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is this for real? What's the catch?

Old 12-06-2010, 07:06 PM
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Default is this for real? What's the catch?

6 channel heli capable 2.4ghz radio for $23?https://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/...idproduct=9042
What's the catch?If a spektrum 6xi is $169 there has to be some major shortcoming with the lesser radio

And if an HK450GT is under $50 where a 'real' align 450 is $400 (w/ motor, servos, gyro, esc) how much is really saved by buying the bits over the 'kit'?

My experience has been when things are this much cheaper than the 'real' thing there's a catch someplace....

Old 12-07-2010, 05:41 AM
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Default RE: is this for real? What's the catch?

There is no catch..

You are paying for cheaper produced items.. in most cases they work fine..

As for the helicopters.. I have 4 of the hobbyking helis and they are all fantastic...

Here is my 450 GT in action.. 

Realistically. once you add motor, esc, servos, receiver and gyro you will have outlayed around $200.

Still much less than the Align and let my videos speak for themselves as to the quality..

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0DRv4Wz-T4Q[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tNrafMSx_AU[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9X0rYnHEDY[/youtube]

And here is a $10 kit.. now out of stock on Hobbyking.. but it flies great!

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfBQvRmxVmc[/youtube]

and there is a lot of work to build one..

this shows you 9 hours work in 7 minues..

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lU4w7IT-1do[/youtube]

I use Futaba and Spektrum radios, but the helicopter clones are just fine..
Old 12-07-2010, 06:02 AM
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Thanks for the videos and reply! It was especially great to see them flying in the wind - I live where it's windy almost all the time and coax's (i have several including a big lama) just get blown around like a helium balloon in the wind.

OK, you've pretty much sold me -my flying skills aren't there yet but over the winter I will have time to build it - 9 hours or whatever it takes.

What about spares? I've, um, bashed my coax's a few times and just rotor blades so I suspect they're not gonna be an issue to get, but what's good to have on hand?

Of all the 450 kits they sell what's the best one - i read some of the reviews and screws came up over and over and there's the torque tube model and I assume the older is a belt drive model?

Then of course I have to work on the list of motor/esc/servo/gyro that are good, not just good enough - being a newbie to CP I don't want to fight with sub-par parts -my skills won't be able to overcome the shortcomings (hence the thought of a cheap radio scaring me a bit).

so they show all these choices...
450 gt pro belt $68 https://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/...dProduct=14508
450 ccpm v2 $28 - what's missing?I mean, it's $40 less....what's the deal there? https://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/...dProduct=10811
450TT pro torque tube $70 https://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/...dProduct=14894

And since ihear bigger is better (easier to fly, etc) would a 500 heli be better?How much more costly for the servos or motor or esc and such on the bigger one? Or is crashing going to be that much more expensive or do I need like 10 acres to fly it about?
hk 500gt pro for $70 https://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/...dProduct=14507
Old 12-07-2010, 06:40 AM
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Default RE: is this for real? What's the catch?

[color=#000099]Dispite the reply, & the video of it flying well the "catch" is, usually they don't go together well. See some of Daddysam's posts on his HK 500 issues & some of the other posts on the HK 600. Parts often don't fit together right. Modifications have to be done by the builder and being new to the hobby if it doesn't fly right you'll never know if it's you or the kit. These are alright for experienced guys who like to tinker. If I were you I'd stick with a repitable manufacturer and hobby shop. One local if possible for support & find a club to help you out. nothing like seeing it in person when someone's shows you something is not right. If Money is a issue I'd look on RunRyder or HeliFreak for used stuff can be found very resonable like a align 500 esp BNF for about $600 plus shipping. Just get a Dx6i for about $150. & viola you got a good setup.
If you want to wait til after Charistmas some time I'll be selling my Trex 450 V1/V2 Scorpian motor, Stealth CF blades, fusuno Sunset canopy with some spares, venom charger & 2 batteries for $400.00 in BNF set up. Flys great and cheap to repair. Just my two cents &
Good Luck

Oh and if you are interested in my 450 I can send pics and a complete list of what's on it. I going to go larger I have a Trex 500 now & I want a Trex 550 Flybarless that's the only reason I'd sell the little bird, money issue. Sell one to fund another LOL[/color]
Old 12-07-2010, 08:34 AM
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Default RE: is this for real? What's the catch?

Well, used is an option but you don't know what you're getting. I bought a used, very much upgraded lama v4 coax. I saw it run and everything worked but there was no way to fly it. Once I got it home and indoors it had really bad TBE. I corrected that and now it has a bad vibration. I've yet to take it all down and check each part/shaft but when running it up in place nothing (shaft/head) wise appears bent. I just got new blades for it over the weekend (fun of esky stuff is it's not an LHS supported brand) so we'll see if makes a difference (not that the old blades are out of balance, but they are some form of unbreakable blade so I'm gonna try stock ones and see what's what).

