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KMP F-7F Tigercat

Old 08-19-2008, 10:19 PM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

Hey VK and All,
I finally got the Gen V gear for my T-cat.
I'll be changing it out and MIGHT get to do some circuits n bumps this weekend!
This ought to be interesting after having a "fixed gear" Cat for the first bunch of flights.
Regards,
Wally
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Old 08-20-2008, 06:26 AM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

HI F82FAN!!

A little advice for your gen 5 retracts, I have this retract too, and after 30min of ground test
the pin on the the retract ( see pic ) came out on 2 two retracts, even if the lock screw was tight
so I made a little flat on the center of the every pins, don't forget to put locktite on every screws

have fun!!
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Old 08-20-2008, 08:54 AM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

Hey Dub,
Thanks for the heads up.
Why can't someone send China the formula for some loctite type substance and have them do it right - from the start!!!!
Other than that, do they work better???? I have the good Robart accessories for mine, so the retracts are all that will be factory.
F82FAN
Old 08-21-2008, 07:42 AM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

Balanced the TC this am. Wheels down 95mm wheels up 103 mm. On the balancer seems like a big swing, maybe I need to use something different than the CG machine...
Old 08-21-2008, 08:30 AM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

I balanced last week on ez balancer and then checked with suspended method. With gear up I moved battery and balanced at 117 mm. With gear down cg moves forward 10 mm. Weighed just over 30 pounds with all except fuel. Using Sierra gear and Evolution 26 engines. No ballast needed. Hope to maiden soon.
Old 08-21-2008, 09:23 AM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

Hi everyone, not to change the subject but I also am building one of the latest composite designs. I made a new post in Multi Eng forum regarding gear door installation. It is the Poorman's answer to gear doors to offer another linkage install with air cylinders. I also wanted powerful engines and a picture of an inverted Saito 125 with Keleo Creations inverted pitts muffler is there too. The valve covers just peek out of the cowl at the bottom and I am going to make a small airscoop to cover them. Just FYI!
Old 08-22-2008, 05:22 PM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

DUBER, I RECIEVED THE GEN 5 GEARS LAST WEEK, MORE OF THE SAME KMP WOES WHICH INCLUDE: 6 SCREWS MISSING, INCLUDING THE SET SCREWS THAT HOLD THE CYLINDER ENDS TO THE CROSS PINS., HAD TO COBBLE THE SCREWS OFF T-CAT #1'S CRASHED GEAR TO FIX THIS. THE I.D. OF THE BLOCK BORES THAT HOLD THE MAIN GEAR STRUTS WERE TOO BIG, HAD TO LINE THE BORE WALLS WITH .002 SHIM STOCK TO GET THEM TO TIGHTEN UP. THE BOTTOM OF ONE OF THE BORES HAD A NUB STICKING UP ABOUT .050 SO THE MAIN GEAR STRUT WOULD'NT SIT DOWN IN THE BORE ALL THE WAY. FOUND MULTIPLE SCREWS AND BOLTS LOOSE, SOME SCREWS WERE'NT EVEN SCREWED IN THE UNITS, FOUND THEM FLOATING AROUND IN THE SHIPPING BAGS. THE AIR LINE SHIPPED IS TOO SMALL ON THE I.D. AND WON'T GO OVER THE SUPPLIED FITTINGS.THE SET SCREWS THAT HOLD THE NOSE GEAR TO THE PIN ARE WAY TOO SMALL, MACHINED THEM TO A 10-32, WAY MORE GRIPPING POWER. NO CABLE CAME WITH THE RETRACTS FOR THE NOSE GEAR STEERING.( THE CONTROL ARM I.D. IS BIGGER ON THE GEN 5 UNIT, SO YOU HAVE TO CUT AND RE -STRING THE CABLE TO USE THE GEN 5 ARM.) ONE OF THE MAIN GEAR'S AXLE'S WAS TOO SHORT TO FIT THE SUPPLIED SPACERS AND NYLOCK NUT, AGAIN HAD TO SWIPE A LONGER ONE OFF THE CRASHED T-CAT'S GEAR. THE BIGG QUESTION IS...... WHERE IS KMP'S QUALITY CONTROL?? GUYS, IF YOU CHOOSE TO USE THESE GEARS, LOCKTITE EVERY BOLT AND SCREW AND DON'T ASSUME THEY'LL WORK WITHOUT DOING THIS. HAVE SHELVED ALL THE KMP HARDWARE AND AM USING ROBART AIR VALVES, TANK, AIR LINES, FITTINGS, ETC. GENTS, SAVE YOURSELF A LOT MORE AGGRAVTION AND JUST GO BUY THE SIERRA RETRACTS[&:]..........
Old 08-23-2008, 12:25 AM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

