2004, 02:30 PM
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Default RE: Tell me what you think about this

Okay, construction has ensued. The only 2 mil coroplast I can find is only 48 inches wide with the flutes running chordwise, so I have been forced to scale down my plans some. The wing is 48" x 15", including the ailerons (basically a spazzler wing). The overall length will be 50" from the tip of the spinner to the back edge of the rudder (41" fuse). The wing is done, glue is drying, the fuse, and tail stabilizers are cut out, and the motor mount is cut out. I've got all the peices built, now I just have to assemble them. If the assembly goes miraculously smoothly (I can't start on it until about 8:00 tonight) the first flight will be tomorrow!
Old 05-15-2004, 03:53 PM
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BalsaTree
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Default RE: Tell me what you think about this

Change in plans! First flight still scheduled for tomorrow, but now I have a a Super Tigre G51 to put on it, so I can leave my TT Pro 46 on the DPS.
Old 05-17-2004, 02:31 PM
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Default RE: Tell me what you think about this

Many flights of the plane (I'm told it has been dubbed "Dragonfly") took place yesterday. First some details on how I ended up building it. The 2mil coro is only 48" wide and I didn't want to have to make the wing in 2 halfs, so I reduced the scale of the plane a bit. The wing is 48x12 with 3" ailerons, and a triple-scored LE. Pretty much a spazzler wing but set up for the fuse to run through the middle. From the tip of the spinner to the back edge of the rudder is 50", 10.5" longer than the DPS. The rudder and elevator control surfaces are 4" x something. The fuse is square aluminum tube, and seems plenty strong, I may end up drilling speed holes. The first major disappointment was with the Super Tigre G51 engine... First I could not get it to start, then on further inspection I noticed the "flywheel" thing that the prop rests against had two big crack in it! Bummer, never even got it started. I'll try to take it back the the LHS and see what they can do. I really wanted to fly the thing, so I took the TT 46 Pro off teh DPS and mounted it on the Dragonfly, with some minor modifications (good thing I brought the Dremel).

It took off and flew, took some trimming to get it right, but it got there. The first thing I noticed was on a high speed pass the ailerons started to flutter. It only did that once, and it was a windy day, but it is something that will need to be addressed. I think the elevator does it too. A couple times when flying down at full throttle (fast) the elevator seemed to kinda stop responding for a moment. I think dowels through a flute in the wing and horizontal stbilizers will fix both problems. It only took one landing to realize that the landing gear was not up to the task. It bent on nearly every landing, so I'll have to build a new one out of thicker material. Apart from those issues it flies great. Rolls are axial, it flies upside down as well as it does right side up, and the wing will fly at much lower speeds than the DPS. Overall it flies much better than the DPS, but is also much more difficult to build, and the wing is not removable for transportation, unless you want to take off the engine and radio too...

Oh yeah, one more little problem I had with it... I did not change the colors from the top to the bottom, and the vertical and horizontal stabilizers are both black, so it looks exactly the same on top as it does on the bottom. During some low altitude crazines top became bottom for me briefly, and the wing hit the ground hard. It actually ripped the right side of the 2 mil wing right off, but no other damage to the plane.[X(] I just hafta build another wing for it, and fix the other little problems, but it is a really fun plane!
Old 05-17-2004, 06:19 PM
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FrankC29
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Default RE: Tell me what you think about this

How does it loop? Are the loops tight and round, or do they look a bit oval? My Spazzler on rails flies great, but's it's difficult to get that nice round loop like my Sig SE. I've wondered if it has anything to do with the sharp le. Maybe the triple score takes care of this problem.
Old 05-17-2004, 09:48 PM
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BalsaTree
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Default RE: Tell me what you think about this

Fairly round. Much smoother than the DPS. Building a new wing now.

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