I looked at a used blade 400 but the seller wanted as much as a new one - I did see this one fly and was tempted - it was obviously all setup and dialed in.  Talking with folks that fly tell me the trex450 is an easier to fly bird than the blade 400 but of course the cost will be more ($200 roughly from what I can figure - radio, batts, charger needed on a 450 super sport combo) plus assembly.   I don't have a clue on which is cheaper to repair if  (ok, when) it kisses momma earth. the trex450 guy says he had a bad smack when learing 3D and it only cost him $80 -his most expensive repair. That's not too terrible (if it doesn't happen often )

I've head lots of good things about the knockoffs but it's the 'gotcha' I need to be aware of. As long as I'm 'an informed consumer' I'm willing to buy - I just don't like the surprises later.
Old 12-07-2010, 10:09 AM
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Default RE: is this for real? What's the catch?

I here the whole cost thing my 500 tried to commit suicide last week jumped from 100+ up. about 200 in damages. ( broken link from servo to swash [] ) Try to find a club near you. Most guys buy new stuff all the time & are willing to sell there's reasonable. You'll see it fly & know what your getting. Don't blame you for being cautious. I bought a gyro a few months ago & it nearlly killed me to buy it used. but price was right & when I got it it was fine from helifrreak so I'd do it again.
Good luck
Old 12-07-2010, 05:39 PM
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Default RE: is this for real? What's the catch?


ORIGINAL: proffate61


What about spares? I've, um, bashed my coax's a few times and just rotor blades so I suspect they're not gonna be an issue to get, but what's good to have on hand?

Of all the 450 kits they sell what's the best one - i read some of the reviews and screws came up over and over and there's the torque tube model and I assume the older is a belt drive model?

so they show all these choices...
450 gt pro belt $68 https://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/...dProduct=14508
450 ccpm v2 $28 - what's missing?I mean, it's $40 less....what's the deal there? https://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/...dProduct=10811
450TT pro torque tube $70 https://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/...dProduct=14894

And since ihear bigger is better (easier to fly, etc) would a 500 heli be better?How much more costly for the servos or motor or esc and such on the bigger one? Or is crashing going to be that much more expensive or do I need like 10 acres to fly it about?
hk 500gt pro for $70 https://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/...dProduct=14507
Ok Spares - .. Hobbyking carry all spares for their helis.. but a better way is just buy 2 or 3 kits.. then you have a complete set of spares for under $50

I had a Blade 400 and it had one minor crash.. 3 spares cost me over $60 to rebuild it.. so the clones are far cheaper to repair also

I would stick to the 450 size helis for now.. they are big enough to be great for training and are much more bang for buck.. IE the 500 is going to cost you a lot more to get flying..

Here is a link to a post that got me started on the clones.. it tells you everything you need to know..

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9990427

Start off with a V2.. it s nice and light and great for learning.. the only difference is it has a few more plastic components in the rotor head and tail assembly but in flight there is no difference..

I have the Pro, the GT and a V2 and a V1 and they all fly the same..

You can go for an all metal head later when you get serious about hard 3D flying but plastic is fine and mine have hundreds of flights with no problems at all.

Parts..

All from Hobbyking

Motor Turnigy Typhoon 2215 - an awesome motor http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...idProduct=9021

12 or 11 tooth pinion

ESC 40 amp Hobbywing Pentiium ( a great esc.. don't be tempted to use a 30 amp.. it will let you down)

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...idProduct=2165 (the turnigy Plush is the same as a hobbywing)

Gyro - Hobbyking 401. - http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...dProduct=10113

This gyro is great

Servos - Hobbyking 939Mg (they drop straight in http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...dProduct=14458

Tail servo Turnigh DS 480 - http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...idProduct=8511

That will be around $150 for the heli and parts.. radio is seperate..

Radio and RX.. you choice. but personally I don't go cheap here.. I have futaba FASST and it never fails me..

Hpe that helps



Old 12-07-2010, 05:45 PM
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Default RE: is this for real? What's the catch?


ORIGINAL: proffate61

Well, used is an option but you don't know what you're getting. I bought a used, very much upgraded lama v4 coax. I saw it run and everything worked but there was no way to fly it. Once I got it home and indoors it had really bad TBE. I corrected that and now it has a bad vibration. I've yet to take it all down and check each part/shaft but when running it up in place nothing (shaft/head) wise appears bent. I just got new blades for it over the weekend (fun of esky stuff is it's not an LHS supported brand) so we'll see if makes a difference (not that the old blades are out of balance, but they are some form of unbreakable blade so I'm gonna try stock ones and see what's what).

