Im running savage with- 3 speed- tsias M25 pipe- OS 30 - 17/47 Gearing-
nova heat sink engine mount- no body on during break in- trinity monster horse power 25% and OS # 8 glowplug

I also just rebuilt all diffs and gearboxes-

the OS 30 is so so so rich out of the box- I dont understand

ran first 4 tanks @ factory settings ( so fricking rich) in figure 8 motion to seat and break in diffs- I spent alot time with aluminum cups and shimmed pinion and aluminum grearboxes ect. I wanted to seat all diff first-

first 4 tanks I did not even get out of first gear- just doing figure 8's to seat diff- temp only like 125 degrees- not dumpiong on throttle at all-

next 5-9 tanks spent doing figure 8's and slowly leaning the hsn still stuck in first gear- not dumping on it and like 3-5 second throttle bursts- higest temp achieved like 162.5 degrees-

today I leaned out the hsn more and slightly leaned out the lsn- maybe ran 6 -8 tanks- finally hit second- ( i think) I serously doubt it 3rd gear- anyway higest temp today was like max 180 degrees- mostly between 168 and 175 degrees- doing pretty good throttle and rpm blasts to try to bring up temp- not really beating on it- however by now I should beable to peg the throttle by now?

I dont understand why they set these thing so rich out of the box-
I have run like 15-18 tanks of fuel- thats like 75% of a gallon and still have not hit 200 degrees- 178-180 degrees is the highest sofar-

now I have been doing some reading on engine break in and Im totally freaking out that I have run my engine to cool ( not hot enough) for to long- do you think my engine is toast or done?- I was hopeing it would last over 5 gallons- with the body off and the nova heat sink moter mount- and being set ungodly rich from the factory im having a really hard time getting my temp up to 200 hundred-

any comments would be great-

Im scared I toasted my engine -

please help-

is 180 degrees hot enough for full break in- its been like 15-18 tanks of fuel-

I have read so much like never go by temp- go by smoke-
only use heat cycle method-
beginers NEVER use heat cycle method-
" I never break in my moters"

please help Im freaking out over here if you cant already tell-

thanks everyone

Engines have to be broken in rich and thus the engine temps will remain quite low-which is totally normal and acceptable. The added fuel keeps the engine well lubricated while the internal parts wear to each other-which is what we call break-in.[8D]

After 15-18 tanks you should be WOT and have leaned out for max power by now!!! [X(]

i had the same engine dude, it is very rich from factory... and they need a bit of leaning to get the torque they are well known for, i had the 3speed also, its a pain of an engine, temps on mine were around 210 but still on the rich side, but watch you engine!!...

after 3 gallon the o.s is no longer as powerfull as it once was...

my suggestion to anyone buying an o.s engine is get the most from it rather than be "to" safe with the rich settings... as it will lose the life fast...

good engine but for ther money i wish i had bought a nosram...[&o]

O the w000's of a breakin..

Your doing fine bro.

Its a great thing to have an engine that keeps running rich, and isnt heating up too quickly. This is a great sign for you. As it shows that your new engine is sealed correctly (for the time being) and that everything checks out.

I would start leaning on the HSN a bit. Then you can start to hit the gears alot quicker and more consistently.

And just so you know, you should be doing about 200-210 temps at idle when that thing is fully broke in, and tuned correctly. Your exact engine may be a bit different, so check your manual for ideal operation temps.

Have fun.

If you lost life after 3 gallons then you did something wrong.
IMHO, if you're breaking in that engine and not getting over 200 degrees then, yes, you are doing harm.
I've been at this hobby over 40 years and have an os .10 engine that is litterally 20 years old and still runs strong.
It's not the engine that's at fault...

Well wonder what the ABL sleeve looks like? I have talked to some and seems some are having trouble with them and no wonder since they use nickel for the plating process. Wondering if OS feels that ABL is better why they do not use it on their high-end engines like the V Spec? Is it better or just cheaper? 99% of engine manufactures use ABC, which is a proven method. All so when breaking in an engine to get temperatures up wrap the head with aluminum foil and if need be a rag or something over the aluminum foil.

ABL should be good since it's not only nickel. It's a bimetallic liner called nicasil. The nicasil is used in high grade quality racing motocross engines. Nitro engine should hold ups fine with that.

Still have to wonder why they do not use it in their high-end engines as well as other manufactures using it. May be this is something we will see in the future? Only time will tell. Right now I stick with the ABC and let others test it.

Just worries me when they mention ABN as we know how durable it is. Of OS web site.
ABL
Advanced Bimetallic Liner. Specialized form of ABN. Instead of a single-step, single-material plating, the ABL Plating process is based on a layered approach made possible by two OS-developed hard-nickel alloys. The first alloy is used as the bottom (bonding) layer, to fuselage the top layer to the brass liner. The second alloy, developed for superior hardness, forms the top layer. Together, they create a barrier that protects the liner against excessive heat and wear.

Thanks for the input.

How much pinch is there when you take off the glow plug? If there is still noticable amounts it's not broken in. If there is hardly anything at all it will be broken in.

-Josh-

Run it till it quiets, as you never know many go for a long time. To late to worry about what has been done. Good Luck.

Im going to check the pinch and compression tomarrow- you know there is absolutly no mention of temp during break in in the instructionS given with the moter by O.S..

I hope I did not toast my motor-

the temp did get up to 180 however it took awhile-

I keep everyone posted after I check compression and pinch-

later-

im not saying my engine died.. im saying the o.s 30vg max has amazing torque for the 1st 3 gallon but it starts to wear of after that!.. still runs well, but not as well... if that makes sense??...

