Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco
#51
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: duncanville,
AL
Posts: 282
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco
Big Bird, I used 1/4 in. wire for my landing gear. It's a pain to work with but I was planning on using my ZDZ 80 for power, so the extra strength may be needed.
#52
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco
ORIGINAL: mango12
Big Bird, I used 1/4 in. wire for my landing gear. It's a pain to work with but I was planning on using my ZDZ 80 for power, so the extra strength may be needed.
Big Bird, I used 1/4 in. wire for my landing gear. It's a pain to work with but I was planning on using my ZDZ 80 for power, so the extra strength may be needed.
#53
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: duncanville,
AL
Posts: 282
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco
No pictures yet, my wife has the camera. I did use 3/16" wire for the spreader bar on the L.G. I will post pix ASAP , but no comments about my shops neatness, o.k.? When used to breed parrots in the same building. Got rid of the birds, and gained a hangar!!!
#54
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: duncanville,
AL
Posts: 282
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco
Well I have run into my first real problem during construction. As I said earlier, I plan on using a ZDZ 80 for my powerplant. After installing F2 on the fuse I did some measuring to see how the engine will fit. If I install the engine on F 2, the prop shaft is 1&1/4" to short to clear the cowl. On the pther hand, if I install the engine on F 1, the prop clearance is perfect, but with the carb mounted on the rear of the engine, the carb will be located somewhere in the balsa spacer between F1 and F2, making adjustments nearly impossible. I contacted RCshowcase about putting a propshaft extension on the engine and they do not reccomend it. Any suggestions? Right now a different engine is out of the question.
Scott
Scott
#55
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco
Scott, I agree with RC Showcase, I don't like extensions because of potential vibration problems and extra stress on the crankshaft. Here is a photo again of my G-62 mount. As you can see F1 is only used as a cap for the balsa. The mounting block is actually mounted to a 1/2" thick F2.
Now for information on how I mounted my ZDZ80RV on my 1/3 scale Super Decathlon. As you can see from the photos I made standoffs from 1" red oak dowel. There is a hole cut in the firewall to accept the bottom end of a soft drink can. I did this to provide adequate air flow for the carb and to prevent any fuel from getting into the fuselage. I have been flying this plane for over 2 years and this arrangement has worked out fine. Adjusting the carb has been no problem. I think that shortly after my first flight I never adjusted the carb again. I love the ZDZ80RV. Believe me, you may wind up with a rocket ship Waco with the 80.
Note how I used bel cranks to operate the choke and throttle. On the SD, all of the radio equipment is hidden. This is the same for my 1/3 scale Bucker Jungmeister.
Now for information on how I mounted my ZDZ80RV on my 1/3 scale Super Decathlon. As you can see from the photos I made standoffs from 1" red oak dowel. There is a hole cut in the firewall to accept the bottom end of a soft drink can. I did this to provide adequate air flow for the carb and to prevent any fuel from getting into the fuselage. I have been flying this plane for over 2 years and this arrangement has worked out fine. Adjusting the carb has been no problem. I think that shortly after my first flight I never adjusted the carb again. I love the ZDZ80RV. Believe me, you may wind up with a rocket ship Waco with the 80.
Note how I used bel cranks to operate the choke and throttle. On the SD, all of the radio equipment is hidden. This is the same for my 1/3 scale Bucker Jungmeister.
#56
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: duncanville,
AL
Posts: 282
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco
Thanks Ken, thats exactly how I'm gonna do it!! Already got the stand offs cut, just gocenter drill them and I am ready to go. But lining up that drink can may be tricky, and I may put the bell cranks on the front side of the firewall. I'll let you know how it turns out.
Scott
Scott
#57
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco
ORIGINAL: mango12
Thanks Ken, thats exactly how I'm gonna do it!! Already got the stand offs cut, just gocenter drill them and I am ready to go. But lining up that drink can may be tricky, and I may put the bell cranks on the front side of the firewall. I'll let you know how it turns out.
Scott
Thanks Ken, thats exactly how I'm gonna do it!! Already got the stand offs cut, just gocenter drill them and I am ready to go. But lining up that drink can may be tricky, and I may put the bell cranks on the front side of the firewall. I'll let you know how it turns out.
Scott
I discovered that the horizontal stab and elevators were not drawn symmetrical. I copied one half on my light box and used it as the pattern for both sides. On my plans, if you lay a straight edge on the horizontal trailing edge, it curves off.
Looking forward to seeing how your mount works out.
#58
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco
John, here is what my final landing gear assembly looks like at the back of F3. The plans say to epoxy the groved LG blocks in place. Knowing that it is entirely possible that I might have to cut into the LG area to replace a badly bent wire, I think I'll only depend on the 6x32 screws with lock nuts to hold everything in place. I added the additional piece to the shock absorber block to allow for carry through of the 1/4" square balsa. The LG main wire is 1/4".
#59
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco
It would be far easier to make smooth ailerons but they just wouldn't look right. I built 3 of the original Pica 1/5 scale YMF-5 kits and all included the molded plastic caps to go over the ailerons. These added a lot of realism realism to the model. There are 34 stiffeners on each aileron surface on the full scale plane.