It is the Chinese!! I too had a lot of missing screws, parts from my gear, in this day and age the fact is manufacturing for the aircraft they are selling is being done to specifications in China. You won't find this kind of thing going on with Yellow or any of the other American or Canadian manufacturers so when you buy something at a reduced price manufactured in China, you got to feel lucky to breeze through the kit without any issues. The measure of a company to do business with is are they talking to you. Are they taking care of your complaints, Are they supplying your parts you need and replacing them if it isn't right. I own several KMP planes and I was appreciative of both and most of all the customer support. I called Paul on the parts and he promptly sent them out at no charge for everything that was omitted.

I found the people at KMP to be all of this and even though my buildout has been delayed, they stand behind what they sell. They have been right by me all along and I would still buy another product from them. The Tigercat is an amazing bird and the finish is second to none. The improvements that has been made to the P-38 production have marched right along. Anyone buying one of those now will get one in fine condition with the bugs worked out. I feel for the money that has been paid for those retracts, try spending the same dollar for what you do get somewhere else. I believe the costs will run upwards of twice their price or more. True, they may be better, but you will pay for it. The company is growing and improving all the time. This is what I look for, you can call them and talk to them not like some of the manufacturers who make you communicate with them on line only. I wanted the Ultra-RC Zero at one time but when they shut their phone off, that was it. I wouldn't buy a thing from them.
Old 08-23-2008, 06:01 AM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

FLYTAILDRAGGER, WHEN YOU PAY $1000 FOR AN AIRPLANE, IT BETTER BE RIGHT, THE HARDWARE SHOULD BE OF EXCELLECT QUALITY, AND YOU SHOULD'NT HAVE TO START RE- ENGINEERING THE PLANE TO MAKE IT RIGHT, EVEN IF IT IS MADE IN CHINA. KMP SHOULD REJECT AND SUB STANDARD PRODUCTS BY THEIR "MANUFACTURER" AND MAKE THEM EAT THE COST OF MAKING JUNK. THEN, FIRE THEM AND HIRE A MANUFACTURER THAT DOES WORK LIKE GREAT PLANE'S MANUFACTURER.....
Old 08-23-2008, 11:22 AM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

HIRE A MANUFACTURER THAT DOES WORK LIKE GREAT PLANE'S MANUFACTURER.....
You obviously haven't been following the threads on Great Planes fiberglass ARFs. They are wishing for the quality level of the KMP kits.

Jim
Old 08-23-2008, 02:10 PM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

One thousand bucks is a LOT of $. More than any other I have ever spent. I was amazed however, what kind of money people are selling comparable composite airframes for on the website.. I have seen Bearcats and a lot of single engined airframes sell for between two and three thousand. This airplane is a fully composite high tech material airframe designed with the skin being an integral part of the strength of it's structure. $1000. Is it truly a lot of money for a full composite twin of 80 plus wingspan? I personally am gratefull for the opportunities afforded us for busy people who do not have the time to replicate such work. For the time it would take to replicate the structure of the Tigercat I would gladly fork it out. A few missing parts no big deal. The finish bubbling however is another story and they are working with the guy to replace the airframe. Sounds like a good company to me!
Old 08-23-2008, 04:20 PM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat


ORIGINAL: jrf

HIRE A MANUFACTURER THAT DOES WORK LIKE GREAT PLANE'S MANUFACTURER.....
You obviously haven't been following the threads on Great Planes fiberglass ARFs. They are wishing for the quality level of the KMP kits.

Jim
I have the Giant Chipmunk, the Cosmick minnow, and the Cessna twin........Alll have stellar FIberglass work!.....

The fiberglass work on the hawks cowl and wheel pants are Amazing!!!!! And I aM A very picky person.....

Not sure what you are talking about but all the forums I have seen with Gp products have yet to see anyone complain about there Fiberglass work!.....

Old 08-23-2008, 07:16 PM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

I agree. Generally speaking, Great Planes fiberglass work is gorgeous. I was only using "fiberglass ARFs" to define a class of class to their ARFs that are similar to KMP's. I haven't heard a lot of complaints about KMP's glass work either. Most of the complaints concern parts fit, structural design, hardware and accessories, which seems to pretty well match the complaints about KMP kits.

If you have found the overall quality level of the Great Planes "fiberglass ARFs" to be acceptable, that's great. At least the Great Planes ARFs are reasonably priced.