Most big block engines are just comming into their own at around a gallon. At three gallons it should be at it's peak. It should not be getting weaker at that point.
Proper break-in really is key to a long engine life and temps of 200 - 210 are key for a proper break-in.

you know this just occured to me- when I check temps- Im using this peice of junk durrarax temp gauge- I check temps at the top fin of heatsink because I dont have the temp gun that can fit on the glow plug-

maybe my heat sink reads 175 degrees but is more realistly like 200 degrees at the glow plug?

How true, how true.
[8D]

Does any one have a VG 30 or a VG21 with over 5 gallons on it running as well as it did with 3 gallons on it?

Yes, for sure this could make a difference.

I have always read my temp from the button head/plug. This way you have a pretty good idea of what the actual internal running temps are.
You need to have a good temp gun so you can get accurate readings. Once you get one, play around, and temp it all over the block, youll see where the differing temps are.
Also, its hard to come by two different temp guns that will give you the same reading, however most are very close within 2deg, which is close enough to make a judgment.

Dont be a victim of tuning by temp, becuase so many factors play out in overall temps. Its gets too frustrating. Get the manual for your engine and see what they recommend for "safe" temp ranges. and just stay within them.

The VG engines use ABN (the ABL process) for a particular reason: it is supposed to be cheaper (although I question that since nickel by itself on the market today has a high sale value).

I agree, ABC is the better production method as far as engine performance and longevity.

Another thing to consider is that the VG engines (.30VG and .21VG) are horribly very simple designs. They do not use the proven port configurations, timings, and race designs seen on a .21 V-spec speed tuned or even a .12TZ race tuned. The VG engines are meant to be a competitor against the cheaper Chinese engines (STS, SH & SH derivatives, etc.) with OS' reknown quality and ease of tuning. Also, since the VG engines use very very simple designs, they might be great at low end brute torque, but hey seriously suffer at RPM ranges at 30000+ RPM.

I got this e mail for O.S. today in responce to the same thing I posted on this fourm-
check it out-


Thank you for your recent e-mail.

It's not possible for us to give you an actual temperature or
temperature range for your engine. The specific temperature is
determined by too many factors. There is only one way to determine at
what temperature your engine should be run. You have to run it first
and then find out what temperature the engine reaches.

Make sure your engine is operating properly, with the performance you
expect. Use the exact setup every time...fuel, exhaust system, plug,
measurement location, and so forth. If you change anything, the
temperature will change. Once you have the engine running the way you
want it. Take your measurement. This is your starting point. You
will
have to take measurements over time to find out how the weather affects
it. As the air temperature and humidity change from day-to-day, the
operating temperature will change. Eventually, you'll find a
temperature range that you can use.

Engine temperature is not an absolute number for setting your engine.
It is only a guide, and can help alert you to potential problems. The
only sure way to make sure your engine is running correctly is to see
how it's running. An engine can be operating at "correct"
temperatures,
but not running well.

Finally, use any temperatures you read about, or people tell you, as
rough information. The only useful numbers are the ones you actually
measure when your engine is running correctly. If your engine is
running correctly, then what you measure is correct, even if some else
says it's too high or too low. Don't worry about the differences.
Each
engine is in a unique installation with a unique set of circumstances,
so there can be wide variances in engine temperature.

As far as the engine being set rich from the factory,this is need so
that the engine gets the lubrication.

I hope you find this information helpful. Should you have any further
questions or concerns, please do not hesitate to contact us at this
email address. (Please be sure to copy all previous emails into any
future questions.) You can also reach our product support technical
team at 217-398-8970, or via fax at 217-398-7721.

Yes I sent OS an email asking what material was used for the plating process on the VG and they told me all they new it was ABL! So I found out on their web site posted below. I all so one time email them asking what air filter would fit my TZ and they said the one that comes with it and it does not come with one! Glade to see you got someone that is a little more knowledgeable then the two I got. [sm=spinnyeyes.gif]

We all know ABN is not very durable! This is why I will not pay $200 to $250 for a VG 30 when there are much stronger, faster engines at about half the price!
OFF OS web site.
ABL
Advanced Bimetallic Liner. Specialized form of ABN. Instead of a single-step, single-material plating, the ABL Plating process is based on a layered approach made possible by two OS-developed hard-nickel alloys. The first alloy is used as the bottom (bonding) layer, to fuselage the top layer to the brass liner. The second alloy, developed for superior hardness, forms the top layer. Together, they create a barrier that protects the liner against excessive heat and wear.

When they say superior hardness of the second layer, I bet they mean superior only to nickel. I am wondering if this magical 2nd layer will surpass chrome and if it is as durable or more durable than chrome?

If it is better then ABC why don’t they run it in all there engines not just their low-end engines? Wonder why other engine manufactures are not using it? Might be very good but only time will tell but for now I will stick with the proven ABC.

Same here. I will take a $150 STS D30M (ABC sleeve) over the OS .30VG with its "magical" ABL sleeve (which is about $200!).

Though the STS engines are not as good as far as materials and production quality as OS engines, the STS D21 and D30M will respectively spank the ever living h3ll out of the OS .21VG and .30VG.
Too add insult to injury, the STS engines are considerably cheaper too!

If anyone wants to get an OS engine, get the better designed ones and stay away from any VG engine. You will get the OS reliability as well as much better performance than what the VGs will give you.