I looked at a used blade 400 but the seller wanted as much as a new one - I did see this one fly and was tempted - it was obviously all setup and dialed in. Talking with folks that fly tell me the trex450 is an easier to fly bird than the blade 400 but of course the cost will be more ($200 roughly from what I can figure - radio, batts, charger needed on a 450 super sport combo) plus assembly. I don't have a clue on which is cheaper to repair if (ok, when) it kisses momma earth. the trex450 guy says he had a bad smack when learing 3D and it only cost him $80 -his most expensive repair. That's not too terrible (if it doesn't happen often )

I've head lots of good things about the knockoffs but it's the 'gotcha' I need to be aware of. As long as I'm 'an informed consumer' I'm willing to buy - I just don't like the surprises later.
Stay away from the Blade 400.. the components are thinner and lighter than the cheapest V2 hobbyking helicopter ( have both and have compared them side by side)

Even the V2 Plastic head on the clone is more substantial than the one on the Blade 400.

Yes the TREX clones do fly better.. I have flown both.

and finally.. you put YOUR own choice of components in the clones.. all the above I had listed are good quality and should be extremely reliable..

My Blade 400 was a disaster.. it crashed twice due to a faulty elevator servo..

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BgoztDiEZ7k[/youtube]

and finally the best thing to do is follow the youtbube videos by MikeysRC.. they take you through every step in building one and will help you avoid the "gotchas"

Here is the first one.. they link in sequence

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4zJREpU7u0
Old 12-07-2010, 05:49 PM
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Default RE: is this for real? What's the catch?

Hers my opinion. I get shafted more times than not buying used pictures look good but when you recieve them more times than not you lose. I have had the HK450, HK500 and now the HK600 all have HK servos ,speed controls and motors. Only had one bad ESC the rest have been great. I only use Futaba radio systems and gyros I don't trust any others and don't want to take a chance. The difference between flying the 450 and 500 is night and day and as far as things fitting right I have had the best success with the 500. I have had several of each due to me and my dumb thumbs crashing them. The 600 is better than the 500 but not a lot better like it is between the 450 and 500. I like them and will stick with them I don't fly 3D I fly sport or scale and they can be well behaved for that. Parts do come in and out of stock so sometimes you have to be patient there and shipping from China the stuff is in better shape than shipping at home sometimes. I have never had any real issues with them and recommend them to people I know. One thing is when you get one go over it with a fine tooth comb because they can forget to tighten things.
Old 12-08-2010, 02:18 AM
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ORIGINAL: augerin2
]Dispite the reply, & the video of it flying well the "catch" is, usually they don't go together well. See some of Daddysam's posts on his HK 500 issues & some of the other posts on the HK 600. Parts often don't fit together right. Modifications have to be done by the builder and being new to the hobby if it doesn't fly right you'll never know if it's you or the kit.
Some may have had this experience but my EXI 450 kit and all my hobbyking heli kits have been very easy to assemble and everything fitted nicely... Just my own personal experience..
Old 12-23-2010, 06:54 AM
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Default RE: is this for real? What's the catch?

Well, I have a pile of parts in my basket - I may give the HK radio a go - it's just to cheap to believe but fro what I can find it seems to work.  Total parts needed (less heli kit itself) is $93-120 range depending on servo choices - the better ones are on backorder so I"ll probably hold off till they come in and 'splurge' so to speak.

I just can't believe how cheap it all is. Unreal.
Old 12-23-2010, 08:52 AM
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ORIGINAL: proffate61

Well, I have a pile of parts in my basket - I may give the HK radio a go - it's just to cheap to believe but fro what I can find it seems to work. Total parts needed (less heli kit itself) is $93-120 range depending on servo choices - the better ones are on backorder so I"ll probably hold off till they come in and 'splurge' so to speak.

I just can't believe how cheap it all is. Unreal.
Yes, it is fantastic..

I can strongly recommend the Hobbyking E500 motor also..

I have it in my1 week old 450 GTbuild (5th TREX clone)

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=76Aemqguvks[/youtube]

I completed a 6th today.. they are so damn cheap and I enjoy building them now as much as flying...

Good luck with your build.. you can find the manuals here http://www.align.com.tw/html/en/rcwo...ters_en_1.html




Old 12-31-2010, 10:11 PM
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ORIGINAL: proffate61

6 channel heli capable 2.4ghz radio for $23?https://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/...idproduct=9042
What's the catch?If a spektrum 6xi is $169 there has to be some major shortcoming with the lesser radio

And if an HK450GT is under $50 where a 'real' align 450 is $400 (w/ motor, servos, gyro, esc) how much is really saved by buying the bits over the 'kit'?

