Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

I'm getting the 28% Edge and watching the movies, abserved how slow the roll rate was. Is there anyway I could increase the surface area on the ailerons? I like to roll really really fast and like to have great control at stall speeds.

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

Mine rolls pretty fast.. Ailerons are plenty big you just need big servo arms for max throw..

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

There is nothing slow about the roll rate on the 28% Edge. High rates provide an extremely quick roll rate for a large plane, while the low rate provide more than adaquate roll authority for most speeds other than when it's flown in low speed, high alpha 3D. The plane maintains excellent roll authority at all speeds, regardless of the rate selected.

Using the 1-1/4 to 1-1/2" servo arms that are available from various manufacturers will permit you to set the plane up from mild to wild. Bear in mind that using high rate surface travels at high speeds is a recipe for disaster.

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

Concur.. If I snapped and rolled the Edge like I did my little Yak She might be in a world of hurt.. The scale roll rate for a 540T is 420 deg/sec and I know I can at least match that.. I just wish I had some vid of mine.. I will work on it when the freezing rain is gone[:'(]

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

So your saying the plane wouldn't be able to take a faster roll then what it's set for stock? Cause I'd like to get it as fast as I can.

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

go 45 deg on the ailerons if you want.. trust me it will be fast.. I have yet to see a video of the edge doing anything but hovering [:'(] but I assure you that ain't all it can do..

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

I was told if you move the ailerons at to much of a degree they won't be effective, is this true? And how much clearence does the edge have on the ailorons? I'd like to make them 60* if I can.

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

go 45 max. Anything more is a waste

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

Matt,

I'm sorry, but I have to ask. Have you ever flown a giant scale plane, or have thay all been smaller fun fly types?

That wasn't meant to offend, but it appears that you don't understand that larger planes can only roll so fast, and then can't roll any faster. You have longer wing spans and inertias. The structure will only handle so much stress before something breaks due to the increased mass of a larger plane and G loading. The sudden stop of an extremely fast roll on a large plane has the ability to snap the wings off outboard of the wing tube.

The Edge will roll somewhere in the neighborhood of 1-2/3 to almost 2 per second at high rates and at speed. I know, beacuse I've done it. That was with 37 degrees of aileron travel. That's all I use for 3D work at any time, and usually I only need around 20 degrees for a roll rate of 1 per second. More than 40 to 45 degrees of travel will offer no useful benefit.

A good flyer can establish the roll rate with his fingers due to his understanding of the way things work, and his skill. Watch Mark Leseberg sometime. He has the fastest fingers I have ever seen, and is one of the few that can roll a plane continuously a 1-3/4 per second and maintain the roll on a point. Strike that. He's the ONLY person that I have ever seen do it that well.

Anyway, bigger flys a lot different from the smaller stuff out there. Fly a giant scale plane like it's a fun fly and you won't have it very long. This I KNOW to be true.

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

Hey thanks for the help silversurfer. I am 15 years old and am trying to learn all I can. I'm taking the plunge into gassers and I need to get the most out of my first one(short on money so it needs to be right). I like to fly stalled and fast. Thats why I need the most aileron movement I can get to keep the bird level otherwise its more ground time then air time. Anyway my question is can I set an extreme for high rate when I'm flying slow and then switch to a lower rate when I'm flying fast? And do you know what extremes the WH edge can take at stall speed and at normal speed?

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

Okay, that explains quite a bit. Flying stalled and fast are terms that are usually not related to one another.

Normally you would use the low rate anything for higher speeds. The higher rates should be reserved for slower speeds permitting maximum control authority at high angles of attack and in slow flight regiemes. How much stress will a 28% W/H take? Quite a bit. Without having a structural engineering degree, or having a "G" meter in the plane, I'm going to guess that I regularly put mine through maneuvers pulling at least 10 to 12 g's, possibly more. But I learned a long time ago that a stalled large plane will not recover like a small one, and will usually be spun into the ground if you try to do it like you would a small one

All of the 28% W/H planes will handle quite a bit of abuse, but there is a point where any plane with an 84 inch wing span that weighs in at around 16 to 19 pounds will start to come apart from high flight loading. A good example is watching giant scale race planes blow themselves up as they turn a pylon. Any plane can only take so much.

