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New Guy with Boat Question

Old 01-26-2004, 01:34 AM
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OldCoot
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Default New Guy with Boat Question

I am new to both gas boating and this forum but have already learned much from the rest of you before joining by browsing the posts.
I have been in the R/C hobby for 30 years and fooling with 1/5 scale gas cars for many years but have just aquired my first boat.
I got a Gator hull (Super G) from a friend and installed a Superior HE23HP engine that I was about to try in one of my cars.
Not only am I impressed with the boat but also hooked. Strapped on the GPS and it tops out at 37.4mph.
My questions are:
For lack of a better term I am having trouble keeping the boat from "hooking" in a turn.
Is this a setup problem or just lack of driving skill ??

The boat has an Octura XP drive and I am using a prather 275 prop.
Had no idea that balancing and polishing was such a chore !!
The strut has two lead/teflon sleeves. The shaft seems a little loose in these. What is the normal life expectancy and I assume that due to their makup do not require any type of lubrication.
The shaft also has plastic thrust washers in which one seems to be worn down to about half the width of the other.
I did install a new drive cable / teflon sleeve / and stub shaft.
I am using a standard marine grade wheel bearing grease.

Am I on track ?? Any advise is greatly appreciated.
Old 01-26-2004, 02:27 AM
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Doubledog
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Default RE: New Guy with Boat Question

The boat is hooking because:
A- you're turning too hard at speed
B- you've got your throws set too much

at least thats what I've personally experienced.

I've been told that the dual rudder system will help solve that problem. I've got mine set to where it takes about 30ft to turn a full circle. A little large, but when its booking along, I can turn almost full and it doesn't hook out.

---------------------------------------

Teflon bearings. Buy some more. If its sloppy, its toast. Rather spend a buck and save yoursel in the long run. Tap them out and tap them in.

----------------------------------------

Plastic thrust washers. When in doubt, replace them. They're cheap.

Place 3 or 4 on there and put snug up to the drive dog. Leave about a 3/16" space between the back of the washer and the strut.... When the torque of the prop & engine against each other, the shaft winds tighter so put a drop of light motor oil or WD40 between each of the washers.

Oh, & let us know how it goes.
Old 01-26-2004, 03:34 AM
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ibuildstuff
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Default RE: New Guy with Boat Question

Hooking could becaused by the boat leaning too far, and matching the deadrise and its "spinning out" try a turn fin, they are easliy made and easier to install. The double rudder is ok, but theres some speed that can be lost by using it. Do ya have any pics of your setup? Id like to see em


Jesse
Old 01-26-2004, 10:10 AM
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TERBObob
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Default RE: New Guy with Boat Question

Morning OLD COOT ,
Like PHCM said ...
First , is your rudder able to make turns over 12 degrees ? If so , then re-do your servo throws ( really don;t want any more than that , BUT ... up to 18 would be ok )
If your prop is balanced out good ... your liners and bushings should last at LEAST a season or two pending on how much use they get .
Again , like PHCM said , replace .... the stubshaft should have ZERO play . ( if your prop is not balanced , THIS would be a sure fire way to wear your liners/bushings )
You said that the prop was "real" fun sharpening and balancing ... ( hope it was a berillium copper one and not a stainless one ... those stainless ones a TRUE "time consumer" to sharpen verses the BC ones ... )
And I would try just adjusting the servo throw for the grabbing in the turns . In the previous thread , it states that a dual rudder will cause you loss of speed , this is true , but is ALSO true for a turn fin . ANYTIME you place an added item on the boat that will be in the water , will cause drag ... ( of course , somethings more than other )

And as far as being "ON TRACK" ???? Well , as long as you have FUN , and some more fun , and then add a touch bit MORE of fun ... then - YEP .. your on the RIGHT TRACK !
Remember ... SAFETY , and FUN is what its all about !
If you could show us some pics , I know we would really enjoy viewing them , as well ,as being able to better assist you . [8D]
Oh ... and watch those fingers when sharpening those props ... they kind of tend to make mincemeat of your fingers for some reason ...
Old 01-26-2004, 12:04 PM
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OldCoot
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Default RE: New Guy with Boat Question

Here are some pics.
Thanks for your input and I believe that my problem is too much travel on the rudder.
Has anyone else used the HE23 engine. So far I am very pleased. It performs as well as any of my G230s and I bought the engine (less carb) for $118.00
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Old 01-26-2004, 12:42 PM
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TERBObob
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Default RE: New Guy with Boat Question

VERY nice looking install there ....
There is ONE thing that I ould suggest ... you don;t have any space in between the drive dog and the thrust washers where they meet the strut ... This might cause your cable to twist and break and make a BIG mess inside near your clutch .
Put about 1/4 or so , space there which will allow for the flex cable to tighten as it gets under pressure from the engine ....
Otherwise ... glad you got her figured out and hey ... always remember ...

