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Newbie just got Raptor 50

Old 07-04-2007, 02:46 AM
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Dr.ArmoMaxx
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Default Newbie just got Raptor 50

Its used, but its in great condition, it has os 50 sx engine.

Never flow a plane or heli before, i am gonna need transmitter, receiver, gyro, 6 servos, Right??



I am thinking to get either Spectrum DX7 or Futaba 7C...4 servos come with either one of them, are they good servos?

I am leaning toward the futaba, because i always used futaba on cars and never had problem.

http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXSBX1&P=0


For the Gyro i would love to get gy401, $220 and comes with a servo.


So I still need 1 more servo, and i am guessing its for the throttle, which servo should i get?





As you can tell i am clueless, so please any help would be greatly appreciated. I want to make sure that i got every thing right, so i can place an order.
And don't worry i won't be flying anytime soon, i just ordered RealFlight G3, and i just got a small eflite electric heli.

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Old 07-04-2007, 07:19 AM
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50

The gyro combo comes with a servo so you need 4 more (btw its 182 at ricks http://www.ronlund.com)

Honestly they are both good radios but both come with servos I wouldn't use on a 50. They will get you through hovering but I wouldnt trust them flying around (the 821's have a warning from JR not to use them in anything larger than a 30 size heli)

Servo city sells transmitter/reciever only packages, you might check into that and get some decent servos. Hitec 5625's are ok, 9252s are better so you might get 3 of those and a hitec for the throttle, depends on how much money you want to spend. I can tell you its better to spend a bit more up front and get what you need then to go cheap and have to buy again.

That and find someone in your area to go over your setup and test fly it for you.
Old 07-04-2007, 02:55 PM
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50


ORIGINAL: BarracudaHockey

The gyro combo comes with a servo so you need 4 more (btw its 182 at ricks http://www.ronlund.com)

Honestly they are both good radios but both come with servos I wouldn't use on a 50. They will get you through hovering but I wouldnt trust them flying around (the 821's have a warning from JR not to use them in anything larger than a 30 size heli)

Servo city sells transmitter/reciever only packages, you might check into that and get some decent servos. Hitec 5625's are ok, 9252s are better so you might get 3 of those and a hitec for the throttle, depends on how much money you want to spend. I can tell you its better to spend a bit more up front and get what you need then to go cheap and have to buy again.

That and find someone in your area to go over your setup and test fly it for you.
"I can tell you its better to spend a bit more up front and get what you need then to go cheap and have to buy again."

Thats is exactly what i want to do. And for some reason I really want to get Futaba radio.

So total i need 5 servos? For the 9252, it says 4.8 volts only.
I am thinking to get S9350 servos.

Is it really worth the extra money for GY611? Lets say later i decide to upgrade to 90 size heli? or will it make it easier to fly?
Also, what does the governor do? Do i need one?


I know someone who fly's RC helicopters for a living. With camera mounted on it, he shoots movies and stuff. I am gonna get in contact with him, talk to him and see what he says.
Old 07-04-2007, 03:03 PM
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50

What voltage are you planning on running? They are good up to 6v regulated and what near about everyone flys on 50s.

You dont need a 6v setup in any case. If you are getting a Lithium Ion like a duralite or fromeco setup run 5.1v or 5.3v and you will be just fine.

You have a long way to go before you can tell the difference in flight between a 401 and a 611. The 611 is definately a better gyro but at 320 is it 138 bucks better? My 401 will hold fine in tail slides and rolling tail slides, the 601/611 really shine in consistent piro rates no matter what you are doing, the 401 will slow down against the wind and speed up with the wind, its not a big deal unless you are throwing alot of piros into other manuvers such as funnels.

Also the AP guy has a different mind set than the 3d guys so keep that in mind when getting advice from him.

A governor uses a hall effect sensor to monitor engine rpm (which is directly related to head speed), it sits between the throttle servo and the reciever, if the rpm drops it adds a bit of throttle for you, if it over speeds it backs off the throttle. They can be set up without one, people have been doing it for years, but when you start doing aerobatics and are loading and unloading the head alot there's no substitute for a good governor and a fast throttle servo. My reccomended governors are the Revlock RL 20 and the Aerospire Multigov.

Old 07-04-2007, 03:14 PM
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Dr.ArmoMaxx
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50

I guess i will stick with 401, and the price difference is a lot.

See i don't know at what voltage heli's run at.

You think s9350 would be good?

By the way, thanks for all the help.
Old 07-04-2007, 06:03 PM
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50

Here are some more pics.
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So far I am looking at

Futaba 7C 7-Channel 2.4GHz
Futaba S9350 digital servos x4
Futaba GY401 Gyro w/S9254
Duralite 4300mah Li-Ion 7.4v 4c Redundant Pack
Duralite 65053-HD Regulator w/HD Switch. 5.3v
Duralite Li-ion Charger, 7.4v Sng Out
Heli-Max Heli Super Start
Heli-Max One-Way Starter Shaft 6mm
DuraTrax Starter Box Power Pak
Hobbico Voltwatch2 4.8V/6V
Power Glo-Starter Long w/Meter

Easily $1200-1400, anything else I need? [>:]



Old 07-04-2007, 11:05 PM
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50

And can anybody tell me if this is v1 or v2?
Old 07-05-2007, 10:32 AM
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50

v2

Dont get that geared starter, its got plenty of torque but its not fast enough so it sounds like an impact wrench. It wll tear up your starter shaft, start shaft adapter and the one way bearing in the raptor clutch.