My experience has been when things are this much cheaper than the 'real' thing there's a catch someplace....

<span lang="EN">

The HK</p>

(quote)</p>

This transmitter requires a PC to modify any of the channel variables including mixing and servo reversing.</p><font size="2">

The DX6i can make programming changes on its own screen at the field</p></font></span>
Old 01-01-2011, 06:40 AM
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ORIGINAL: Joe K



<span lang="EN">

The HK</p>

(quote)</p>

This transmitter requires a PC to modify any of the channel variables including mixing and servo reversing.</p><font size="2">

The DX6i can make programming changes on its own screen at the field</p></font></span>
If that's the only difference i'll save myself $150 then.

BTW, got the HK450GT kit in the other day - i'm impressed for $45. I plan to spend some time this weekend working on assembly and then I'll have a better idea of the quality of it and the screws (which I've read about being soft). I"m surprised that the main frame is already assembled. I plan to go over every screw and loctite where needed.

Ia week or so I hope to be ready to order the electronics - still researching what others have used and then i'll likely post a thread trying to identify the best bits.

Old 01-01-2011, 07:08 AM
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ORIGINAL: proffate61

If that's the only difference i'll save myself $150 then.

BTW, got the HK450GT kit in the other day - i'm impressed for $45. I plan to spend some time this weekend working on assembly and then I'll have a better idea of the quality of it and the screws (which I've read about being soft). I"m surprised that the main frame is already assembled. I plan to go over every screw and loctite where needed.

Ia week or so I hope to be ready to order the electronics - still researching what others have used and then i'll likely post a thread trying to identify the best bits.

The screws are not soft.. if you use good quality hex drivers then you won't have a problem

I used a couple of cheaper hex drivers and allen keys in my first build and some of the hex screws stripped the head but with good quality hex drivers they work fine.

Either Hudy drivers http://www.hudy.net/xhudy/products/p...;kategoria=538

or these HK drivers are excellent also.. http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...dProduct=11048

Old 01-01-2011, 11:02 AM
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ORIGINAL: proffate61


ORIGINAL: Joe K



<span lang="EN">

The HK</p>

(quote)</p>

This transmitter requires a PC to modify any of the channel variables including mixing and servo reversing.</p><font size="2">

The DX6i can make programming changes on its own screen at the field</p></font></span>
If that's the only difference i'll save myself $150 then.

BTW, got the HK450GT kit in the other day - i'm impressed for $45. I plan to spend some time this weekend working on assembly and then I'll have a better idea of the quality of it and the screws (which I've read about being soft). I"m surprised that the main frame is already assembled. I plan to go over every screw and loctite where needed.

Ia week or so I hope to be ready to order the electronics - still researching what others have used and then i'll likely post a thread trying to identify the best bits.


<span lang="EN">

I like the Towerpro 40A ESC same programming as hobby wing ESC</p>

The SG90 Servos work good f or scale flying but the gears strip in a crash. Replacements gears are under a $1 but metal gears are less work. </p></span>
Old 01-01-2011, 11:45 AM
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the parts that seem to come up often as good (for non-3D flying anyway)

towerpro MG90 ($7 or so) Some say a better servo the rudder helps..my list that I'm compiling says am md922 12g servo works best (any thoughts?) I'd imagine a better servo would center better and that would be most beneficial.

gyro- lots of different ones turn up here - GY401by futaba being the gold standard but the HK401 for what, $12 seems to get good reviews.

radio..perhaps the turnigy 9X at $54 - seems to be programmable w/o a PC http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbyking/s...idProduct=8992 and get great reviews.

motor - turnigy 22i5h

batt and charger...and good to go, right?OK, some spare blades and I"m 99% sure a co-pilot thing like http://www.cnchelicopter.com/servlet...-3D-KDS/Detail or http://www.helihobby.com/html/co_pilot_fs8cp.html.

Some feel it's cheating but then RC helis were once flown w/o gyro's but who'd fly that way today?
Old 01-02-2011, 06:41 AM
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ORIGINAL: proffate61

the parts that seem to come up often as good (for non-3D flying anyway)

towerpro MG90 ($7 or so) Some say a better servo the rudder helps..my list that I'm compiling says am md922 12g servo works best (any thoughts?) I'd imagine a better servo would center better and that would be most beneficial.

gyro- lots of different ones turn up here - GY401by futaba being the gold standard but the HK401 for what, $12 seems to get good reviews.

radio..perhaps the turnigy 9X at $54 - seems to be programmable w/o a PC http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbyking/s...idProduct=8992 and get great reviews.

motor - turnigy 22i5h

batt and charger...and good to go, right?OK, some spare blades and I"m 99% sure a co-pilot thing like http://www.cnchelicopter.com/servlet...-3D-KDS/Detail or http://www.helihobby.com/html/co_pilot_fs8cp.html.