Now is the time for some brain storming from you guys. What kind of sticks, etc could be glued to the ailerons to simulate this. Possibly molds and vacuum formed parts? I've never done any vacuum forming. I don't mind gluing on 272 sticks. I have plenty of time.
Now is the time for some brain storming from you guys. What kind of sticks, etc could be glued to the ailerons to simulate this. Possibly molds and vacuum formed parts? I've never done any vacuum forming. I don't mind gluing on 272 sticks. I have plenty of time.
#60
RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco
BB,
Check out Evergreen Scale Models http://www.evergreenscalemodels.com/ (model train supplies) they have angle stock in a variety of sizes. You will need to pick the right size for your scale. Glue the angle to the surface (balsa, 1/64th" ply or styrene) with the corner up and by the time you add any putty, sand, primer, sand and paint, the corners will be rounded over and the angle/surface joints will be filled in to look like the real thing. Or if you find stock to vacumm form long enough for the airlerons, make a left and right master pattern and form the covers, that will give the rounded effect to the airleron corrigations. The pictures are of a full scale QFC/UBF airleron. Notice that every 3rd corrigation on the bottom side is open to allow condensation to escape. Good Luck.
Check out Evergreen Scale Models http://www.evergreenscalemodels.com/ (model train supplies) they have angle stock in a variety of sizes. You will need to pick the right size for your scale. Glue the angle to the surface (balsa, 1/64th" ply or styrene) with the corner up and by the time you add any putty, sand, primer, sand and paint, the corners will be rounded over and the angle/surface joints will be filled in to look like the real thing. Or if you find stock to vacumm form long enough for the airlerons, make a left and right master pattern and form the covers, that will give the rounded effect to the airleron corrigations. The pictures are of a full scale QFC/UBF airleron. Notice that every 3rd corrigation on the bottom side is open to allow condensation to escape. Good Luck.
#62
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: duncanville,
AL
Posts: 282
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco
Hey Ken, on the plans it says that Sigs Morrisy Bravo has corrugated ailerons and you can order the parts from them. I assume that they are the correct scale. I finally got my engine mounted( ZDZ 80) and discovered that the wrap around muffeler, Pitts style, will not fit because of the short distance to the firewall !! I am not sure about some of the aftermarket mufflers as I have heard that some will fry the engine. I am also concerned about those ugly downpipes on the side mounted ones. I may be switching to a G62.
#63
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco
John, thanks for the information on evergreen. It looks like their site is primarily for dealers.
One thing that I've considered is using a piece of square brass tubing as a guide and push a square balsa stick through it into a single edge razor blade. This would make the triangle stock. I could then round the ends of the stock to simulate the way the stiffeners look. The next decision will be what size square balsa stick to use.
Scott, I know what you mean about the ugly pipes. I think mine turned out somewhat ugly. I have thought about turning the muffler upright and adding some curved pipes to bring the exhaust out. I can restore the cutout if necessary. Don't know if I'll go to that much trouble though. From a G-62 up the cowl is pretty tight.
One thing that I've considered is using a piece of square brass tubing as a guide and push a square balsa stick through it into a single edge razor blade. This would make the triangle stock. I could then round the ends of the stock to simulate the way the stiffeners look. The next decision will be what size square balsa stick to use.
Scott, I know what you mean about the ugly pipes. I think mine turned out somewhat ugly. I have thought about turning the muffler upright and adding some curved pipes to bring the exhaust out. I can restore the cutout if necessary. Don't know if I'll go to that much trouble though. From a G-62 up the cowl is pretty tight.
#64
RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco
BB,
I believe you are correct about Evergreen being mostly for the dealers, just wanted to show the different material available. Maybe your LHS can order you the quantity you need.
On the other hand, with a little more work, the split balsa stock is a good way to go also. If I remember correctly the Pepino YMF is 1/4 scale and the corrugations on the full size were "about" 1/4" tall, you would need something like 1/8" sq. to split. This would leave a little more than 1/16th tall strips, but after filling, sanding, primer, sanding and paint it would be very close to being right on. That would be close to scale, but you may try a little larger for the visual effect. Remember, we are illusionists, if it looks right, it is right.
I believe you are correct about Evergreen being mostly for the dealers, just wanted to show the different material available. Maybe your LHS can order you the quantity you need.
On the other hand, with a little more work, the split balsa stock is a good way to go also. If I remember correctly the Pepino YMF is 1/4 scale and the corrugations on the full size were "about" 1/4" tall, you would need something like 1/8" sq. to split. This would leave a little more than 1/16th tall strips, but after filling, sanding, primer, sanding and paint it would be very close to being right on. That would be close to scale, but you may try a little larger for the visual effect. Remember, we are illusionists, if it looks right, it is right.
#66
My Feedback: (1)
RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco
Hi Ken: The angle stock from Evergreen is perfect for corrugations. I used it on my Little Toot bipe for the rudder and elevator. It's worth tracking down a source. I got mine at a model railroad shop.
Continued good luck with your WACO and keep posting!
Brad
Continued good luck with your WACO and keep posting!