Just get a regular high torque starter and a 6mm hex drive start shaft.
Old 07-06-2007, 02:27 AM
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50


ORIGINAL: BarracudaHockey

v2

Dont get that geared starter, its got plenty of torque but its not fast enough so it sounds like an impact wrench. It wll tear up your starter shaft, start shaft adapter and the one way bearing in the raptor clutch.

Just get a regular high torque starter and a 6mm hex drive start shaft.
Ok...

You think it would be good idea to get hitec 5625 servos? because they are good and they cost $50.
Old 07-06-2007, 12:35 PM
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50

They are car servos so they probably dont center as well. I'd go 9252s or the hitec's are decent.
Old 11-30-2007, 08:55 AM
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50

Just get a regular high torque starter and a 6mm hex drive start shaft.
I use a 6mm starter shaft in a 14V cordless drill. works better than any starter I have used. bought a cheap drill in a case with two batteries and charger for AUD$50 and have never looked back. I have converted three others to using the same setup now, and they all use the starter for planks only, the same as I do.
Old 11-30-2007, 10:23 AM
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50

I use a Team Losi Car starter with the battery leads reversed to give me counter-clockwise rotation. Works fine for a 50, and it's lightweight, inexpensive, and small. One battery required.
Old 11-30-2007, 10:27 AM
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50

Don't know if this will help you, If you buy the DX-7 in a package the DS821 servo's are better than a lot of top of the line servo's out there i have a titan with about 5 gallons burned with no problems at all...The Futaba servos are also very good but the centering seems weaker on my 90se with a PCM futaba then it does with the DX-7 821s on my .50 but its all personel preferance...It will be sometime before hard 3-D so you might want to consider the DX-7 package and its a good idea to have a very strong RX pack with any of the power sucking digitals...But i have been running the JR 2400 pack's for a couple of years and there more than enough power to keep me in the air all day...The 401 with the 9254 is a great set-up for the money...Before you spend a pile of money on you V-2 you should consider a sim saved me many hours on the bench and in parts...It's all about orientation...Check out heliproz.com they have a line of blades and parts that are really nice quality for the money...Mavrickk line...Good luck and welcome to the addiction...
Old 11-30-2007, 11:27 AM
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50

So far I am looking at

Futaba 7C 7-Channel 2.4GHz
Futaba S9350 digital servos x4
Futaba GY401 Gyro w/S9254
Duralite 4300mah Li-Ion 7.4v 4c Redundant Pack
Duralite 65053-HD Regulator w/HD Switch. 5.3v
Duralite Li-ion Charger, 7.4v Sng Out
Heli-Max Heli Super Start
Heli-Max One-Way Starter Shaft 6mm
DuraTrax Starter Box Power Pak
Hobbico Voltwatch2 4.8V/6V
Power Glo-Starter Long w/Meter

I'd skip the expensive duralite stuff. Get a Fromeco 5200mah Lion battery and the Align 6X regulator. Don't need a voltwatch either, it's build in to the 6X. Spend the difference on a good charger like the ICE or Triton that can charge everything (Nicad, Nimh, Lion, Lipo).
Try a HS525 servo on throttle instead of a S9350.

Fritz
Old 11-30-2007, 03:44 PM
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50

You are advised NOT to use those DS821's on a 50 size Nitro helicopter!

New Guidelines for DS821 Servo Use
Tuesday, February 20, 2007

The DS821 servo is a powerful, accurate sport digital servo recommended for RC airplane applications up to 1.20-size. For helicopters, the DS821 operates best with 30-size glow models, and up to 50-size electric. Loads and vibration in larger models may cause premature failure of the servo resulting in damage or injury to property and persons.

Important: Do not use liquid thread lock with the DS821 servo!

Do not use any form of liquid thread lock to secure the servo arm screw to the output shaft of the DS821 servo. Chemicals in these liquids react with the polycarbonate gear set causing the plastic to become brittle, fracturing the final output gear.
Old 11-30-2007, 04:29 PM
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50

Thats the old version in 2005 the 821s where updated gearing motor etc...Call there help line...
Old 11-30-2007, 05:13 PM
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50

Please note the date on the release, thats from JR.