Some feel it's cheating but then RC helis were once flown w/o gyro's but who'd fly that way today?
The HK401 Gyro is great.. I have them on four of my helis with hundreds of combined flights.. make sure you do the fix..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6TPSZtg5ZfY

The 922 servo is ok on the tail but a Turnigy DS480 is much better.. I flew my HK 450 for a few flights with a 922 until my proper tail servo arrived.. it was ok but used to over shoot on piro stops.. as per this video at 0:38 .. (this is with the 922 as a tail servo)

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=76Aemqguvks[/youtube]

I have since replaced it with the Ino Lab 261 HB servo and it is MUCHbetter.. the tail is now rock solid..

See the piros from onboard camera at 0:58

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEnygAzIMzU[/youtube]

Old 01-02-2011, 09:35 AM
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Thanks for the videos - helps a lot in understanding things a bit better (the old picture is worth 1000 words bit and then some).

So the MG90 are OK for the rotor control servos then? the rest of the list looks good?

Regarding assembly - build the bird then add electronics or is it better to have the electronics on hand and install them during the build (to avoid taking things apart again to fit in the motor, etc). I don't mind doing anything once, I just hate doing things over and over again.


Any suggestions on spares?Since it takes a few weeks to get an order, extra blades of would of course be handy, anything else? Frame or servo bits or ?

The plan is to do one of two things - (i've been through some of the training vids online, fly coax and have a simulator) - either do chest high hover over grass or ground 'skating' on pavement (on grass the training gear will catch tipping over the heli). Iknow there will be major ground effect issues so i'm leaning toward chest high over grass - what's best for training gear (carbon fiber rods or wood dowels or ?)

Old 01-02-2011, 11:54 AM
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ORIGINAL: proffate61


Any suggestions on spares?Since it takes a few weeks to get an order, extra blades of would of course be handy, anything else? Frame or servo bits or ?
<span lang="EN">

Most crashes</p>

Blades
Main shafts
Feathering shafts
Main gear</p>

These every so often
Tail boom
Landing gear</p>

</p></span>
Old 01-03-2011, 08:24 PM
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Default RE: is this for real? What's the catch?

The catch is if you get a DOA one, (like I did), the shipping to return it is more than the original cost.
Old 01-08-2011, 04:26 AM
  #22  
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Default RE: is this for real? What's the catch?

<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt"><span style="LINE-HEIGHT: 105%; mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt"><font size="3"><font face="Cambria">That is true; I was just telling a friend the same thing. It would be better to at least deal with a US supplier when it comes to radios.

</p></font></font></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt"><span style="LINE-HEIGHT: 105%; mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt"><font size="3"><font face="Cambria">I would recommend getting a DX6i from US supplier, Check E-bay or forums for used or new auctions

</p></font></font></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt"><span style="LINE-HEIGHT: 105%; mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt"><span style="mso-spacerun: yes"><font face="Cambria" size="3"> </font></span>

</p></span></p>
Old 01-11-2011, 06:18 AM
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Default RE: is this for real? What's the catch?



<span style="font-size: larger"><span style="font-family: Arial">I have the cheap 6 channel radio and have never had any issues with it. Thecatch is that you have to plug it into a computer to program it. For me this isn't a big deal,I do most of my programming at home and carry a laptop to the field if I'm not certain of my setup. The radio only holds one model setup in memory at a time but you can save as many as you want on the computer and upload whichever you want.

If you are concerned about ordering from china, HobbyPartz.com carries the same radio.</span></span></p>
Old 01-14-2011, 05:33 PM
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Default RE: is this for real? What's the catch?

I taught myself to fly helis first with the Twister 3D and then with the basic HK450 kit that was only $30. I spent a little extra on a nicer canopy and some carbon blades ($10 from HK). For the money you just can't go wrong as a beginners machine if electric is your thing. The video was shot last summer and I was still getting to grips with moving the heli around the garden and gaining confidence. I now fly the machine at my club field and am happy with close circuits, figure 8s etc.
I don't think I'd got into helis if it hadn't been for the low prices from Hobby King - ten years ago you were looking at £300 - £400 for a similar setup at UK modelshop prices.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZFC3RSkCKY

Kevin.

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