HAVE FUN !
Old 01-26-2004, 05:53 PM
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nitropower
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Default RE: New Guy with Boat Question

Nice looking job Old Coot, I raised the rudder height on my cat 1/4" to reduce rudder surface in the water. may not work for you but does help get the lower pivot block up out of the way of prop. Turn fins work well also but will slow you down a bit Maybe .5mph. I put 2 on a 46" hull and it turns L&R equally well


Do you have a square drive on the clutch? If so you definitely need washers between strut and dog, if its a collet leave 3/16" to 1/4" between washers and strut. Grease everything!! its easier to wipe off grease than replace parts

Don't know much about the superior engine, but for 118$ you cant beat it. Get a tuned pipe for it and do some mods on the cyl, it'll really be fun then!!!

Nitropower
Old 01-26-2004, 07:04 PM
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OldCoot
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Default RE: New Guy with Boat Question

I appreciate everyone's help and kind remarks.
I guess I need to learn NOT to apply what I know about cars to boats. I had my rudder set up for 35 degrees of rotation each side of center. My clutch is square drive so I will verify thrust washers and clearances.

I pull the drive cable for cleaning and lube after each day's run.

By the way - How much grease should be pumped into the zerk fitting on the nose piece ???



Again: Thanks to all for the advise !!!
Old 01-26-2004, 07:12 PM
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TERBObob
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Default RE: New Guy with Boat Question

Till it oozes out and gives you a clump of mess
Although it may have sounded sarcastic ... it honestly wasn't ..
You want to make sure that there is PLENTY of grease ...
Just make sure you carry along a rag and a bottle of that purple grease cleaner ( can't remember the name of it - sorry )
Old 01-26-2004, 07:36 PM
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ibuildstuff
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Default RE: New Guy with Boat Question

If ya runnin a square drive, ya setup is pretty much perfect except for a bit of angle on things.. other than that it looks great.
Old 01-27-2004, 01:41 AM
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OldCoot
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Default RE: New Guy with Boat Question

TERBObob,
Till it oozes out the end of the log, right ??

ibuildstuff,
Which angle ?
The strut and trim tabs are set at 0 (perpendicular to the transom) using a square in reference to the transom.
It is square drive on the clutch end.

Thanks
Old 01-27-2004, 02:08 AM
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Default RE: New Guy with Boat Question

Yep .. till she oozes right on out there .
And if your set at 0 ... and the rides attitude is good ... then leave it be .
And although it is a square drive . you should STILL leave the spacing between the strut and drive dog .... that way , it will STILL have a little room for tightening in more than just up by the square drive . ( just a little ... no more than max of around 3/16 inch - 1/8 inch )
Old 01-27-2004, 03:25 AM
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ibuildstuff
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Default RE: New Guy with Boat Question

use the zero of everything as a starting point, give it some positive and some negative, see what gets your speed up, play with it, trial and error.
Old 01-27-2004, 07:05 AM
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bill heacock
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Default RE: New Guy with Boat Question

Superior engines are made in China, exact coppies of the Zenoah, in fact you can interchange parts!
Do you know a web site that is selling them. If you do please send me the link, I'd appreciate it.

[email protected]
Old 01-27-2004, 08:18 AM
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nitropower
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Default RE: New Guy with Boat Question

Bill try Scorchinscooters.com they have these engines. Cant find anyplace that has water cooling for them yet. Hope this helps. Nitropower
Old 01-27-2004, 10:39 AM
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bill heacock
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Default RE: New Guy with Boat Question

Thanks, yoiu can find the water jackets for the Zenoahs at aeromarinerc.com bhhanson.com rocketcityracing.com all the parts interchange on both motors.
Old 01-27-2004, 02:12 PM
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OldCoot
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Default RE: New Guy with Boat Question

Cheapest place I have found for Zenoah and Superior parts is:

www.davesmotors.com

They are GoPed folks so I use them for engines, parts, and accessories only.
The exhaust can on my boat (as seen in the pic above) is made for a GoPed.
The ony mod was to put a pressure tap on the bottom to drain excess oil since it normally mounts on the GoPed with the pipes in a downward position.

They don't have any R/C stuff.
Old 01-27-2004, 04:41 PM
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ibuildstuff
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Default RE: New Guy with Boat Question

www.hookupzracing.com has superior engines for 120 bux..

and is a good guy to deal with!
Old 02-02-2004, 12:37 PM
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pompebled
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Default RE: New Guy with Boat Question

Hi, old coot,

As I'm new here I stumble through all threads which interest me, as I'm building my first gaspowered boat, after years of electrics.

That's a very nice looking boat you have there!

If reducing the throw on the servo does not solve the hooking, you may consider putting the rudder further behind the prop.
The way it's fitted the boat will react very abrupt to rudder movement, the greater distance will mellow this.

Greatings, Jan.

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