Jim

I apologize for getting off topic. Back to the Tigercat.
Old 08-24-2008, 10:03 AM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

A couple of things. one I balanced my TC where it is to be 117mm by moving the onboard glow to the center of the plane from the nose. Next, while checking out the balance and all I noticed cracks along the leading edge of the center section! It looks like stress crack or just plain bad mfg. Anyway I ran some CA in them to help keep it from growing. I have not even had this plane off the ground and I am getting possible stress cracks? Makes me think it'll never survive it it flies...
Old 08-24-2008, 01:27 PM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

There have been 3 generations of airframe manufacture, which one do you have, the balsa wing, the composite foam skin or the honeycomb kevlar composite? Call Paul or Andy at KMP, they will make it right by you. The cracks could also be just the paint. The paint is make of epoxy paint and the paint can crack too if the piece was dropped or not carefully handled. In that case, KMP now has matching paint in stock. I believe it is only $10.
Old 08-24-2008, 01:54 PM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

Maidened the Tigercat yesterday. Everything went very well, ground control was better than expected and flight was good. Did a few laps and cycled gear. Some sudden pitch ups so landed. Wind or glitch probably will never know. Flight and landing went very well according to the test pilot Pete Rosas, a 3D Futaba Team pilot. 30 pounds, balanced at 117 mm with gear up, Evolution 26s and Sierra Gear. Pete thought plane was very sensetive. Throws set at factory reccomendations on high rate, flown at low rate approx 75%, will probably reduce or use expo. Glad the first flight is behind us.

Jack
Old 08-25-2008, 05:09 PM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

JB, CONGTATS ON YOUR MAIDEN. MINE WOULD PITCH UP WHEN THE GEAR WAS RETRACTED, THEN LEVEL OUT WITH SOME DOWN ELEVATOR, THEN BACK TO NETURAL STICK....
Old 08-25-2008, 07:52 PM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

now that I am on teh cusp of maiden and have set my cg at 117mm I guess I should see a fairly good drop in the nose once i hit the retracts from what I have read. I know I saked beore but has the fact no gear vs having gear doors made a difference?
Old 08-25-2008, 07:57 PM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

We flew mine without doors. No noticeable problems.
Jack
Old 08-26-2008, 05:12 PM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

Thanks for the update..
Old 08-27-2008, 12:38 AM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

Talk about scale. Having maintaned and flown 2800 powered airplanes it takes as much labor and $$$$ to get a PMP arf to fly and as the real thing. Think of the AD's that would have been issued if the goverment regulated models. Yes I have the first gen P-38 and tigercrap. Look at the threads on KMP airplanes. At least Nitro and others you get what you pay for. Kmp is just a rip off. Not flaming, just a fact.
Old 08-27-2008, 12:46 AM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

Well Mr. Waldo, you make statements like you have owned a KMP airplane in the past. Which one was it.?
Old 08-27-2008, 12:54 AM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

The P-38 and tigercrap.
Old 08-27-2008, 06:19 AM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

Hmm, I have a friend in Oregon who purchased a first gen P-38 and he wasn't happy with it either. I refrained for a long time before I purchased a KMP model because of it. When the ME-109 came out, I couldn't help myself and bought it. I have had good experiences with my purchases, sorry about yours. I think the Tigercat is a good value. I am building it now. I have been building models for years and it's quality in my opinion, (besides the hardware ) is top notch for the money you pay. I of course have received the most current productions of the kit. I am glad there aren't too many complaints I have seen like your experiences. Have you tried calling the company and talking to Paul or Andrew about your "Tigercrap".?
Old 08-28-2008, 01:28 AM
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Default RE: KMP F-7F Tigercat

Hi T-Cat builders. Have my Fuji 24s and my Sierra Retracts mounted. Did my first engine runs with engines on aircraft. (Engines were broken-in for about 1 hour each on a test bed). All went well. High RPM was 8100, Low was 2100 with APC 16x8 props. Engines seem VERY HAPPY at 8100 RPM, no heating problems and very rapid throttle response. Sierra retracts are GREAT and the wheel brakes are smooth and very strong. Did some taxing and braking. I did notice that the Sierra retracts did bottom out taxing when I went over a bump. My T-Cat weighs 30 lbs. I called Sierra retracts and they are sending me heavier springs. Sierra Company is great to work with. Quality equipment and rapid response to any question. I sure wasted a lot of MONEY and TIME with KMP recommended engines and retracts. Hope these pictures come through. I have a new i-Mac computer and LOVE IT.

Col. Chuck Winter
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