Brad
#68
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco
John, I dropped by a hobby shop the other day that had the Evergreen plastic angle that you talked about. I think the right size is .080" (P/N 292). There are other sizes available. I still have to take more measurements to be sure. They also have PlastiStrut with several sizes.
On another subject, I installed the tail wheel assembly that I built on the fuselage that my friend gave me just to see how it looked and I like it.
Bedford, first flight yet?
On another subject, I installed the tail wheel assembly that I built on the fuselage that my friend gave me just to see how it looked and I like it.
Bedford, first flight yet?
#69
RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco
BB,
Looking good. I was able to take a few pictures from the top inside (stabilizer has been removed) of a UBF being restored. The first picture shows the shock absorber (top of the picture) which is a series of rubber donuts with metal plates in between. The second picture shows the front pivot and the locking mechanism for the tail wheel (to lock it straight for take off and landing). The cables on the left and right are rudder, the loose ones across the tail wheel are elevator and the center goes to the tail wheel lock. The black back ground is the leather boot around the tail wheel as in picture 3 (different plane, also a UBF).
Looking good. I was able to take a few pictures from the top inside (stabilizer has been removed) of a UBF being restored. The first picture shows the shock absorber (top of the picture) which is a series of rubber donuts with metal plates in between. The second picture shows the front pivot and the locking mechanism for the tail wheel (to lock it straight for take off and landing). The cables on the left and right are rudder, the loose ones across the tail wheel are elevator and the center goes to the tail wheel lock. The black back ground is the leather boot around the tail wheel as in picture 3 (different plane, also a UBF).
#70
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco
John, those are great photos. I was looking for the elevator push rod or pull-pull connections. Did the elevator use a push rod inside the fuselage? Of course, for safety reasons, I plan to use a push rod on each elevator half. Looking at the fuselage arrangement it looks like I might want to put the two elevator servos in the baggage compartment so that the push rods would have a pretty straight shot to the elevators. What do you think?
Pull-pull for the rudder and tail wheel is very easy. I do that on my Jungmeister.
Pull-pull for the rudder and tail wheel is very easy. I do that on my Jungmeister.
#71
RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco
BB,
The full size WACOs had a free turning tail wheel that was not steerable, it was only locked straight for take off and landing. The full size elevator is cable controled, pull-pull, those are the elevator cables crossing the tail wheel from lower left to upper right (the loose ends are by the shock system) in picture 1.
I have not done any 1/4 scale aircraft so your method of control is up to you. Over in the Vintage & Antique, WACO YMF forum, with the Pica 1/5th, some builders are using a hidden elevator control system with both elevators connected together (central control horn on the joiner), other are using external control horns with push rods, either a single on one side with joined elevators or a single rod with a "Y" at the elevator end. My elevator will use the hidden system on my 1/6th Pica YMF with a single push rod and pull-pull on the rudder and tail wheel with a bellcrank for the pull-pull cables and a short pushrod to the bellcrank from the servo.
You might want to take a look at the build thread on RC Scalebuilders, Other Designers, Rosenstock HKS WACO and the Barth YMF thread in giant scale here on RCU to see what they are using.
The full size WACOs had a free turning tail wheel that was not steerable, it was only locked straight for take off and landing. The full size elevator is cable controled, pull-pull, those are the elevator cables crossing the tail wheel from lower left to upper right (the loose ends are by the shock system) in picture 1.
I have not done any 1/4 scale aircraft so your method of control is up to you. Over in the Vintage & Antique, WACO YMF forum, with the Pica 1/5th, some builders are using a hidden elevator control system with both elevators connected together (central control horn on the joiner), other are using external control horns with push rods, either a single on one side with joined elevators or a single rod with a "Y" at the elevator end. My elevator will use the hidden system on my 1/6th Pica YMF with a single push rod and pull-pull on the rudder and tail wheel with a bellcrank for the pull-pull cables and a short pushrod to the bellcrank from the servo.
You might want to take a look at the build thread on RC Scalebuilders, Other Designers, Rosenstock HKS WACO and the Barth YMF thread in giant scale here on RCU to see what they are using.
#72
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 1,329
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco
Ken,
Have had had a minor set-back in the pursuit of first flight. The Q50 that it came with is not in as good condition as I had thought. The carb mounting threads are stripped in the cylinder body. I discovered this when getting everything tuned and ready for flight. The Q50 ultimately would not start.
I am going to trial fit a G62 here soon. The challenge there is the carb and muffler are reversed. I don't mind re-arranging the throttle, but I am not looking forward to replacing the cowl to make the fit. If it doesn't work out, I will get the BB Q52 upgrade kit.
Meanwhile I fly other things.
Bedford
Have had had a minor set-back in the pursuit of first flight. The Q50 that it came with is not in as good condition as I had thought. The carb mounting threads are stripped in the cylinder body. I discovered this when getting everything tuned and ready for flight. The Q50 ultimately would not start.
I am going to trial fit a G62 here soon. The challenge there is the carb and muffler are reversed. I don't mind re-arranging the throttle, but I am not looking forward to replacing the cowl to make the fit. If it doesn't work out, I will get the BB Q52 upgrade kit.
Meanwhile I fly other things.
Bedford