As planes become larger and heavier, so do the flight loads imposed upon them. At any given size, structural trade offs have to be made to help keep the weight of the aircraft down. In smaller planes these trade offs will not usually have a significant impact on the structural strength of the aircraft due to their lighter weights and shorter spans. Just the opposite is true with the larger ones, we do sacrifice some strength to lower the weight. Larger structural components are as a rule heavier than smaller ones.

A word of caution, don't "plunge" into larger gassers. Step gracefully into them a do it right the first time. Going balls out without taking the time to learn the difference in the way bigger planes fly will end up costing you a lot of money. Perhaps a lot more than you are willing to spend.

There's a lot of people in this forum that will lend a hand along your way, including the manufacturer. Take advantage of them, and the knowledge that they have acquired along the way.

If you haven't heard it already, find someone to tell you the old tale of the old bull and the young bull. There's a good lesson it it.

Pat

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

Well spoken by someone who has made a few mistakes and LEARNED from them...

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

Silversurfer...

Can you tell me the story? I love storytime!

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

I can't tell it in a public forum such as this. It has to be told using the original terminolgy for the most effect. Send a PM to Redrum, I don't know why, but I think he may have a copy somewhere.

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

Scott told me a PG version of it...

YIKES!

You BOYS are so BAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Y'all especially better watch out for FlyinTiger...he is in T-R-O-U-B-L-E!!!

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

HE HE:D[8D]

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

You're not by any chance insinuating that FlyinTiger is a young bull[sm=idea.gif] standing atop the hill while you're down in the valley??[sm=surprised.gif]

Redrum, that was in retaliation for your post in another forum. You know which one[sm=kiss.gif]

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

If we are talking about the same old bull, young bull story. Heres a P.G. version
1 older bull and a young bull are standing on top of the valley. They are looking down below over the herd of cows (of course cows are female).

the younger bull said to the older bull, lets run down there to the herd and get friendly with a few cows.

Then the older bull replies, how about we walk down there and get friendly with all the cows.

I guess that the same story your talking about.

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

It is, but it loses quite a bit of impact in the Sesame Street version. The moral is the same though.

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

I hate to take this "Bull Story" any further, as it is messing up an otherwise helpful thread. No, I'm not in trouble because I am a bull, young or old, but because I bought a WingTote for my Wild Hare Extra before it even arrived.:D Wouldn't want any hanger rash to plague my wings while I'm assembling the rest...;)

Thanks for your patience...[8D]

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

No...FlyinTiger is not the young bull...he's the married bull...married to ME! I was inferring to the ordering he has done lately for his WH Extra...holy cow!!! (No pun intended.)

Back to the subject: You won't be disappointed in these WH aircraft's roll rate. Whether you are getting the Edge or an Extra...whatever. They have great performance and I can see already that my thumbs are going to get a workout keeping up with the roll rate that we'll be setting up on "OUR" Extra 300LX. The key as someone already pointed out is that you can overstress these big birds by doing what you used to with smaller planes.

Just my .02

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

Guys:

Keep in mind that performance of the controls is dramatically affected by the servo selection you make.

Putting 645MG servos on ailerons, while on paper it seems ok, will be vastly different from flying with 5645s and a good 6v power supply system.

This is one place where giant scale diverges from small planes. They have to work as a system, and just throwing huge ailerons on the plane doesn't make it roll faster if the servos and power system are not up to the job.

TF

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

Why mess with inferior components...JR 8611s all the way around (except throttle and choke, of course).

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

I;m a bit short on money and own all futaba. What would be the best servo to use in the ailerons (futaba under $120 a peice). Ok I don't think I'll make any mods to it as long as this plane can do a 1 sec roll while it's hovering, so thats my question anyone know?

RE: Aileron Mods on the Edge?
 

I also use all Futaba equipment..However I went with all jr8611's...The only futaba's I would go with would be the s9451's (79.99) 120 oz tourqu at 6volts..The s9152-53's are HUGE!! For 100$ more the 8611's give you more than double the tourqe so thats why I went with them along with a 9ch Futaba PCM RX