Those servos are NOT rated or reccomended for 50 size nitro helicopters.
Old 11-30-2007, 05:27 PM
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50

Just got off the phone from Horizon hobby and they said they have heard of a few DS-821s failing, But never in a heli that was treated with some respect...If you are slamming hard 3-D szabo style then they will become a issue...And of course you can't require a 30 dollars servo to hold up to that abuse...But for a begginer on a budget there a better choice than a 3151 futaba...But if you do smooth 3-D as i do and prefer the more smooth flight, there will never be a problem with output shaft failure...Hard cyclic changes and stick slamming will destroy any 30 dollar servo...Smooth Tick Tocks, Chaos, Etc wont do any more damage than Scale flying...I also spoke to some folks at Heliproz and they also have not seen any problems with these servo's...As with all servos they have a usable life span and for a beginner they would be a good choice for any .50 set-up...I have seen plenty of 100 dollar servos go bad mostly because of binding and a poor maintenance schedule...And if your new to the Hobby crashing a heli and destroying the gears on a 30 dollar servo is a lot less painful...Just last week-end i witnessed a crash with 3 ccpm 9252s and it smoked all three Ouch !
Old 11-30-2007, 05:30 PM
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50


ORIGINAL: BarracudaHockey

Please note the date on the release, thats from JR.

Those servos are NOT rated or reccomended for 50 size nitro helicopters.
My Fault i meant they replaced the 811s and are better...I flew the 811s in my V-1 .50 for three years with no problems..
Old 11-30-2007, 08:43 PM
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50

For what its worth.... I had a ds 821 on my titan.. output gear sheared off flush at the case. No hard 3d flying, when it snapped off I was hovering it back in for landing. I just looked for the servo, I was trying to get a pic but I can't find it at the moment ....might have thrown it out..I think I had about two gallons through it......

My 2 pennies.
John
Old 12-01-2007, 12:05 AM
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50

the DS821 servo's are better than a lot of top of the line servo's out there
I have top of the line Digital Servo's. I've also had 3 Major Crashes with them, and they all came out with no problems every time - I'm still running them, and I have several hundred hours of flight time on them, and I'm not talkin about hovering around. If you use the DS821 servo's on that heli, you will be greatly dissappointed and put yourself and/or others at risk of serious injury or death!
One a side note: Make sure you do your research, even after someone on a forum tells you what to do. You have to remember that everyones experiences are different, and just because one person's had no trouble with their set-up, doesn't mean that you can take their single experience as gospel. Get the information from as many sources as possible before makenig a decission. Jeff - No Offense Intended
Those servos are NOT rated or reccomended for 50 size nitro helicopters.
I had a ds 821 on my titan.. output gear sheared off flush at the case
Old 12-01-2007, 07:42 AM
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50

811's are a completely different story.
Old 12-01-2007, 12:31 PM
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50

Just get 9252's and dont worry any longer. B/c once you decide the raptor 50 isn't up to snuff for you anymore, you will be able to use those servo's on a full eccpm bird and not have to upgrade again.
Old 12-01-2007, 05:33 PM
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50

So far I am looking at

Futaba 7C 7-Channel 2.4GHz
Futaba S9350 digital servos x4
Futaba GY401 Gyro w/S9254
Duralite 4300mah Li-Ion 7.4v 4c Redundant Pack
Duralite 65053-HD Regulator w/HD Switch. 5.3v
Duralite Li-ion Charger, 7.4v Sng Out
Heli-Max Heli Super Start
Heli-Max One-Way Starter Shaft 6mm
DuraTrax Starter Box Power Pak
Hobbico Voltwatch2 4.8V/6V
Power Glo-Starter Long w/Meter

Easily $1200-1400, anything else I need?
may I suggest you get some fuel to?
Also, even after using a sim to get the basics, I would suggest you put a training undercarriage on for the first few flights until you get a feel for the model, and the shakey hands. My hands are always fine on the sim, strange or what.
The sims are very good these days but the heli will feel and respond a little bit differently to the sim and the training gear is just a little safety net for your wallet.
I even went as far as putting mine back on when I moved from hovering to forward flight, as an aid to orientation. I also put it on for the first flight of my Titan until I had tested the setup and partly trimmed her. Then took it off for final tweeking.
I suggested this to my mate when he moved into forward flight and he found it really helpful.
For the record Dr Armomaxx, I am using a 401, Fromeco regulator with fail to on switch, but no governer. I am not working the heli hard enough yet to need one and I am learning loads about throttle and pitch curves. The governer removes the need to do this but if you don't have it setup and the gov fails, things could get ugly fast. Also, once I feel the need to install the gov it will only be a small learning curve having sorted everything else out already. To try and do it all at once, well, seems like a huge recipe for nightmares to me.
Old 12-01-2007, 06:19 PM
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Default RE: Newbie just got Raptor 50

Thanks for the info guys...I have only been flying for two years and still have plenty to learn...Just placed a order for 3 9252s from readyheli...I did a bunch of research here today and i really dont trust the 821s....Maybe for throttle only or in my boats...I am currently building a 109 coast guard scale 600...I have had good luck with the Hitec servos and had a hard choice...But for $ its not worth stuffing my raptor se 50...One thing that makes no sense to me is why would a Spektrum build such a nice radio (DX-7) and put such poor quaility servos in the box...I would of paid 100 bucks more for the system with better servos...

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