HELP

I am ready to maiden my first jet.

I have a P70 with kero start that I purchased used.
ECU 5.0
3300 6 cell NiMh pack

When I turn the system on I get a flashing red LED and and a bad glow plug indication on the GSU.
If I touch the kero start plug the bad glow plug indication will turn off and the start procedure will proceed but it will not start.
After each failed start attempt I have to dump fuel out of the turbine so I know it is getting fuel.
The start attempt will just run the starter at ~3,500 rpm till it times out.
I can hear the solenoid clicking and the pump running.

During the preheat, is the ECU constantly checking the Kero Start or does it just check it at power up?

I pulled the kero start off the engine to check it.
Can I just hook up 6V to test it?
I tried to check it with an ohm meter and am getting an intermittent 150 - 180 ohms.
If I wiggle the top connection I can get the intermittent resistance reading.

Is it possible that a good bump in shipping could have damaged it?
What is the realistic life span of a kero start in a P70?
Is it normal to see wear of the ceramic in use? The end of mine is unevenly rounded off looking like erosion type wear.

I am expecting that I have a bad Kero start.
Is it worth it to get a new kero start or just convert to gas start?

HELP, I am ready for my first jet flight except for this one "minor" detail of the engine not starting.

Hi Jeff,

Sounds like a damaged kero ignitor. Hard to say for sure what the failure mode was.

If you want to fly on gas, you can, if you have some 3mm and 4mm tubine you can replumb the system for gas.

To change the ECU back to gas:

• Switch off RC-receiver
• Connect the GSU to ECU
• Simultaneously press and hold the “Ignition� and “-“ buttons
• Switch on the RC receiver (keep the buttons pressed!)
• After a few seconds the display of the GSU shows: PROPANE Startup activated !!!
• Release all buttons, the ECU is now configured for Propane start-up

Call me and I can walk you through all of this. (805) 907-4462

Sorry for the frustration, it will all be forgotten when you get that bird in the air, trust me!

I don't know much about much...but Im pretty sure that an intermittent resistance is bad. Sounds like a new kero plug to me.

Mr Jetcat himself (Bob Wilcox) suggested that I skip the kero purchase on my new Titan and wait for a more durable plug coming out later. When someone is trying to convince me to NOT spend $$ in his store, I listen. I think he said the new style plug would be available this fall(?)

Is there any chance you can swap back over to gas start for now, just to get back into the air?

I will need to pick up all of the gas tank and associated stuff, and find a place to put it.
I haven't heard about a new and improved kero start plug.

Call Jetcat and ask about the kero start. they've always been helpful to me.

Flyinfool1,

Silly question, but you have set your ECU to kerostart?

Cheers,

Mick.

I'd be interested to hear how many starts people are getting on version 1 & 2 of the kero plug.

And what is the projected life of this new version 3 plug ?

At about £110 a pop, I'd like to know.

i am using them for over 5 months now
Perfect!

Spartan

I have around 80 starts on my P80 in the ARF Super Bandit everyone perfect, we have had a few igniters go bad after a range of start numbers-The Highest we replaced was after 93 starts in 3 months-All were replaced under warrantee so don't worry about the cost.
Overal we have sold over 100 and the percentage failure is quite low.
The Mk111 available now it's too early to say whether they are better...but I would guess so.

Dave w

Yes the ECU is set for Kero Start.
That was the first thing I checked when it said bad glow plug.

Is that the new Version 3 that you have been using for 5 months now?
How many starts and hours does 5 months equate to?
How many starts and minutes did you get on the V1 and/or V2 plugs?

Thanks Dave.

I guess the trick is to have the few bits necessary in your field box to revert to gas start, if the kero plugs fails at the field.
It would be a 5 minute job.

P-60
Version I, I got about 80 starts
Version II, about 12 starts
Version III, ??? don't know if I want to try again.
Plumb it both ways to make it easy to switch when the Kero Burner quits.

we used them the whole flying year on :

Merlin
P-60
P-160
P-120SE

i had a few older ones that indeed stopped working very soon...

OK, I talked to JetCat this morning and was told that an Ohm meter is not a reliable way to check a Kero Plug.
The only good way to check the plug is to remove it from the engine connect the red lead to the top of it and hold the kero plug case against the motor case.
Using the GSU go into test mode and and use the glow plug/kero plug test function to see if the plug glows bright red.

I was told that erosion of the ceramic is normal, "It is a nasty environment inside the combustion chamber".
They do have the new Kero Plugs in stock at $150 ea.
The old ones had a nichrome wire wound around the ceramic that would burn out. The new plugs do not have a wire to burn out and are being made by a different manufacturer than the old ones.
I was also told that after a no start the engine will be flooded and will not start till blown out.

I am hoping to have time to test my kero plug as instructed tonight so that I can get whatever is needed before the weekend.

Jetcat should replace the one you have with the new version - send it in to them and they will send you the new ones when the come in.

Is JC replacing them at no charge?

doubt it unless u r under warranty.........

Do you know when they are supposed to come in?

Thanx!

Bernard

I was told yesterday that they have just received 100 of the new kero starts. $150 each.

A friend of mine here in Cincinnati has 185 starts on his P-60 kero start engine, and he is still using it...I think it was maybe the second generation plug...Gary

My version 1 failed after about 20 starts in my P-60. That was replaced by Jetcat with version 2. That one went straight to the RCU classifieds and I hope it's still working for the new owner. $150.00 buys a heck of a lot of Powermax and glow plugs.

Marty

It is not the cost of the gas and glow plugs that I am concerned with.
I am after reliability and simplicity.
The kero start is definitely more simple than the gas start.
Not that the gas really complex it is just one extra step and one more piece of needed equipment to haul around, store and keep in stock.

Jeff,
My P-60 was my first turbine and the reasons you give were the exact reasons I decided to get the P-60 with the kero start. Turns out that reliability is questionable and unless you make sure to keep a spare $kero igniter$ in your tool box all the time, your day of flying could be ruined. It's a little easier on the pocket to keep a few glow plugs in the tool box. I don't know about the starting sequence for the bigger engines but the P-60 takes about seventy seconds to start on the Kero start and when I switched it over to gas it takes about fifteen and it also sucks a larger amount of current out of your ECU battery. The p-60 also spits out a fair amount of flames on startup with the kero start. Something to be aware of if you have an external under the fuse setup like I have on my Reaction. JMO.

Marty

Bob Wilcox sent me the very first JetCat V1 kero-plug in the USA. It has been running fine since February 2006 and it has over 50 starts on it in a PHT3. The kero-plug sure is a nice convenience and I just love the thing. It is interesting that some plugs had trouble and others have been flawless. Now especially that the technology has matured and the V2 plug is out I would certainly recommend to anyone that kero-start is the way to go.

nick